Garter snake emergancy!!!!!!!!!

ErikBush97 · 06-18-13, 08:45 AM

Hello everyone! Quick question... My garter is laying on her back and seems to have lost control of her muscles or something... I don't know... maybe she was climbing and fell off her rock & is having trouble getting on her belly? She is actually slithering around of her back... Again. she's fighting to try and flip herself onto her belly and has not suceeded. The closest reptile vet is 45 minutes away in a car, and two hours on the bus + I don't think they'd let me on the bus with my snake. I do not have a car... Is she just being silly or is she sick?? She has been acting very odd lately. She's been a bit fussy during handling and usually she'll explore my hands and arms but she has just been laying in my hands, without much response to me. I am pretty scared, and nervous and I don't know what this is. I haven't experienced anything close to this in the past. And she's struggling, trying to flip herself, as if she's exhausted. She's wild caught so I thought it could potentially be some sort of parasites she picked up or something?? Again... Any input on what this could be is VERY VERY much appreciated. also... should I help her get back onto her belly or leave her alone???

Kettennatter · 06-18-13, 08:46 AM

What are you feeding her? Small fish?

ErikBush97 · 06-18-13, 08:47 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Kettennatter

What are you feeding her? Small fish?

Yup.. Cloud Fish (no thiamine)
Really scared

Kettennatter · 06-18-13, 09:01 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by ErikBush97

Yup.. Cloud Fish (no thiamine)
Really scared

Cloud fish are a kind of minnow, to my knowledge. So I would consier them suspect.

I'm not sure if this link is against the forum rules or not, but this is a very decent write-up:

All About Thiaminase - Gartersnake.info

Ourobouros · 06-18-13, 09:10 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Kettennatter

Cloud fish are a kind of minnow, to my knowledge. So I would consier them suspect.

I'm not sure if this link is against the forum rules or not, but this is a very decent write-up:

All About Thiaminase - Gartersnake.info

Lol I took so long saving my post you beat me to it =D

Terranaut · 06-18-13, 09:05 AM

A snake on it's back is nothing silly. Your snake is knocking on deaths door. I hope you figure it out. What are your temps?

ErikBush97 · 06-18-13, 09:37 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Terranaut

A snake on it's back is nothing silly. Your snake is knocking on deaths door. I hope you figure it out. What are your temps?

For the garter, a little higher than room temp since she's native and doesn't need extra heating. (around 75-80F) And I think the guy who replied before you was right. I think's it's thiaminase. The thing that's really bothering me about this, is I asked the guy at the pet store if they had any small feeders WITHOUT thiaminase and he, WITH 0% HESITATION, said "Cloud fish are fine for Garters! That's what we feed our Ball Pythons"... He said Cloud Fish so quickly that you'd think he had studied it and had been asked a million times before. Guess that's what I get for trusting someone who works with animals for a living...
The reason I said acting silly is because she often climbs on top of her hide, falls onto her back (3 inch drop, so it isn't going to cause any damage if she falls), and twirls her way back onto her belly. I thought she'd just flip right over... But she's still there. I am working on finding a ride to a vet, so now that I have a $100 vet bill, stop riding my *** about buying a thermostat.

Ourobouros · 06-18-13, 09:09 AM

All About Thiaminase - Gartersnake.info

Also where were you advised those fish don't contain thiaminase? I have found no resources indicating whether white clouds are safe or unsafe....

Either way I'd call that reptile vet if I were you... Like.. Now

ErikBush97 · 06-18-13, 09:43 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Ourobouros

All About Thiaminase - Gartersnake.info

Also where were you advised those fish don't contain thiaminase? I have found no resources indicating whether white clouds are safe or unsafe....

Either way I'd call that reptile vet if I were you... Like.. Now

The guy at the pet store. He said "Cloud fish are fine for Gartes" without ANY... A.N.Y hesitation as if he had researched it, and knew exactly what he was talking about.

Kettennatter · 06-18-13, 09:52 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by ErikBush97

The guy at the pet store. He said "Cloud fish are fine for Gartes" without ANY... A.N.Y hesitation as if he had researched it, and knew exactly what he was talking about.

And what is your point? What qualifications do you need to work at a pet store?

ErikBush97 · 06-18-13, 10:30 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Kettennatter

And what is your point? What qualifications do you need to work at a pet store?

What does qualifications to work there have to do with it?.... The point is: he shouldn't have given advice, if he didn't know what he was talking about. This is the problem with SsnakeSs... Someone ALWAYS has to change the subject. I'm sure we'll be talking about cars, or computers, or measuring tapes pretty soon here...

Kettennatter · 06-18-13, 11:53 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by ErikBush97

What does qualifications to work there have to do with it?.... The point is: he shouldn't have given advice, if he didn't know what he was talking about. This is the problem with SsnakeSs... Someone ALWAYS has to change the subject. I'm sure we'll be talking about cars, or computers, or measuring tapes pretty soon here...

Erik. I feel sorry for your loss, I really do. The point is that you took advice from somebody who was not qualified to give advice. A pet store employee doesn't breed snakes. He sells them. His goal is to make snake ownership sound easy and get you out the door. (I know I'm stereotyping, but at the end of the day a pet shop is a business.)

I feel particularly bad because my own garter went through this and is alive today. So, anything I'm going to say will feel like a smartass comment, when it really isn't meant to be.

Ourobouros · 06-18-13, 09:56 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by ErikBush97

The guy at the pet store. He said "Cloud fish are fine for Gartes" without ANY... A.N.Y hesitation as if he had researched it, and knew exactly what he was talking about.

I believed a friend he had the proof of insurance in his car when he let me drive it.. A mistake I shall never make again. I'm sorry this happened to you. :'(

ErikBush97 · 06-18-13, 09:49 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Ourobouros

All About Thiaminase - Gartersnake.info

Also where were you advised those fish don't contain thiaminase? I have found no resources indicating whether white clouds are safe or unsafe....

Either way I'd call that reptile vet if I were you... Like.. Now

I did... They said they could have me in tomorrow evening. I informed them that by the looks of it... the snake might not be alive tomorrow evening but that didn't seem to matter. The only vet that will see me today is in Washington (no buses go to Washington from here)

Kettennatter · 06-18-13, 09:13 AM

The snake looks like one that is thiamine deficient. (No way to know for sure unless you are able to administer thiamine. The snake would recover quickly if it was thiamine deficient.) A vet is the safe bet.