Gaining weight fast enough?

JellyBean · 09-14-16, 10:31 PM

According to our best guess, Bean will be one year old on October 22nd

Maybe his original birthdate is incorrect? He came from a facility that had dozens to choose from, and mistakes can happen.

More important than his age, is health.
Does his growth pattern look healthy?

We brought him home on January 22nd 2016

January 30th: 28g and approx 20 inches (14 wks old?)
April 13th: 35g and 20 inches (25 wks old?)
September 11th: 70g and 25 inches (46 wks old?)

We started feeding pinky mice every 5-7 days.
Switched to peach fuzzy mice once a week

The past 2 feeding we upped to two peach fuzzy mice every 7-10 days (since we have them)

Plan is to switch to either fuzzies or hoppers. (Open to suggestions)

He is extremely friendly, never stressed, and has a beautiful sheen.
We only want the best for him. Let the opinions fly! LOL

**Andy_G** · 09-15-16, 07:16 AM

Your snake is ready for hoppers without a doubt.

JellyBean · 09-15-16, 07:21 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Andy_G

Your snake is ready for hoppers without a doubt.

Thanks Andy!

I'm curious to see if this is a normal growth pattern, even if he is small? (Anyone?)

bigsnakegirl785 · 09-15-16, 08:23 PM

They are born large enough for mouse fuzzies. At 70 grams, he's large enough for hoppers. I bumped my oldest to hoppers when he was 60-65 grams, and about 5-6 months old, I'd had him about 4 months.

Also, wow that is a tiny baby! Most likely when you got him, he wasn't even a month old. All 4 of my BRBs were born over 30 grams, so at 28 grams either he was a very tiny newborn, or he was a little older but wasn't being fed properly and lost some weight.

The weight gain also seems a tad slow, but if you've been feeding pinkies that would explain a lot, pinkies are little more than milk, water, and skin.

I would feed a hopper every 7-10 days myself.

JellyBean · 09-16-16, 12:11 AM

Thank you for the info and your honest opinion BigSnakeGirl

So, is it possible for us to "stunt his growth"?

Or is it more likely we have a slender, healthy snake, that's about to get bigger & fatter a little faster, once we up him to hoppers?

(Appreciate all the input)

P.S. We will be making a hopper order next week

bigsnakegirl785 · 09-16-16, 01:03 AM

It's certainly possible you've slowed his growth down, but that's not necessarily a bad thing (better slow than fast imo), and he'll eventually catch up. You should definitely see an increase in weight gain and length growth once you up him to hoppers. I would wait to go to small adult mice until hoppers don't leave any bulge and small adults leave a small, reasonable bulge.

I would caution to be slow and steady with how you feed him, even a baby a little behind in growth will be able to grow to normal size given time. If pushed to size too soon, it could seriously cut his life short, so feed him like normal and don't worry about giving him anything "extra."

Considering how tiny he was born, he's not too far behind all considering.

JellyBean · 09-16-16, 01:11 AM

Yup & yup!

Obviously we are not fans of over feeding. Not gonna start now.

I just hope Bean will know what to do with a hopper when he sees one.

bigsnakegirl785 · 09-16-16, 01:20 AM

He should! With how long he's been on the smaller meals, it may take him a bit longer to get one down, but he should get one down easily enough, he's certainly large enough. In the meantime, offer him the biggest peach fuzzies you have left for a couple feedings before giving him a hopper, probably easiest to weigh them and separate the heaviest into a separate bag. Just to kinda help him along.

Snakesitter · 09-16-16, 02:05 PM

A birth weight of 28 grams is well within the normal range. I believe my long-term window is 28-32, with a few outliers on either side.

As BSG noted, they can take larger prey from birth. In fact, I feed mine either rat pinks or mouse hoppers (in all cases frozen/thawed) right from the start. (Note I also wait until first shed to feed.) The diet so far probably slowed him down...but he will eventually grow to full size anyway.

I would try moving to rat pinks once per week. The reason is that as he grows, he will eventually need larger meals than a single mouse. By the time is an adult, you can either offer a single medium rat...or four to six adult mice (the sale total weight). I'd rather feed once and be done.

Good luck!

bigsnakegirl785 · 09-16-16, 03:12 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Snakesitter

A birth weight of 28 grams is well within the normal range. I believe my long-term window is 28-32, with a few outliers on either side.

