Snake Stigma?

[backafter30]

I haven't kept a reptile in over 30 years, hence the userid. When I did, as a teenager through part of college maybe, I noticed that there was a definite social stigma attached to keeping snakes. Maybe it was living in hick-ville Illinois, or maybe I was just overly sensitive, but I believe that simply not hating snakes was reason enough for people to look at me funny. I was categorized as "odd", and referred to as "that snake guy" or "snake-lover" or just avoided. I don't think that I ever knew anyone else with interests like my own. I was one of a kind, the only kid with a caiman and a boa, and I really think that if I went back for a class reunion (not likely), I would be remembered by some only because I actually kept live snakes in my room! (God only knows what he does with them in there.)

I still do not have any reptiles, and I turn 50 this year, but I'm seriously considering getting back into the hobby. I don't think I care that much about what other people will think of me now, but I am curious what your experiences have been. Are you stereotyped or considered "odd"? One thing I see is that there are certainly a lot of you out there, and the community seems rather friendly. That could make all the difference with the stigma thing, knowing I wasn't alone. Anyway, thought it might make an interesting discussion...

[Hannibalcanibal]

LOL i live in canada, and when i tell my classmates i keep snakes, they do look at me funny, but in the same way you would look at santa claus or the easter bunny- interested, and suprised, but not at all thinking i'm a freak. Guess i'm just a bit lucky to live in Toronto :D

[Lickeypie]

I just got my Ball Python on Satuday, and I'm already hearing malarkey about my snake. My boyfriend's mom told me it was evil and to take him back. She has never personally met a snake, she just thinks its disgusting to own one. She proceeded to say "oh how can you feed it mice, the poor mice"

I didn't want to get into a debate, but I was thinking to myself: You have no room to talk. Nobody has any room to talk, unless you are a vegan or vegetarian, of course. Humans and our pets are all (for the most part) omnivores, we eat meat. We just don't see our meat killed. Our cats and dogs, they are omnivores, they eat meat. Chicken, pork, beef, fish. Just because we don't see that meat killed does not mean it was not once killed. I'm sure a cat or dog would not eat kibble in the wild. So anyone saying that feeding mice to a snake is cruel, is a hypocrite. It's life, it's nature.

People give snakes this stigma because of way back when, when our ancestors actually feared snakes for a reason. We had a fight or flight mentality, and I guess the flight mentality stuck. (Even though BP's are so sweet and docile. And the snake is probably more afraid of us!)

[backafter30]

Ancestors? Heck, most people right NOW are terrified of snakes, and for absolutely no good reason. I try to sympathize with some of them, because spiders give me the heeby-jeebies, also for no good reason, but I have to agree on the hypocrisy call. Unless all of nature becomes vegetarian, for something to live, something must die. That's the way it works.

[Lickeypie]

anthropologically speaking, our fear of snakes is derived from our primitive ancestors.

[backafter30]

I gotta wonder about that. I have no doubt there are many strange things that are inherited, but I've seen many small children that had only curiosity towards snakes, not fear. That is, until their parents totally freaked out and yanked them away from "that awful, filthy, evil animal". That seems more a learned response than an inherited one, but maybe there is a bit of both going on? It is odd just how prevalent the fear is, despite the lack of obvious reasons, so that may actually suggest something inherited. How do we explain those of us without that fear, then? Oh, right... we are just "those snake-lovers".

I doubt if you're going to change your boyfriend's mothers mind.

[CK SandBoas]

I can honestly say i've never gotten flack for owning snakes, or looked at funny. A lot of people i talk to, and i get to talk with a lot working in retail, are genuinely interested in what got me into keeping snakes, what i keep, what i feed them, etc.

I feel incredibly lucky to be able to educate those who are led to think and believe that snakes, and any other reptile, are "evil" and should be killed on sight. If i can even get a few people to listen and understand that they deserve our respect, then i feel as if i've accomplished something really great:)

[backafter30]

Good for you, KKgal. Most people I've known growing up felt that they were doing the world a favor by killing as many snakes as possible. My explanation of how they eat the rodents that eat our food was just wasted air.

And may I say that I am just flabbergasted at the number of women in this hobby! I really have a lot to learn, and maybe undo some of my own stereotypes. I may have been called "odd" as a teenager, but a girl who kept snakes back then might have been burned at the stake as a witch!

[Lickeypie]

It is arguable, but I believe that it is as much inherited as learned (The inheritance is embedded way down deep).

My boyfriend is definitely more open minded than his mother. He is clearly wary, and when I told him I wanted a snake, he was shocked. But I'm sure after a few feedings, he will be fine.

There's definitely a stigma that if you have a snake, you must hate other animals... oh you are an animal killer. Which is completely not true! I love all animals, and snakes are included! My boyfriend's mom was afraid that my BP was going to eat my cat! My cat weighs well over 12 lbs, there is NO way. I mean, fear really causes people to act outrageously.

[dinosaurdammit]

my grandmother along with the rest of my family and most people that live near me think snakes are evil and implements of the devil to be feared. Needless to say I dont agree

[StudentoReptile]

There will always be people whose mind you will never change. Some people are open-minded and may offer to be near or watch, or even touch a snake, after years of "irrational" phobia (and probably never being near a snake except behind glass or watching the tube).

Then there will always be folks who refuse to admit they may possibly be wrong. They won't come within 20 ft of a snake, and hold steadfast to their phobia, than be open-minded, learn something new about the world and be in a position that they might have been wrong about something. THAT is the true fear.

