Puppies and Dog Breeding

Vengeance · 10-02-04, 06:34 PM

Since dogs have been such a popular topic of conversation, I thought I should throw my opinion into the mix.

I've been watching these threads about people with new puppies they've bred, pit bull breeders, and just anyone with a new puppy from a breeder and I really have to say that I'm disgusted by all of it. There is such a huge problem with the dog population in North America right now that there is no excuse for ANYONE to be getting a puppy from a breeder or breeding dogs. No excuse what so ever. Now I'm sure a bunch of you are going to be up in arms saying, well I breed for quality or I only deal in pure breeds, or I only breed for temperament, or the breeder I got my puppy from is reputable. But unless you can come up with a solution to the Thousands of dogs that die needlessly everyday due to overpopulation, I don't care how pure bred your dog is, there are mutts AND purebreds (even championship ones) in the pound that need homes and don’t deserve to die so you can have another pure bred whatever.

Now of course on the other side of the argument you can say there are allot of rescues related to herps, and the over population of retics and Ball pythons and burm's. But I don't have anything bad to say about them. Reason being is this, if you go to www.petfinder.com, one of the major websites responsible for placing thousands of abandoned animals and you do a search for Ontario, they have only 47 active cases of reptile rescue currently for snakes. Only about 20 active cases for Lizards and 102 active cases for Iguanas (Putting this in anyway even though I don't agree with Iguana breeding because of the overpopulation problem), and also this search is stretching into USA so it covers a broader region. That makes only 169 active cases, including Iguanas, in all of Ontario and surrounding provinces and states(the search turns up animals in BC and Michigan). If you do a search for dog, there are currently 450 active cases of dogs that need homes just in Ontario, now to me that is a staggering difference.

So the next time your thinking about breeding your dog, or getting that puppy from a backyard breeder, think of the all of the active cases on www.petfinder.com who all need a good home and instead of contributing to the problem by justifying the surplus of dogs in North America by purchasing one, adopt one instead.

I have two beagles, one came from the Toronto Humane Society and one from Kennel Inn in Newmarket. Myself and my girlfriend are fostering the dog that came from kennel in, getting him back in shape so that he may be adopted out. They are both great loving, and gentle dogs and I'll be sad to see Toby go when we adopt him out but we are trying to do our part to help this horrible problem. So again instead of breeding and buying, adopt.

reptiguy420 · 10-02-04, 06:48 PM

and thats YOUR opinion....nice thought but id much rather have a pure bred rather than some mangy whatever that was found on the streets with who knows what wrong with it.

Matt_K · 10-02-04, 06:53 PM

Most of the animals on Pet Finder are NOT, dirty old dogs that were found on the street.. Most of them are animals that people can no longer care for due to many different reasons.. Whether it be an elderly couple giving up their dog, people leaving the country or accidental puppies....

Here's my girl that I got from www.petfinder.com ..

reptiguy420 · 10-02-04, 06:57 PM

all im saying is to each there own....take it any way you see fit.There may be nice dogs there but i rather know EXACTLY where mine have been who they come from and i want references simple as that.Matt that is a good looking pooch though congrats for taking in a stray

capsicum · 10-02-04, 07:33 PM

I believe there are pros and cons to all methods of finding a pet, however it is the choice of each person

Personally I would take a rescue first over a bought dog, however sometimes you can't find the right dog as a rescue. For example if somewhere in Ontario was a dog for adoption, I could not adopt it since I am way over in BC. Even if the personality, breed, age, etc were all perfect, I still won't go there to get it.

But anyways, it's the responsibility of pet owners to be sure that their animals are sexually altered, and not reproducing. I do believe in breeders though, as otherwise we would lose the strong blood lines of many breeds, and I wouldn't want to see that happen

TK

Delirium · 10-02-04, 07:55 PM

If you want to adopt and are concerned about the type and temperment of a dog, go with a rescue as opposed to a pound. In almost all cases, the dogs are currently living in foster homes where that foster parent works with it, evaluates and then delineates that information down to the adopter. In fact, through this system, you are likely going to know what you are getting more so than in any other case with a pet. Even puppies on their first owner are unpredictable. With a rescue you generally have a solid history of the animal as well as a continued resource for assistance with the animal after the fact.

