Good display animal for a 20L

[Corey209]

I'm getting a 20L and a nice stand for it to put in the living room.

What would be an animal that would make a nice display that could live in a 20L for it's lifetime?

[poison123]

Dendrobates

[Corey209]

Are they pretty easy to care for? they do seem like an awesome display animal.

[poison123]

They are pretty easy once you get there environment right which is not hard. And yes they are great display animals. Though with some species females don't do well together.

[Corey209]

Will they be fine in a terrestrial set up?

[poison123]

Yep. Nost species aren't climbers.

[Corey209]

Awesome I'll definitely set it up for some of those, cricket eaters I'm assuming?

[poison123]

They eat fruit flies, spring tail and very tiny pinhead crickets.
Heres a pic of my tincs enclosure
http://i1261.photobucket.com/albums/ii600/poison619/P1020467.jpg

You can do a lot more in a 20g

[poison123]

Also heres a great site for supplies
New England Herpetoculture LLC - Home (http://www.neherpetoculture.com)

[DeadlyDesires]

you and your frogs lol

[Corey209]

So would I be able to get spring tails and fruit flys to produce on their own inside the enclosure?

[poison123]

So would I be able to get spring tails and fruit flys to produce on their own inside the enclosure?

Spring tail yes. Idk about fruit flies they have never bred for me inside the enclosure.

[poison123]

you and your frogs lol

Hush I'm trying to turn everybody to the dark side :p

[medicinhed]

I like Fire Belly Frogs. Brightly colored. Ready Eaters. They sing sometimes. I turned an old 20L into a paludarium.

[Corey209]

I like Fire Belly Frogs. Brightly colored. Ready Eaters. They sing sometimes. I turned an old 20L into a paludarium.

I thought they're toads not frogs?

[medicinhed]

I thought they're toads not frogs?

Well, technically they are frogs. The popular "pet trade" name is a misnomer. Like Colombian Red-tail boas being used on price tags, rather than calling them, "common boa constrictors".

"Although it is typically referred to as a toad, the Fire-Bellied Toad is not a member of the toad (http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Toad) family (Bufonidae (http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Bufonidae).) As such, it may properly be referred to as a frog."

Oriental fire-bellied toad - Wikipedia, the free encyclopedia (http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Oriental_fire-bellied_toad)

[Corey209]

Good to know, the local pet store labels their common boas as red tails and fire bellies as toads haha

I'll have to research both dart frogs and fire bellies to see which I'll prefer.

[medicinhed]

Good to know, the local pet store labels their common boas as red tails and fire bellies as toads haha

I'll have to research both dart frogs and fire bellies to see which I'll prefer.

Darts are prettier. All the small rainforest ones are brilliant.

I got my colony of fire bellies because:

1. I'm new to frog keeping. So I wanted something easier.
2. Hardiness.
3. Cheap. Mine were $6.99 each.
4. Nicely colored for the price and ease of care.
5. Good introduction to amphib husbandry.
6. Wanted a reason to make a paludarium.
7. Was going to full empty 20L with yet another snake, must...stop...buying...snakes.

[Corey209]

Well I have the money to spend to make everything perfect for darts so I'll probably just stick with them. I think I'm going to get the plants growing for a month and establish my own culture of spring tails and isopods before buying any frogs though.

[medicinhed]

Well I have the money to spend to make everything perfect for darts so I'll probably just stick with them. I think I'm going to get the plants growing for a month and establish my own culture of spring tails and isopods before buying any frogs though.

Cheers.
Great choice.

[ilovemypets1988]

id go for a nice tarantula personally lol or a nice scorpion

[Chu'Wuti]

I also have FBTs (Bombina orientalis--in keeping with a new forum member's request that we include scientific names to help him find posts because he doesn't know all the acronyms, abbreviations, and common names in English!) in a 20L paludarium. DH & I inherited them from his research partner . . . long story short, they are cute, easy to care for, interesting to watch, and make interesting sounds, so we are enjoying them!

[poison123]

FBT's are great pets as well. And great for a first time frog owner. However if darts is what you want then go for it best to get something you like.

[DragonsEye]

PDFs will also eat small roaches, isopods, or -- simply put -- any small arthropod.

Corey, in reality there are no such thing as toads -- they're all frogs.

[Squirtle]

You can also look into Red-Eyed Crocodile Skinks, they're like miniature crocodiles and alligators, maybe even dinosaurs. I don't know how many you'd be able to fit inside a 20L, but they sure are cool! :)

[poison123]

You can also look into Red-Eyed Crocodile Skinks, they're like miniature crocodiles and alligators, maybe even dinosaurs. I don't know how many you'd be able to fit inside a 20L, but they sure are cool! :)

I heard these guys are always hiding. And a 20 gallon per skink.

