View Full Version : Savannah Monitor Redemption
Hi All,
I am a failed savannah monitor owner many months ago. Using the wrong info from books and internet causing gout and death of my baby savannah named Nugget. After it was too late I came across infernelis's website and started learning about the right ways of keeping savannahs. Also got the book about the truth about savannah monitors(recently got a better/clearer version from this forum) But I have been reading a lot of the correct info for the past few months.
Today I will be receiving 2 baby savannahs! No clue what sex they are. I'm very excited but almost worried at the same time that I will do something wrong. So I want to keep here a journal of what I'm doing so that people can quickly correct me if I'm doing something wrong.
I had sand before this, which now I know is bad but here below is what I have got now, and what I'll get in a couple months.
I converted my old dessert tank into a moist tank.
- aprx 2ftx4ftx3ft
- half a foot of soil/sand mix(75%/25%) (moist but not wet on the top, except when I dump water in it)
- Right side is raised brick with a MVB bulb + ceramic bulb that yields a 130F basking spot
- left side has no heating which gets coldest of 75-80F ambient
- and anywhere between the 2 points is a gradient b/t the 2 points of temps, avg(middle part is 85-90F)
- tank is sealed with just a couple small gaps on the top that doesn't let much moisture or heat out. Humidity can be 60-70% I can feel the humidity when I open the tank in my face.
- I need the ceramic emitter because it's cold here at night and when the light turns off the emitter will prevent the cage from cooling down.
This tank will last a couple months for the babies, then I'll be building a 8x4x4feet tank this summer, that's as big as I can make to fit in my house. Using the same technique above except, I won't be using MVB, but
- 3 flood light halogen 45W,
- with 1 UVB coil bulb
- I'll be putting in 1.5ft of soil/sand mix
- I wanna add some roly polies and spring tails if I can find any, also earth worms in the soil
- I want to try to make the substrate bio-active
I plan to give them crickets and super worms. Not sure if I can dust that many crickets since they eat lots, so should I just feed the crickets fruits, grains and fluker's high calcium cricket food? Or can I mix reptile calcium powder into whatever I feed the crickets/worms? I need some guidance in this area, couldn't really find any good info about this specific area.
Anything else you see wrong here, please let me know! I'm here to make sure I'm doing things right this time.
I'm so excited! I've been counting down to this day! Please do not let me screw this up! And I'll be posting pictures and maybe videos! Then I'll keep updating this thread to keep everyone updated on what's going on, etc... thx!
p.s. I got a temp gun so I measure correctly.
Also an extra info is that since I got my substrate setup for a few weeks now, when I water it, many times I smell mold for a little while.... not sure what this is going to do. But I assume as long as there's soil, there's gonna be some kind of mold in there, cuzz moist plus warmth = breeding ground for mold?
My sav started with an enclosure almost identical to yours and he done fine. Although if I were to start over again I would start off with the full sized. My guy hasnt ate in 2 weeks due to the stress of moving. Also make sure your doors are fitted with locks on the new one. Mines figured out how to open them if not closed over tightly lol
Edit: dont know about the bulb and emitter though. I used 2 50w flood lights
murrindindi
03-20-13, 01:35 PM
Hi, can you give the size in length, width and height? Also, what`s the make and wattage of the UVB bulb and why that instead of the low wattage halogens? An 8 x 4 x 4 feet enclosure is the minimum size recommended for ONE monitor, not two!
I`d also like to ask why you`ve bought two monitors which might need separately at any time before you`ve got experience with keeping even one healthy? Absolutely no disrespect, it`s just a question.
Pirarucu
03-20-13, 04:24 PM
Sounds to me like you're good to go, though if you can I'd raise the basking temp to over 140F, they just do better from what I've seen. I'd also get them in the larger cage as soon as you can, and see if you can't set up something bigger. Maybe set it up in a corner and extend it?
DeadlyDesires
03-20-13, 04:30 PM
8x4x4 is only size for 1 monitor.. you WILL deff need bigger...
DeadlyDesires
03-20-13, 04:34 PM
Hi All,
This tank will last a couple months for the babies, then I'll be building a 8x4x4feet tank this summer, that's as big as I can make to fit in my house. Using the same technique above except, I won't be using MVB, but
- 3 flood light halogen 45W,
- with 1 UVB coil bulb
- I'll be putting in 1.5ft of soil/sand mix
- I wanna add some roly polies and spring tails if I can find any, also earth worms in the soil
- I want to try to make the substrate bio-active
I plan to give them crickets and super worms. Not sure if I can dust that many crickets since they eat lots, so should I just feed the crickets fruits, grains and fluker's high calcium cricket food? Or can I mix reptile calcium powder into whatever I feed the crickets/worms? I need some guidance in this area, couldn't really find any good info about this specific area.
thx!
dust anyway. i dust everything with calcium and once a week with a multivitamin, as for the substrate ... make it 2 ft. also dont use a coil uvb bulb get a florescent fixture its better with eh T5 high output bulbs..
DeadlyDesires
03-20-13, 04:38 PM
My sav started with an enclosure almost identical to yours and he done fine. Although if I were to start over again I would start off with the full sized. My guy hasnt ate in 2 weeks due to the stress of moving. Also make sure your doors are fitted with locks on the new one. Mines figured out how to open them if not closed over tightly lol
Edit: dont know about the bulb and emitter though. I used 2 50w flood lights
in my enclosure i have 3 60watt halogen flood lights for the day and a 150 watt emitter for night temps to stay up when i turn off all the lights..
also you started with an enclosure his size for 1<<<< sav, i just wanted to point that out. He will have 2 i believe he should start with an 8x4x4 enclosure for 2 and then go bigger from there..just my opinion.
murrindindi
03-20-13, 05:05 PM
Sounds to me like you're good to go, though if you can I'd raise the basking temp to over 140F, they just do better from what I've seen. I'd also get them in the larger cage as soon as you can, and see if you can't set up something bigger. Maybe set it up in a corner and extend it?
Hi, from what you`ve seen of captive hatchling monitors, why should the surface temp be over 140f, and how is that small " matchbox" with a full 6 inches of substrate "good to go" for two of them?
Pirarucu
03-20-13, 05:23 PM
Hi, from what you`ve seen of captive hatchling monitors, why should the surface temp be over 140f, and how is that small " matchbox" with a full 6 inches of substrate "good to go" for two of them?Wayne's certainly used temps that high, and if they use them, why not offer them? I'm not saying they can't do without them, the question is why should they?
Six inches is enough for a hatchling to burrow in, remember my premise was that a new cage be built sooner rather than later. By good to go, I meant that his new temps/humidity/knowledge should be sufficient to raise a Sav. I did not say his current cage was good for two adult savs, which is how you seem to have interpreted it. That cage is fine for housing two savs up to a bit under a foot, IMO.
Hi, can you give the size in length, width and height? Also, what`s the make and wattage of the UVB bulb and why that instead of the low wattage halogens? An 8 x 4 x 4 feet enclosure is the minimum size recommended for ONE monitor, not two!
I`d also like to ask why you`ve bought two monitors which might need separately at any time before you`ve got experience with keeping even one healthy? Absolutely no disrespect, it`s just a question.
Hi, don't worry I'm here for information and I filter out any emotional aspects from messages and just take the data.
I have an exo-terra mercury bulb 100w, that alone is not enough to yield 130F basking spot, and I don't want to get a really high wattage one as I read it can dry thing out easier so I got the low wattage one. Plus a ceramic heat emitter(as suggested in Ravi's book). Those 2 together gave me 130F basking spot and when night time comes it still keeps the tank warm, just a little cooler than day time.
Quote: "why you`ve bought two monitors which might need separately at any time" - I'm not sure I understand what that part of the sentence means, perhaps it's a typo of some sort. But I bought 2 because Ravi's book said it's good to house more than 1 monitors together as long as you monitor aggressions. I felt that I have gotten a lot of knowledge the past few months to succeed this time, plus I'm also going to be on this forum to take advices(hence this post), that's why I bought them.
I was under the impression that Infernelis also has a 8x4x4ft tank for his 2 monitors. Perhaps I got it wrong? Please correct me if I'm wrong...
I wouldn't mind raising that a little too. But so far the babies seem content with 130F, and they don't stay there very long(under 1 minute) before they become hyper active and start running around lol. They are VERY active haha.
Sounds to me like you're good to go, though if you can I'd raise the basking temp to over 140F, they just do better from what I've seen. I'd also get them in the larger cage as soon as you can, and see if you can't set up something bigger. Maybe set it up in a corner and extend it?
dust anyway. i dust everything with calcium and once a week with a multivitamin, as for the substrate ... make it 2 ft. also dont use a coil uvb bulb get a florescent fixture its better with eh T5 high output bulbs..
Please tell me the recommended complete lighting setup in your opinion, thx!
Hi, from what you`ve seen of captive hatchling monitors, why should the surface temp be over 140f, and how is that small " matchbox" with a full 6 inches of substrate "good to go" for two of them?
Please note that this enclosure is only going to exist for 2-3 more months. 6 inches substrate should be good for hatchlings. However, now that you mention 8x4x4 is too small for 2 adults, I might have to sell 1 if more experts on here concur with you.
Here's an update. I have gotten them finally, and after basking under 130F they became really active. I captures some photos and videos when they first started to move, but after I took them, they became even more active, literally running around the whole cage and eating crickets! They rejected small crickets and would only go for 5 week old crickets and they ate several each.
https://plus.google.com/photos/103641022791999749733/albums/5857533968660359681?authkey=CPnGurOry93_RQ
P.s. keep the feedback coming. If you feel the need to be hostile towards me that's fine as long as your feedback will help the monitors, that's the whole point.
DeadlyDesires
03-20-13, 08:02 PM
Please tell me the recommended complete lighting setup in your opinion, thx!
