Retic (Esmeralda) not Feeding

[guyabano]

Hey guys, what do you usually do when a snake goes off feed? Last time she fed was about a month ago, right before she went pre-shed blue. She shed on a Saturday so I tried feeding the next evening. She didn't take it after an hour, so I took the rat out and went to bed. I tried again three days after and I observed the most peculiar behavior.
Usually, I open up the enclosure and she goes for one of her hides but leaves her head out. She sees the rat, stalks it and takes it. This time, she stalked it, direct movement, quick tongue flickering but then she just froze 3 inches away. Didn't move for a couple of minutes and she just turned around and went to the other side of the enclosure. Tried it again the next Sunday, same thing.

Since then, I've left her alone and skipped the Sunday after that. I plan to try again tomorrow. What do you guys think?

She seems to have lost some weight, but I keep her hydrated.

[Lankyrob]

Personally if a snake misses a feed i just leave it be until the next scheduled feed. If it misses two i then double check all temps and humidity and then leave it be.

I had a GTP not feed from October last year til April this year, he then ate once and has missed all feeds since. As long as they arent losing condition it isnt an issue, if they start to lose condition then a vet visit is in ordre.

[Hillsberry]

Weird for a Retic. How long have you had her? Is she a Wild Caught? How old is she? Please tells us the temps in the cage.

[guyabano]

Thanks for the replies. She is a wild caught. Not quite sure how old, but she is 4'5" long. Temps are no cooler than 28C no hotter than 32C. Last night, I tried a smaller rat, she still didn't take it. I'm starting to get a little worried ._.

[Hillsberry]

How long have you had her? You need to let her settle, only bother her when you have to clean water/cage. I am heard rubbing chicken down feathers helps get them to feed. Don't offer door for at least a week. I am guess she may be stress. Lower the cool side of the enclosure to about 78F.

[millertime89]

pics of her enclosure?
Let the temp drop a little bit, go 25-30C
What's your humidity at?
Are you 100% positive she is a she?

[guyabano]

How long have you had her? You need to let her settle, only bother her when you have to clean water/cage. I am heard rubbing chicken down feathers helps get them to feed. Don't offer door for at least a week. I am guess she may be stress. Lower the cool side of the enclosure to about 78F.

I've had her for about 6 months now and she has been a shy eater, but prior to this has never missed a feeding. I was slowly getting her used to my presence around her enclosure while she fed so that I could eventually get her to take pre-killed. I tell ya, of all the retics to get back into the hobby with, I've never had this much trouble with a specimen. Even the poo smearers. :rolleyes:

I live in a tropical country, so dropping the thermostat isn't an option I am lucky to have. Will a large tub that she can soak in suffice?

[guyabano]

pics of her enclosure?
Let the temp drop a little bit, go 25-30C
What's your humidity at?
Are you 100% positive she is a she?

This is what she's currently housed in. I don't have any current pictures, but imagine it with a branch in the middle, a shallow water dish about 5in in diameter and two half terra cotta pots on either side as hides.
http://i290.photobucket.com/albums/ll261/miGsKills/IMG_0281_zpsfeee3911.jpg
Humidity is whatever is outside. I live in a country naturally populated by retics so it shouldn't be an issue. I do mist the enclosure when she is shedding though. I'm about 80% sure that "it's" a female. Either that or a fat male with a relatively short tail. :)
If you don't mind me asking, what does the gender have to do with it?

[millertime89]

A male at that size is sexually mature, they will sometimes go off food when they want to breed. Tail length isn't the best indicator of gender in retics IMO. I've seen plenty of long tail females and short tail males. Best to probe or pop. Try covering half the cage door in something dark to provide a little extra security for the snake. What size is the cage? Looks good sized.

[waf]

Hi! if you have it since 6 months ago, and she (or he) was feeding well, this behavior is unnormal. I think it could be one of two things: 1) if its an adult, they get off food getting ready to mate. 2) some disease is occuring. In general, Esmeraldas are pretty picky, I had that behavior with one of my BCC and she was diseased with stomatitis. Friend, my suggestion is to take her to the vet ASAP.
Regads.........

[guyabano]

A male at that size is sexually mature, they will sometimes go off food when they want to breed. Tail length isn't the best indicator of gender in retics IMO. I've seen plenty of long tail females and short tail males. Best to probe or pop. Try covering half the cage door in something dark to provide a little extra security for the snake. What size is the cage? Looks good sized.