[Squirtle]

I heard these guys are always hiding. And a 20 gallon per skink.

What you hear isn't always true, right? I just read a couple of care sheets, some say that 10 gallons is adequate for a pair, while others say 20 gallons per pair, So I'd assume you can fit at least 2-3 geckos in a 20 gallon long.

[poison123]

What you hear isn't always true, right? I just read a couple of care sheets, some say that 10 gallons is adequate for a pair, while others say 20 gallons per pair, So I'd assume you can fit at least 2-3 geckos in a 20 gallon long.

Depends on who your getting the info from. I talk to people with personal experience. Care sheets is the last place i look. And what do you mean 2-3 geckos can fit in there? We're talking about skinks not geckos lol.

[Squirtle]

Depends on who your getting the info from. I talk to people with personal experience. Care sheets is the last place i look. And what do you mean 2-3 geckos can fit in there? We're talking about skinks not geckos lol.

My bad, they resemble geckos so I get them confused sometimes. There are plenty of people on YouTube with one or a pair of skinks inside a 10-20 gallon fish tank, they're also "not always hiding".

[poison123]

Youtube is also one of the last places i would look for info. Did the enclosures you see have enough substrate and hiding spots for them to hide? Or were they all water? (I've seen people put them in all water enclosures and say they are active)

[Squirtle]

Youtube is also one of the last places i would look for info. Did the enclosures you see have enough substrate and hiding spots for them to hide? Or were they all water? (I've seen people put them in all water enclosures and say they are active)

lol :bouncy:

[Chu'Wuti]

It's not exactly accurate to say there's no such thing as toads. What is correct is that all toads are frogs, but not all frogs are toads unless you want to be 100% accurate scientifically. As we commonly use common names on this forum, it's really OK to differentiate, but it's definitely nice to know that there's no scientific difference.

If we're differentiating based on common usage, frogs and toads are in the same kingdom, phylum, class, and order (the order of frogs), but they are in different families.

Kingdom: Animalia
Phylum: Chordata
Class: Amphibia
Order: Anura

Bufonidae is the family that is considered to be "true toads;" Bombinatoridae is a separate family, so not one of the "true" toads.

That being said, however, Bombina orientalis have been called "Fire-bellied Toads" for so long that getting most people to change to calling them "Fire-bellied Frogs" will be very difficult.

What I find most interesting about this kind of thing is how current scientific research is informing and reorganizing so many flora and fauna taxonomically; what we think we know seems to be changing nearly every day at times!

[Corey209]

In my opinion, one skink per 40 gallon. I have my pair of BTS in the 60 and I feel like that's no where near enough room for them even though it appears to be working.

But from what I've seen Croc skinks are known to be shy up to a year before even coming out to see humans and they do hide a lot.

[DragonsEye]

It's not exactly accurate to say there's no such thing as toads. What is correct is that all toads are frogs, but not all frogs are toads unless you want to be 100% accurate scientifically.

Which I do. :)

As we commonly use common names on this forum, it's really OK to differentiate, but it's definitely nice to know that there's no scientific difference.


I do understand your point of common usage distinctions, and have no great angst associated with the usage of such (most times at least ... there are a few here and there that drive me nuts :D ), But I do feel that too often people get mislead by such things as common names and common usage distinctions. Hence, my pointing out -- really as just an FYI sort of thing -- an issue with a "toad" moniker.


What I find most interesting about this kind of thing is how current scientific research is informing and reorganizing so many flora and fauna taxonomically; what we think we know seems to be changing nearly every day at times!


And some of those changes are flips back into a group from which just a short time ago the organism had been removed. The orchid world is a prime example.

[Chu'Wuti]

Which I do. :)




I do understand your point of common usage distinctions, and have no great angst associated with the usage of such (most times at least ... there are a few here and there that drive me nuts :D ), But I do feel that too often people get mislead by such things as common names and common usage distinctions. Hence, my pointing out -- really as just an FYI sort of thing -- an issue with a "toad" moniker.




And some of those changes are flips back into a group from which just a short time ago the organism had been removed. The orchid world is a prime example.

Yes, the orchid world is definitely a good example! There are many others, too, and your point is an excellent one. Guess I need to start habituating myself to say "FBF" or Fire-bellied frog and specify Bombina orientalis; it's a good habit to get into!