Recommended - is a cluster of 3 Halogen flood lights 45 watts for the basking area to achieve a good temp and gradient through the cage. however i found that this wasn't hot enough for me so i just upped a light wattage at a time until i achieved the temp i wanted and it came down to 1 -45watt halogen flood light and 2- 60 watt flood's ... i also put in a 150 watt ceramic heat emitter to use at night when i turn off all the lights. I have a Florescent light fixture in my cage (2ft long) with 2 - 10.0 uvb florescent bulbs in there. with that being said my hot side stays around high 90's and cool side mid 80's humidity strong on the cool side at 80% never less than that and hot side humidity is at 65 ish % down in my borrows its almost 100% humidity and the temps are mid 70's... i also have 2 feet of sand/soil mix in my cage as well.
DeadlyDesires
03-20-13, 08:04 PM
can you post some pictures of your whole enclosure please?
Recommended - is a cluster of 3 Halogen flood lights 45 watts for the basking area to achieve a good temp and gradient through the cage. however i found that this wasn't hot enough for me so i just upped a light wattage at a time until i achieved the temp i wanted and it came down to 1 -45watt halogen flood light and 2- 60 watt flood's ... i also put in a 150 watt ceramic heat emitter to use at night when i turn off all the lights. I have a Florescent light fixture in my cage (2ft long) with 2 - 10.0 uvb florescent bulbs in there. with that being said my hot side stays around high 90's and cool side mid 80's humidity strong on the cool side at 80% never less than that and hot side humidity is at 65 ish % down in my borrows its almost 100% humidity and the temps are mid 70's... i also have 2 feet of sand/soil mix in my cage as well.
Thanks for the details! I will try that setup when I have the large tank built. Also may I ask how big your tank is and how long have you had your sav(s) for? Were they babies when you first got them, etc?
Thanks!
can you post some pictures of your whole enclosure please?
Yes they are in my last post in this thread. Again this is not going to last for more than 2-3 months as in the summer I'll be building a new one.
can you post some pictures of your whole enclosure please?
oops sorry, those where just close ups, but the video will show you part of it and I'll be adding more to that album of the enclosure tomorrow!
DeadlyDesires
03-20-13, 08:14 PM
Thanks for the details! I will try that setup when I have the large tank built. Also may I ask how big your tank is and how long have you had your sav(s) for? Were they babies when you first got them, etc?
Thanks!
No Demon wasn't a baby.. i actually have my tank in the "monitor enclosure" thread if you wanna take a look. it came out to 7 1/2 long, 4ft high and4ft wide. my first sav i had from a baby died from unknown circumstances her growth had been stunted somehow before i got her i think and then my husbandry conditions didnt help any so she died a few months after i got her. the one i have now ive had a bit and hes thriving well.. he was sick when i got him so he is still getting better little by little.
The enclosure is now included in the album: https://plus.google.com/photos/103641022791999749733/albums/5857533968660359681?authkey=CPnGurOry93_RQ
DeadlyDesires
03-20-13, 08:17 PM
http://www.ssnakess.com/forums/varanid/90995-monitor-enclosure-discussion-thread-20.html
my enclosure is on page 20.. step by step on how i built it.
DeadlyDesires
03-20-13, 08:19 PM
the enclosure looks a bit run down.. you should start building the other right away so they can get in a better enclosure. that one looks like its going to fall apart. is there really duct tape onit?
The duct tape is actually not exposed, it's behind the heavy duty plastic linings. Also the tank will not fall apart I'm sure of it lol, not with the small guys anyways. And yes I have plans to build a way more sturdy enclosure as when they get bigger they will also be much stronger. But for the babies I think this tank will work fine. If you can point out the problems and why the babies will not do well in the current tank that would help too! But yes there's already plans to build the new one!
DeadlyDesires
03-20-13, 08:28 PM
The duct tape is actually not exposed, it's behind the heavy duty plastic linings. Also the tank will not fall apart I'm sure of it lol, not with the small guys anyways. And yes I have plans to build a way more sturdy enclosure as when they get bigger they will also be much stronger. But for the babies I think this tank will work fine. If you can point out the problems and why the babies will not do well in the current tank that would help too! But yes there's already plans to build the new one!
will deff need more pictures to determine weather they will do well.. i can't see it with the door closed its open. can't see it with the lights on so you cant really see inside the tank well..just take a whole bunch of pics and post them on here so we can see.
will deff need more pictures to determine weather they will do well.. i can't see it with the door closed its open. can't see it with the lights on so you cant really see inside the tank well..just take a whole bunch of pics and post them on here so we can see.
When the lights are on again in the morning I'll post more.
No Demon wasn't a baby.. i actually have my tank in the "monitor enclosure" thread if you wanna take a look. it came out to 7 1/2 long, 4ft high and4ft wide. my first sav i had from a baby died from unknown circumstances her growth had been stunted somehow before i got her i think and then my husbandry conditions didnt help any so she died a few months after i got her. the one i have now ive had a bit and hes thriving well.. he was sick when i got him so he is still getting better little by little.
hey just saw your tank, really nice I'll have to do something like that. But you said it's not a baby, but I saw a baby on that first picture.
DeadlyDesires
03-20-13, 08:36 PM
hey just saw your tank, really nice I'll have to do something like that. But you said it's not a baby, but I saw a baby on that first picture.
yes, that is the one i WAS building this tank for and she died before i could have it finished.. i was devastated.
after she died the tank sat in my living room for almost a month and i almost tore it down several times because i didnt know what to do anymore and i would just sit and stare at it and it made me more upset everyday so i got another to put in it.
yes, that is the one i WAS building this tank for and she died before i could have it finished.. i was devastated.
yikes... that sucks.
DeadlyDesires, I notice your tank has like I bars and then you stuff it with insulation materials. Is that required? Or will wood itself be fine?
I'm basically planning to make a wooden box with wood that is an inch thick and if it doesn't feel strong I'll have planks on the outside to reinforce it but no insulation.
DeadlyDesires
03-20-13, 08:56 PM
insulation is better for holding in heat and humidity, i would suggest insulating your cage.
insulation is better for holding in heat and humidity, i would suggest insulating your cage.
Maybe it would be a good idea. For my small tank now it's ok, but since a 8x4x4 box would be more than 4x the size of my current setup, it could be hard to keep the temp at the current level without insulation.
More question. My temp setup only uses heavy duty plastic sheets for water proofing the wood to prevent rot etc... I'm not sure I'd be able to find the same stuff that could line the new tank. I see many people use coating, but I have to build my stuff in the basement and I need a coating that will guarantee not to leak water but at the same time not have toxic fumes and must dry fast. Anyone know if home depot would carry anything like this? Also I think with plastic sheets, a grown monitor could cut it right open with their claws, so I think I will need to use some kind of coating.
Ok, they dug a burrow under the brick slab at 5pm last night and went to sleep.
It is now 9AM and I still don't see them... is this normal? Should I just leave them down there?
DiscoPat
03-21-13, 10:13 AM
They love to burrow. Do not disturb them in their burrows. When they are little you will probably not see them so often after they have a burrow.
Make sure the slab is sturdy and won't collapse though.
Mine still spends most his time in a burrow and he is quite large now.
They love to burrow. Do not disturb them in their burrows. When they are little you will probably not see them so often after they have a burrow.
Make sure the slab is sturdy and won't collapse though.
Mine still spends most his time in a burrow and he is quite large now.
Right. it's a pretty wide slab so lots of surface area to keep sturdy. I might just change it to a log instead just to be safe.
Also don't babies need to eat daily, so they need to come out at least each day to eat?
There's now a panoramic shot of the interior in the album: https://plus.google.com/photos/103641022791999749733/albums/5857533968660359681?authkey=CPnGurOry93_RQ
The inside is lined with several layers of heavy duty plastic for heat insulation and to water proof the interior. And and extra layer at the door as a curtain to guide jumping crickets back away from the ledge.
Don't mind the cricket container on the left side on the ground, I was about to put crickets in there for feeding but the monitors were still underground so I put it down and took a photo of the interior while I was at it.
The right side is a raise brick slab, I think I might replace that with a log just to be save, as that brick is kinda heavy and if for some reason their burrow causes it to collapse.. it might be bad...
I might replace that water dish with a non-white colored one, seems kind of unnatural .
The right side as said in the first post of this thread is a ceramic heat emitter and next to it a MVB 100w light. I put a tin foil above both of then to make it more effecient, basically just reflecting radiation(heat, etc) back down. It helped raise the basking temp by a couple degrees.
This is what they'll be in for the next 2 months until I get the 8x4x4 completed.
If you see anything that can be improved for the sake of the lizards please do share. I know the cage doesn't look like it's built by a craftsman, but I'm more interested in feedback that makes a difference to the lizards and not pleasing to the human eyes :)
https://lh6.googleusercontent.com/-hcDRdsT3X_o/UUs0hOnVqZI/AAAAAAAAQMQ/ks1_wg9ICPU/s1093/PANO_20130321_101739.jpg
lady_bug87
03-21-13, 02:28 PM
I just have one question..
The plastic looks like its kinda loose, is there any way that the hatchlings could manage to get trapped between the plastic and the side of the tank?
I just have one question..
The plastic looks like its kinda loose, is there any way that the hatchlings could manage to get trapped between the plastic and the side of the tank?
The first 2 layers are lined from bottom to top and there's no opening for them to get in. The next 2 layers are from top to just touching or almost touching the dirt( and not tugged into the dirt on purpose so things don't get trapped), like a curtain and they can't get trapped by that.
lady_bug87
03-21-13, 02:42 PM
Ohhh OK that makes sense I wasn't sure and I know next to nothing about varanids I was just curious
murrindindi
03-21-13, 03:00 PM
Hi, why is the enclosure so bare? There should be lots of hiding places (not just underground), you need a few stout, firmly fixed branches (they like to climb/explore every inch of their "home"), some relatively large plastic plants (for cover), especially around the basking and feeding areas. This is so they can move all around the enclosure without being seen easily, that means they are less stressed, which is healthy!
