BP not good beginner snake

[limey]

Sadly, I'm going to be giving my ball python away to a new home. The main reason is relocation. Next month I'm planning on driving across the country to start afresh.

However, I am also disappointed that my ball python has not been the pet I expected. Even after much research, the ball python tended to be far more finnicky, extremely picky (much to her own detriment) and less intelligent than I'd hoped - to the point of being quite dumb. As such, I spent a great deal of time fussing over her, her enclosure, her food and her picky tastes, and feeling relatively little to no reward for my efforts.

It is a shame that ball pythons are considered beginner snakes by many people, because I would tend to disagree. People are quick to recommend them to newcomers. They are perhaps “beginner pythons”, but in my opinion definitely not beginner snakes.

As a first time snake keeper, but also an animal lover and former zoo keeper, I actually found my ball python too frustrating for any first-time keeper and as such I would refrain from advising them to newcomers.

This experience has sadly tainted my opinion not of snakes, but of keeping snakes, and I am considering it best not to have another in the future, but perhaps try another type of pet instead.

I would advise all beginner hobbyists to choose very wisely when considering a first snake.

Regards,

Limey

[Corey209]

I wouldn't say that ball pythons aren't good beginner snakes. I'm pretty new to personally keeping snakes and I have yet to have a problem with mine. I just think you need to find the right one and make sure it's established before purchasing.

[EmbraceCalamity]

All snakes are different. Your experience with one single snake doesn't necessarily determine the experiences of every new person with every ball python. Though if you wanna talk easy, corns would probably be the easiest, so if you ever decide to try again, that might be a good route. Either way, I'm sorry to hear it didn't work out.

~Maggot

[iBaman]

and thus why retics rule. get a baby, have mentors for questions, and grow and learn with them. I will never have a ball again due to the boring nature of them..pet rocks indeed.

[Corey209]

and thus why retics rule. get a baby, have mentors for questions, and grow and learn with them. I will never have a ball again due to the boring nature of them..pet rocks indeed.

I would never recommend a retic as a starter snake.. You need a very large enclosure and multiple people to handle a 10+ foot snake.

[iBaman]

dwarfs and super dwarfs don't require multiple people. and really...they aren't that difficult. pains in the arse sometimes, yes. but much more rewarding

[GarterPython]

No a retic should not be a begginer snake. It can be but most will disagree with your statement. Sorry

[iBaman]

and those who disagree are likely those who have never had them. but, to each their own.

[GarterPython]

Well a retic is a big commitment!!

[iBaman]

aren't all snakes?

[Corey209]

and those who disagree are likely those who have never had them. but, to each their own.

aren't all snakes?

Not all snakes can weigh over 100 pounds.. Regular dwarfs still get around 10 feet don't they? So the only retic I'd ever recommend is a super dwarf. My first snake was an ATB and that was a pain, I could only imagine if I would have been recommended a retic...

[GarterPython]

Yes but a retic is huge and can take up a lot of room. They are just not concidered a beginner snake and never will be mostly probably because of there size. I'm sorry but I'm not going to argue any more about this because I have never had one.

[totheend]

Sorry you had such a poor experience with your first snake. But it's pretty clear that they can be picky eaters...you have to not worry if they skip a meal here and there. But I also have to say, if kept properly they are pretty easy pets.

[limey]

This is just my personal experience with snakes. I have experience with many different types of animals - some captive, some wild. In reference to the retics, any animal that is a big commitment is probably not for a beginner. A beginner (in any hobby) is somebody who is just getting started. You get started on something that is easily maintained, a pleasure to keep, gives you an insight into the hobby and whets the appetite for animals of more advanced keeping skill.

Therefore it is my opinion that ball pythons are a little outside of what a beginner may expect from a beginner snake. Mine was too frustrating for me to consider keeping a snake again... instead of whetting the appetite it unfortunately had the opposite effect. I never want another.

I would refrain from recommending them as a No.1 snake... just my opinion.

Regards.