The aforementioned beagles. Toby, the foster, is the one in the back.

Hardly what i'd describe as mangy, although Toby is in fact a Mutt. Sneaky, the one in front, is from what we can tell a purebred beagle (possibly bluetick).

Also, keep in mind that if you ever find an animal that is too far away for you to adopt, many rescues will arrange for transports to occur. If you can pay to bring them to you, fine. However, in many cases it can happen free of charge through a network of volunteers who will drive them a leg at a time up to your location. Veng and I have participated in one such transport ourselves. A very rewarding experience that we were happy to participate in.

Dee

Vengeance · 10-02-04, 07:58 PM

reptiguy

But that's just it, it shouldn't be to each their own. The over population of dogs is more then a problem, its an epidemac. There are reputable rescues with full historys on almost all of their dogs. Instead of looking for the closest breeder it's much more benifical to look for the cloesest rescue. Not only are you helping the problem, but you can get exactly what your looking for at a cheaper price. There are so many diffrent avenues to take that using a breeder should be a last option instead of a first.

Capsicum

I understand that there are some rare blood lines that may need to be kept and would be a shame to lose. But at what cost are we keeping these rare bloodlines? Sure there is an exception to every rule but for every 1 rare bloodline there are thousands of others that are being exploited by the same trade. Backyard breeders and puppy mills selling these same animals with diffrent bloodlines. Now in a perfect world it would be great if we could identify which bloodlines needed to be kept going and allow them to continue to breed, but it's not. Everyone here is an animal lover in some way shape or form, can you honestly say that you would prefer to keep some bloodlines around at the cost of thousands of other dogs lives, and even then, the people buying these rare dogs, sometimes they still end up in pounds and shelters. At this point in time the only real solution is to stop breeding until the overpopulation has come under control. Breeding could never stop entirely of course but we need to get some sort of controll over the situation and the only way to do that is to make people aware of the problem

Matt_K · 10-02-04, 08:13 PM

Quote:

Originally posted by reptiguy420
Matt that is a good looking pooch though congrats for taking in a stray

Who said she was ever a stray???

She was brought to a Shelter cause her owners got divorced after the husband went to jail.. The wife was leaving the country and couldn't bring her with herself and the kids.. She'd been in a foster home for a couple months before I went and saw her.. She's been socialized and around other dogs and people her WHOLE life.. She never was and never will be a stray..

reptiguy420 · 10-02-04, 09:02 PM

exactly its the choice of each person and as i said a pound or whatever is definately not mine.So as i said to each their own.Great thing about america freedom of speech as well as choice, if you choose to be offended then so be it...but like i said just MY 2 cents plain and simple.It may be a wide spread problem and it sucks but its not my problem and im not going to take in any animals from a pound or puppy half way house thats all there is to it.No one on this site is going to change my mind about that.So as i said if you choose to take offense to this than thats YOUR choice, as it is my choice and my right to state my opinion

capsicum · 10-02-04, 09:07 PM

Quote:

Originally posted by Vengeance

Capsicum

I understand that there are some rare blood lines that may need to be kept and would be a shame to lose. But at what cost are we keeping these rare bloodlines? Sure there is an exception to every rule but for every 1 rare bloodline there are thousands of others that are being exploited by the same trade. Backyard breeders and puppy mills selling these same animals with diffrent bloodlines. Now in a perfect world it would be great if we could identify which bloodlines needed to be kept going and allow them to continue to breed, but it's not. Everyone here is an animal lover in some way shape or form, can you honestly say that you would prefer to keep some bloodlines around at the cost of thousands of other dogs lives, and even then, the people buying these rare dogs, sometimes they still end up in pounds and shelters. At this point in time the only real solution is to stop breeding until the overpopulation has come under control. Breeding could never stop entirely of course but we need to get some sort of controll over the situation and the only way to do that is to make people aware of the problem

No, I don't feel that a few lives are worth thousands of others. I have spent most of my adult life working with rescues, shelters, and abandonded animals.