Hi, why is the enclosure so bare? There should be lots of hiding places (not just underground), you need a few stout, firmly fixed branches (they like to climb/explore every inch of their "home"), some relatively large plastic plants (for cover), especially around the basking and feeding areas. This is so they can move all around the enclosure without being seen easily, that means they are less stressed, which is healthy!
Thanks for the info. So place some plastic plants around the whole area, e.g. next to the brick, and next to the water dish? Could you give some pictures of what kind of plastic plants?
Pirarucu
03-21-13, 04:23 PM
Thanks for the info. So place some plastic plants around the whole area, e.g. next to the brick, and next to the water dish? Could you give some pictures of what kind of plastic plants?Anything that provides cover and breaks sight lines. Live plants would probably work too until they're a bit bigger. Leaf litter would also be a good idea.
so today is over and out of the 2 monitors only one came out of the burrow and went back in after exploring for jus10 minutes and never out again is this normal?
DeadlyDesires
03-22-13, 02:02 AM
so today is over and out of the 2 monitors only one came out of the burrow and went back in after exploring for jus10 minutes and never out again is this normal?
perfectly normal.. people dont see their monitors for days/weeks
smy_749
03-22-13, 05:17 AM
perfectly normal.. people dont see their monitors for days/weeks
People *who understand monitor behavior and respect it* don't see their monitors for days/weeks. People who want to see their monitor everyday will do so, ruining all sense of security in the process (nothing to do with the original poster, but deadlys post reminded me of one of the main reasons people are disappointed keeping monitors when they watch you tube videos of dave durham calling his by name and sleeping with them on the couch.
People *who understand monitor behavior and respect it* don't see their monitors for days/weeks. People who want to see their monitor everyday will do so, ruining all sense of security in the process (nothing to do with the original poster, but deadlys post reminded me of one of the main reasons people are disappointed keeping monitors when they watch you tube videos of dave durham calling his by name and sleeping with them on the couch.
If that's normal then I'm relieved. But I just felt worried because I thought babies will need to eat daily, and not coming out for days would mean starvation?
Wait... There seems to be a thin line b/t what I described, and what a lethargic and unhealthy monitor is... lethargic monitors will not move much... and normal monitors will not come out for days...
I have to agree. Id be very concerned if I didnt see my monitor for days or weeks, or at the very least evidence that they had been out for that long. Since yours are young, it may be that they are just only coming out when you are not around. In which case, thats fine. But if they arent coming out at all, that means you have a problem with your enclosure. Im guessing since yours are young, they are scared of you and so not coming out when youre around. Just leave the bugs in the enclosure and then they have the option of eating when they want to.
I have to agree. Id be very concerned if I didnt see my monitor for days or weeks, or at the very least evidence that they had been out for that long. Since yours are young, it may be that they are just only coming out when you are not around. In which case, thats fine. But if they arent coming out at all, that means you have a problem with your enclosure. Im guessing since yours are young, they are scared of you and so not coming out when youre around. Just leave the bugs in the enclosure and then they have the option of eating when they want to.
Well honestly I haven't been near the cage much so they aren't scared due to my presence, I put a web cam there(with motion alarm) so I know exactly what goes on and when something moves.
That's why I know 1 of the 2 came out yesterday for 10 minutes out of the whole day, that's exactly what happened. He did eat 1 cricket on camera. But the other never came out, unless when he went back in after the first 5 minutes, the other came back out in his place haha, but I don't think so.
Hopefully this is due to the fact that they just moved into my tank and they are not used to the env yet... But I'll observe for a few more days and see what happens.
Oh and Grendel and Jay who voted that my monitors will die soon. Please give insight on the reasons of their deaths so I can correct it. Just voting that they will die soon doesn't help me. Thanks!
smy_749
03-22-13, 09:00 AM
Just because you don't seem him out, doesn't mean he isn't out. My little roughneck is always out, just that when I walk towards the cage, he gets ready to dart into his burrow, and sure enough, when I peak in his cage, all I see is the end of his tail. Leave the food in there, he will eat it if hes healthy and hungry. Just make sure I guess that he has no reason to stay underground (humidity is ok, he has good basking, and its not TOO hot for him) and be patient. I dont know where I saw it, but someone had videos up of them tying food to a string, and dangling it in the monitors cage. I've been doing it, I have a fuzzy dangling mid air in his cage, and its very losely clipped onto one of those black paper clamps (dying may cause him to swallow the string)...its almost like a puzzle and having to make him work for it if hes shy to take from tongs still I guess. Sorry if that didn't make any sense I havent slept. Time to go to a wedding :no:
Just because you don't seem him out, doesn't mean he isn't out. My little roughneck is always out, just that when I walk towards the cage, he gets ready to dart into his burrow, and sure enough, when I peak in his cage, all I see is the end of his tail. Leave the food in there, he will eat it if hes healthy and hungry. Just make sure I guess that he has no reason to stay underground (humidity is ok, he has good basking, and its not TOO hot for him) and be patient. I dont know where I saw it, but someone had videos up of them tying food to a string, and dangling it in the monitors cage. I've been doing it, I have a fuzzy dangling mid air in his cage, and its very losely clipped onto one of those black paper clamps (dying may cause him to swallow the string)...its almost like a puzzle and having to make him work for it if hes shy to take from tongs still I guess. Sorry if that didn't make any sense I havent slept. Time to go to a wedding :no:
Not your own wedding I hope lol jk
p.s. I just wanted to share that I am using a technology to monitor my monitors(no pun intended LOLOL)
OK It's called iCam... so
- I got a ip camera(actually an old phone) setup by the tank, and it sees the tank.
- I got a software(free) called icamSource running on my computer, which has motion detection algorithms running, and will record(optional) and report any moving events(sensitivity is configurable)
- I got an app called iCam on my phone, that will BEEP when something moves in the tank.
On my phone I can look at my tank anytime anywhere, and I can also view and motion event footages anytime anywhere, meaning the computer will record the footages whenever a motion is detect so you can watch it later on(via my phone anytime anwhere) to see all the movements in the tank. This is how I know exactly what happens in my tank. I've tuned it so crickets will not be considered a motion even, but a monitor will be. This is a great setup if you wanna monitor your monitors without spooking them! You also won't have to glue your eyes to the phone because the motion detection will alert you as soon as something moves!
Pirarucu
03-22-13, 11:13 AM
Baby monitors are very shy, their first priority is to not be eaten. Wayne's weren't out much either when he first got them, and his cage was much less bare. Clutter up the cage and they will get bolder.
I will also say that they don't necessarily need to come out to eat. Some bugs will inevitably wander down into the seemingly safe burrows, and the Savs can just dart out and snag passing insects when they need to.
Baby monitors are very shy, their first priority is to not be eaten. Wayne's weren't out much either when he first got them, and his cage was much less bare. Clutter up the cage and they will get bolder.
I will also say that they don't necessarily need to come out to eat. Some bugs will inevitably wander down into the seemingly safe burrows, and the Savs can just dart out and snag passing insects when they need to.
starting at 10:45 I started getting some notifications about 1 of them coming out to roam/bask a little and back in. And when I walk by he runs back in. Always just 1 though, not sure if it's the same one I can't tell them apart yet since they don't really give me the chance just yet. Hopefully they are taking turns instead of one of them not being healthy... but again, I do know one of them is more shy than the other since the first day..
I'll give an update in a couple days.. I'll see what I can find to make the place more cluttered.
p.s. based on the video logs I captured, 1 monitor is very very active and roams around for hours.. while the other never comes out of the burrow.
murrindindi
03-22-13, 02:51 PM
Hi again, I buy plastic plants on Ebay, so try there, ferns and other relatively large "leafy" types are best, they are quite cheap to buy (at least over here in England). Do not buy the small aquarium plants, much too small and more expensive (especially from petshops).
If you can get some stout branches it will allow them to use more of the space, they love exploring, and get to know every sq cm of their "home" (up, down, and all around)!
smy_749
03-22-13, 05:07 PM
I dont know about canada or england, but over here, walmart and joannes fabric, michelles, any place with a "arts and crafts" section will have plants of all sizes. Last time I was in walmart they had some decent sized ferns for 80 cents so I bought like...15 of them.
I dont know about canada or england, but over here, walmart and joannes fabric, michelles, any place with a "arts and crafts" section will have plants of all sizes. Last time I was in walmart they had some decent sized ferns for 80 cents so I bought like...15 of them.
this fern is plastic right?
smy_749
03-22-13, 08:59 PM
this fern is plastic right?
Everything at these arts and crafts stores are plastic yes. I've become a strong advocate of alternate sources for reptile supplies. CVS heatpad with 3 settings working wonders, a 4 dollar walmart outlet timer, 4 dollar 45 watt halogen flood light, and so on and so forth. Before you buy, make sure you check all your local craft stores, some are much cheaper and have better variety than others. But you would be suprised at the selection they have, you can buy fake TREES, ferns, vines, moss, cork bark, and make a thick jungle for a decent price...