[Terranaut]

Not to sound preachy here but maybe the problem wasn't the snake but was your expectations of the snake. Royals are great first snakes. Easy to handle. Simple needs. Not to big but still enough animal to be impressive. I have boas,gophers, kings and carpets and would recomend a Royal as a first snake to anyone. Everything mentioned is true to the nature of this breed.
They are boring and sit in their hide all day. This is normal.
They are finiky eaters. Not true they just take breaks fron eating for weeks at a time.
They are not very smart. Show me a smart snake. Seriously none of them are smart.
So in my opinion you bought a snake before you researched enough about it.
As far as a retic for a first snake.....ahh no.
In my opinion this is recipe for tragedy 9times out of 10.
Either the owner will give it up and not stay commited or the snake will just be a snake and bite the owner during a feeding mistake. Always exceptions but again I wonder why we see many people with young retics on this site but only a couple with adult retics.

[iBaman]

cause I just got my guy ;D I dunno, I guess because he's not as bad as everyone told me he would be, I figure almost anyone could do it. but, i could be wrong. Babies are also easier to photograph...as my guy grows, he gets increasingly difficult to get good pictures of xD

[SSSSnakes]

A first snake should not be a baby. A baby Ball can be nippy and a very picky eater. Get a juvenile Ball that has been eating and you know it's temperament. I have seen many baby Corn snakes refuse to eat and starve themselves to death. Again, a juvenile Corn is the way to go. As for a Retic, I have them and I like them, but I would not recommend them as a first snake.

[iBaman]

why is one snake better than the other for starter? a ball python is nothing like a retic, is nothing like a boa...so why should one get a boa before a retic?

[SSSSnakes]

why is one snake better than the other for starter? a ball python is nothing like a retic, is nothing like a boa...so why should one get a boa before a retic?

The only reason I would not recommend a Retic as a first snake, is because of it's size, even a dwarf is to large for a beginner. I also do not recommend Boa constrictors, Burmese, Scrubs, Rocks or Anacondas (green or yellow). Not for a first snake. I think Retics are great snakes myself. I keep them and probably always will.

[SnakeyJay]

why is one snake better than the other for starter? a ball python is nothing like a retic, is nothing like a boa...so why should one get a boa before a retic?

That's like saying why not have a hummer for a first car.. The dangers with greater size come with 'tics. Not saying you can't go out n get one as your first, but it's easier to learn basics with something you can hold in your hands.

[Gungirl]

Not to sound preachy here but maybe the problem wasn't the snake but was your expectations of the snake. Royals are great first snakes. Easy to handle. Simple needs. Not to big but still enough animal to be impressive. I have boas,gophers, kings and carpets and would recomend a Royal as a first snake to anyone. Everything mentioned is true to the nature of this breed.
They are boring and sit in their hide all day. This is normal.
They are finiky eaters. Not true they just take breaks fron eating for weeks at a time.
They are not very smart. Show me a smart snake. Seriously none of them are smart.
So in my opinion you bought a snake before you researched enough about it.
As far as a retic for a first snake.....ahh no.
In my opinion this is recipe for tragedy 9times out of 10.
Either the owner will give it up and not stay commited or the snake will just be a snake and bite the owner during a feeding mistake. Always exceptions but again I wonder why we see many people with young retics on this site but only a couple with adult retics.

I agree 100%

[Lankyrob]

There is no such thing imo as a "good beginner snake". There are just too many variables involved, a younger person ( stereotyping i know - sorry) mayforget to check things so a corn could be better than a ball. An older person (sorry) may want something where they have to be pernickety about every part of husbandry and a gtp maybe better than a corn so that they dontget bored etc etc etc

BUT there are a lot of snakes that probably arent suited to a first snake, i would say anything over seven foot as an adult or any hot are probably best not to be starter snakes.

I was informed categorically that i would kill my GTP as i "was not ready", yet he is perrfectly happy and healthy two years later. It is all down to the people and the snakes involved :)

[StudentoReptile]

I concur that there can be more than one "good beginner snake." But I also agree that a baby ball python is often not the best choice, for reasons I have stated before.

They are not a good "buy one from the pet shop and stick it in a glass tank" snake. Cornsnakes do great in tanks, kingsnakes do great in tanks, garter snakes, gophers, African house snakes, etc. But in my experience as a pet store grunt for over 10 yrs, baby BPs do NOT do well in this set-up. That is why many new keepers are frustrated with them. And like Terra said, they are one of the most boring snakes you could get. My first snake was a BP...I still have him after 20 yrs, but I can attest that they are very boring animals to keep. I likely will never own another BP again.

[KORBIN5895]

Yeah, royals are stupid. Get a boa. They eat anything and are fairly active.