Oh wow. All this time, I thought they were sexually mature at around 7ft. I don't have access to a probing kit right now. Would it still be safe to pop at this size? I might have to hold him/her down. Might not help with her trust issues.
The enclosure is a 4x2.

Quick update, looks like Esme is shedding again. Didn't feed once between the last time and this one. Odd.

[guyabano]

Hi! if you have it since 6 months ago, and she (or he) was feeding well, this behavior is unnormal. I think it could be one of two things: 1) if its an adult, they get off food getting ready to mate. 2) some disease is occuring. In general, Esmeraldas are pretty picky, I had that behavior with one of my BCC and she was diseased with stomatitis. Friend, my suggestion is to take her to the vet ASAP.
Regads.........

Best case scenario I'm hoping for is that it is indeed a sexually mature snake and this is normal. So far, she looks okay. Slimmer than I'm used to, but not unhealthy looking.

[millertime89]

Females generally don't go off feed when they reach sexual maturity unless they're gravid or sitting on a clutch. Yes its still safe to pop at 6 ft, I helped a friend do it on his 12 ft male. Its a little more difficult at that size as they like to fight you every step of the way but its definitely doable. He put them most of the way in the cage and closed the door so only the vent and tail tip were sticking out to keep the snake from whipping around and biting in case it decided it wanted to. Males can definitely still reach sexual maturity at 6 ft, every snake is different, some will go even smaller.

[guyabano]

Females generally don't go off feed when they reach sexual maturity unless they're gravid or sitting on a clutch. Yes its still safe to pop at 6 ft, I helped a friend do it on his 12 ft male. Its a little more difficult at that size as they like to fight you every step of the way but its definitely doable. He put them most of the way in the cage and closed the door so only the vent and tail tip were sticking out to keep the snake from whipping around and biting in case it decided it wanted to. Males can definitely still reach sexual maturity at 6 ft, every snake is different, some will go even smaller.

Awesome. The more I think about it, the more it would make sense that she is in fact a he. I'll wait 'til after the shed to pop just to be sure. I'll keep you all posted.

In case Esme is indeed a he, what should I call him instead? I need ideas. :)

[guyabano]

"E" shed yesterday, got her out of the enclosure and she came out fighting. I popped and didn't quite see two phalluses sticking up at me, but I did see two red bumps that may have been musking me at the time.

I'm leaning towards her being a female, but experts please chime in. Can a male also just show those two bumps? Maybe he(?) had some performance/shrinkage issues being restrained and all. Guys, y'all know what I mean. . some dudes like being restrained though. This is going off on a really weird tangent, yet I can't stop typing.

Thoughts?

[millertime89]

Sounds like you did it right so probably a female, but I had a male BP that just couldn't be popped, don't suppose you can get a probe and check that way can you?

[guyabano]

Hmm, how does one go about making a probe? Kits are very hard to find here where I live. If I ordered one, I'd probably get reamed on taxes. Still doesn't quite answer why she isn't eating though.

[waf]

As I told you before... it could be a disease, take it to the vet ASAP.

[guyabano]

As I told you before... it could be a disease, take it to the vet ASAP.

I did see a vet for a consultation. Apparently, she's in perfect health. Still active and responsive. Colors still bright as ever, staying hydrated. She doesn't act defensive towards the rat apart from when it goes up to her and touches her in the first few seconds. She flinches and the rat goes away. She then stalks it for a minute or two, getting close enough to strike and then backs away and goes to her corner.

I haven't regularly handled her since she started skipping meals. I was thinking that without handling, she might never calm down. Should I just leave her be until she starts feeding again or can I handle her?

pardon the iphone pic, this is what she looks like right now.
http://i290.photobucket.com/albums/ll261/miGsKills/Snakes/IMG_1365_zpsd964a419.jpg (http://s290.photobucket.com/user/miGsKills/media/Snakes/IMG_1365_zpsd964a419.jpg.html)

[waf]

well... at least you are confident that she is healty, that´s good! In my opinion, you should continue handling, as normally, if all parameters are ok, the vet says she`s ok, and you look her in good condition, your girl is OK! you only have to wait a little more.. I have a boa (female) who stop feeding one day, and didn`t get a meal, for 4 months.. she drove me crazy, and one day... just started again.

