Hognose Twitching..

AwesomeGuy376 · 03-23-16, 04:27 PM

So now shes twitching and movine around really fast.. Ive read online about males twitching for breeding and i dont know if its the same for females but its making me nervous.. She just started doing it today out of no where. She did have a prevent-a-mite treatment a week ago, but others on the forums said the effects wouldve happened then.. Is this normal?

Albert Clark · 03-23-16, 04:59 PM

I doubt that it's related to the provent a mite that was 1 week ago. If she were going to have a reaction to that it would've been within 24 to 48 hrs. later. Can you move her to a different enclosure temporarily? Is she in a communal enclosure?

**Minkness** · 03-23-16, 05:17 PM

I would need to see a vid of this. But for now I would get her in a sterile tub with paper towels. Give her a good soak, maybe 2, then put her in the tup without any water.

I have heard hogs react poorly to PAM. Hopefully yours will be ok.

**Andy_G** · 03-23-16, 05:43 PM

Please post a video. I have heard of staggered reactions to PAM with western hognose, but for reasons that Albert already touched on, that's not usually the case.

AwesomeGuy376 · 03-23-16, 06:18 PM

Heres a video- https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=ypSY...ature=youtu.be

I just took her to the reptile shop and they think its because of stress and not neurological.. idk man this seems pretty bad.. These were the same people that told me to treat her with PAM in the first place... Ugh i swear if she dies ima be pissed. Also i feel terrible cause its my fault.. Ugh..

Albert Clark · 03-23-16, 06:28 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by AwesomeGuy376

Heres a video- https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=ypSY...ature=youtu.be

I just took her to the reptile shop and they think its because of stress and not neurological.. idk man this seems pretty bad.. These were the same people that told me to treat her with PAM in the first place... Ugh i swear if she dies ima be pissed. Also i feel terrible cause its my fault.. Ugh..

AG, that presentation does look suspicious of a Provent a mite reaction. Sorry to see that. Involuntary jerking and twitching is very suspicious. Unusual to happen so long after the treatment. Main thing is to get her away from the enclosure into a fresh air area and decrease anything that may be stressful. When did the twitching begin? Because if they survive the initial 24 hrs from the time symptoms begin the toxicity wears off considerably. And survivability is very good. Well, PAM is a great mite killer but it has to be used correctly and unfortunately the manufacturer doesn't differentiate in hatchling dose, juvenile dose, and or a adult dose to be used. The main thing is to make sure to keep her in a place where there is fresh air and adequate ventilation. A totally different enclosure for the next 72 hrs. Paper towels and a hide only with a different water dish. It's not your fault. You did the best you could with the information you had. These things happen brother. You had nothing but good intentions and things took a turn we didn't expect. No blame game, just work on getting her better. This is doable!

RAD House · 03-23-16, 06:35 PM

I had a garter snake that had a bad reaction to PAM and I hate to tell you but before he passed he was moving in a similar way. If this is the case then you need to move her to a clean tube right away and hope she can pull through. Did you spray her water or an area that does not entirely dry out? If not I would be surprised if the pam caused this after an entire week. Sorry to be the bearer of bad news, but I just want to prepare you for the worst. I will never use PAM on a snake again.

**Minkness** · 03-23-16, 06:36 PM

Definitely looks nuro to me. None of mine have ever exibited such behavior.

Please follow the instructions I posted earlier. If you treated her and had her in her cage with a full water dish, it may have washed into the water and she may have recently taken a drink of the poison.

Good luck man, sending healing vibes your way.

AwesomeGuy376 · 03-23-16, 06:59 PM

Ugh i feel so awful right now... I dont even know if ill be able to feel comfortable with my boa if she dies.. None the less another snake ever..

Nightflight99 · 03-23-16, 07:00 PM

Unfortunately, those are very likely symptoms of permethrin poisoning. Your best bet is to leave that snake alone and let it rest (no feeding!). Symptoms are normally quick to develop immediately following exposure, but this is far too pronounced to be an unrelated and coincidental issue.

I would also talk to the owner of the pet shop: regardless of the outcome of this, it would be in their best interest to offer to make up for their poor advice. Granted, it was obviously an unintentional mistake on their part, but they would be well served in accommodating you in some way.

AwesomeGuy376 · 03-23-16, 07:05 PM

I doubt theyll do anything.. Even today the manager pretty much blamed me like i shouldve known better... This week has been a nightmare.. I swear sometimes i regret even going to the shop and getting the boa knowing all this would happen.. Now if she dies im gonna have an emtpy cage with over $200 worth of equipment.. And ill never have the confidence to own a snake again

RAD House · 03-23-16, 07:10 PM

Don't be too hard on yourself most people who have been in the hobby have had a snake die because of a mistake they made. You were trying to do the best thing for your snake based on something that you though was from a reliable source, unfortunately it was not. I think you can learn from this that the more research you do the better off your animals will be. Don't let your other animal suffer because of the loss of this one, and there is a chance that your little hognose may pull through this.

AwesomeGuy376 · 03-23-16, 07:13 PM

I would never let them suffer. If anything id sell my boa cause i think hed be better off that way.. Or just wait a week and deeply think about if i trust myself with a snake.. Killing one of the easiest snakes to care for is a huge punch to my confidence..

Albert Clark · 03-23-16, 07:18 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by AwesomeGuy376

I doubt theyll do anything.. Even today the manager pretty much blamed me like i shouldve known better... This week has been a nightmare.. I swear sometimes i regret even going to the shop and getting the boa knowing all this would happen.. Now if she dies im gonna have an emtpy cage with over $200 worth of equipment.. And ill never have the confidence to own a snake again

Well, don't take a all is lost type of outlook. The main thing is to try and get the hog nose to a well ventilated area and have her try and eliminate as much of the poisoning as possible. She does look to be a animal that is in good shape and has some mass to her where she can overcome the exposure. Time is going to be the biggest indicator of which way this will turn out. You have to try and believe she will pull through. Don't even think about her dying right now bc she hasn't. Fingers crossed and hope alive!

AwesomeGuy376 · 03-23-16, 07:21 PM

Im just a naturally negative person i guess (bad family past..). I just think realistically. And shes in a new tub with air and isnt doing any better after soaking.. I just feel so bad knowing i did this..