Unmoving 2-month-old corn

CalamityFortune · 10-12-16, 01:16 AM

I received my first snake today- a two month old corn snake (from BHB). The terrarium is 30 gal, quite large for a baby, I know, but there are two hides, one near the heating pad which is on the bottom of the right wall, the other with a (sturdy) wooden structure on top of it that the snake can get behind and use as another shady hide. There are two water sources containing partially tap water and partially filtered water. The substrate is aspen- it looks like tiny little wood blocks. (Pic of terrarium setup: https://s21.postimg.org/7159b7iqv/20161007_210443.jpg ) In addition to the heating pad, there are a couple lamps that came with the tank that I've been messing with to keep the tank at around 80F. I know that the snake is stressed from being shipped to a new environment; I have instructions not to unnecessarily handle it for about a week. I am also not supposed to feed it until a week.
When he arrived, my mom was teasing me about being afraid of the little guy, so I picked him up and placed him in his enclosure. He seemed okay-tongue flicking a bit and wriggling himself around. He didn't do much, not that I expected anything extravagant but he seemed lethargic (it was about 11AM). I left the room for a few hours and he was behind the log every time I checked on him: https://s18.postimg.org/xb4sy0urd/20161011_111201.jpg . I took a nap for several hours and when I saw him next (at around 6PM), he was comfortably under the warm-side hide.
Skipping to later in the night, around... say 10PM, I had seen him- chilling by his water dish and then I left the room. When I returned, about 15 minutes later, he was upside-down, not moving: https://s16.postimg.org/aoa4ix50l/20161011_215923.jpg . Freaking out, I opened the top of the container and righted him. He opened his mouth sometime during all this, but as soon as I righted him, I went to get my mom. When I returned with her, he had a mouth full of substrate. She brought his upper body to the water so that the substrate could at least moisten for easier consumption, as he was far too small for us to be wrestling some wood chips out of his mouth. I looked online about the hazards of eating the substrate and from what I had read, snakes can digest all kinds of stuff, so I was relieved for the time being. Well, it's now 2AM the next day and the snake has done nothing but lay upside down for extended periods of time and move slightly. In a moment of desperation, after almost an hour of him being upside-down, I had opened the tank and righted him again. He was limp. I told my mom, who told me that I should wait until morning before calling him "dead". When I came back, he moved slightly, only rearranging his body. He has yet to move from his position in the middle of the tank: https://s16.postimg.org/pvi5z8xzp/20161012_015051.jpg
I also believe he still has a piece of substrate sticking out of his mouth.

TL;DR - My corn snake has substrate in his mouth and was laying on his back for long periods of time. Doesn't move for hours on end.

What I want to know is: Why is my snake being all upside-down and still? Could he be choking on the substrate? Could he have some sickness? Can colubrids get IBD? Is it just the stress from the large enclosure and handling? Should I contact a vet or wait it out? Offer food sooner or wait the full week?

*I am a paranoid person.

Albert Clark · 10-12-16, 05:44 AM

Wow, seems like quite a bit going on here. Sorry you're having a difficult time with the little guy. What you need to do first is get him into a smaller enclosure and onto paper towels so you can really monitor his condition. Something like a 6 qt. tub with air holes put in it and a snap on lid. Maybe even a glad Tupperware tub? If there is anything in his mouth it needs to be removed bc that can certainly block his airway. You can use a small tweezer to remove any foreign bodies, wood chips, paper. The smaller tub can be placed into the tank with half of the tub over the warm side.

**Andy_G** · 10-12-16, 07:41 AM

I can't access the pics from where I am as it blocks them. There are a few select morphs that will "stargaze" but none of this sounds right or typical even for stargazers. Some kind of poisoning (usually from cleaning vapours, vapona, some kind of harsh mite treatment that has been administered incorrectly), an internal parasite of some kind, or heat stroke can all cause what you're describing. Colubrids don't get IBD. It doesn't sound stress related and this is not normal. I would be contacting a vet as well as informing BHB of your problems. I'd also agree with the things that Albert mentioned. All we can do is speculate at this point unfortunately. Best of luck and keep us updated.

CalamityFortune · 10-13-16, 01:18 AM

I'm sorry to say but the little guy was dead when I woke up. He was most likely dead (or at least really close to it) before my first post was actually posted. He was in the same position as he had been in for hours and when my mom picked him up, he was limp and had a gnarly dark green bruise along his stomach.

Thank you all for your advice. We contacted BHB and I will be getting a new snake hopefully within the week. I'm gonna change the bedding to larger aspen pieces, and just overall try and make the cage a bit nicer for the new one.

Question: If I have a 30 gal tank, is one heating pad enough for a baby? And should it be on the bottom or the side? I'm also thinking of dividing the tank somehow...

Albert Clark · 10-13-16, 05:45 AM

Awww! So sorry for the loss of the corn snake. Glad Bhb is doing the right thing by replacing him. Why don't you consider paper towels as the substrate during the quarantine period?

macandchz · 10-13-16, 06:41 AM

really sorry to hear about your snake.

**Minkness** · 10-13-16, 07:44 AM

I would call bhb directly with this information and see what they say/do.

jay's reptiles · 10-13-16, 07:53 AM

Honestly i would use paper towels for the new baby. Wait till she/he is older before moving them to aspen. Just a thought.

jay's reptiles · 10-13-16, 07:54 AM

Btw sorry for your loss. Thing just happen

. Don't blame yourself.

SWDK · 10-13-16, 08:03 PM

Sorry to hear the little guy didn't make it. It's best to put the heat pad on the bottom of the tank instead of the side. Just make sure to have some type of thermostat to control the temp.

**Minkness** · 10-13-16, 09:18 PM

I feel dumb for not reading your last post. My condolences. It is nice to hear BHB will be replacing it for you.

As for the chips, they should have been fine. I use sanichips with all my small babies and never had an issue. However, any time you get a new snake, you should use paper towels or newspaper to gauge health more easily as well as provide a more sterile enviroment for a while.

The heating pad should be on the bottom to allow for belly heat. It should be on the outside of the enclosure however.

Also, a 30 gallon tank really is too big for such a small snake. I highly recomend getting a smaller locking tub like a rubbermaid, zip lock, or sterilite. The 30 gallon you have will be better for a 2 year old in my opinion.

Looking forward to seeing your new-new baby.

CalamityFortune · 10-14-16, 05:55 PM

So it turns out that I'm crazy and the tank is actually 20L, not 30gal.
The little kisatchie baby arrived this morning and definitely looks healthier and more energetic. The cage was cleaned, the bedding was changed to some natural aspen shreds, and the heating pad is on the bottom. Thank you all for your kind condolences

Here's the little guy: https://postimg.org/image/dx12lybo7/

Albert Clark · 10-14-16, 06:15 PM

Great! Cute little guy. Please make sure to use a thermostat on that heat pad. Congrats.