starting a rescue [Archive] - sSNAKESs : Reptile Forum

miya

11-10-12, 10:44 PM

so i finally decided to start an actual rescue after taking in yet another 3 reptiles shelby and duke came from a man who had originally had 4 BPs 2.2 house together on pine bedding and was feeding them each one mouse a week one of them died after a yr and the other one had to be put down when we got there (was limp, drooling, puss coming out of its vent and had no body mass at all) after getting them home we weighed them shelby weighed in at 1038 grams she is a 5 yr old female and duke weighed in at 1082 a 5 yr old adult male the 3 rd rescue is peanut a 5 mnth old male beardie...i am not sure what his home situation was he has extreme MBD for his age

Peanut
http://i1110.photobucket.com/albums/h448/miya1685/IMG_0568.jpg

Shelby
http://i1110.photobucket.com/albums/h448/miya1685/IMG_0558.jpg

Duke
http://i1110.photobucket.com/albums/h448/miya1685/Duke6.jpg

Duke again
http://i1110.photobucket.com/albums/h448/miya1685/IMG_0563.jpg

Shelby chillin in a 15quart full of water
http://i1110.photobucket.com/albums/h448/miya1685/shelby3.jpg

Lankyrob

11-11-12, 08:20 AM

I would love to do something like this but just dont have the space to set up separate quarantine areas.

Do you quarantine all the animals rescued from one home together? Or do they each get tehir own quarantine space?

Kinda hope in the future to be able to set up a large shed well away from the house and our own animals, then split it into five foot "rooms" each sealed so that each room can house one quarantined animal.

Zoo Nanny

11-11-12, 08:37 AM

Miya you should apply for 501 3c status. It will help out with taxes and such saving you a bit of money each month.
Best of luck with the rescue. Best Friends Animal Society does a mentoring program to help people get started. There are also some great articles to help get started on the Avian Welfare Resource Center. Avian Welfare Resource Center from the Avian Welfare Coalition - Avian Welfare Coalition Mentorship Program (http://www.avianwelfare.org/needhelp/mentor.htm)

miya

11-11-12, 09:46 AM

honestly the way i quarantine depends on the space i have available.

thank you zoo nancy ill have to take a look at that

StudentoReptile

11-11-12, 10:01 AM

honestly the way i quarantine depends on the space i have available.

thank you zoo nancy ill have to take a look at that

Your intentions are noble, but I have seen a lot of well-intentioned hobbyists try to start a "rescue" and they run into a host of issues, the aforementioned tax-exempt status being a major one. Be careful calling yourself a rescue if you do not possess that status yet.

Secondly, make sure you do it right. Someone already mentioned proper quarantine practices. That is only the beginning. Will you be able to take unhealthy animals to the vet when necessary? Perhaps you have already thought of these things, maybe not. Bottom line: if you cannot provide a better home for the rescued animals, you really are not a rescue. You are just someone who is taking in free/cheap/defective/unwanted animals. Not trying to come across as harsh or step on toes, but that is the reality of it.

Going hand in hand with the above, do not be afraid to say NO. Like any rescue, you have limited resources, space and money for this venture. As much as we all would love to, we cannot save every animal out there. There will be cases where you cannot take in a certain animal. You need to be smart and say no. It helps to get involved with your local herp community and network with other responsible keepers, maybe set-up a foster program to help house some of the critters that come down the line.

Just things to think about...

Lankyrob

11-11-12, 10:19 AM

honestly the way i quarantine depends on the space i have available.

thank you zoo nancy ill have to take a look at that

The way you quarantine HAS to be RIGHT everytime or you are condemning your own animals to health issues. As student said, if you cant do it right yu have to say no. Even the largest best funded rescues in the world cant take every animals that comes their way, t just isnt feasible.

jaleely

11-11-12, 04:19 PM

The way you quarantine HAS to be RIGHT everytime or you are condemning your own animals to health issues. As student said, if you cant do it right yu have to say no. Even the largest best funded rescues in the world cant take every animals that comes their way, t just isnt feasible.

