Do ball pythons and rat snakes get along?

[ClintDaynard]

I have a red rat snake (5 ft.) and a ball python (4.5 ft.). I was wondering if they get along together.

[Kavyrie]

No. Snakes, especially different species should almost never be housed together, and a lot of people don't like to even introduce them for even tiny periods of time.

[Gungirl]

No............

[Pareeeee]

No. If you do that, you will end up with a dead snake.

[Terranaut]

Do you mean- will they hunt each other down and fight to the death if I let them both out?
Or. - can I house them together?

First one I highly doubt but the second one will end badly.
Just keep your snakes apart. I let some of mine roam the reptile room at the same time but I keep an eye on them for sure. They seldom even act as if the others are there.

[Lankyrob]

There is no need for them to ever meet, keep them separate. :)

[reptileexperts]

As others stated this question is pretty vague - are you asking to house them together or just introduce them outside of the cage?

The better answer to both is no - but many people do let their snakes interact outside of the cage. This is not the wisest of things to do, but it has been done without much worry I will say that. . .

As for housing - 2 snakes should never be housed together unless they are a breeding pair IN breeding season locking. Outside of the breeding season you should not be housing any snakes, same species or not, together. The main reason is that in order to understand what's going on with your snake you need to be able to visually observe signs and symptoms. Let me explain.

You need to be able to check for feces, urates, sheds, and possible discharge. If you house two it's usually hard to see who it was that did it in the cage, and then on top of that, it could be contagiouis and you end up with two snakes that are now sick.

Snakes are not like birds, and are not social creatures. The only time snakes seek out partners and other snakes is during the breeding seasons. So save the courtship for the same species and breeding seasons :-)

Hope this helps.

[StudentoReptile]

Just to drive the point home...this experience keeper also says: bad idea.

As others have already surmised, there are plenty of darn good reasons to keep them separate. There really is no legitimate reason for keeping them together. You're talking about two species that come from different habitats, climates, heck...completely different continents.

[Ryodraco]

Albeit isn't it true that certain species of garter and ribbon snakes are often housed together and said to benefit from it? I have read experienced keepers and breeders referring to how their garter snakes eat better and are more active if housed with a fellow snake of approximately the same size. They of course are a exception to the norm, as living in high densities is normal for garter snakes compared to most snakes, and indeed rather than a true social thing is may be a matter of them feeling safer with another snake as a potential target for a predator besides themselves.

But a rat snake and a ball python? No reason to keep them together.

[Jay]

I have a red rat snake (5 ft.) and a ball python (4.5 ft.). I was wondering if they get along together.

Yes, they'd become bestess friends!

[StudentoReptile]

Albeit isn't it true that certain species of garter and ribbon snakes are often housed together and said to benefit from it? I have read experienced keepers and breeders referring to how their garter snakes eat better and are more active if housed with a fellow snake of approximately the same size. They of course are a exception to the norm, as living in high densities is normal for garter snakes compared to most snakes, and indeed rather than a true social thing is may be a matter of them feeling safer with another snake as a potential target for a predator besides themselves.

But a rat snake and a ball python? No reason to keep them together.

As far as I know, garters and ribbons are not "social" any more than any other species of snake. What happens in the wild is that in certain geographic areas (more common in the northern/colder parts of their range), optimal den sites for hibernaculum are few and far between. That's why a lot of these snakes congregrate in such large numbers in a relatively small area. And when spring comes and breeding season blooms, they all just happen to be right there together, so they come slithering out of those den sites, hordes of males clobbering the females.

It happens in some areas with timber rattlesnakes, copperheads, and ratsnakes as well, although not nearly in the same high numbers as with garters. There was also a recent case of a communal nesting site for black rat snakes. I forgot what state it was in, but apparently, a handful of rat snakes had been the underground cavities under a particular stump for nesting, because a landowner was reporting an unusual amount of hatchlings in and around the stump every year. They finally dug it up and found (I wanna say) 40-something eggs. The estimate was that at least 3-4 female snakes were using the site.

Now none of these are evidence of genuine social behavior. It's simply a matter of the particular breeding habits of the species in question, as well as geographic location and habitat/terrain. Again, most of the den sites where large numbers are recorded are in the northern part of the continent, when winters are longer & harsher, and the terrain is not as forgiving. Finding a warm shelter to last a reptile all winter is a lot harder to come by up there than it is down here in the south.

Think of it this way: say there is two dozen guys in a bar and only one TV works. Superbowl is on. Where are you going to find those 24 men? Parked in front of the tube. All 2 dozen of them may be complete strangers and have no interest in interacting with each other before or after the game is over.