Added a plastic tree that has a hide on the bottom, added a hide on the left, replaced the heavy brick with a log I got in the yard. Still need some leaf litter when the snow melts and leaves grow back...
https://lh6.googleusercontent.com/-P6VINBRQsN0/UU41uMvln-I/AAAAAAAAQNE/mmnIHkmNk5Q/s1094/13+-+1
smy_749
03-23-13, 05:56 PM
I hope you didn't pay full price for that, those are like 27 - 40 dollars at petco and petsmart :-/. That could have been used to cover half the enclosure with fake plants! I don't like those ready made hides from petco, I had one that came with a setup I bought off craigslist similar to yours, and I put it in my fishtank (it was designed for aquariums), the paint slowly came off, making my water murky. The second problem is if a piece snaps off, they create VERY sharp corners. You could have easily picked up some logs for free from your back yard, bought lots and lots of fake plants, and even then , your save will probably just make his own hide and never use that anyways! (no offense, just saying that the petco decorations are a complete rip-off and your cash is better spent at craft stores or kept in your pocket and go outdoors)
I hope you didn't pay full price for that, those are like 27 - 40 dollars at petco and petsmart :-/. That could have been used to cover half the enclosure with fake plants! I don't like those ready made hides from petco, I had one that came with a setup I bought off craigslist similar to yours, and I put it in my fishtank (it was designed for aquariums), the paint slowly came off, making my water murky. The second problem is if a piece snaps off, they create VERY sharp corners. You could have easily picked up some logs for free from your back yard, bought lots and lots of fake plants, and even then , your save will probably just make his own hide and never use that anyways! (no offense, just saying that the petco decorations are a complete rip-off and your cash is better spent at craft stores or kept in your pocket and go outdoors)
Yeah I got the log from my yard so that's free.. but that tree I do feel ripped off but I thought it would be a good addition, at least for the next while. And you are actually right about the hide... When I took the original brick out of the enclosure(cuzz it seems dangerously heavy) I thought the savs would be under there, but they actually dug a tunnel under the brick and I have no clue where it leads but it's a deep tunnel that led somewhere far enough for 2 savs, cuzz one of their heads is as the hole when I lifted the brick then it was gone, so far in the hole that I can no longer see.
But yeah price aside I hope the addition of the log, the hide, couple rocks and the rip off tree would give them more coverage and feel more secure.. then when I have the bigger tank built it will be summer by then and no more snow out, I'd be able to find more stuff form the park for free. After all 8x4x4 would cost a lot to cover if bought from a pet shop.
Think I might not bother with fake trees this time around.. just grab a bunch of logs and leaf litter instead... maybe grow some grass if possible.
also I don't think I like plastic and paint..
smy_749
03-23-13, 09:21 PM
also I don't think I like plastic and paint..
Easiest way to cover it is with foliage (fake or real) , if you just buy a few big ferns or fake bushs and stick them in the ground, your entire enclosure will be covered for probably less than 20 dollars. I'll post a pic of some of the plants I found at walmart for 80 cents.
http://sphotos-a.xx.fbcdn.net/hphotos-frc3/894103_116209865237112_1475259661_o.jpg
http://sphotos-d.ak.fbcdn.net/hphotos-ak-prn1/901861_116209935237105_1181525826_o.jpg
Ofcourse they have bigger stuff/different looks, but this was just temporary, I think for that entire bundle on the carpet I spent 3 dollars...
So today I finally see 2 of them out at the same time, either that, or finally the other one is coming out. Although 1 is still out much more, like out since morning till now and non-stop roaming, and the other didn't come out till 11:30am and still shy. He's even scared of the other guy a little, he's huff or breathe real hard when the other guy approaches.. But when they are active, they move around a lot and real fast.
If the shy one continues to not be able to be relaxed around the other one, I guess I might have to sell him to prevent problems later on.
Today the active one started to be less and less fearful of my presence. I can actually move around to watch him and he won't bolt back in his burrow! He is also out a lot more today. He was out from 10am and roaming almost non stop till 7pm before he went back to his burrow! That's a lot of roaming!
Pirarucu
03-25-13, 03:57 PM
They come out of their shells with time, especially once they learn you have food.
The tree proved to be a good addition after all, there are crickets that go up there and they would get chased down by the babies. Great climbing exercises hehe.
P.S. the weather is getting warmer now and the cold end is going up to 84F is that going to be a problem? Should the cold end me more like 75F?
smy_749
03-25-13, 05:23 PM
The tree proved to be a good addition after all, there are crickets that go up there and they would get chased down by the babies. Great climbing exercises hehe.
P.S. the weather is getting warmer now and the cold end is going up to 84F is that going to be a problem? Should the cold end me more like 75F?
Get a thermostat to regulate it for you :-P problem solved
The problem is the heat is coming from the basking lights and if the thermostat turns off the heat source to lower the temp, there will be no basking spot for that period of time.
murrindindi
03-25-13, 06:10 PM
The tree proved to be a good addition after all, there are crickets that go up there and they would get chased down by the babies. Great climbing exercises hehe.
P.S. the weather is getting warmer now and the cold end is going up to 84F is that going to be a problem? Should the cold end me more like 75F?
Hi, if you`re still using the 100w MVB plus the 150w CHE you would be better to swap to the low wattage halogens now, I think the CHE is the reason the ambient temps are relatively high. You would be better changing to the low wattage halogens now, not when you build the bigger enclosure in several months. Yes, the cool side is too high at 84f, (if that temp is in the hides/burrows)?
No the burrows are like 75(due to the tank being in the basement) but above ground it's now 84F, whereas it was 75 very lowest before.
ok, I will change to low wattage halogen, But I need more advise before this switch...cuzz night time temps will drop(I'm in canada) without the light and I'm not sure I should keep the lights on all night, so once night time comes and lights turn off, without the CHE the cage will be too cold.
smy_749
03-25-13, 06:22 PM
No the burrows are like 75(due to the tank being in the basement) but above ground it's now 84F, whereas it was 75 very lowest before.
ok, I will change to low wattage halogen, But I need more advise before this switch...cuzz night time temps will drop(I'm in canada) without the light and I'm not sure I should keep the lights on all night, so once night time comes and lights turn off, without the CHE the cage will be too cold.
What about some sort of heatpad to keep night time temps on the warmside up? I would suggest a ceramic heater but you'd have moisture issues I guess. I'm curious as well how people keep there cages warm at night if they keep them in basements...
murrindindi
03-25-13, 06:28 PM
No the burrows are like 75(due to the tank being in the basement) but above ground it's now 84F, whereas it was 75 very lowest before.
ok, I will change to low wattage halogen, But I need more advise before this switch...cuzz night time temps will drop(I'm in canada) without the light and I'm not sure I should keep the lights on all night, so once night time comes and lights turn off, without the CHE the cage will be too cold.
It`s o.k, so long as the coolest ambient (air) is around 75f in the hides/burrows. The problem with the 150w CHE in particular is it`s drying out the air (lowering the humidity) during the day when the monitors are active (obviously it will rise at night when the basking bulb is off, and they are resting in their hides). Providing there are always cooler, darker places to retreat to, it`s fine to keep the heat/lights on 24/7 if you wish (or at least `til the warmer weather comes).
DeadlyDesires
03-25-13, 06:34 PM
What about some sort of heatpad to keep night time temps on the warmside up? I would suggest a ceramic heater but you'd have moisture issues I guess. I'm curious as well how people keep there cages warm at night if they keep them in basements...
i use a heat emitter and have no issues with humidity dropping in my tank..but my tank it built right. anyway. my ambients are always high.. my cool side is mid 80's and my hot side is around 100 my basking 152 degrees this is and i just leave it.. he doesn't seem to mind.. his borrows are mid 70's usually.
My CHE is one 24/7 and at night the CHE is what keeps the cage's cold end at 75F, without the CHE night time temp would be too cold for monitors to survive.
Day time, the CHE combined with the other bulb will yield 130F for basking spot. So it's perfect, and the cold end was 75-80F before.. but now the weather is warmer and the basking spot is still 130F but cold end temp is now 85F.
so I think even if I change the basking spot to use 3 halogens, as long as I make it add up to 130F basking, the result on the cold end will still be facing the same problem, being, everything is good during winter seasons, but when summer hits, the temp is thrown off... to get the left side to cool off will mean lowering the basking temp which is not good.
Only thing I can think of now is to lower basking temp, but raise the wooden log basking spot so the basking spot is closer to the lights to see if it will be 130.
I'll need to try that out.
smy_749
03-26-13, 07:09 AM
My CHE is one 24/7 and at night the CHE is what keeps the cage's cold end at 75F, without the CHE night time temp would be too cold for monitors to survive.
Day time, the CHE combined with the other bulb will yield 130F for basking spot. So it's perfect, and the cold end was 75-80F before.. but now the weather is warmer and the basking spot is still 130F but cold end temp is now 85F.
so I think even if I change the basking spot to use 3 halogens, as long as I make it add up to 130F basking, the result on the cold end will still be facing the same problem, being, everything is good during winter seasons, but when summer hits, the temp is thrown off... to get the left side to cool off will mean lowering the basking temp which is not good.
Only thing I can think of now is to lower basking temp, but raise the wooden log basking spot so the basking spot is closer to the lights to see if it will be 130.
I'll need to try that out.
Is 85 ambient air? how warm is the cool side inside the burrows? Have you tried running a heatpad on high and checking the substrate temps. I made the mistake of checking air temps and found it was about 72 in my older cage, and when I checked inside the burrow he was hanging out in, it was about 80...Correct me if I'm wrong, but as long as his burrow is warm enough, (not hot though) and hes familiar with where to go during cold coniditions, you could have a layer of snow in his cage over night and he would be fine....
You'd be surprised how cold africa can get during the night, theres no cloud cover, the fluctuations between day and night work much differently than it does here. But admittedly I learned from FR, just worry about what the temps in his burrows are for night time temp, more than ambient.
It`s o.k, so long as the coolest ambient (air) is around 75f in the hides/burrows. The problem with the 150w CHE in particular is it`s drying out the air (lowering the humidity) during the day when the monitors are active (obviously it will rise at night when the basking bulb is off, and they are resting in their hides). Providing there are always cooler, darker places to retreat to, it`s fine to keep the heat/lights on 24/7 if you wish (or at least `til the warmer weather comes).
