I hate this..

[infernalis]

People, excuses.. justifications!! Ugh it makes me nuts.

I spend all this time putting together all the hard data I can about Savannah Monitor care, and everyone I present it to has an excuse:angry:

Mine is just a baby, a fish tank is just fine.

I have a room I can let it run free in..

blah blah blah..

why do these people even buy a Lizard if they are not willing to take care of it correctly?

[KORBIN5895]

Mainly because they are stupid. Remember you can teach the ignorant but you can't educate the stupid.

[Snakefood]

Because the lizzard is cute and they're stupid, it's a bad combo.

17864

17865

[CK SandBoas]

Wayne, you can lead a horse to water, but you can't make it drink........

[jarich]

Its a difficult thing to be told you are killing your animal, especially with this particular animal. They are so hearty and active, even up to death, that I think it makes people feel they are doing just fine, even in the worst situations. Its hard for people to grasp the immediate need for change when the lizard is active, eating and doing all the things a healthy lizard does. I think we have to be patient and just keep plugging away at it. Plus the amazing example you set speaks volumes that words just cant.

Im not meaning to be harsh, but how long did you have Chomper in that cage before realizing you needed to get him into a better habitat? I know the first month of my Savs time with me was definitely scary. Makes me sick to think of what I put him through with my lack of knowledge. Excuses and justifications are easy for us all, and unfortunately we learn quickest through tragedy.

[alessia55]

I've noticed people getting baby savs on Facebook auctions and I've been private messaging them the varanus.us website. *shrugs* there's not much we can do to save them all, Wayne :no:

[KORBIN5895]

Wayne I have an idea and it isn't the most pleasant. Pm me if you want to know.

[infernalis]

shove pictures of chomper in his final moments in their face??

[Bradyloach]

Umm but Wayne! I was that person :(

[CDN_Blood]

Unfortunately, it's all too easy to be a terrible keeper these days. The current attitude towards herps these days is downright disgraceful, on the whole. There are very few truly dedicated and knowledgable keepers out there, and those who don't fall into that category are spreading their "knowledge" around so fast that it's impossible to stop.

I've met *so* many people who think they're experts in this or that aspect of herpetoculture, yet as far as I'm concerned, they're know-nothing know-it-alls. I've seen it more times than I can count.

A prime example are a few folks in my area who've attached themselves to a local reptile 'rescue', which is actually a horror show in disguise, yet everyone who works there thinks that parasites, disease, minimalistic husbandry and frequently losing animals is all part of everyday life with reptiles. They'll say "I'm a professional. I have X years experience", but if you ask them how many animals have died under their care, the truth of the matter becomes painfully obvious and it's like they don't seem to learn anything from it all. It's all just a matter of routine to them.

There is certainly no shortage of quality information out there for anyone with the desire to learn it, but most simply can't be bothered because to them these animals are so readily available that they'll just go out and get another to replace the one that died. It's far too easy to do when you consider living animals to be disposable items that can be picked-up just about anywhere.

I've turned-down many calls for help from people who I know are repeat offenders, and as much as it pains me to see their animals suffer and inevitably die due to their steadfast unwillingness to learn and change their practices, I simply will not take their animal in, fix it and return it only for them to repeat the exact same foolishness. It's a tough call to make, but for these repeat offenders, if I help them, they simply don't learn anything.

I could ramble-on about this for days and cite many cases-in-point, but it's futile because it won't change anything, so these days I keep my blinders on and *only* focus on those deserving of my attention. If someone is willing to learn, I'm there for them if they need me, but the rest of them will just get kicked to the curb. I'm at the point in my herp life that I have a zero tolerance policy for idiots, which explains my increasingly large ignore list.

[infernalis]

Umm but Wayne! I was that person :(

and look at you now, we are all proud of you...

You didn't put up a brick wall and ignore people. (Like I once did)

[infernalis]

Wayne I have an idea and it isn't the most pleasant. Pm me if you want to know.

Pm me, I want to know...

http://www.varanus.us/stone.jpg

[Bradyloach]

Yah I know! I'm Getting her an 8x4 in a couple weeks because the 5x2 is look really small for her now :p

[Kayla90]

So after reading this this morning .. this is what came out and I posted it a bunch of places on facebook..