@Dan

Indigos. They are very intelligent from what I hear.

[dinosaurdammit]

Yeah, royals are stupid. Get a boa. They eat anything and are fairly active.


Personal opinion flying out, boas are quite possibly the BEST animal on earth. They have great personalities, great to feed, interesting life habits. Ive never had a snake before, in fact the first reptile I ever owned was an iggy back in the day when I was very young, needless to say it didnt work out because they (pet store) told me it would only get as big as the set up and that I didnt need any special lights rolleyes:

I decided on getting a snake now that i am an ADULT and while at the pet store I met jerry rice, he was my birthday present to myself and I hadnt done a whole lot into what they needed but it was easy for me to learn. Humidity, temps, food and a set up and there isnt much else you have to worry about. They are AWESOME. I considered a ball but they /are/ boring. Boas actually cruse around and you do see them a lot more than balls. I never have to worry when feeding a boa either, drop a dead rat in at night, gone by morning. They are also good lap snakes and mine actually seem interested in me and what I am all about.

[lady_bug87]

Its true
I love my boa she is one of my favourites of my collection hands down

[Snakeman8]

sometimes i think my ball python kows whats going on in the next room,. she a very smart. not a good beginner snake, king snakes are better.

[Loucifer]

Meh, Balls are prettier. I'd rather a mellow snake than one I'd have to worry about trying to escape all the time. No short attention span, here. Feeding? Learn about the thing before you dive right in. Husbandry is numero uno. ;)

[dinosaurdammit]

sometimes i think my ball python kows whats going on in the next room,. she a very smart. not a good beginner snake, king snakes are better.

I feel bad for never seeing a nice king

[Corey209]

I feel bad for never seeing a nice king

Every king I've held was nice, unless you mean aesthetically.

[dinosaurdammit]

Every king I've held was nice, unless you mean aesthetically.

No I ment temperament, it seems like all the ones Ive been around launch out or are just plain NASTY

[Corey209]

No I ment temperament, it seems like all the ones Ive been around launch out or are just plain NASTY

That's strange I haven't had any problems with them but whenever someone held my king they'd ask if she was nice first.. lol

[shaunyboy]

i agree with you mate,ball pythons can be finecky eaters,that don't move around a lot on display,its sad that 1 ball python has put you off snake keeping...

if you are willing to give it another go...

i would recomend a Carpet Python...

hardy species,easy to keep

most of the time out hanging of a branch,come in all sorts of colours and patterns

great feeding responses

either start with a hatchling and you will get to know the snake,or get an established calm adult from a reliable source

i wish you all the best in your fresh start mate

cheers shaun

[dinosaurdammit]

That's strange I haven't had any problems with them but whenever someone held my king they'd ask if she was nice first.. lol

Some can just be nasty just like any animal but I have only seemed to be exposed to the psychos of the snake world and I have never seen a mean boa either, it might be prejudice though :P

[rmfsnakes32]

I have 4 ball pythons care is quite easy and all are great eaters patience imo is the key! Also getting established feeders is a big requirement many low life breeders just want to make a buck and will sell it anyway figuring it will eat sooner or later!

[Terranaut]

i agree with you mate,ball pythons can be finecky eaters,that don't move around a lot on display,its sad that 1 ball python has put you off snake keeping...

if you are willing to give it another go...

i would recomend a Carpet Python...

hardy species,easy to keep

most of the time out hanging of a branch,come in all sorts of colours and patterns

great feeding responses

either start with a hatchling and you will get to know the snake,or get an established calm adult from a reliable source

i wish you all the best in your fresh start mate

cheers shaun


I was waiting for someone to say this. I am biased but yeah carpets are great. Want excitement? Get a baby JCP. They can be nippy,fast,hungry,great to watch and will keep you involved. You can most likely find a sub adult or adult if you want to skip the taming.
Carpets are my favorite over boas kings gophers and royals.

[Gungirl]

It saddens me to say I have never held a carpet.. I need to change that.

[MoreliAddict]

It saddens me to say I have never held a carpet.. I need to change that.
Holding a JCP after being used to my BP is how I became an addict..

[Gungirl]

No more snakes until I move but then.. Oh boy... lol

[shaunyboy]

It saddens me to say I have never held a carpet.. I need to change that.

