Flesh-Eating Bugs

[Strutter769]

So, I'm going to have to put Lucy (My very first snake, BCI born in'96) down, and I've always kept the ashes of (only) my animals that have passed. Unfortunately, with my upcoming move, I can't afford that at the moment.

As an alternative, I'm thinking of keeping her cleaned skeleton. I think they usually do that with beetles of some sort. Does anyone know what type bug is used, or where I can get it?

Thanks!

[Strutter769]

I got my answer. Thanks BB!

Mods: Please delete this post.

[KORBIN5895]

They are called dermestid beetles. I know a guy in Illinois that could hook you up. The down side to this method is you will need to bleach the bones and glue them together.

[BarelyBreathing]

You're welcome?

Make sure if you bleach the bones, you rehydrate them.

[KORBIN5895]

You're welcome?

Make sure if you bleach the bones, you rehydrate them.

That's not necessary.

As for bleaching I would use hydrogen peroxide. You can get it at a beauty supply store at 30%-40% concentration. You then dilute it yourself. There is also some preparation required when using dermestid beetles. If you plan on just tossing the carcass in you will actually need dung beetles as dermestid beetles don't like rotting flesh.

[Strutter769]

Great tips... Thanks Kevin. Feel free to PM me someone here in IL. I'm interested in seeing what this'd cost.

[Strutter769]

You're welcome?

You gave me the answer on FB.

[BarelyBreathing]

Oh, duh. I'm spacey today.... I've worked too much over the past two days.

[Strutter769]

Well, no one has gotten back to me yet about how many beetles I need for this job, which is not really in the budget right now anyway. So, I'm thinking of freezing the body until I can get pricing info on the beetles.

Those beetles will eat f/t I presume, correct?

[dinosaurdammit]

Well, no one has gotten back to me yet about how many beetles I need for this job, which is not really in the budget right now anyway. So, I'm thinking of freezing the body until I can get pricing info on the beetles.

Those beetles will eat f/t I presume, correct?

if its flesh they do not care

[Strutter769]

That's What I was thinking too, thanks. Do you have any idea how many I'd need? She's about 30lb.

[stephanbakir]

Kodiak Bones & Bugs Taxidermy (http://www.bonesandbugs.com/) is my far my fav company to get dermestid beetles from.
They have terrific guides on their website that show the steps one at a time.
The other option is maceration but you will most likely lose the teeth, it also takes a few months.

[stephanbakir]

That's What I was thinking too, thanks. Do you have any idea how many I'd need? She's about 30lb.
You NEED to do the legwork first, you need to skin and gut the boa, then remove as much flesh as possible, then dry the meet/bones til they are the consistency of beef jerky to get the best and fastest results.
Edit: It would also be best to remove the brain.

[Strutter769]

Thanks Kevin for the link.. I called and I mentioned I would be freezing the carcass first and he said it was good because it'll toughen the meat a bit, like you said.

Yes, he also told me the body would need to be gutted and skinned. Any volunteers? I can't do that....

[stephanbakir]

Gutting is easy, skinning is also easy, other then the strip touching the spine. get someone with upper body strength :P

[Strutter769]

... and no personal connection to Lucy.

[stephanbakir]

That too :P do you have a hunter in your family?

[Strutter769]

Nope. On the contrary.. We're animal lovers.

[stephanbakir]

I'm an animal lover, and a hunter ;)
When one of my animal dies, I generally try to preserve it in some way to use it for educational purposes, I've got an articulated blackthroat monitor skeleton I did last year, skulls from colubrids, pythons and chameleons etc... That way they don't just rot away and they can still benefit the hoby.

[Strutter769]

I usually do a private cremation, but that's not in the budget right now, so I thought of this as an alternative.

[KORBIN5895]

Thanks Kevin for the link.. I called and I mentioned I would be freezing the carcass first and he said it was good because it'll toughen the meat a bit, like you said.

Yes, he also told me the body would need to be gutted and skinned. Any volunteers? I can't do that....

Sounds like Pete is getting soft. Lol!

[pdomensis]

Just curious but how is this a cheaper alternative than a DIY funeral pyre? You could also keep the head in a jar of formaldehyde.

[Strutter769]

I don't understand "funeral pyre"?

Do I need to worry about the euthanasia drugs affecting the beetle? I thought about only cleaning the skull, but I like to go "all or nothing." Lol I found someone somewhat local who will complete the entire process for me for $50+beetles. That's great, cuz Marcy is dead set on not having that odor anywhere near her! Lol

[stephanbakir]

I designed a dermestid enclosure that doesn't smell at all... costs about 15$

Anyone who cleans the bones for you will charge you money, its work... That being said, they wont articulate the skeletons for you because its a royal pain if you havent done it before.
50$ is a fair charge for a large skeleton, its actually pretty cheap. especially if its articulated.

[Strutter769]

Oh yeah, I get that. He initially was only interested in the preparation, but not the beetles. But he too thought $50 was fair.

How do I get my hands on one of your enclosures?

[stephanbakir]

You make them.
Its essentially a big critter keeper with 75% of the top covered in plastic (the beetles need good air flow, but I'll get to that) and the rest of the top covered in fine mesh screen (REALLY fine mesh, the larva can climb walls and are super tiny) on the side farthest from the screen top you make a hole big enough for a computer fan and you cover the fan in fine mesh so the beetles cant go out that way, the fan sucks air from the enclosure and out an exhaust tube and blows it outside your house.
The only time smell escapes the container is when you open it, mind you this is only useful if you have under 5-10,000 beetles but I doubt you will have anywhere close to that many.

[Strutter769]

Stephan, have you articulated skeletons?

[stephanbakir]

only a blackthroat and a ball python, but I cheated on both ;)
if your colony is big enough to come at the skeleton from all sides and envelop it, they tend to eat the tissue first, then the cartilage. If you keep an eye on their work and pull the body at the right time you can remove the cartilage yourself and all the bones will be more or less in the right order when you get to them.

[Strutter769]

I was told 300 would do it in "weeks.' That's the smallest amount available.

[stephanbakir]

How big is this animal?
Doing it in "weeks" in one shot is a terrible idea, if its even a little humid it will rot in those places.
If its a large animal I'd prepare it was usual then chop it into pieces that will take 1-3 days and freeze the portions, be sure not to damage the bone.

Kodiak bones and bugs will send you 1200 for aprox 100$ with a great care guide. they over count, for the lols Kayla and I counted the colony I got and we were well over 1700 and that doesn't include the small nymphs that are too small to see/bother with

[Strutter769]

So smaller pieces will take less time? Due to increased surface area, I presume? She's about 30 lbs. How do you not damage bones when cutting into smaller pieces?

[stephanbakir]

Smaller pieces take less time because they are smaller, overall it takes the same total time.

Once you skin/gut the snake be gentle with his spine/ribs, find which ones are even a little loose and use a sharp knife to separate them. Alternativly you can dry the bones/flesh a bit and see if any loose spots pop up. You can avoid decay with enough air circulation and by positioning the bones properly.