; People! It's time to realize that just because it was "right" in the past doesn't mean it's actually the right thing to do. For years people have been buying Savannah Monitors, and treating them just like every other Monitor out there. Well guess what people, Savannah's are INSECTIVORES! Their body can not process a diet of rodents or meat. (I actually had someone tell me the other day that a sav's diet should consist of insects and DOG food. There is a reason it's labelled DOG food) Yes, they occasionally do it in the wild, but guess what, in the wild they have the EXACT husbandry that they need. In captivity, Sav's enclosures RARELY meet the requirements.
I think the fact that Savannah's in Captivity rarely make it past the first 5 years of their lives is proof enough of that matter. If anyone knows of a Sav that has made it to 10 years or 20 (which is what they SHOULD make it to) and it happens to have been brought up the way the majority of Sav's are, then please please bring it to my attention!
Sav's are NOT easy pets, and anyone who buys one thinking otherwise is mistaken. And if you don't read up on your animal EVERYTHING there is to know then I think that's cruel! And I'm not just specifying that to Sav's, but EVERY animal you take into your home be it Cat, Dog, Snake, Bird or Lizard!
I'm not trying to blame you, even I have made mistakes regarding my Sav's, I'm not ashamed to admit that, the only thing you can do is make it better from now on.

So PLEASE stop being so defensive when someone tells you that what your doing is potentially wrong, don't let your ego get in the way of doing what is best for the animals you bring into your life. It's not fair to them that they have to suffer because you are not willing to do a little research.

Anyone that would like to own a Savannah monitor please read up on them. Here is a website that can provide you with the information you need about them: Savannah Monitors (http://www.varanus.us/bok/)

[Bradyloach]

Savannah monitors can digest rodents :) its been proven by Daniel bennet. Just most people frown on it, including me. But a diet that has the occasional rodent will not do any harm, and according to Daniel bannet it does good.

[Kayla90]

I didn't say they couldn't digest them. I said that give the wrong environment it's harder for them to do so. Sav's in the wild have exactly what they need to do so... but when you have sav in captivity kept at about snake temps or lower??

[Bradyloach]

My sav you mean? Basking temp 135-143F. Cool side temp is 78. The coolest in the borrow I've ever recorded was 68 that was way down at night. Humitdy is always 50-68% but it's because my enclosure sucks. A 5x2 deffintly getting an 8x4 in a couple weeks

[Kayla90]

No Brady. This is not personal at all. This is about the whole of a species not an individual person.

[Bradyloach]

Oh haha, i will be posting a huge research project my girlfriend did on savannah monitors. It has a lot of nutritional information :)

[mattchibi]

Unfortunately, it's all too easy to be a terrible keeper these days. The current attitude towards herps these days is downright disgraceful, on the whole. There are very few truly dedicated and knowledgable keepers out there, and those who don't fall into that category are spreading their "knowledge" around so fast that it's impossible to stop.

I've met *so* many people who think they're experts in this or that aspect of herpetoculture, yet as far as I'm concerned, they're know-nothing know-it-alls. I've seen it more times than I can count.

A prime example are a few folks in my area who've attached themselves to a local reptile 'rescue', which is actually a horror show in disguise, yet everyone who works there thinks that parasites, disease, minimalistic husbandry and frequently losing animals is all part of everyday life with reptiles. They'll say "I'm a professional. I have X years experience", but if you ask them how many animals have died under their care, the truth of the matter becomes painfully obvious and it's like they don't seem to learn anything from it all. It's all just a matter of routine to them.

There is certainly no shortage of quality information out there for anyone with the desire to learn it, but most simply can't be bothered because to them these animals are so readily available that they'll just go out and get another to replace the one that died. It's far too easy to do when you consider living animals to be disposable items that can be picked-up just about anywhere.

I've turned-down many calls for help from people who I know are repeat offenders, and as much as it pains me to see their animals suffer and inevitably die due to their steadfast unwillingness to learn and change their practices, I simply will not take their animal in, fix it and return it only for them to repeat the exact same foolishness. It's a tough call to make, but for these repeat offenders, if I help them, they simply don't learn anything.

I could ramble-on about this for days and cite many cases-in-point, but it's futile because it won't change anything, so these days I keep my blinders on and *only* focus on those deserving of my attention. If someone is willing to learn, I'm there for them if they need me, but the rest of them will just get kicked to the curb. I'm at the point in my herp life that I have a zero tolerance policy for idiots, which explains my increasingly large ignore list.

Damn you bring up some great points and I couldnt have said it any better myself.