As BSG noted, they can take larger prey from birth. In fact, I feed mine either rat pinks or mouse hoppers (in all cases frozen/thawed) right from the start. (Note I also wait until first shed to feed.) The diet so far probably slowed him down...but he will eventually grow to full size anyway.

I would try moving to rat pinks once per week. The reason is that as he grows, he will eventually need larger meals than a single mouse. By the time is an adult, you can either offer a single medium rat...or four to six adult mice (the sale total weight). I'd rather feed once and be done.

Good luck!

I did figure it was within normal range, just on the smaller end. Most of the babies I see with their weight listed are 30-36 grams at birth, but I've seen teeny babies a lot - just not with their birth weights.

As long as it switches, starting out with mice would be better. A hopper mouse is more nutritious than a rat pink, and plus you have that milk belly to contend with, which is mostly fat and boas don't metabolize fat well. A mouse that's more developed will also have a higher calcium content, better for a growing snake.

Even if the snake is difficult to switch later, all you need is persistence and they will eventually switch. Switching a bit sooner than weaned rats may make the switch easier, like switched at rat pups (which are about the size of a small or medium adult mouse, or a small jumbo mouse, weaned rats are the size of a large jumbo mouse and get a little bigger than that). They generally have good appetites, so it's likely it shouldn't be hard to switch at all.

Snakesitter · 09-19-16, 02:33 PM

I *rarely* see babies at 36 grams. That's huge for a baby rainbow. I can look up my stats of you like, but I've tracked each and every birth weight for at least ten litters....

I agree with you they grow a bit faster on hoppers, and I do feed those every now and then, but I see getting them on rats pre-sale as a benefit to the customer.

And I've seen some *really* stubborn snakes. ;-)

bigsnakegirl785 · 09-19-16, 03:12 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Snakesitter

I *rarely* see babies at 36 grams. That's huge for a baby rainbow. I can look up my stats of you like, but I've tracked each and every birth weight for at least ten litters....

I agree with you they grow a bit faster on hoppers, and I do feed those every now and then, but I see getting them on rats pre-sale as a benefit to the customer.

And I've seen some *really* stubborn snakes. ;-)

That would be cool! You don't have to go out of your way if it's too much trouble, though.

I think Sanji was born at 35 or 36 grams (don't have his card anymore and didn't record it on iHerp so he could have been lighter but was definitely over 30 grams), Homura was 32, Morzan was 31, and Guin was 36 grams. I could probably ask Dave to look up Sanji's records, I think he keeps all of them but not sure.

Dave sends cards with all recorded feedings, weights, and sheds since birth. I think it's really cool to know birth weights so I'm thinking of doing the same thing when I start breeding boa constrictors.

lol Me, too, believe me. I have a ball python! Took me 1.5 years to get him switch to f/t. Probably wouldn't have taken so long if I hadn't kept giving in and giving him live, though.

sattva · 09-19-16, 05:18 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by bigsnakegirl785

That would be cool! You don't have to go out of your way if it's too much trouble, though.

I think Sanji was born at 35 or 36 grams (don't have his card anymore and didn't record it on iHerp so he could have been lighter but was definitely over 30 grams), Homura was 32, Morzan was 31, and Guin was 36 grams. I could probably ask Dave to look up Sanji's records, I think he keeps all of them but not sure.

Dave sends cards with all recorded feedings, weights, and sheds since birth. I think it's really cool to know birth weights so I'm thinking of doing the same thing when I start breeding boa constrictors.

lol Me, too, believe me. I have a ball python! Took me 1.5 years to get him switch to f/t. Probably wouldn't have taken so long if I hadn't kept giving in and giving him live, though.

I'm going to show my ignorance on the subject here, but is a hopper a living mouse? When I went to the reptile store to get some meals for Crystal, I asked the guy when I should switch her from hoppers to rats... He said now! so I went with a f/t fuzzy rat which she is eating... I never did see a hopper... The word hopper suggest... well they hop? So alive or not?

Snakesitter · 09-20-16, 01:52 PM

Will do.

I send cards too -- it's a nice touch for sure.

LOL balls are notorious for that behavior. It literally is like trying to feed a pet rock. ;-)

Snakesitter · 09-21-16, 02:05 PM

Here are those stats:

My heaviest litter came in at a stunning 44 grams. My average litter was 31 grams. My lightest litter came in at 28 grams. Excluding the heavy one, the high was 35 and the average 30.