Yup. I looked into tax exept status, and not only does it require a lot of capital, but in the meantime this is correct. You have to be careful because what's the point of taking in a new animal, if you can't afford vet care for it...or more importantly...it spreads a disease to your other animals and they ALL suffer.

this has been very difficult for me. My local pound gets snakes in for only ten dollars each. I could go buy a new snake twice a month, but where would i keep them? what if they're sick? what if my current babies get sick because i brought in a new sick baby? it's hard.

half my hoard is rescues...but after a while i became very scared of making my current animals sick.

someday if i have space and money i can have dedicated quarantine spaces. until then i try not to look for opportunities to get more animals. it's very hard.

StudentoReptile

11-11-12, 04:41 PM

To perfectly honest, everyone should be doing proper QT anyway....rescue or not. ;)

And I'm preaching to myself just as much to anyone else.

jaleely

11-11-12, 05:04 PM

To perfectly honest, everyone should be doing proper QT anyway....rescue or not. ;)

And I'm preaching to myself just as much to anyone else.

Like. Me too. lol

Aaron_S

11-11-12, 05:08 PM

honestly the way i quarantine depends on the space i have available.

thank you zoo nancy ill have to take a look at that

All the best to you and I mean that.

Just remember that you need to quarantine every animal the proper way no matter your space. Also, aside from the vet help you need to ensure you know EVERYTHING about the species you rescue every time.

This isn't really directed at you but I'm sick of seeing "rescues" take in an animal species just cause they felt bad but don't supply the proper husbandry and think it's still "okay" in "better" conditions. Unless it's in the PROPER conditions then it still needs to be rescued...

jaleely

11-11-12, 05:25 PM

This isn't really directed at you but I'm sick of seeing "rescues" take in an animal species just cause they felt bad but don't supply the proper husbandry and think it's still "okay" in "better" conditions. Unless it's in the PROPER conditions then it still needs to be rescued...

Yup. This.

EmbraceCalamity

11-11-12, 06:03 PM

You can take in animals without being an actual "rescue." I've taken in sooooooooo many animals (dogs, cats, mice, rats, chipmunks, birds, snakes, a fawn, a raccoon, etc.), but that's just my thing. I'm not a "rescue." All that matters is you do some good - without inadvertently doing harm.

~Maggot

Zoo Nanny

11-11-12, 06:07 PM

Miya There are ways to be involved with rescue without actually needing to house the animals. I'm involved in parrot rescue and know of people who were successful doing private rescue in their homes. Parrots and reptiles have very similar issues when it comes to vetting and quarantine, neither are easy but they are doable. Because of the limited space I have I assist with placements without actually having to house any animals. People contact me when they need to rehome their bird/birds. Because of my extended network in the parrot community I have been able to locate good forever homes for needy birds. Aside from calls, emails and talking with people I have also assisted in the transport of animals and getting them settled in their new homes. It gives you a good feeling to know that you have been able to help but you are removed from the day to day worries of an actual rescue facility. Best of luck with what ever way you decide to do it.

miya

11-12-12, 08:54 AM

ok i guess first i should say that i have not had my first coffee of the morning before reading this, so if im snippy well ya...second im not dumb..i know how to quarantine an animal..3 i alrdy have alrdy been in contact with the local animals shelter, wildlife and fisheries, and the closest reptile rescue, you are not required to file for tax exempt. tho i do still plan on doing so. 4 i live in a 5 bedroom house with a garage and full basement i have plenty of space. 5 i live here without bills so my money is my own do with as i please which generally means it goes to the reptiles 6 there is NO reptile rescue in the state of maine the closest one is in NH and for some people that is a drive so i do what i can...and again i have to add in...im not dumb...i do appreciate all of the advice even it was not actually asked for. i am not dumb. i do not take in any reptile that i can house properly...tegu, large boas, monitors. honestly i do not know enough about these to be able to take them in and know they are being takin care of properly. and on the subject of proper housing...internet exists ignorance is not an excuse. now you all saw 3 reptiles i have rescued..not 20..just 3..i havent jumped in head first and rescued rooms full of reptiles, only 3 but before i have people telling me what i should be doing before they ask what im doing...my quarantine area is in the basement and entire FLOOR away the other animals but come spring half of my 2 car garage is going to be turned into the new quarantine area. i know someone did ask me something of this before and i gave a short answer because quarantine sucks and i hate explaining myself

miya

11-12-12, 08:55 AM

again im sorry but no coffee yet

Lankyrob

11-12-12, 09:41 AM

honestly the way i quarantine depends on the space i have available.

thank you zoo nancy ill have to take a look at that

Ths is the response you gave previously and that is why you got the responsess you did. This sounds like "if i can be bothered i will do it but if i cant then so waht"

Your secnd post explaining your setup and the space you have available and your decision not to take animals you cant care for properly makes you sound much more credible as a person and a rescue.