No more snakes until I move but then.. Oh boy... lol


be carefull pal.....

Carpet Pythons are very addictive..

even touching one can have you hooked :laugh:

cheers shaun

[Gungirl]

I honestly don't see me ever owning one. I want to get into one specific snake ( ATB) and possibly breed later on. Carpets just aren't for me...

[Aaron_S]

Corn snakes. No other questions.

Size? They stay relatively small and slim so anyone can handle one and keep one in a relatively small enclosure/tub/fish cage.

Temperment? Very rarely ever do anything aside from being peaceful. I personally side with SSSnakes that a sub adult is the best choice regardless of species. Well established feeders and can tell how it is around people and handling.

Colour? EVERY colour under the sun has been done or can be done.

Feeding? Super easy. Never have to go bigger than mice really and usually doesn't take a hiatus from eating like ball pythons do.

Housing? Super easy as stated above. Can be kept in simple enclosures or more elaborate. Doesn't need the commitment that retics or other large species do. Even the dwarfs/super dwarfs.

Price? They can be had from free to hundreds of dollars.

Reason that kings or milks don't get the same level of beginner? I've always found them to be far more flighty than corns, hatchlings to adults. As well as, no body wants to reach into an enclosure where the snake thinks food first and you MAY be bitten. They also tend to poop more on you than a corn.

[Kettennatter]

Corn snakes

You can't get around corns, but with one exception: They hide a lot. If you want an easy snake that you can see, I would recommend garters. They are otherwise just as easy to maintain as corns. While corns are the better snakes to handle, garters are more fun to watch.

[Aaron_S]

You can't get around corns, but with one exception: They hide a lot. If you want an easy snake that you can see, I would recommend garters. They are otherwise just as easy to maintain as corns. While corns are the better snakes to handle, garters are more fun to watch.

I have experienced quite the opposite with the hundreds of corns I've seen in my days. It's true that garters are solid but the corns are just as active as they are also diurnal.

[KORBIN5895]

It saddens me to say I have never held a carpet.. I need to change that.

Am I tho only one who giggled at this?

[Gungirl]

Nope.. I did as well after I posted it. :D

[sws]

i agree royals pythons make good beginner pets, i have two of them and have had little trouble even with the little one who was abused when she was younger. I will avoid owning retics on the base i don't want any snake over 15ft for my own personal reasons.

[Kettennatter]

I have experienced quite the opposite with the hundreds of corns I've seen in my days. It's true that garters are solid but the corns are just as active as they are also diurnal.

In my experience there is quite a difference in activity between garters and corns. Both are definite diurnal, but garters are very responsive, and tend to interact with each other and their environment a lot. As far as the display side of things are concerned, garters are a step up from corns, IMHO.

[Philmul]

My first snake was a bp and I thought she is great. Yes a bit boring but you don't want a lively one to start with, retic s are dear to house and feed and not everyone do enough research. Retics require a lot more than balls. But core, balls and king snakes are still good beginner snakes

[limey]

My BP is probably the most unintelligent creature I've ever come across.

It's actually a wonder that BP's manage to even survive in the wild. This live adult mouse has been in her enclosure for 2 and a half hours now and outsmarted her at every turn. The snake deserves to be preyed upon, the mouse is a winner in my book. We'll see how long it takes for her to get eaten though...

I'm getting sick and tired of supervising such a long ordeal. Another reason BP's suck... I don't have all night to watch this feed. She went off Frozen/thawed completely at 6 months ish. Could never get her back on them. $50-60 of wasted F/T food. I'll say it again, I don't think BP's make good beginner snakes.

[KORBIN5895]

Royals are stewped!

[Aaron_S]

My BP is probably the most unintelligent creature I've ever come across.

It's actually a wonder that BP's manage to even survive in the wild. This live adult mouse has been in her enclosure for 2 and a half hours now and outsmarted her at every turn. The snake deserves to be preyed upon, the mouse is a winner in my book. We'll see how long it takes for her to get eaten though...

I'm getting sick and tired of supervising such a long ordeal. Another reason BP's suck... I don't have all night to watch this feed. She went off Frozen/thawed completely at 6 months ish. Could never get her back on them. $50-60 of wasted F/T food. I'll say it again, I don't think BP's make good beginner snakes.