Wayne, I think the problem is bigger than just sav's. Reptiles just arent cute and cuddly and I guess most people just dont give the same respect to their reptile friends as they would a furry friend. It sucks. Even most of the reptile owners that I know personally in Toronto, most of them would call themselves "experienced" but I know for a fact that they still neglect their snakes or reptiles in many ways. Its also much easier to neglect a cold-blooded animal which generally have lots more husbandry needs than a cat or dog ever would. When I first read about ball pythons, I read on so many websites: "Ball pythons are very low maintenance pets, great for beginners!" Its true that ball pythons might be easy for someone who is actually experienced with reptiles, but for a beginner with the expectation that the snake will be easy to care for, once it becomes ~NOT~ easy to care for then the owners 90% of the time wont do anything to remedy the situation. I have a friend who has let countless reptiles and snakes die in his care- chinese water dragon, boas, tegus, savannah monitors and a bunch of corn snakes.. It pains me that I cant change the way he thinks.

Another thing that really bothers me is that if a dog or cat is being treated inhumanely, the owner can be reported and something would be done about it. But if a reptile is being mistreated, I have yet to see an organization who is willing to jump in and help out. People dont seem to be sympathetic towards reptiles, for some reason or another.

[kriminaal]

People are selfish when it comes to the environment and animals.
All they think about is how it will serve their needs and the present time with very little outlook on the span of it's life.
Unfortunately it becomes more prevalent as us older ones in the hobby become more obsolete and the younger ones take over. Not that all young people are irresponsible.

[BarelyBreathing]

I saw that. Ugh.

[Gregg M]

People are selfish when it comes to the environment and animals.
All they think about is how it will serve their needs and the present time with very little outlook on the span of it's life.
Unfortunately it becomes more prevalent as us older ones in the hobby become more obsolete and the younger ones take over. Not that all young people are irresponsible.

I agree. Lets put things into perspective here though. The very act of keeping wild animals like reptiles makes all of us who keep them selfish. Lets face it, by keeping and breeding these animals in our homes it does nothing good for our captive reptiles or their wild counterparts. Are there really different levels of selfishness? Being a good keeper does not make you any less selfish than a not so good keeper. Is a person who offers their Sav an 8 X 4 CAGE less selfish than someone who offers a 6 X 3? In the grand scheme of thing, no. You are still keeping a wild animal captive and offering it a fraction of the space it would have if it were in the wild.

In reality it is pretty hypocritical for a reptile keeper to call another keeper selfish. Also words like "pure" and "natural" should not be thrown around too often neither. There is nothing pure or natural about what we do. We keep wild animals in small boxes for our own selfish reasons.

A little OT...
I was once called selfish because I breed reptile in order to make some cash. Like there are better reasons to breed reptiles in captivity? When I asked why they breed their reptiles the answer was something like... "Because I wanted the experience" or "because I like the feeling I get when I see eggs hatching blah blah blah"... How are those reasons better than mine? Ofcorse I love reptiles and get excited during breeding season. So what makes making money on reptiles a bad thing?

[lady_bug87]

^^ makes a lot of sense to me.

[infernalis]

agreed on all counts, I have said it before...

What truly irritates me is that there is no standards, no enforcement.

A. you chain a dog to a post with a 12 inch lead in the hot sun

B. you keep a Monitor in a fish tank with a single brooding lamp

c. you keep a 12 foot snake in a sweater box under your bed

here is what happens...

A. someone reports you, the dog is taken away from you, you are fined for animal cruelty.

B & C someone turns you in, no one cares, the animal dies...

[lady_bug87]

That unfortunately is the nature of the beast. We all know anyone can buy anything without any kind of background check or permit. I would be all for permitting reptiles and having someone come out and check my tanks

This is not how the world works, some people don't even treat their CHILDREN with care and respect why would you expect them to treat animals any better?

[infernalis]

This is not how the world works, some people don't even treat their CHILDREN with care and respect why would you expect them to treat animals any better?

I know that one too, I am raising someone else's kid right now because her mother likes men more than children.

[Gregg M]

What truly irritates me is that there is no standards, no enforcement.



And that is why our hobby is in the shape it is now. We never had standards. People insist that our "right" to keep reptiles is being taken away from us. Where in our constitution does it state we have the right to do so? It is not a right, it is a privilege. Now we are faced with this problem with the government cracking down. Now we are spending money and time trying to protect a right we never really had to begin with. We should be and should have been spending time and resources on making a standard. Instead it is a free for all. Regulation and setting a standard is key. We should be looking at how gun owners, hunters, and people who do falconry regulate their hobby and keep their rights.