I hope it all goes well for you and the aimals you take in :)

miya

11-12-12, 09:52 AM

honestly it doesnt sound like anything...its typing and i hate typing just as much as txting you cant actually feel out the way someone is saying something you can just assume as all of you did that because i did not feel at that point in time like going into a big explanation of the way i do things that i must not care or that im doing it wrong when the reality of it is you didnt know...anyone could have just said hey could you elaborate? and i would have log'd back in later when i was done doing my rounds and done just that lol instead i log in this morning before my first coffee grr to people jumping on me about things they dont know

but ya im not a morning person so sorry if this comes off grumpy i usually just wake up long enough to get everyone there breakfast and UV lights then crash out for another couple hours i have not done that yet today and my coffee pot does not brew fast enough!!!!

Lankyrob

11-12-12, 09:55 AM

Thats the problem with writing on the forum, we all need to elaborate as there is no body language to put our words into context :)

At least it is sorted in a civil manner without resorting to silly arguments :)

miya

11-12-12, 10:02 AM

lol i hate arguing on a forum i like to see the person if im gonna fight with em lol

StudentoReptile

11-12-12, 10:47 AM

No one is arguing, Miya.

If you had given all the information you did this morning in the very first post of this thread, you probably would not have received much of the unsolicited advice full of information that you already were aware of. We cannot read your mind. We can only take each post at face value, and your OP raised some questions. That is all.

You're not dumb and have thought some of this through. Great.

All that said....welcome to the internet. Anywhere you post, whether it is here, Facebook, another forum, people will ALWAYS give you advice, regardless if you specifically asked for it. Here is some more: get used to it and deal with it. Occasionally, as much as you think you know, someone may actually bring up a point you did not consider. That is how we learn things, and presumably why most individuals join forums like this in the first place.

Hope you enjoyed your coffee and have a Happy Monday! :)

Zoo Nanny

11-12-12, 10:52 AM

Miya I'm sorry if I offended you with my suggestions. I hadn't meant to and was only trying to pass on information that I thought may be useful to you

EmbraceCalamity

11-12-12, 10:57 AM

Wait, do you breed bearded dragons? I've never heard of a "rescue" breeding, since that's the reason rescues have to exist in the first place. =/

~Maggot

StudentoReptile

11-12-12, 11:00 AM

It is possible, Maggot. As long as the person(s) can adequately keep the rescued animals and their breeding projects separate.

A lot depends on exactly what they rescue. They may only take in injured, or special needs animals, and adopt them out as "pets." And keep their breeding operation entirely separate.

miya

11-12-12, 11:06 AM

EmbraceCalamity

11-12-12, 11:09 AM

miya

11-12-12, 11:10 AM

nobody offended me just dont like waking up first thing in the morning to find people telling me stuff i alrdy know. i am a research junkie. and if i have a question about what im doing i have no problem asking for advice :p

miya

11-12-12, 11:14 AM

EmbraceCalamity

11-12-12, 11:19 AM

i breed because i enjoy it, not for money. i have never heard of a breeder giving away there animals because they dont want them...excess animals come from owners who do not want them anymore. its not the breeders fault someone decided they didnt want there pet anymore its the owners fault ( and yes i felt the same way even before i started breeding)I see you're missing my point. Breeding is the reason there are animals needing rescued, unless you're saying people have figured out how to make them spontaneously generate. Obviously it's up to you what you do. I'm just personally pretty anti-breeding because I've taken in so many animals.nobody offended me just dont like waking up first thing in the morning to find people telling me stuff i alrdy know. i am a research junkie. and if i have a question about what im doing i have no problem asking for advice :pLike Student said, there was no way for anyone to know what you did and didn't know.