[guyabano]

well... at least you are confident that she is healty, that´s good! In my opinion, you should continue handling, as normally, if all parameters are ok, the vet says she`s ok, and you look her in good condition, your girl is OK! you only have to wait a little more.. I have a boa (female) who stop feeding one day, and didn`t get a meal, for 4 months.. she drove me crazy, and one day... just started again.

Thanks man, that's really reassuring.

I'll keep you all posted on what else I find out. I was talking to a friend in the industry and I might be able to get access to a probe kit.

[millertime89]

I don't know how to go about making one, I would be unsure. I wouldn't worry about it too much honestly if the vet says she's in good health. She might just not want to eat, it happens sometimes.

[guyabano]

I don't know how to go about making one, I would be unsure. I wouldn't worry about it too much honestly if the vet says she's in good health. She might just not want to eat, it happens sometimes.

Can't get enough reassurance at this point. I just haven't had a retic go off feed before. :)

Anyway, here's a pic from yesterday when I got her out of the enclosure. For some reason, she thinks she could pass for a ball python.

http://i290.photobucket.com/albums/ll261/miGsKills/Snakes/IMG_1394_zps077e7675.jpg (http://s290.photobucket.com/user/miGsKills/media/Snakes/IMG_1394_zps077e7675.jpg.html)

If you notice, she's also grown quite a bit from when I took my avatar picture. Didn't really notice myself till I had the picture taken.

[Ivanator]

She's a gorgeous snake! When do you normally try to feed her (day or night)? You shoykd try feeding her at night since shes wc and they are naturally nocturnal. See if that helps. Also, I would stop handling her until she starts feeding again. Just my 2 cents.

[guyabano]

She's a gorgeous snake! When do you normally try to feed her (day or night)? You shoykd try feeding her at night since shes wc and they are naturally nocturnal. See if that helps. Also, I would stop handling her until she starts feeding again. Just my 2 cents.

Thanks! I've always fed at night. I'll keep trying every other week to see if she takes.

About the handling, I feel like I'm walking a fine line here because since she is wild caught, she's got a bit of a temper. I stopped handling for about a month when I realized that she wasn't feeding and she started striking again. Prior to that, I got her to where the most she would do was flinch at a touch and go into the 'S' form but not strike. Ideas?

[Ivanator]

I've never had experience with a wc retic before, but me, personally, would just try to get her to start eating again first. You might have to reteach her to trust you again once she's eating, but having a healthy, feeding snake is more important than having a tame one.

[waf]

A WC will be more difficult to deal with, so, patience will be a main factor in this situation. as Ivanator says, get her to start eating again first, then, start handling her in a daily basis, starting 10 minutes, then 20 then 30.... but with a lot of patience....

[guyabano]

Hey guys, quick update on Esmeralda. She shed a second time without any meals in between last Friday. Tried giving her an appropriately sized male rat from my colony. She struck at it twice but didn't take.

She isn't showing any signs of losing condition at all, I haven't handled her since ^ that picture up there. Still active at night and in the morning doing the retic dance. Got a "kiss" from her a week and a half ago when I was spot cleaning her enclosure.
http://i.imgur.com/qebP3Vj.jpg

I know I shouldn't be worrying too much, but I'm sure you guys can relate when I say that I enjoy seeing my pets well fed. I often find myself pleading to a reptile to just eat something.

I heard someone mention offering up smaller prey items to get brooding ball pythons back onto food. I'm considering buying her a mouse just to see if it will whet her appetite. Would it be safe for her to feed on something that is no bigger than her own head?

Thanks for the replies guys, I appreciate all of them.

[millertime89]

Yes its safe and worth a shot. If she's still shedding and drinking and urinating I would say you're still in the clear. Do you feed live or do you kill the rat prior to offering? If you kill the prey item try offering live, that got two of mine that went off feed to start eating again and after a few live feeds they went back to frozen/thawed or pre-killed.

[guyabano]

Yes its safe and worth a shot. If she's still shedding and drinking and urinating I would say you're still in the clear. Do you feed live or do you kill the rat prior to offering? If you kill the prey item try offering live, that got two of mine that went off feed to start eating again and after a few live feeds they went back to frozen/thawed or pre-killed.