Another reason I use tubs. The mouse has no real place to go and if the snake is hungry then it's game over real quick. Luckily, I don't have issues of my snakes going off F/T.

If the snake isn't showing interest then remove the mouse.

[limey]

Royals are stewped!

Can't wait to be done with her. It's more entertaining watching the mouse, think she would make a better pet!

[EmbraceCalamity]

Can't wait to be done with her. It's more entertaining watching the mouse, think she would make a better pet!Rats. If you want an intelligent pet, get a rat.

~Maggot

[limey]

Rats. If you want an intelligent pet, get a rat.

~Maggot

I was being sarcastic. But yes, that's what I heard. But I don't care for rodents too much.

[EmbraceCalamity]

I was being sarcastic. But yes, that's what I heard. But I don't care for rodents too much.I know, but figured it was worth adding anyway. I'm not much into furry pets - guinea pigs, mice, rabbits, hamsters, gerbils, etc. - but I do love my rat.

~Maggot

[MoreliAddict]

I didnt know that a ravenous appetitie makes for a better beginner pet than a calm temperament...

[limey]

If the snake isn't showing interest then remove the mouse.

The snake is definitely showing interest, but she's just a total dumbo. The rodent is showing a great deal more cunning and intelligence. Even after I took all the items out of the tub, and let her hunt on bare aspen shavings.

Like I say, it's a real wonder they manage to survive in the wild.

[Aaron_S]

Meh. All mine do just fine so natural selection would keep mine alive and yours not hahahaha

[Little Wise Owl]

The snake is definitely showing interest, but she's just a total dumbo. The rodent is showing a great deal more cunning and intelligence. Even after I took all the items out of the tub, and let her hunt on bare aspen shavings.

Like I say, it's a real wonder they manage to survive in the wild.

Why not stun the mouse so it's still fidgeting but unable to avoid her?

BP's were my first snakes. One is active and a ravenous eater and the other is more reserved and picky. I've decided to not stress about it anymore. If he's not hungry, he's not hungry. When mine avoids food, I don't feed him for up to a month or two because I know he won't eat. Once he looks likes he's searching for food or comes out when I'm around, then I offer food (f/t). He's avoided food for up to 7 months at a time but remains healthy.

[Terranaut]

Yet another reason to avoid live prey.
Again I think the problem was your expectations of the snake and not the snake itself. Don't be discouraged. It's a lap snake so to speak. Get something with more vigor and you'll be happier. I like my royal but don't expect it to be a retic. It is what it is. I can guarentee someone out therewishes their carpet or king was a bp and would gladly trade. They just made your mistake but opposite. Check your classifieds.

[EmbraceCalamity]

Yet another reason to avoid live prey.
Again I think the problem was your expectations of the snake and not the snake itself. Don't be discouraged. It's a lap snake so to speak. Get something with more vigor and you'll be happier. I like my royal but don't expect it to be a retic. It is what it is. I can guarentee someone out therewishes their carpet or king was a bp and would gladly trade. They just made your mistake but opposite. Check your classifieds.True. The girl I was talking to about the kingsnake decided to get rid of it after getting a BP and preferring how docile it was in comparison to the king, who was a bit too "feisty" for her. I know I like feisty, which is why I'd never get a BP.

~Maggot

[sws]

there's a trick i heard about to get BP to eat that helped someone i kinda know, dipping the mouse in chicken broth and after that she had no trouble getting her snake to eat(although she was switching from mice to rat but may work in this case idk)

[Lankyrob]

there's a trick i heard about to get BP to eat that helped someone i kinda know, dipping the mouse in chicken broth and after that she had no trouble getting her snake to eat(although she was switching from mice to rat but may work in this case idk)

Just make sure the broth is salt free ;)

[alessia55]

I'm getting sick and tired of supervising such a long ordeal. Another reason BP's suck... I don't have all night to watch this feed. She went off Frozen/thawed completely at 6 months ish. Could never get her back on them. $50-60 of wasted F/T food. I'll say it again, I don't think BP's make good beginner snakes.
Was she 6mos old or did she go 6mos without eating? I'm confused. If I remember correctly, she was a new snake, so I'm guessing she was 6mos old. How long did she stop eating for before you gave in? You don't have to waste a lot of f/t rats in trying to get her to eat. Offer food every 2-3 weeks instead of every week if need be. Missing a week or two wouldn't do her much harm, and might even build an appetite.
The best beginner snake IMO is a corn snake. The next snake, with a little work, is the ball python. You do have to keep an eye on humidity and they may not feed as consistently as a corn snake (then again, some do). I'm biased since I love ball pythons, but I would still agree that they are good beginner snakes for someone who will put in the time to get the right enclosure and not get frustrated over missing a feed here and there.