~Maggot

Aaron_S

11-12-12, 12:24 PM

i was a breeder first, not gonna stop one cus im doing the other lol...i do not breed rescues
rescues do not exist because of breeders rescues exist because people cant take the time to research something before they get it 2 of my 3 current rescues came from a pet store not a private breeder

LOLOL

I was going to be nice to you but then you posted this.

Do you think animals just APPEAR in pet stores? How do you think they get there? I know TONS of breeders who wholesale their low end stuff to you guessed it, PET STORES.

You won't get accredited as a proper rescue while pursuing the same animals in a commercial venture.

Also, a rescue can't pick and choose what they take in and don't. You should be able to house (proper housing) for anything given to you until you call one of your many contacts who can foster care for it in a better situation.

Aside from that, a "rescue" usually drains one's energy and passion for their own hobby and I know of other people who have stopped taking in 'rescues' or keeping animals they actually want because it's all gone.

I never claimed you were dumb, but I just don't think you have really thought this through.

I'm sure you'll come back now and say you did and you just wish I would say "please elaborate" but really, if you weren't out to prove that everyone jumps on someone you would have done so in the first post. Why leave vital information out on purpose?

Also, not being a morning person or not having a coffee is no excuse for the way you put things.

mykee

11-12-12, 03:26 PM

I have yet to see a homemade "rescue" really be anything but someone looking for free pets. 99% of the time, the care given in the "rescue" is barely marginally better than where they came from.

Zoo Nanny

11-12-12, 03:42 PM

Some of the best rescues in the US started out as homemade rescues including Best Friends Animal Society, New England Exotic Animal Sanctuary and Central Virginia Parrot Sanctuary just to name a couple.

StudentoReptile

11-12-12, 04:22 PM

EmbraceCalamity

11-12-12, 04:24 PM

To say breeders are the cause is not entirely accurate. Yes, that is where a lot of the animals come from, along with wild caught imports. But the main problem is people simply getting pets and not taking the time to learn how to care for them. Occasionally, life choices are made, living situations change, money situations fluctuate, causing one's ability to keep a particular pet to vary as well....And all of those pets come from breeders.

~Maggot

StudentoReptile

11-12-12, 04:44 PM

Not wild caught ones. ;)

Or by "breeders" are you simply referring to parent animals, not the human being that deliberately pairs them up in captivity? If so, then yes, you are correct (duh!).

[most of the time, when herpers use the term, it is referring to the latter!]

EmbraceCalamity

11-12-12, 04:48 PM

StudentoReptile

11-12-12, 04:52 PM

Okay then, if you were using the term "breeders" as people, and not the animals themselves, then your earlier statement is untrue.

Mean what you say and say what you mean. ;)

EmbraceCalamity

11-12-12, 04:54 PM

Okay then, if you were using the term "breeders" as people, and not the animals themselves, then your earlier statement is untrue.

Mean what you say and say what you mean. ;)Lolwut.

~Maggot

StudentoReptile

11-12-12, 04:59 PM

You said all pets came from breeders (captive propagation). That is not true. Some come from wild populations.

Aaron_S

11-12-12, 05:09 PM

To say breeders are the cause is not entirely accurate. Yes, that is where a lot of the animals come from, along with wild caught imports. But the main problem is people simply getting pets and not taking the time to learn how to care for them. Occasionally, life choices are made, living situations change, money situations fluctuate, causing one's ability to keep a particular pet to vary as well.

I'll agree with you on the WC part but less and less animals are being brought in as WC.

I know a large chain of pet stores uses a single breeder to supply most of their normal ball pythons.

EmbraceCalamity

11-12-12, 05:31 PM

You said all pets came from breeders (captive propagation). That is not true. Some come from wild populations.Okay, the vast majority come from breeders. Perhaps you missed it, but I then said: "And WC beardies are rare - if even in existence." I also said, "It's just an unusual combination because most people who rescue animals realise that there isn't a need for more of them (especially something so common as beardies)..." As she is breeding beardies, I was talking about beardies, which is what I said. And since Oz has a ban on exporting any reptiles, that only proves my point.

