mice or rats?

[omega]

So, I've done all this research and some say to start (my juvenile ball python) on rats right away. He has been eating mice up till now at the breeders. Is one or the other better? Will he eat rats if he has been raised on mice? I have a few mice that I bought when I brought him home as that is what he is used to.

Suggestions???

[jarich]

Nutritionally, they are basically the same. The reason people say to feed rats is that rats are bigger and a single rat is a perfect size meal for an adult BP. Its mostly ease of feeding and price (1 rat equals around 8 mice or so) that gets most people feeding rats. Sometimes BPs can be selective eaters so its best to start them off right away with rats so as to avoid the possible difficulty in switching them over from mice later on. Since yours already is eating mice, its up to you when you want to switch it over.

[exwizard]

Gram for gram, there's much more to rats than mice. I used to breed both and am very familiar with both. Nvm the fact rats get so much bigger anyway. I would switch to rats ASAP.

[jarich]

Not wanting to propagate any big disagreement, but the difference in nutrition is insignificant Wizard. You can check out the nutritional breakdown on RodentPro's website.

[mykee]

Yup, Jarich is correct.
Gram foir gram they are almost identical.
I love it when someone makes a statement and then actually backs it up with FACTS!
Magnificent.

[omega]

ok, thanks... that helps. i will switch him over to rats.

[Loucifer]

My snake has one more frozen mouse to go, then it's onto rats. According to every thing I've read, mice and rats are nutritionally pretty close. It's just the size thing. When my BP gets bigger, I'll much rather give him one small rat than a handful of mice.

[omega]

My snake has one more frozen mouse to go, then it's onto rats. According to every thing I've read, mice and rats are nutritionally pretty close. It's just the size thing. When my BP gets bigger, I'll much rather give him one small rat than a handful of mice.

I agree... one is better than many in my opinion!!!

[Terranaut]

Yup, Jarich is correct.
Gram foir gram they are almost identical.
I love it when someone makes a statement and then actually backs it up with FACTS!
Magnificent.

And just to add to this there is a difference nutritionaly when you compare very young or pinky rats to similar sized mice. The rats will have more fat content and less calcium as they haven't had time to develope any bone density yet. As stated akready the reason you want rats is to reduce the amount of animals to be fed and thus reduce cost. 1 jumbo rat is much cheaper than 6 adult mice in most cases.

[omega]

And just to add to this there is a difference nutritionaly when you compare very young or pinky rats to similar sized mice. The rats will have more fat content and less calcium as they haven't had time to develope any bone density yet. As stated akready the reason you want rats is to reduce the amount of animals to be fed and thus reduce cost. 1 jumbo rat is much cheaper than 6 adult mice in most cases.

If rats have more fat and less calcium, is that what a ball needs?

[Loucifer]

I just individually bagged up 40 weaned rats. Whoa, those things smell a lot stronger than the mice I've been using. Pee and popcorn come to mind...:Wow:

[omega]

LOL... gross. I thought mice smelled worse than rats??? That's what someone told me anyhow.

[Corey209]

If rats have more fat and less calcium, is that what a ball needs?

I was always told Python's can handle fatty foods so it's best to just switch to rats as early as possible but boas aren't as good with fatty foods.

Not sure if that's true though.

[omega]

I was always told Python's can handle fatty foods so it's best to just switch to rats as early as possible but boas aren't as good with fatty foods.

Not sure if that's true though.

Thanks, guess I will research it a little more.

[Little Wise Owl]

I'm so glad this thread isn't full of people going "MICE ARE NUTRITIONALLY INFERIOR TO RATS. MICE ARE JUST SKIN AND BONES BY COMPARISON". I've heard that so many times it makes my brain melt. Kudos to you all.

I would go for rats though due to the additional size choices they come in.

[Gungirl]

I think feeding rats is easier in the long run due to the size prey needed to make a good meal for a royal. You either have to feed multiple mice or 1 rat of proper size, feeding 1 is easier than feeding multiples. :)

[Loucifer]

LOL... gross. I thought mice smelled worse than rats??? That's what someone told me anyhow.

These rats are a bit larger than the mice I have been feeding. They also came from a guy who breeds and distributes them himself, not like the factory boxed mice from big box stores. That may have something to do with it. I've also heard male rats smell worse than female. Maybe someone who knows more will chime in. Its not a horrible smell, just a bit stronger.

[Squirtle]

From experience, I'll say that rats are better. When my Albino Burmese Python was much younger, I had him on mice. When I switched him to rats, not only did his growth improve greatly, but so did his coloration, he had a lot more white than the orange and yellow he had as a hatchling. Two years later, I'm now feeding him chickens. I've noticed that his white has reduced and although he IS growing, he isn't growing too much. Starting March/end of February, I will start to feed him rabbits to see if his coloration goes back to the lovely yellow and large amounts of white as he's maxing out his length.

In conclusion, if you want your snake to grow nice and healthy and have better coloration (again, the coloration part is from my experience) then go with rats.

[Loucifer]

I think feeding rats is easier in the long run due to the size prey needed to make a good meal for a royal. You either have to feed multiple mice or 1 rat of proper size, feeding 1 is easier than feeding multiples. :)

Yup! Plus, rats come in many more different sizes than mice. I appreciate a larger selection.

[omega]

From experience, I'll say that rats are better. When my Albino Burmese Python was much younger, I had him on mice. When I switched him to rats, not only did his growth improve greatly, but so did his coloration, he had a lot more white than the orange and yellow he had as a hatchling. Two years later, I'm now feeding him chickens. I've noticed that his white has reduced and although he IS growing, he isn't growing too much. Starting March/end of February, I will start to feed him rabbits to see if his coloration goes back to the lovely yellow and large amounts of white as he's maxing out his length.

In conclusion, if you want your snake to grow nice and healthy and have better coloration (again, the coloration part is from my experience) then go with rats.

Interesting observation! I wonder what changes I might see in my Ball when I switch him over.

[omega]

These rats are a bit larger than the mice I have been feeding. They also came from a guy who breeds and distributes them himself, not like the factory boxed mice from big box stores. That may have something to do with it. I've also heard male rats smell worse than female. Maybe someone who knows more will chime in. Its not a horrible smell, just a bit stronger.

Are they not so good from pet stores that sell them? I would like to find someone near me who breeds them.

[Corey209]

Are they not so good from pet stores that sell them? I would like to find someone near me who breeds them.

Some pet stores sell rats specific for breeders which are cheaper. The local "general" pet store that isn't a chain store sells their mediums for $5 but they look like a large. The local reptile shop sells theirs for $3.74.

[KORBIN5895]

The main difference between rats and mice really depends on what stage the rodent is in. An XL adult mouse will have more fat than a weaned rat which is about the same size. So if you are trying to cut down on the fat intake rats are leaner as pups and weaneds than a large or xp mouse.

Now assuming that your XL adult mouse weighs 40g and your snake eats four XL mice or one medium rat ( 85g-175g) you will get a much higher fat content out of your four XL mice.

Boas can handle fatty foods just as well as a boa but they need more exercise. No matter what you feed a boa you need to remember that a boa is semi arboreal and need more stimulation and exercise than a royal.

[Aaron_S]

Interesting observation! I wonder what changes I might see in my Ball when I switch him over.

You won't see anything from food intake really change the colour of a ball python.

Burmese pythons from the post you read are generally always orange as babies and grow into the adult yellow/white. So the switch between mice to rats didn't affect it.