OK, yes the burrow temps is around 75F... This could explain why they didn't bask much yesterday and was not out as much, perhaps the temp is too high above ground so they stay under to keep cool.. but I'm not sure if that's a good thing.. I still think the cold side above ground should be a 75F so they have the choise to come out if they want right? What do you think?
i use a heat emitter and have no issues with humidity dropping in my tank..but my tank it built right. anyway. my ambients are always high.. my cool side is mid 80's and my hot side is around 100 my basking 152 degrees this is and i just leave it.. he doesn't seem to mind.. his borrows are mid 70's usually.
With your cool side around mid 80s does your sav come out and roam lots or mostly hiding underground. cuzz mine were roaming like crazy active guys when cool side was 75F, and yesterday at 85, they were hardly out. could be coincidence.
The extra heat wont keep them from coming out, if thats what you are worried about. If anything, it should make them a little more active. Optimal body temps are in the mid to high 90s so a cool side of mid 80s isnt problematic.
Is 85 ambient air? how warm is the cool side inside the burrows? Have you tried running a heatpad on high and checking the substrate temps. I made the mistake of checking air temps and found it was about 72 in my older cage, and when I checked inside the burrow he was hanging out in, it was about 80...Correct me if I'm wrong, but as long as his burrow is warm enough, (not hot though) and hes familiar with where to go during cold coniditions, you could have a layer of snow in his cage over night and he would be fine....
You'd be surprised how cold africa can get during the night, theres no cloud cover, the fluctuations between day and night work much differently than it does here. But admittedly I learned from FR, just worry about what the temps in his burrows are for night time temp, more than ambient.
I'm gonna have to double check the night temp of burrow, but night temp of ambient is 75 cold end. I think the burrow wouldn't be that cold as they get up each day.. but I'll need to put a probe in to be sure. thx for the idea.
The extra heat wont keep them from coming out, if thats what you are worried about. If anything, it should make them a little more active. Optimal body temps are in the mid to high 90s so a cool side of mid 80s isnt problematic.
OK that's good to know they are not suffering from stroke hehe.. May I please ask how long you have had your savs, or monitor in that env, and how they are doing etc? thx
DeadlyDesires
03-26-13, 06:13 PM
With your cool side around mid 80s does your sav come out and roam lots or mostly hiding underground. cuzz mine were roaming like crazy active guys when cool side was 75F, and yesterday at 85, they were hardly out. could be coincidence.
mine is in and out in and out all day long... sleeps in his borrows but hang outside of the borrow during the day in his other hiding places he likes. (on the hot end where its almost 100) ambient.
Coming out of his burrow, all muddy.
https://lh6.googleusercontent.com/-gqNYRt7g3nE/UVNrJBUrINI/AAAAAAAAQRQ/kj81XivmuXQ/s889/DSC_9508.JPG
Cute little guy!
As for my own monitor, while my own personal experience is relatively short (my monitor is only 2), those temps and parameters are ones that have been used for generations of monitors successfully.
Woohoo! After over 1 week of behind the window abservation, Potato, the most restless of my savs finally doesn't feel the need to run away from me. Strangely, he always runs away when my family walks by, but not me.. not sure if it's a coincidence but it happened time after time.. I kind of doubt the can recognize a person, but wishful thinking..
Anyways, since he's no longer scared of me even when I opened the door, I put a thawed silk worm in front of his face slowly, and he didn't know what it was at first, but one lick and he went crazy and started biting on my tong, then got the worm.. put another worm on my tong and he came to get it!
murrindindi
03-28-13, 12:40 PM
Woohoo! After over 1 week of behind the window abservation, Potato, the most restless of my savs finally doesn't feel the need to run away from me. Strangely, he always runs away when my family walks by, but not me.. not sure if it's a coincidence but it happened time after time.. I kind of doubt the can recognize a person, but wishful thinking..
Anyways, since he's no longer scared of me even when I opened the door, I put a thawed silk worm in front of his face slowly, and he didn't know what it was at first, but one lick and he went crazy and started biting on my tong, then got the worm.. put another worm on my tong and he came to get it!
Hi, they must definitely CAN distinguish between people!
smy_749
03-28-13, 12:42 PM
Im pretty sure they can recognize their owner.
Hi, they must definitely CAN distinguish between people!
I want to believe it, and it SEEMs to be true from my observations, but really hard to believe lol. How did you come to the conclusion?
Here's another observation, first silk worm he had a hard time eating as he had to fling it around to rid the soil he go on the worm, second one, started of the same but he took the worm on the basking log where it's clean to swipe the soil off.. third silk worm, he tripod to get it haha(he's only a hatchling)... then instead of dirtying the worm on the soil, he took the worm straight to the basking spot on the log and ate it much quicker.
On the side note. I've read that baby savs should be fed as much as they want, but I am not sure. He already ate some crix today and just ignores all crix after. That should indicate that he's full, but now comes the silks and he goes for 3 of them and he looks bloated... I'm kind of worried that I over fed him I hope he doesn't get hurt from eating too much... Any ideas?
smy_749
03-28-13, 01:04 PM
Here's another observation, first silk worm he had a hard time eating as he had to fling it around to rid the soil he go on the worm, second one, started of the same but he took the worm on the basking log where it's clean to swipe the soil off.. third silk worm, he tripod to get it haha(he's only a hatchling)... then instead of dirtying the worm on the soil, he took the worm straight to the basking spot on the log and ate it much quicker.
On the side note. I've read that baby savs should be fed as much as they want, but I am not sure. He already ate some crix today and just ignores all crix after. That should indicate that he's full, but now comes the silks and he goes for 3 of them and he looks bloated... I'm kind of worried that I over fed him I hope he doesn't get hurt from eating too much... Any ideas?
Monitors are the smartest of all lizards. They learn to know who is providing the food. Someone will chime in with regards to knowing by sight who you, but I'm definitely sure they can recognize you by taste.
murrindindi
03-28-13, 01:39 PM
I want to believe it, and it SEEMs to be true from my observations, but really hard to believe lol. How did you come to the conclusion?
I would think there are many, many keepers the world over who are aware their monitors recognise them by sight (obviously also taste smell), and there are a number of published articles which confirm this (though I can`t think of a specific title offhand).
These animals are extremely sight oriented and aware of the world around them!
Have you seen the "Lizard Kings" film?
murrindindi
03-28-13, 01:45 PM
Here's another observation, first silk worm he had a hard time eating as he had to fling it around to rid the soil he go on the worm, second one, started of the same but he took the worm on the basking log where it's clean to swipe the soil off.. third silk worm, he tripod to get it haha(he's only a hatchling)... then instead of dirtying the worm on the soil, he took the worm straight to the basking spot on the log and ate it much quicker.
On the side note. I've read that baby savs should be fed as much as they want, but I am not sure. He already ate some crix today and just ignores all crix after. That should indicate that he's full, but now comes the silks and he goes for 3 of them and he looks bloated... I'm kind of worried that I over fed him I hope he doesn't get hurt from eating too much... Any ideas?
Hi, you can and should feed as much as the monitor wants to eat at this stage, all the energy goes on growth, their metabolism is at it`s highest, so providing the conditions are supportive there should be no problems with obesity. As they reach adulthood and growth slows down you may need to regulate the total ammount fed.
smy_749
03-28-13, 01:45 PM
I would think there are many, many keepers the world over who are aware their monitors recognise them by sight (obviously also taste smell), and there are a number of published articles which confirm this (though I can`t think of a specific title offhand).
These animals are extremely sight oriented and aware of the world around them!
Have you seen the "Lizard Kings" film?
That is a very good film. You can watch it on youtube.
I would think there are many, many keepers the world over who are aware their monitors recognise them by sight (obviously also taste smell), and there are a number of published articles which confirm this (though I can`t think of a specific title offhand).
These animals are extremely sight oriented and aware of the world around them!
Have you seen the "Lizard Kings" film?
LOL yeah, before I got my sav, during my research and stuff I read tonnes of stuff and also watched tonnes of youtube videos(many sad ones), but one if the ones I watched was Lizard Kings, about monitors, I forgot the name of that particular monitor they talked about in the dessert, it was big and it ate this big snake by hunting it down.. it was a nice one!
I also saw their studies on sav's being able to press buttons to get food haha.. That sav, if I remember correctly looks almost like he's ready to die tho..
Hi, you can and should feed as much as the monitor wants to eat at this stage, all the energy goes on growth, their metabolism is at it`s highest, so providing the conditions are supportive there should be no problems with obesity. As they reach adulthood and growth slows down you may need to regulate the total ammount fed.
So even though his stomach looks really bloated after eating lots of food I should keep feeding? And I do believe the env is supporting him just fine now, he's taking some pretty big crap every day and really active.
smy_749
03-28-13, 04:44 PM
LOL yeah, before I got my sav, during my research and stuff I read tonnes of stuff and also watched tonnes of youtube videos(many sad ones), but one if the ones I watched was Lizard Kings, about monitors, I forgot the name of that particular monitor they talked about in the dessert, it was big and it ate this big snake by hunting it down.. it was a nice one!
I also saw their studies on sav's being able to press buttons to get food haha.. That sav, if I remember correctly looks almost like he's ready to die tho..
It was a perentie, the largest species in Australia
DiscoPat
03-29-13, 09:03 AM
I would think there are many, many keepers the world over who are aware their monitors recognise them by sight (obviously also taste smell), and there are a number of published articles which confirm this (though I can`t think of a specific title offhand).
These animals are extremely sight oriented and aware of the world around them!
Have you seen the "Lizard Kings" film?
I can vouch for this. Steve will get very protective over his space if he sees someone he doesn't recognize at all, he gets very puffed up and whippy. If he sees me or my fiance he will allow us to pet him and get close to him without any trouble. If it is around feeding time he will walk up towards the glass if he sees one of us.
