beginners

[Lrptls]

what do you all think the best venomous snake would be for a venomous snake beginner? (who has had alot of experience with non venomous snakes including medium sized boids, but never venomous) thanks

[jim mcallister]

I have no experience with hots, but i just want to be sure you know you want to do this. There is no room for error!!!! I'm sure you have thought about this alot but be sure!!! thanks

[Crotalus75]

Agkistrodon contortrix (copperhead) and Bothreichis schlegelii (eyelash viper) are two species that I recommend. Copperheads are moderate in size and temperment and are very easy to care for. They hook like champs! Eyelash vipers are also smaller and moderately toxic but can be a littlle more tricky in the husbandry department. Try to get well started captive bred specimens so that you can focus more on safe handling and less on medicating sick snakes or fighting to get them to feed.


....also make sure that you have all the proper equipment (hooks, hemostats, tubes) and secure LOCKING cages well before you acquire your specimens. Practice by using these tools with your nonvenomous snakes first.

With some of these animals you don't get a second chance. One mistake could cost you your life.

Here are some helpful links:

http://wwwDOTkingsnakeDOTcom/snakegetters/

http://www.tongs.com

[earthmover]

i would think i copperhead would be a good choice. i would not under any circumstance start with an eyelash though, they can be hard to keep feed and if you are a beginner handle, arboreal venomous can strike a great distance so i would definetly prepare with something different. also if you could sit in on someone else handling venomous reptiles and then participate some

[atheris]

what do you all think the best venomous snake would be for a venomous snake beginner?

There is no such thing.

Nobody cant recommend actually any venomous snakes. Dont take "practise" individuals, get the one you are really interested on. Starting point would be best if you have opportunity to shoot the breeze, plus see in practise what its like to hande such thing as venomous snakes. But best advice is, dont get any.


Just my opinion.

Kert Lipponen

WWW.HOTSNAKES.ORG

[Mustangrde1]

Please tell me i am reading this wrong!!!!!!!!

Dont take "practise" individuals, get the one you are really interested on.

So are you saying if a person is interested in a Black Mamba that is what they need to get first???

Nobody cant recommend actually any venomous snakes.

Actually we can make recommendations! A person living in North America would be far better off starting off with a Native venomous of low aggression and low toxcicity giving a person a chance if a bite occurs to survive it.

As for your Opinion on

But best advice is, dont get any.

You have a right to your opinion. However people that wish to get in to venomous keeping most likely will and the best advice is to tell them to work under a experianced handler.

[BWSmith]

One thing to also remember, you should know where the AV is located for your snakes. So naturally it is "safer" (NOT "SAFE") to choose a species that the AV is readily available, such as CroFab for North American Pitvipers.

And PLEASE, Venom 101 should be your bible! Read it, learn it, read it again. It far from complete, but the best so far.

[atheris]

So are you saying if a person is interested in a Black Mamba that is what they need to get first???

Basically yes, but using your own commonsense. My argue is that if this new beginner takes for example some Trimeresurus albolabris etc. only cause somebody did recommend this for a good first hot. But actually this beginner is really interested on Crotalus cerastes etc. So he/she will dump the albolabris pretty soon and cause he/she dosent have any interest to this species, also the handling could be unguarded. So when you get the one you really like, your interest will go on.
Hope you get the idea.

Actually we can make recommendations! A person living in North America would be far better off starting off with a Native venomous of low aggression and low toxcicity giving a person a chance if a bite occurs to survive it.

Still im not in the same boat with you in this issue. Giving advice is better than giving recommendations.

people that wish to get in to venomous keeping most likely will and the best advice is to tell them to work under a experianced handler.

Like i mentioned on my previous message.


Kert Lipponen

WWW.HOTSNAKES.ORG

[Mustangrde1]

Kert

It is far better to start with a native venomous to a persons country as the AV is most likely easier to obtain. If someone is interested in a specific herp yes in time they will get it . But far better to start off with proper trainning on less lethal animals.

Wouldnt it be far better to tell people get trainning first then work with a few native species to get some degree of understanding of what you will be dealing with. Who knows after seeing what they are going to have to deal with might turn them off hence the training first. But after training its far better to work with species with AV more available.

[C.m.pyrrhus]

Well Michelle,

I know ya from another room, er chat room that is. So to you I say it would be a good idea to read, research and get some experience from an experienced venomous snake collector before you get into it yourself. Here is a good short idea of what you need to understand. All in all you should have a great understanding of venomous snakes before you attempt to keep them at home. Honestly, I do not want to suggest any snake for you frankly because I feel you are not experienced enough about it yet. But if it is something you seriously want to do, there is no stopping ya, but would hope you understand how serious that kind of move is on your part. Being bit and squeezed by a large boa, having your hand tore by a monitor or what have ya is nothing to having a lil prick of some fangs from a venomous to teach you what pain means....if not a very good lesson on life. Do yourself the favor and research first eh.

[cantil]

I agree in principle that it is preferable to start with either native snakes or at least with snakes which have readily available antivenin and a low rate of mortality to begin with. However, by the time you begin keeping hots independently you should have sufficient experience working with them that the risk of a bite from any of the less aggressive more tractable ones is all but none existent. By that I mean that when your keeping hots, you should be prepared in case of a bite, but from the small stuff vipera, coppers, most arboreals, if you got nailed you screwed up. With most venomous snakes their is NO reason for you're hands to be within strike range.

Specifically I agree that coppers are the best choice for a starter for some reasons other than the availablility of anti-venin and the low toxicity. Its better to start with something a little wiry and prone to strike occasionally because this will keep you on your toes so to speak. If you start with some trimeresurus for instance they'll let you get bloody close before they do anything then...pow. Animals that are more ambush oriented make bad choices as starters because they encourage carelessness and complacency. They let you get away with errors and this compounds them until one day they catch you on that mistake you'd gotten away with a hundred times before.

[C.m.pyrrhus]

With all the venomous talk today, I wanted to add. I think it is a great idea to know how to deal with venomous in the wild long before your working with them in a captive situation. I know for some this is harder said than done, but it seriously is something that should be done IMO.

I am a "Mountain Mans" son , it was just something I grew up around. Part of everyday life. We had to trap and hunt for food, no such thing as a shopping center till I was way into school. I remember running into rattlers while checking trap lines with my dad, and even just going to the outhouse to do my 'duty.' I have relocated and removed snakes for years, dealt with them on a constant routine. Otherwise, I would not have the natural responce and understanding I do towards hots. I suggest that folks learning would understand the nessesary development of understanding the snakes before they even think about sharing space in their homes with one. Only after 'knowing' a snake will you fully understand what it takes to keep it.

[mark129er]

This debate is well and fine, but the best piece of advice I have seen in this thread yet recommended to get a well started captive born. I don't know about you but I sure as he!! wouldn't want to force feed a baby copperhead.

[Mustangrde1]

Captive Born are deffinately a good idea for anyone to begin with, It is a very royal pain in the butt cleaning up a wild caught animal and giving one Oral treatments is extemely dangerous. The bussiness end is never a fun place to be around.

[snakehunter]

[QUOTE] Giving advice is better than giving recommendations.[QUOTE]

arent these the same thing?

i would say go witha copperhead, it is a widley known species, and AV would be readily available