~Maggot

miya

11-12-12, 06:08 PM

Aaron S- i did my research i do know what i can and can not do...do you live in maine? just because YOU say i cant does not make it truth LOL and as much as you may not like me to be able to do both i CAN and am.

Mykee- most not all but most home rescues do take in reptiles and forget or just down right dont want to rehome the animal or they are hoarders that think they are helping when in fact they are not so i have to agree with most of what you said

Embracecalamity- you cant just blame the breeders and be done with it, do i think all breeders are correct in the way they do things no. do i think its all there fault that individuals buy these snakes and cant care for them no. it is the fault of the person who purchased the animal to have enough common intelligence to say hey theres a problem maybe i should look for a new home for my pet. or to get in touch with local reptile keepers and see if anyone can assist until they get back on there feet. that has nothing to do with the breeders and for someone who probably keeps and has reptiles that btw probably came from a breeder you probably shouldnt be hating on them to much or you wouldnt have any...just sayin

miya

11-12-12, 06:19 PM

Aaron s- if in a few yrs if i lose my passion for breeding then so be it, but as of now the only thing ive lost my passion for is dealing with the owners of the poorly taken care of reptiles

i do things to help people out..heat lamps food ect if someone lost there job or fell on hard times i would help them rehome the animal without it having to come here.

and there is also a rescue in NH that takes in the larger reptiles

now at this point this post has become a rant for certain people i will no longer be posting on it but anyone who wants to continue there discussions with me about whats right and wrong feel free to msg me i do enjoying seeing other peoples points of view when they take the time to actually post facts instead of assumptions :) ..sorry just tired of scrolling through posts to find ones that arent just complaining or bickering

mykee

11-12-12, 06:41 PM

If you don't tighten up your quarantine, eventually you'll get something that rips through your entire collection.
I can guarantee that 100%.

jaleely

11-12-12, 10:28 PM

Also miya, people post things even though you may know it (though it was pointed out that your previous post did imply you were flippant about quarantine, even though you have now explained you are not) so that anyone searching or reading the forum will have all of the important information in one place. It's not just for you, it's you asking and others giving you knowledge, and it's all shared.

Please don't take it as an offense. When i started looking things up, i appreciated reading all the information in one place. Surely as a research junkie you understand that. Also you stated you understood that no one can gather all of what you mean from text, and then you even admitted to being grumpy *lol* don't take it so personally. There's nothing wrong with someone trying to give proper information, as long as it is proper.

Anyway, to get back to the topic: Quarentine good, space to do that, good, rescue good.

As to debate on whether breeding is synonymous with animals leading to rescue, it's kind of obvious it is. lol
but let's say you're rescuing dogs...it's not the same as breeding snakes, and then having a dog rescue. But yeah, i could see where breeding reptiles then rescuing them is kind of weird.

Aaron_S

11-13-12, 10:12 AM

I'm not ranting for the sake of ranting. I'm putting out there all the info I've seen and gathered over the 15 years I've been around, 7 of them on this forum here. I've seen the "rescues" come and go as fast as the flippers.

All the power to you but I don't this working out in dual action with a breeding business/rescue.

Gungirl

11-13-12, 10:40 AM

I would personally never support a rescue that breeds anything. Huge internal conflict going on there...

KORBIN5895

11-13-12, 10:58 AM

Wait, do you breed bearded dragons? I've never heard of a "rescue" breeding, since that's the reason rescues have to exist in the first place. =/

~Maggot

I saw a thread about this on another forum and will pm it to you. It was terrible.
The owner was and is a complete idiot. She thinks that rocking iguanas in a rocking chair will tame them.

i breed because i enjoy it, not for money. i have never heard of a breeder giving away there animals because they dont want them...excess animals come from owners who do not want them anymore. its not the breeders fault someone decided they didnt want there pet anymore its the owners fault ( and yes i felt the same way even before i started breeding)

The first line of defense against unwanted animals is for the "breeder" to see what the market saturation is. They then need to screen their potential customers. If "breeders" were more responsible there would be fewer unwanted animal.

I would personally never support a rescue that breeds anything. Huge internal conflict going on there...

Yeah. I agree. Something is not right. Free money maybe?