DeadlyDesires
03-29-13, 03:54 PM
Just so you know, i voted that they would suffer because i dont approve of your cage.
Just so you know, i voted that they would suffer because i dont approve of your cage.
Please tell me why. thx
DeadlyDesires
03-29-13, 06:20 PM
Please tell me why. thx
i have already told you why i dont like it, its poorly built and wont last very long, you have duct tape on it I just dont approve of it, but its my opinion, i also dont approve of the permanent cage you wanna have them in either its not big enough but they aren't my monitors so.
i have already told you why i dont like it, its poorly built and wont last very long, you have duct tape on it I just dont approve of it, but its my opinion, i also dont approve of the permanent cage you wanna have them in either its not big enough but they aren't my monitors so.
I have wrote that I'll be selling one of them when they out grow the current cage. So that there will only be 1 monitor in the 8x4x4 cage. With that said I have 2 questions.
1.) For the current cage, while they are still so small please tell me exactly what the problem is. They won't be in there as soon as they reach 10 inches. currently I have already stated the temps, and deep enough substrate for their size which they burrow in, and humidity is like 60-70%. So I know there's duct tape but could you tell me how exactly they will suffer? It almost seems you are set on how it doesn't look good, but you are not pointing out the actual problems that will cause them to suffer. If you are interested in helping please tell me, I'm not here to argue but for the facts.
2.) With 1 monitor in the new cage which will be built better, also with correct temps and humidity, but will have 2 ft substrate instead.. do you still think that monitor will suffer?
Again, your opinion matters, that's why I'm on here. But I need to know the real reasons beyond esthetics. I'm not one of those people who go on here and when negative feedback comes, I get angry and stick to my way, that's why I have changed from using sand(which I thought was good) and converted to the environment that the experts here recommend. I listened to them because they gave good reasons and I don't want to kill more animals. I will listen to you too if you are logical and give me real reasons that matters to the monitors(not to the human eyes).
Thanks!
DeadlyDesires
03-29-13, 07:00 PM
if your going to sell one of them why not just do it now? what is your issue with keeping 2 when you know you can't house them?
and i dont know what your temps are actually, all i know is what you are saying. take a picture of the basking spot where the IR gun is and you can see good temps. take pictures of the humidity gauges inside the cage and temp gauges the only thing im getting from you is numbers, i dont see proof just what you are "saying" and again the cage looks poorly constructed so that is my reason behind my statement, if you can prove to me that it holds these temps/heat and humidity well i will change my statement but until then i want pictures like this.....
this is my hot side... i keep my cage on the warmer side because he still isn't 100% healthy yet from when i got him, thats a diff story for another time..
http://i1309.photobucket.com/albums/s638/cynthia_mitchell/20130329_185221_zps84567726.jpg
this is my cool side. is usually isn't this hot, but its a hot day today.
http://i1309.photobucket.com/albums/s638/cynthia_mitchell/20130329_185229_zpsfd5a0fb9.jpg
this is his basking spot, i wanna be clear that I almost burned my finger from having it on the rock too long, not sure how it doesn't burn him but he lays there.
http://i1309.photobucket.com/albums/s638/cynthia_mitchell/20130329_185321_zps3b11e6a9.jpg
and this is my little tree hugger.
http://i1309.photobucket.com/albums/s638/cynthia_mitchell/20130318_152716_zpsb2c778dc.jpg
lol, so the truth is you know my setup is good, but you just think I'm lying and based on how my tank looks you think it's not possible that what I say is true. You went all the way to take those photos just to try to proof I'm a liar lol. I'll show you som pics.
smy_749
03-29-13, 09:55 PM
Guys we are all here to learn about proper husbandry so lets not get offended. I won't say I agree with deadly, because I don't have enough experience building enclosures or working with homemade ones. However, maybe he sees some faults in the way its built, and thats why he doesn't think it will hold the temps. I do however understand his logic about procrastinating stuff until later (infern would agree I think) with things like selling your second baby, and building the permanent enclosure. If you sell the second one now, you will be able to focus more on your other one, and you may get attached to him, or not notice that they are stressed from eachother, etc. etc. till its too late. Basically, do stuff now or you won't ever do it. I realized that with my roughneck, and was afraid he would be in the 'tub' longer than I anticipated, so I rehomed him. (the day after I rehomed him I got a 4 x 3 x 2 animal plastics cage that he could have chilled in for a while but oh well) ..Rant over.
DeadlyDesires
03-30-13, 03:41 AM
I'm not saying that I don't believe you, just saying that those are simply words pictures prove everything.. and I don't know your set up is good, thats why im questioning it , no offense intended i only care about the monitors not if your enclosure is pretty or not ...
DeadlyDesires
03-30-13, 03:42 AM
By the way, im a girl lol
By the way, im a girl lol
That explains your doubting words lol just joking. But by saying you don't think my setup is good even though I told you my temps/humity etc, and you need me to proof with pictures does mean you think I'm lying. Just admit it, that is why I am gonna take those pics, and that is why you said that if I show you the pics you will change your opinion, it's because you think I'm lying, and pictures will proof I'm not lying, so admit it!
And I'll be showing you pics.. right now I got another head ache, my family unplugged my MVB bulb 2 times yesterday and turned it on right after, this morning when the timer came on the light doesn't come on anymore. The MVBs are known to be finicky like that.... so now I need to figure out if I should spend another $50 to replace that bulb, or spend the money on extra fixtures and just go with a row of normal 45W bulbs plus a florecent UVB bulb... But while I'm deciding that for the next couple hours I replaced that bulb with a 100w, which won't give the same basking temps.. so I gotta hussle today once the stores open...
Also, Infernelis has 2 three-foot long monitors in a 8x4x4, I will only have 1 when I have the 8x4x4 build, not sure why you are spazzing over my situation. But perhaps you like drama.. I guess when I sell the monitor you'll probably need me to show you a receipt to prove it too haha
Pirarucu
03-30-13, 09:14 AM
Also, Infernelis has 2 three-foot long monitors in a 8x4x4, I will only have 1 when I have the 8x4x4 build, not sure why you are spazzing over my situation. But perhaps you like drama.. I guess when I sell the monitor you'll probably need me to show you a receipt to prove it too hahaWayne said today he is planning on building their larger, permanent cage this summer.
Wayne said today he is planning on building their larger, permanent cage this summer.
Yeah I know he has plans, but if he can wait till they are 3 foot long before starting to build a new tank, I don't see why I should be getting crapped on for planning to sell 1 before they even reach 10 inches.
smy_749
03-30-13, 11:53 AM
Nepoez, you don't need approval from deadly or any of us. The important thing is that the monitors are healthy, not that you get approval here on the forums. That being said, if you truly want to prove something, like deadly and everyone else always says "pics or it didn't happen" ahaha. Also don't let infernalis's setup limit yours. If he had more cash, more space, more hands to help build, I'm sure he would have built them an entire biodome to replicate the Savannah. So when you set your mark, set it above waynes, not @ his or close to it. Aim high, just in case you fall short.
Also why are you using the MVB? Isn't the smallest mercury vapor 100 watts? One of the first things I learned here is big wattage is big no no. Get a low wattage uvb tube or regular bulb if you want to do uvb, and the flood light system that everyone here uses. (idk if you do to 3 of them at the moment, but if your planning to make a fixture, might as well build 3 now).
On a side note, I didn't used to know that so many girls were into keeping reptiles, until I started posting/buying stuff on craigslist about a year ago, and like 70% of them were girls, I was shocked. I think more girls keep reptiles than guys these days.
Pirarucu
03-30-13, 12:25 PM
Nepoez, you don't need approval from deadly or any of us. The important thing is that the monitors are healthy, not that you get approval here on the forums. That being said, if you truly want to prove something, like deadly and everyone else always says "pics or it didn't happen" ahaha. Also don't let infernalis's setup limit yours. If he had more cash, more space, more hands to help build, I'm sure he would have built them an entire biodome to replicate the Savannah. So when you set your mark, set it above waynes, not @ his or close to it. Aim high, just in case you fall short.
Also why are you using the MVB? Isn't the smallest mercury vapor 100 watts? One of the first things I learned here is big wattage is big no no. Get a low wattage uvb tube or regular bulb if you want to do uvb, and the flood light system that everyone here uses. (idk if you do to 3 of them at the moment, but if your planning to make a fixture, might as well build 3 now).
On a side note, I didn't used to know that so many girls were into keeping reptiles, until I started posting/buying stuff on craigslist about a year ago, and like 70% of them were girls, I was shocked. I think more girls keep reptiles than guys these days.Well said.
Actually high watt bulbs are fine if they are achieving the right results. It's just that in most cases they don't. Usually it's that they superheat the air or that the beam is too focused and too hot, meaning spot burns. If the light is hitting the monitor's whole body and if the ambients aren't too hot, then it's fine.
Zoology in general has become a female-dominated profession these days. It used to be that almost all zookeepers were men, but nowadays nine out of ten are women.
DeadlyDesires
03-30-13, 12:37 PM
actually you are the one who is getting defensive, you simply asked why i didnt approve of your enclosure? so i told you why. it DOESN'T look like it would hold all those temps you are saying it will... and the fact that you are argueing with me about it instead of posting pictures doesn't help much. I am giving you my honest opinion, its my choice if i wanna give it or not. and i have yet to give you crap about housing them together, i understand that Wayne does it he also knows that his is too small. He had his built before he knew he was getting 2 also they were a surprise for him. you already knew how many you were getting and you still had this "cage" for them anyway. anyway thats not the point, im saying if you are going to sell one of them why does it matter that you have to keep it to 10 inches? so you can take all the training and bonding away that someone else could be doing? but then when they get it they will have to start all over. I have said my point, i told you why i dont like your cage, it looks as thought it will fall apart at any givin moment. Until i can see proof that your cage holds all that stuff i wont believe that it is that good of an enclosure. your all about making it "right" this time so pictures are what do that. im finished with your thread.
infernalis
03-30-13, 12:52 PM
everybody play nice please... thank you.