[shaunyboy]

Just make sure the broth is salt free ;)

^^^^^
you beat me to it mate

imo its ALWAYS best to check exactly whats in something before you offer it to a reptile...

theres plenty safe human friendly stuff,that can be bad for reptiles

cheers shaun

[sws]

Just make sure the broth is salt free ;)

lol i have never needed to do anything to get my snakes to eat both my BPs eat no problem, did not even have trouble switching my larger one over to rats few months back so i have yet to use the chicken broth trick, might have to with the smaller one idk she was starved when younger though and once she is in her feeding tub is VERY food agressive.

[Philmul]

Sometimes mine doesn't eat her meal so if after a few hrs she does not eat I feed it to my boa. The following week she is hungry enough to eat it

[limey]

I wouldn't mind if it was missing a meal here and there. But she's missing meals more often than she's eating them.

Up until about 5-6 months old she ate reliably every week.

The last 3 months have looked something like this:

Week 1: Did not take rat (did not eat)
Week 2: Did not take rat (did not eat)
Week 3: Did not take rat or mouse (did not eat)
Week 4: Took mouse
Week 5: Did not take rat (did not eat)
Week 6: Did not take rat or mouse (did not eat)
Week 7: Did not take rat. Took mouse
Week 8: Did not eat
Week 9: Ate mouse
Week 10: Ate mouse
Week 11: Did not eat
Week 12: Did not eat

She is looking thinner than she should be imo.

[limey]

/\ Can you see how this might be frustrating? It also wastes my time and money. I'm throwing away more food than seems necessary.

[DeesBalls]

ill take your snake:)

[alessia55]

Offer food less often. Its OK to wait.... it'll build appetite. I would offer food every 2-3 weeks instead. You waste less, and she'll get hungry enough eventually. Not a big deal... ;)

[DeesBalls]

as everyone said, different snakes are good "first pets" for different people- i say corns would be the best, since they usually dont have the picky ness of feeding like BP's do, and they are so easy to set up... they are cheap, and bunch of awesome colors...

ball pythons are great "next step" snakes i think- for those who have patients and the time to be a patient with them.. some new people think they should just eat right away, where a intermediate or something keeper like that may look their husbandry and tweek it a little bit since it may be off... guess this is hard to explain, but makes sense in my head, lol.

seriously, if you ship to OHIO, id take.

[EmbraceCalamity]

/\ Can you see how this might be frustrating? It also wastes my time and money. I'm throwing away more food than seems necessary.People have already told you they can go 6-8 months without eating and to stop worrying, so I don't see why you insist on trying every week and getting worked up when she doesn't take it.

~Maggot

[limey]

People have already told you they can go 6-8 months without eating and to stop worrying, so I don't see why you insist on trying every week and getting worked up when she doesn't take it.

~Maggot

You are assuming, Embrace Calamity. One must not assume. I'm talking in the past tense... I have offered her food every week... in the past.

I'm not so much getting worked up mate, it's difficult to convey your message by writing sometimes. In person, I'm very chilled. On a forum, I write more "to the point", but that doesn't mean I'm getting worked up. Just getting my message across.

I guess when others come on here and say "I disagree" and "they are perfect for beginners", I feel like people are trying to tell me I am wrong. I don't think anybody is necessarily right or wrong, we are talking "case by case basis" here. They aren't right for everybody. Just like most people couldn't manage handling the pack of timber wolves I used to work with a couple years back. It's not always cut and dry.

I'm trying to get others to realise why some ball pythons may be a frustrating pet for some newcomers to the hobby, as mine was, and why they could potentially put people off snakes a bit.

Example: I did 2 months research and read a couple of books before even considering getting a snake. I did okay when I finally got one, but still had some annoyances. Imagine what a straight nOOb would feel like after owning a BP like mine - somebody who just walked into a pet shop and bought one with no knowledge at all. Then people wonder why there are so many snakes given up, abandoned, neglected or given away... I guess I'm straying from the point here.