Or better yet...here is another example: a water hole in the Serengeti. Just because you see a giraffe and a zebra standing next to each other drinking water at the river, doesn't mean you stick them together in the zoo! And those are two African herbivores living in the same ecosystem.

[Ryodraco]

As far as I know, garters and ribbons are not "social" any more than any other species of snake. What happens in the wild is that in certain geographic areas (more common in the northern/colder parts of their range), optimal den sites for hibernaculum are few and far between. That's why a lot of these snakes congregrate in such large numbers in a relatively small area. And when spring comes and breeding season blooms, they all just happen to be right there together, so they come slithering out of those den sites, hordes of males clobbering the females.
Don't males also often emerge first and wait for the females to emerge and begin to compete for them for breeding? It may not be much but it is a social behavior of a sort, unless we are saying breeding-related behavior is not social behavior.

Or better yet...here is another example: a water hole in the Serengeti. Just because you see a giraffe and a zebra standing next to each other drinking water at the river, doesn't mean you stick them together in the zoo! And those are two African herbivores living in the same ecosystem.
I'm just saying that browsing forums like thamnophis.com I have noticed repeated references to keepers and breeders who refer to the benefits of keeping garters communally. They themselves admit it may not have anything to do with the snake "liking" the company of another snake, it may simply be a instinctual response where a garter that is with another garter feels "safer."

Of course, the wandering garter snake is exclused from this keeping practice as it is a species known for often eating other snakes.

[EmbraceCalamity]

Don't males also often emerge first and wait for the females to emerge and begin to compete for them for breeding? It may not be much but it is a social behavior of a sort, unless we are saying breeding-related behavior is not social behavior.It isn't really. Just because there's interaction there, that doesn't mean it's a social behaviour or that these snakes are any more social than others. Every animal in the world interacts with other animals to compete for resources. Doesn't really mean anything.
Or better yet...here is another example: a water hole in the Serengeti. Just because you see a giraffe and a zebra standing next to each other drinking water at the river, doesn't mean you stick them together in the zoo! And those are two African herbivores living in the same ecosystem.But I do that all the time in Zoo Tycoon, and it works like a charm! =o

~Maggot

[StudentoReptile]

Don't males also often emerge first and wait for the females to emerge and begin to compete for them for breeding? It may not be much but it is a social behavior of a sort, unless we are saying breeding-related behavior is not social behavior.

Yeah, like Maggot said, reproductive/breeding behavior is kinda subjective. But in the long run, its not as if these snakes are hunting in packs, or travel in schools, or raise their young in groups or anything. They ONLY come together during hibernation (due to limited den sites) and breeding.


I'm just saying that browsing forums like thamnophis.com I have noticed repeated references to keepers and breeders who refer to the benefits of keeping garters communally. They themselves admit it may not have anything to do with the snake "liking" the company of another snake, it may simply be a instinctual response where a garter that is with another garter feels "safer."


Perhaps. And curiously enough, I see the same thing often with people who keep redfoot tortoises. These are not social tortoises in the wild, but are one of the few species of torts that generally do not mind and sometimes prefer to be in groups in captivity. Some specimens even "mope" and go off feed if a cagemate is taken out of the herd. Once the animal in question returns, the "moper" returns to normal.

[Terranaut]

Yes, they'd become bestess friends!

I know this is a joke buy look at the question. The op might take this as truth.


To the op the better question is which one will eat the other first if housed together ? :)

[EmbraceCalamity]

If these require two entirely different environments - temps, humidity, etc. - how would they be housed together anyway? (Disregarding the fact that they'd likely kill each other.)

~Maggot

[StudentoReptile]

I hesitate to say this, but 19 yrs ago, I did house a red rat snake in with my ball python. Mind you, I was 11 yrs old and didn't know any better. This was a 29 gal tank with newspaper, a heat rock, and a florescent light strip. Both snakes were adults and behavior-wise, they were fine. But the BP sometimes would go off feed, which could have been due to stress caused by being forced into close proximity to another snake.

Thankfully, this was a temporary situation. I gave the rat snake away, and I still have the BP today. But I still ignorantly exposed both snakes to unnecessary stress, risk to pathogens and risk of injury. It can happen, and I have seen it happen in other cases. I will say this: kingsnakes are not the only snake that will eat other snakes.

[infernalis]

If these require two entirely different environments - temps, humidity, etc. - how would they be housed together anyway? (Disregarding the fact that they'd likely kill each other.)

~Maggot


Point very well made..

[Snakeman8]

heck no they would not get along at ALL.