[backafter30]

Without snakes, the worlds rodent population would skyrocket, and the amount of human food available would limit the human population through starvation. It seems to me that either snakes are a necessary part of the natural balance of the ecosystem, or a blessing from God that we might go forth and be fruitful, depending on your perspective, but neither opinion should see snakes as evil. Some people just have opinions that defy all logic, reason, science, and faith. Probably not much use in arguing with them.

[concinnusman]

I am curious what your experiences have been. Are you stereotyped or considered "odd"?

In my experience that has been rare. Most people are just genuinely curious and start asking me lots of questions.

I doubt if you're going to change your boyfriend's mothers mind.

I've changed minds with the help of some very charming and inquisitive garter snakes and even got people who had sworn snakes off as "icky" converted to the point of even keeping and loving snakes of their own. Don't underestimate the power of how the right snake, introduction method, and first hands-on experience can be. But if you screw that up, one little nip or scare can swear them off forever. A very tame and personable snake is a powerful tool where this is concerned and garter snakes in particular are good for this because this is the snake that people most often encounter in the wild (In North America). Most people have seen them, but when you show them how nice they can be in captivity, it wins people over and they're no longer afraid or repulsed when they see one outside or as a pet.

[StudentoReptile]

Some people just have opinions that defy all logic, reason, science, and faith. Probably not much use in arguing with them.

You cannot reason with someone who is unreasonable.

It has been discussed in other threads, that while it is easy to pass judgement on some of these folks, it is important to distinguish a genuine fear from a phobia. The former is a healthy "respect" for something that can actually cause one harm (Ex: fire, grizzly bears, tornados). The latter is something psychological, and while we on the outside looking in may call it "irrational" to be afraid of ______, that person fervently believes it is perfectly rational to be afraid of those things, whether its a ball python, a mouse, a clown, goldfish, etc. Phobias are hard to overcome, so don't be too harsh.

For example, I have a borderline phobia of roaches, and other misc arthropods. I can handle some, but many I cannot. I know I can crush them easily with my foot or a wadded newspaper, and I recognize their ecological importance, but I don't like seeing them in my house, I have nightmares about them, I dance around like a little girl when I think one is on me.

[backafter30]

Yep. I can barely kill a spider, which is probably good, but it's because of a phobia, not out of respect for a necessary part of the food chain. Despite my understanding of snakes, I really want to kill the spider anyway. That's not rational. My wife kills them for me in the house. I just avoid them in the garden.

[concinnusman]

I think nothing of immediately picking up a snake (even some venomous ones) I come across outside, and even some spiders (oddly, it depends on how the spider looks rather than the actual threat level).

What is completely irrational is the emotional reaction I have to an opossum. Don't even get me started on those. The mere sight of one, or even a picture gives me the willies so bad (and yes if I'm surprised by one I might scream like a little girl LoL) but it quickly turns to an overwhelming desire to kill it. I just want it dead, now. Don't know why. It's irrational and I know it so I can sort of relate to how some people feel about snakes.

I don't care that it's irrational and I don't care to be "fixed". I have no interest. Just keep it away from me or kill it, that's all I care about.

[backafter30]

In high school, I tried to make a pet out of nearly everything. I even set out live traps just to see what I could catch. I caught a tiny baby opossum once that seemed friendly and curious. I took it home and put it in a cage, and thought I had a pet. Luckily, I used a glove the first time I petted it, with my hand in a fist and the glove fingers empty, because the little guy just shredded the glove. Definitely NOT a pet. Almost cute, as far as opossums go, but NOT a pet. I sent him on his way.

[Julius2314]

ROFL. yeah they are mean little guys. I used to have a phobia of spiders. Then i worked as a exterminator with a buddy of mine. We been working together for years on in off. Id get him a job with me roofing the he would hook me up then so on and so on lol. Any way one day this house had a massive infestation of brown recluses. Was really bad. Me and my friend crawled under the huge old house to spray.... Thousands upon thousands of brown recluses everywhere. Was very scary lol. But we sprayed and killed em :) put like 50 gallons just in the crawlspace. I now understand spiders better and am not at all afraid :)

as for what people say to me about my snakes, i never really tell anyone i have or keep them. i got my friend into them now he has a ball and his girl has a redtail :) the times i have the people seemed very interested and nothing negative :)

[Stephan Grundy]

And may I say that I am just flabbergasted at the number of women in this hobby! I really have a lot to learn, and maybe undo some of my own stereotypes. I may have been called "odd" as a teenager, but a girl who kept snakes back then might have been burned at the stake as a witch![/QUOTE]

Ah, that's still fairly modern. In the Bronze Age in Denmark, women (or goddesses) were apparently leading processional snakes on leashes (yes, it is possible to leash a snake, it's just not easy). Around the same time, we had the Minoan "snake-priestesses", and in the Viking Age, keeping a snake in a box in your house was apparently a girl-thing (men fought large snakes - women raised them). There are probably a huge number of other examples in folklore and religion, and I suspect that most of them originally came from the "snake-mistress" cult of the Bronze Age, which apparently started in the Mediterranean and spread throughout Europe (yes, Denmark and Southern Sweden were trading extensively with the Med then - there has even been a large Mediterranean, either Phoenician or Mycenean, trading outpost found in south Sweden).
So, as a woman snake-keeper, you stand at the end of a long and honourable line of European tradition!

[Lankyrob]

I tend to get two reactions when i memtion we have snakes, tho both start with a shocked expression this is either followed by A) thats cool, what have you got, can i see pictures, can i come see them or B) ugh they are horrible slimy creatures, how can you keep THEM

I try to educate both people especially about the slimy thing which seems to be the most common misconception alongside them all being "poisonous".

I agree that kids seem to be much more open and curious whereas adults seem to be split fairly evenly between the two reactions.