Beginner in my mind is something that takes very little effort to upkeep. The average guy in the street (not me) wouldn't think you have to do considerable research before getting a pet snake. Many people would just get a few tank essentials and just get one. Those people are your typical beginners. And those people might have their snake die on them or end up not knowing what to do and giving it up to a shelter. Everyone told them to get a BP, and they failed at it's upkeep. Why? Because keeping one might not be as simple as a beginner assumes. And that is why I don't believe this is a beginner snake. My opinion.

Like I say, if I wasn't moving, I really wouldn't have considered getting rid of her.

The main reason she has to go is because I'm planning on driving across the country and may/may not be allowed pets wherever I end up next. My husbandry has been almost spot on for a first time keeper... no hiccups, no health problems, she seems to be okay for the most part. You need a stable situation to keep a pet. My life situation is not ideal. Therefore she'll go to somebody locally that I know will take good care of her.

Perhaps also, like has been said already, I was just looking for something different, you may be right. And perhaps I was slightly disappointed in this species. But I've learned from it, and she's alive and okay and that's the main thing, right?

You are all entitled to your opinions, I understand. Some of you have been nothing but pleasant with me, and to those people I say thanks!

[EmbraceCalamity]

Wow. I wasn't trying to start a novel. Just an observation.You are assuming, Embrace Calamity. One must not assume. I'm talking in the past tense... I have offered her food every week... in the past. Yes, and you cited that as your reason for your frustration, hence me doing the same.
I'm not so much getting worked up mate, it's difficult to convey your message by writing sometimes. In person, I'm very chilled. On a forum, I write more "to the point", but that doesn't mean I'm getting worked up. Just getting my message across.You said you were frustrated with your snake. Frustrated is a level of worked up in my opinion. That is what I was referring to.I guess when others come on here and say "I disagree" and "they are perfect for beginners", I feel like people are trying to tell me I am wrong. I don't think anybody is necessarily right or wrong, we are talking "case by case basis" here. They aren't right for everybody. Just like most people couldn't manage handling the pack of timber wolves I used to work with a couple years back. It's not always cut and dry.Wait...you said they're not good beginner snakes (reference: title), but when people say they are, then you say there is no right or wrong and it's only "case by case basis."
Then people wonder why there are so many snakes given up, abandoned, neglected or given away... I guess I'm straying from the point here.I don't think anyone wonders that...
Beginner in my mind is something that takes very little effort to upkeep. The average guy in the street (not me) wouldn't think you have to do considerable research before getting a pet snake. Many people would just get a few tank essentials and just get one. Those people are your typical beginners. And those people might have their snake die on them or end up not knowing what to do and giving it up to a shelter. Everyone told them to get a BP, and they failed at it's upkeep. Why? Because keeping one might not be as simple as a beginner assumes. And that is why I don't believe this is a beginner snake. My opinion. If your idea of a "beginner" snake is something that requires little or no research or knowledge, then you're out of your mind. That doesn't exist, nor should any snake be put in that situation, "beginner" or not. Every animal on the face of the planet requires research and knowledge. Some are more delicate and require more work, but they all need proper care that can only be given by someone knowledgeable.

~Maggot

[limey]

Ahhh, I can't win. Especially if I'm going to have my posts picked apart.

How's about me phrasing it like this:

1. A ball python wasn't the right snake for me.
2. I did a fair job keeping my BP in good shape considering I live near the arctic circle.
3. Lots of snake people are quick to recommend ball pythons.
4. Keepers should always advise the prospective keepers to do considerable research before getting a snake because to many people (generally speaking, and not referring to me) it might not be common knowledge that keeping a snake can be trickier and very different than, say, keeping a dog.
5. Ensure newbs know what they are getting into (the best you can) before recommending a species and simply saying "these are good beginner snakes", as many people do.

These are the points I'm trying to make. And in an ideal world, the last 2 points are things I would like people to be aware of.

Case in point... we had a lady come on here in the early autumn asking all kinds of questions on the forum. She'd never owned a snake before and had just bought a BP for her young son. She wanted to try and take care of it right. When some of the members tried to advise her of the husbandry needs of the BP she seemed very overwhelmed. She couldn't meet some of it's needs, if I recall, she couldn't get the cold side warm enough, the part of the U.S. she was in was very dry and had trouble with the humidity, plus all kinds of other problems. In the end, she found it very difficult, not as she had imagined a beginner snake to be at all. Perhaps if she had purchased a corn snake, it might have survived or even thrived.