SMY you are right I should spend my time doing what's important for the animals instead of caring whether or not people believe the numbers I give.
With that said I know the MVB worked fine for my basking and temps, but I'll never buy that again. 1.) they are fine for the small guys at that height, but if they get bigger it will be spot burn as you said.. 2.) they seem to burn out very easily and not reliable..
I am going to home depot now, gonna need a temp way to mount 3 floor lights + 1 ubv bulb.. not sure if I'll get the right temps the first shot.. but I'm guessing the hot side might be more humid with 3 low wattage this time around, my hot side have been more dry than the cooler side specially right below the MVB bulb. heading out now, hope I find the right stuff asap. then in a couple weeks when snot melts I can use the yard to start sawing up wood and building the new enclosure.
smy_749
03-30-13, 01:46 PM
Not sure , you probably already left, but I feel the easiest way is just to drill a small hole in the top, run a wire through it, and just let your light fixture dangle. If its too hot or not hot enough, just pull the wire or let it drop, and recheck your temps. Just make sure you fix the wire, so it doesnt slip when your not home. Also I wouldn't worry about burns without a housing, especially with the dangling method, because I would imagine if he tried to hop onto the bulb, it would just swing out of the way and would fall off, I don't think he would be able to get a good hold on it. Plus you save electricity, and its probably less of a hazard than the high wattage ones.
smy, damn I missed your message, but I'm all done now anyways and it's working so far!
I got a fixture that comes with 4 bulb outlets. I chained it to the wood ceiling of the enclosure and have 3 50watt floods on the right side(hot side) and the the 4th bulb screw I put a Uvb 10.0 bulb(which I'm worried about, more later).
pics
Basking temp managed to still work out:
https://lh3.googleusercontent.com/-RZ_UJ6Z8pPc/UVdyTwd1HLI/AAAAAAAAQo0/hiG5XWY0Pu4/s591/IMG_20130330_171542.jpg
no more stupid MVB rip offs! Just plain old floods 3 in s row:
https://lh4.googleusercontent.com/-CpNjyyFHWi0/UVd0FYv0zhI/AAAAAAAAQpI/94rCyotJMlM/s788/IMG_20130330_172331.jpg
but I worry about using a UVB and would like to know if I should take it off. See pic below, I'm not using a dome to hold the UVB would it be bad for the lizard's eyes because if it's at the top downwith dome he won't ever look directly at it.. but since there's no dome, he can be at the far end of the cage and see the bare UB bulb without having to look up.. would it be bad?!? please advise!!!
https://lh3.googleusercontent.com/-yVNLktFsLSc/UVd0pBnaThI/AAAAAAAAQpU/VE6gJzoQkW4/s788/IMG_20130330_172420.jpg
And I had the door opened to install my new lights not too long before taking this pic so the ambient temp went down a little. The humidity is usually around 65% highest is like 67% but for some reason it's 69% now! it will fall back down a little after some time but never below 60%.. well but the time it gets close to that in a few days I'd water it again. I have a feeling maybe the low wattage lights are not as hot as the MVB thus not drying the place as much?! P.S. 30 degrees C is around 85F we use C here more in Canada. This is the middle of the tank so if I wait long enough the temp would be more like 32-34C and the cool side would be like 30C or 29C depending on how cold my basement gets. Night time cold end is big difference like 26C after a few hours without basking lights on.
https://lh4.googleusercontent.com/-FDgGIgShGnE/UVd6iLK3cRI/AAAAAAAAQqM/HwI42wMuBPU/s591/IMG_20130330_175118.jpg
p.s. I like how the humidistat shows a sad face.. lol
p.s. if you wonder why my cage that's "looks like it's falling apart" can hold this heat and humidity it's because there are 4 layers of heavy duty plastic linings(as mentioned before)
Finally came back up after artificial solar eclipse(me installing new lights)
https://lh5.googleusercontent.com/-EuE1HcLbZOw/UVeBO74_dYI/AAAAAAAAQq0/c7IjiUR_oMA/s889/DSC_9516.JPG
smy_749
03-30-13, 06:32 PM
Very nice last pic haha Are those plants growing new? Or you placed them in like that? Also yes, we stated many times that the purpose of the low wattage lights is that they don't run as high of temps, and don't toast the air. I don't have enough experience with the UVB to answer that question, but a dome is only a few dollars if your worried about it, or you could make your own out of a few layers of tinfoil or something.
Is that type of tree with the white bark safe to put in the enclosure? I don't know much about trees.
Very nice last pic haha Are those plants growing new? Or you placed them in like that? Also yes, we stated many times that the purpose of the low wattage lights is that they don't run as high of temps, and don't toast the air. I don't have enough experience with the UVB to answer that question, but a dome is only a few dollars if your worried about it, or you could make your own out of a few layers of tinfoil or something.
Is that type of tree with the white bark safe to put in the enclosure? I don't know much about trees.
cool hopefully the humidity goes even higher with the new lights! I just checked ghana's humidity it's like 84% so I'm still below that, but then savannahmonitor.net says 60% is fine? So hope someone can answer that... will there be problems?
also crap.... Please someone who knows about trees tell me about if that white tree is bad.. I guess it's hard for you to help but it was tree meant for firewood so I assume it should be safe?! Should I just use a plastic log?
And thx, haha I bought some wheat and burried them in the soild and they started growing.. I kinda like the looks. I might try to grow the whole tank full of that when I get my new tank all setup!
DeadlyDesires
03-30-13, 06:41 PM
im happy to see the pictures... with the uvb, i wouldn't use that bulb, they arent very accurate. i have a florescent fixture in mine with tube lights that are 2ft long with 10.0 bulbs.
DeadlyDesires
03-30-13, 06:44 PM
i dont understand your question about the tree? it looks fine to me, as for the humidity, 60% on the cool side is ok but should be a little higher what is the humidity on the hot side? you should have two hygrometers so you can measure both sides. my cool side is 80%my hot side is 60% you just wanna make sure you are creating a good gradient with the humidity, also you can get a small stick humidity gauge from the pet store and check the borrows, if the humidity down there is almost 100% i wouldn't be too worried about the 60% above.
murrindindi
03-30-13, 06:44 PM
Hi, at the end of the day, captive Varanids that are properly supported do not need exposure to either real or artificial UVB to remain in good health and productive for many years, that`s been proven beyond a shadow of a doubt over many generations and species (the choice is yours)!
Very nice last pic haha Are those plants growing new? Or you placed them in like that? Also yes, we stated many times that the purpose of the low wattage lights is that they don't run as high of temps, and don't toast the air. I don't have enough experience with the UVB to answer that question, but a dome is only a few dollars if your worried about it, or you could make your own out of a few layers of tinfoil or something.
Is that type of tree with the white bark safe to put in the enclosure? I don't know much about trees.
p.s. what do u use for ubv?
im happy to see the pictures... with the uvb, i wouldn't use that bulb, they arent very accurate. i have a florescent fixture in mine with tube lights that are 2ft long with 10.0 bulbs.
Could you please tell me more about the problem with UBVs.. I was pretty worried about using coil UVBs but asked on this forum and was told they are fine.. but maybe it's better to be safe.. What did you mean not very accurate? will they do damage to the eyes u think?
DeadlyDesires
03-30-13, 06:48 PM
Could you please tell me more about the problem with UBVs.. I was pretty worried about using coil UVBs but asked on this forum and was told they are fine.. but maybe it's better to be safe.. What did you mean not very accurate? will they do damage to the eyes u think?
they do damage because they are so bright and can cause blindness... as for the accuracy there is a test going around here somewhere on the net that shows the output rays from it.. the problem with the coil bulbs is they are aimed at only one spot and when you get the tubs you have a wider range of uvb exposure to the animal. other then that, i dont really know a whole lot, just that most use the florescent bulbs so i go with majority rules kinda thinking.
i dont understand your question about the tree? it looks fine to me, as for the humidity, 60% on the cool side is ok but should be a little higher what is the humidity on the hot side? you should have two hygrometers so you can measure both sides. my cool side is 80%my hot side is 60% you just wanna make sure you are creating a good gradient with the humidity, also you can get a small stick humidity gauge from the pet store and check the borrows, if the humidity down there is almost 100% i wouldn't be too worried about the 60% above.
My guage is in the middle of the tank. But now that u mentioned it I never guaged it on the cool side or the hot side i can just feel the dryness under my MVB(when I had it) compared to the cooler side.. I should check.. Logically the cooler side will be more humid than what the middle reads, and hot side should be drier.. and the burrow, from the way they come out all muddle I'm pretty sure wet mud is 100% humidity, What do u think? but doesn't hurt to go get a guage that can measure soil just for the heck of it.,
and for the tree.. SMY brought up a concern that's why I'm asking, just to be safe.
Hi, at the end of the day, captive Varanids that are properly supported do not need exposure to either real or artificial UVB to remain in good health and productive for many years, that`s been proven beyond a shadow of a doubt over many generations and species (the choice is yours)!
So you are saying I don't even need UVBs. But then I would need to supplement d3 in the diet then right?
they do damage because they are so bright and can cause blindness... as for the accuracy there is a test going around here somewhere on the net that shows the output rays from it.. the problem with the coil bulbs is they are aimed at only one spot and when you get the tubs you have a wider range of uvb exposure to the animal. other then that, i dont really know a whole lot, just that most use the florescent bulbs so i go with majority rules kinda thinking.
Could more people comment on this? I'd like to know if anyone here uses coils for over 1-2 years with monitors.. but either way I am gonna take off the bulb for now just to be safe... then install the tube one when i have a 8ft tank in a couple weeks, the coil bulb would be too small for a 8ft tank anyways.. but I'd still like to know from anyone's experiences.
smy_749
03-30-13, 06:54 PM
p.s. what do u use for ubv?