She likes 'em live. I was in the process of getting her to try a prekilled, but then she just stopped altogether. I never got past a live one held with tongs.

I'll try a mouse this weekend and see if she takes it. Thanks for the info!

[guyabano]

YESSSSS!!!!!!

At around 17:20 today, she took a rat!

I had just finished playing some fetch with my dog and I was bouncing the tennis ball. It got away from me and hit her enclosure. She quickly darted out to investigate and I just knew that she was FINALLY ready for some food. I hurried up to the roof deck where I keep my rat colony and picked out a medium sized rat. Plopped it into the enclosure, it peeked its head into the clay pot and came out with a snake attached to it.

Here's hoping she takes another one next week. Fingers crossed!

(sorry for the picture quality, iPhones don't really excel at taking indoor photos at sundown)

http://i290.photobucket.com/albums/ll261/miGsKills/Snakes/IMG_1537_zps050a9c1f.jpg (http://s290.photobucket.com/user/miGsKills/media/Snakes/IMG_1537_zps050a9c1f.jpg.html)

http://i290.photobucket.com/albums/ll261/miGsKills/Snakes/IMG_1538_zpsbfe5a8b7.jpg (http://s290.photobucket.com/user/miGsKills/media/Snakes/IMG_1538_zpsbfe5a8b7.jpg.html)

http://i290.photobucket.com/albums/ll261/miGsKills/Snakes/IMG_1540_zps3c446316.jpg (http://s290.photobucket.com/user/miGsKills/media/Snakes/IMG_1540_zps3c446316.jpg.html)

http://i290.photobucket.com/albums/ll261/miGsKills/Snakes/IMG_1541_zps31f0faec.jpg (http://s290.photobucket.com/user/miGsKills/media/Snakes/IMG_1541_zps31f0faec.jpg.html)

Thank you to all who contributed and helped me out in my time of need. I'm glad to be a part of such a wonderful online community. :)

[dave himself]

Glad to see she's eating for you again :)

[Amadeus]

Yess. Looked like she really enjoyed taking down that vile rodent.

[Ivanator]

Congrats! Now just make sure she eats a few more times for you before you start trying to handle her again. Out of curiosity, is that bin she's in a feeding bin or what she's housed in? I'm just asking cuz I thought you had that nice big cage that you built for her.

[guyabano]

Thanks Dave!

Amadeus, I foresee my rat colony taking a sizable hit to their population.

Ivanator, Thanks! That is actually what I keep her in for now.
Kind of a long story, but here it goes. A little before she went off feed, she already stopped using hides in the bigger enclosure. She fed normally in that state, but when she went off feed, she would always get defensive as soon as I slid the glass open. I got them with rollers in the tracks because I though it would make it quieter. Now instead of a sliding, scraping sound, it kind of makes a low rumble. Go figure. It didn't seem to bother her before, but for some reason, it agitated her quite a bit during that period.
I decided to move her to a smaller enclosure in hopes that she would feel more secure. It's also much quieter to open. I can get in and out to fill her waterbowl, spot clean etc. without bothering her too much. She's still has enough room, she's around 4.5ft. and the enclosure is a 3ft x 1.5ft.

[guyabano]

Quick update. I wanted to post another successful feeding today but it seems like Esmeralda had something else on mind. She's shedding right now, so I'll be trying again once she's done.

[guyabano]

She shed last night, fed her this afternoon. She took another! I gave her a larger rat from my colony and she had no problems taking it down.

So glad this ordeal is over. Now I can get back to taming her down and getting her to take pre-killed.

[strictaz]

Very glad she's eating. Beautiful tic! How long was she off feed for?

[guyabano]

Very glad she's eating. Beautiful tic! How long was she off feed for?

Thank you!

I checked my records and the she was off feed for a whole 2 months and 23 days.

[waf]

Very unnusal for a retic.....

[strictaz]

Yes very unusual. I've got a baby burm that's also not eating... I hate the unusual :(

[waf]

My retic never skipped a meal, just when shedding. If all parameters are ok, the only thing I know make retics not to eat properly is a disease or parasitics..

[strictaz]

Not true. There are more picky retics and burms than you'd think. Especially younger ones. Takes a while to get them on their way to being bottomless pits lol.

[waf]

hummm... I will consider myself a lucky guy!