The lady, in her frustration (with both the hubandry and some of the members here (who can also get a bit high and mighty at times it would seem) left the forum. Nobody knows what became of the snake, but it probably wasn't good. Inevitably, my point is, a corn snake is perhaps a better all-round beginner snake. It would be more forgiving of beginner errors.

[EmbraceCalamity]

I don't think anyone is or ever has disagreed with anything you just said. My comment had absolutely nothing to do with whether or not BPs were good beginner snakes.

~Maggot

[limey]

I understand mate.

Speaking to whole forum now: Me, for example, now knowing what I know, I wouldn't say "ball pythons make great beginner snakes, you should get one", and anyone that says otherwise argue with them.

I would be more inclined to say "Ball pythons might make a good first snake for you if you feel you can meet the following criteria and required husbandry - X temps, X humidity, X space and hides and water, and feeding blah blah blah."

Like I say, there's a lot of people that don't know squat about snakes out there and they hear that ball pythons are great beginner snakes from other keepers and on forums like this, and they might go out and get one and then think "oh poo, what have I got myself into"...

The statement of the year should be "it's a good first snake if...

The key word is that "if"... that's where people need to be educated on snake care. A beginner snake to people on here might be a walk in the park, but a beginner snake to a real, never-before reptile keeper might be a really challenging, daunting thing. Just remember that.

[sws]

i think the same can be said for ANY pet animal/human all pets of every kind have some special needs i mean look at dogs and cats they get abandoned more then snakes and treated worse in alot of cases, i dont think this is a BP or even snake problem more a pet owner/buyer not doing enough research and then getting in over their heads. I personal have saved more pets then i like to think need saving and not just snakes.

so over all i think in the end we all all correct in are own way limey has very valid points(personal i cant have a corn afraid of hurting them they are soooo freaking thin) and so do the rest of you guys, BPs are and are not good beginners same with corns it really is snake by snake basis(well and human by human).

[limey]

i think the same can be said for ANY pet animal/human all pets of every kind have some special needs i mean look at dogs and cats they get abandoned more then snakes and treated worse in alot of cases, i dont think this is a BP or even snake problem more a pet owner/buyer not doing enough research and then getting in over their heads. I personal have saved more pets then i like to think need saving and not just snakes.

so over all i think in the end we all all correct in are own way limey has very valid points(personal i cant have a corn afraid of hurting them they are soooo freaking thin) and so do the rest of you guys, BPs are and are not good beginners same with corns it really is snake by snake basis(well and human by human).

True, well said.

[sws]

True, well said.

....0.0 -tilts head to side- thank you most the time i get seriously beeped out when i say stiff like that, its why i basically quit forums for over 3 years was tired of getting yelled at by people.

[Philmul]

When I got a ball python I did my research and after that I new I was taking on a snake that was very picky and could eat fine for yrs an stop eating for months or just intermittent through out her yrs. but after reading all the other pro's I still thoughts I would take the challenge.

No body is picking on anyone. Just trying to help, some are agreeing that they are not for beginners, they say corn snakes are better. Then others are saying why they think balls are good first snakes

[Aaron_S]

Everybody should just take my advice and start with a corn.

[Kettennatter]

Everybody should just take my advice and start with a corn.

If somebody has no specific requirements and wants a first snake, I would agree with that statement. I've seen people with a big adult snowcorn who thought they had a juvenile albino burmese, and set up heat like it was a burmese. It's amazing how hardy corns are.

[sws]

Everybody should just take my advice and start with a corn.

maybe may be not, me and corns do not get along if i had started with one i would have ended up either losing interest or letting my bro take it from me like he tried to do with my BP, i really think people should look at both and see what one is more appealing and probably handle each breed.
i have found corn snakes that tried eating me and yes they wore adults so it really does come down to the snake and the person adopting it then, you can have a easy snake and not like its personality so you don,t like the snake.

[limey]

I will probably get another snake at some point. I can't deny I still find snakes very interesting. I may get a corn next time. Either way, this isn't going to be the end for me and snakes. Just gained some wisdom from the experience... also learned a lot about myself and what I look for in a pet! :)