All I am saying is that some breeders are doing great work with their chosen breed, and that should be acceptable.

I agree that backyard breeders (those not considering the needs and placement of each and every animal) and millers are not right, and they should not be allowed to breed their animals.

But I still stand but what I said, that pure breds need to be saved for the future of these animals.

As for rescue, I would deffinately be willing to help arrange a transport for the right animal (I have helped move smaller animals from one location to another in the past)

TK

spidergecko · 10-02-04, 09:26 PM

Quote:

Originally posted by reptiguy420
exactly its the choice of each person and as i said a pound or whatever is definately not mine.So as i said to each their own.Great thing about america freedom of speech as well as choice, if you choose to be offended then so be it...but like i said just MY 2 cents plain and simple.It may be a wide spread problem and it sucks but its not my problem and im not going to take in any animals from a pound or puppy half way house thats all there is to it.No one on this site is going to change my mind about that. So as i said if you choose to take offense to this than thats YOUR choice, as it is my choice and my right to state my opinion

Bingo to you!

Hundreds of thousands of dogs and cats end up euthanized every year because some people prefer a specific breed of animal rather than a mutt. But you're right. It's not your problem. In fact, the only ones with the problem are the ones that end up in the shelter.

No one needs to change your mind but I need to know one thing: what makes an inbred (purebred) animal more appealing than a mutt? Or is it just that you don't want an animal that has lived in someone else's home (maybe they smell or something) for an extended period of time? Rescues and shelters have puppies, too; virgin animals that don't smell like their previous keepers.

Will · 10-02-04, 09:29 PM

I agree, but disagree...

Personally every dog I have had, have now or ever will own, is a rescue. I agree, I've been in the shelter and see how many great animals do need a home. I agree that there are too many dogs out there that need a home, but...

A lot of people choose to show, compete, etc -- you can't do alot of that stuff with a mixed breed. Who am I to say they should or shouldn't be allowed to do what they want...

Also, try to tell a breeder(any breeder) that the animal they choose to work with will no longer be allowed to breed. Any breeders here, imagine if someone showed up one day and told you all that stock you spent years putting together and raising could no longer be bred.

"Sorry, Game Over..."

I'd like to hear ONE reptile breeder here stand up and say they'd be cool with that...

Restriction is very rarely the correct solution to anything. Education is almost always better, but unfortunately it is usually the biggest obstacle...

capsicum · 10-02-04, 09:33 PM

Quote:

Originally posted by Will
I agree, but disagree...[snippage]
Restriction is very rarely the correct solution to anything. Education is almost always better, but unfortunately it is usually the biggest obstacle...

I agree Will, didn't quite think of it that way o>

TK

leoncurrie · 10-02-04, 09:44 PM

Umm... what exactly is the point to this thread? Are you (Vengeance) just teling everyone your point of view on buying pure bred breeds? Or just complaining about the fact that everyone should share your point of view and buy animals from a shelter because the irresponsible owners allow there dogs to become pregnant and send the pups to shelters, ect... ?
IMO... I understand your frustration, however that does not give you the right to tell people what kind of animals they should be caring for.
I have both a mixed breed and a pure bred. I love them both dearly and equally.

Linds · 10-02-04, 10:00 PM

Leon and Will made some excellent points.

We have both rescues and pure. For longer than I've been alive, my parents have shown, and occasionally bred, English Setters. While if you want just a companion, it is fine to have a rescue, but some people want more from their animals - showing and breeding is very much a hobby just like snakes are. It isn't the professional breeders that are the problem at hand, generally it is mainly backyard breeders (not all), so there is absolutely no need to persecute any and all people that breed animals. While in an ideal world all the dogs would be rescued and there woudln't be a problem, but there are too many irresponsible people out there contributing to the stray, abused, and abandoned population - just because this is happening is no reason those that have a passion for specific breeds need to give that up. It won't change anything, other than the loss of pureblood, papered, good blood ('bad blood' comes from a lot of unregulated breeding) animals.