I don't. They receieve what they need from a good diet, and thats what I plan to provide.
Also about the tree, some tree species contain toxins, syrups, stuff designed to repel or attract predators/pollinators (like caffeine/poison Ivy etc.)
smy_749
03-30-13, 06:56 PM
So you are saying I don't even need UVBs. But then I would need to supplement d3 in the diet then right?
Every mammal (exclude pinkys) that has bones, will provide the necessary vitamins, including calcium. I believe shrimp shells, egg shells, and some other stuff provides this as well. If your feeding whole prey, the general rule is you don't need to supplement. d3 if you are feeding insects or whatever.
And some places say 60% humidity is ok, on the assumption that you have the proper substrate and they are able to simply go down and regulate that way.
murrindindi
03-30-13, 06:59 PM
So you are saying I don't even need UVBs. But then I would need to supplement d3 in the diet then right?
If you offer them a whole prey diet (including a % of vertebrate prey) they do not need UVB exposure, and you do not need to offer supplementary D3. I would personally advise around a 50/50% invert to vertebrate (always whole animals only).
murrindindi
03-30-13, 07:02 PM
Every mammal (exclude pinkys) that has bones, will provide the necessary vitamins, including calcium. I believe shrimp shells, egg shells, and some other stuff provides this as well. If your feeding whole prey, the general rule is you don't need to supplement. d3 if you are feeding insects or whatever.
And some places say 60% humidity is ok, on the assumption that you have the proper substrate and they are able to simply go down and regulate that way.
Pinky mice are low on nutrition because they have very little protein and the bones aren`t formed, fuzzy mice are much better, just cut them in half along the length if too big to swallow whole (do that before defrosting, it`s much easier)!
There`s no specific level of humidity, you need to provide a range, obviously it will be lowest around the basking area, perhaps only 505 or less, but that`s fine so long as there are areas where it`s significantly higher (such as in the burrows/cooler areas where it`s well over 70%).
If you offer them a whole prey diet (including a % of vertebrate prey) they do not need UVB exposure, and you do not need to offer supplementary D3. I would personally advise around a 50/50% invert to vertebrate (always whole animals only).
k thx guys.. right now I got hatchlings and obviously they can't eat mouse, so I guess I'll be needing UVB until they can start eating mice then right? or if I don't use UVB, then give them d3 right? Just wanna make sure I'm getting this right.
p.s. I also got silk worms which is high in calcium.. that's not gonna replace mice is it?
oh and for mice.. do I gut load them? just for future reference when they can eat mice.
smy_749
03-30-13, 07:06 PM
k thx guys.. right now I got hatchlings and obviously they can't eat mouse, so I guess I'll be needing UVB until they can start eating mice then right? or if I don't use UVB, then give them d3 right? Just wanna make sure I'm getting this right.
Read the above, just cut fuzzy's up into fun bite size pieces. Popcorn fuzzys. I reread what I wrote, makes it sound like I thought a pinky was its own species of mammal :S lol You want to exclude pinkys for the reason that murr explained.
hm... cutting a mouse into pieces.. I'm gonna have to think about this one haha.. kinda makes me wanna puke lol
hm.. I don't know if cutting the mouse into peices would work, cuzz he would not be able to finish the whole mouse so only getting some parts of the mouse thus might be no longer a whole food, don't u think? e.g. he could potentially be eating just the liver and not the brain for example..
smy_749
03-30-13, 07:19 PM
hm.. I don't know if cutting the mouse into peices would work, cuzz he would not be able to finish the whole mouse so only getting some parts of the mouse thus might be no longer a whole food, don't u think? e.g. he could potentially be eating just the liver and not the brain for example..
He will be able to eat an entire fuzzy, I'm 100% sure of it. Especially if you cut it up into pieces. And "whole prey" doesnt mean its still in one piece. It just means that it has a bit of everything, its the complete package, cutting it up is irrelevant. Theres no possible way to cut a fuzzy in half and only feed a brain or a liver :-P you either end up with the top half or the bottom half, or cut down the middle and you get two of the same. They will all contain bones, blood, guts, and whatever else. I don't mean to put it in a blender, just take a frozen mouse, and cut it down the middle or horizontally. Also no, you don't need to gutload them, buy them frozen.
He will be able to eat an entire fuzzy, I'm 100% sure of it. Especially if you cut it up into pieces. And "whole prey" doesnt mean its still in one piece. It just means that it has a bit of everything, its the complete package, cutting it up is irrelevant. Theres no possible way to cut a fuzzy in half and only feed a brain or a liver :-P you either end up with the top half or the bottom half, or cut down the middle and you get two of the same. They will all contain bones, blood, guts, and whatever else. I don't mean to put it in a blender, just take a frozen mouse, and cut it down the middle or horizontally. Also no, you don't need to gutload them, buy them frozen.
How do we know the breeder of the mouse make give the mouse good food?, or do u mean as long as the mouse can grow to the stage of a fuzzy it's got enough nutrients so doesn't matter?
also, maybe you can't tell the size of my guys from the photos hehe.. His body is literally the size of a AA batery, it can't fit a fuzzy, it might kill him I think! But perhaps I can just try it and give him half of the mouse on day 1 and then the other half the next day, of if quater.. then split it in 4 days..
smy_749
03-30-13, 07:30 PM
How do we know the breeder of the mouse make give the mouse good food?, or do u mean as long as the mouse can grow to the stage of a fuzzy it's got enough nutrients so doesn't matter?
also, maybe you can't tell the size of my guys from the photos hehe.. His body is literally the size of a AA batery, it can't fit a fuzzy, it might kill him I think! But perhaps I can just try it and give him half of the mouse on day 1 and then the other half the next day, of if quater.. then split it in 4 days..
Just get small fuzzies with fur on them, and cut them down the length, in half the long way. Mouse french fries since you didn't like the popcorn. If he can't fit it, he will rip it apart till he can fit it. He'll be fine don't stress so much. Or if you really don't want to, just feed him whatever else for now I guess. Have you tried silverside fish?
http://www.frozenreptile.co.uk/image/data/fluff-fuzzy-mouse.jpg
If you want to cut it into 4 pieces, by all means do so, it doesnt make any difference as long as it ends up in his stomach, and it doesnt spill its guts before he eats it (which I think will happen if cut into quarters)
Just get small fuzzies with fur on them, and cut them down the length, in half the long way. Mouse french fries since you didn't like the popcorn. If he can't fit it, he will rip it apart till he can fit it. He'll be fine don't stress so much. Or if you really don't want to, just feed him whatever else for now I guess. Have you tried silverside fish?
http://www.frozenreptile.co.uk/image/data/fluff-fuzzy-mouse.jpg
If you want to cut it into 4 pieces, by all means do so, it doesnt make any difference as long as it ends up in his stomach, and it doesnt spill its guts before he eats it (which I think will happen if cut into quarters)
ok I'll try it out this week and see if how it goes. I haven't tried silverside fish.. let me google it.. what do you have to say about it?
So far the only things I tried feeding are crickets, superworms, silk worms. They are ok with crickets.. the ignore superworms, and they love silkworms. They would eat a couple crickets and ignore the rest.. then if u give the silk they will all of a sudden be able to eat more. haha but then u will see their whole body look like a balloon due to being too full..
smy_749
03-30-13, 07:42 PM
Silversides are good, whole prey items, filled with nutrients. Just don't base your diet on fish, from what I understand, they contain higher levels of mercury and shouldnt be the staple, but definately a good item. Shrimp are good as well.
Silversides are good, whole prey items, filled with nutrients. Just don't base your diet on fish, from what I understand, they contain higher levels of mercury and shouldnt be the staple, but definately a good item. Shrimp are good as well.
I'm having trouble finding a place that sells that. Would buying live shrimps from super market me ok?
on the side note. I'm planning to introduce some snails and slugs to live in the new tank in the summer.. since those things are so hard to get rid of once they inhabit your soil, maybe it will be a good constant supply of snacks!
smy_749
03-30-13, 07:57 PM
Petco sells silversides in the same fridge they sell mice in, as food for large fish. I have a big bag in the fridge.
since it's summer time now, I have turned off the ceramic heat emitter during the day time, and turn it back on at night. Now during day time the middle of the tank humidity is about 72%! A few hours after lights out, it's like in the low 80s%! So b/t replacing the MVB bulkb with 3 50watt floods, and shutting off the CHE, I got almost 10% extra humidity for the day time. Now I just need to get an extra timer to turn on and off the CHE with the opposite schedule of the lights so I don't have to manually do it each morning and night. One day I might just forget and night time temps will get too low..
smy_749
04-01-13, 05:53 PM
since it's summer time now, I have turned off the ceramic heat emitter during the day time, and turn it back on at night. Now during day time the middle of the tank humidity is about 72%! A few hours after lights out, it's like in the low 80s%! So b/t replacing the MVB bulkb with 3 50watt floods, and shutting off the CHE, I got almost 10% extra humidity for the day time. Now I just need to get an extra timer to turn on and off the CHE with the opposite schedule of the lights so I don't have to manually do it each morning and night. One day I might just forget and night time temps will get too low..
They are 4 dollars at walmart so don't waste your money @ a petshop. Also why do you think everyone else preaches the floodlight option :-P, no surprise there ;)
They are 4 dollars at walmart so don't waste your money @ a petshop. Also why do you think everyone else preaches the floodlight option :-P, no surprise there ;)
Yah haha, glad my MVB burnt out. I can easily transfer my 4 bulb light fixture to the new tank when it's done too.
I don't think we're as lucky in Canada to get timers for 4 bucks... Probably 15 bucks at walmart here! I spent 20 bucks on my current one at a refurbished item shop haha.
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