[jarich]

Ha! I think you'll find those people had it enforced upon them as well. Self regulation isn't a human strongpoint.

[Gregg M]

Ha! I think you'll find those people had it enforced upon them as well. Self regulation isn't a human strongpoint.

This is true, however they are still able to hunt, own guns and keep birds of prey. They are also very organized groups. The reptile community is getting more organized but it may be a bit too late.

We need to be regulated. Regulation is far better than having things taken away. I am all for not being able to keep reptiles unless you earn it by meeting certain criteria. People who ave a problem with that are most likely those who have something to worry about.

[jdavy]

The very act of keeping wild animals like reptiles makes all of us who keep them selfish. Lets face it, by keeping and breeding these animals in our homes it does nothing good for our captive reptiles or their wild counterparts.

Not sure that I agree with this part. Captive husbandry of all kinds of animals has enchanted a broad range of humans with the creatures that they keep. As such, when the animals that they have fallen in love with are in danger (deforestation, poaching, etc), we spring into action.

If it weren't for zoos, aquariums, (generally responsible) pet stores, and captive husbandry, I wouldn't have had the appreciation for animals that I do. Books and movies are great, but there's nothing quite like seeing and touching an animal to make you really appreciate it. If none of us appreciated them, we'd find ourselves wipping out loads of species for personal gain, and nobody caring.

I think that responsible captive husbandry has been good for wildlife in general.

[CDN_Blood]

...
I was once called selfish because I breed reptile in order to make some cash. Like there are better reasons to breed reptiles in captivity?...

That's the most brainless things I've seen on this forum. Fortunately, it illustrates my point beautifully.

[lady_bug87]

Not sure that I agree with this part. Captive husbandry of all kinds of animals has enchanted a broad range of humans with the creatures that they keep. As such, when the animals that they have fallen in love with are in danger (deforestation, poaching, etc), we spring into action.

If it weren't for zoos, aquariums, (generally responsible) pet stores, and captive husbandry, I wouldn't have had the appreciation for animals that I do. Books and movies are great, but there's nothing quite like seeing and touching an animal to make you really appreciate it. If none of us appreciated them, we'd find ourselves wipping out loads of species for personal gain, and nobody caring.

I think that responsible captive husbandry has been good for wildlife in general.

I think I can kinda see his point but only to an extent if it weren't for all the exhibits you mentioned we wouldnt see or even ave many animals as some kept in zoos are extinct in the wild. However when keepers have animals that they can't take care of or they constantly trade without any thought of the animals welfare that IS selfish...

[infernalis]

I think that responsible captive husbandry has been good for wildlife in general.

Not really, let me put this in perspective..

About two years ago a young man who had been to my home a few times and saw my rather large collection of garter snakes wanted to "impress me"

He saw a wild garter snake and it outran the boy, so he took off his shoe and threw it at the snake to make it stop, then he brought it to me and said "here I got you another one"

Despite my best efforts, that snake died.

The moral is, we are not doing nature any favors here, not until we start leaving the habitats and the animals alone to live as they were intended, we are only fueling mankind's desire to posses.

and yes I look in the mirror and point a finger at myself here too.

I am just as guilty as anyone in keeping wild animals in cages for my own pleasure.

[Bradyloach]

Yeah, good points Wayne. Honestly I think everyone I'll agree with me when I say; they should make it a requirement that you know about reptiles to work in the reptile department at a pet store and if you dont have any employees that know what there doing you should not be able to sell the pets they know nothing about. Ie: you know about bearded dragons, you can sell them. You don't know about savs, you can't sell them

[lady_bug87]

They should stop selling herps all together

[KORBIN5895]

I am just as guilty as anyone in keeping wild animals in cages for my own pleasure.

But at what point do they stop being wild and become domestic? Should we get rid of our dogs? Are we selfish because we keep them?

These are just points to ponder because all animals were once wild.

[jaleely]

Can't say as i don't agree with all of this...because i do!

All i can say is that i acknowledge i am selfish, and since i have been selfish, i'm going to give my animals the best non-natural home i can.

I will say that i won't breed them for money, that's perpetuating the problem. there SHOULD be regulation, and not everyone should be sold to or should own.

[Gregg M]

That's the most brainless things I've seen on this forum. Fortunately, it illustrates my point beautifully.

Not quite sure I follow. Are you saying I am brainless? And what point does what I wrote illustrate exactly?

My point was, and maybe you missed it, is that whatever your reason for breeding reptiles is, it is no better than anyone elses reasons because it is all selfish. How is breeding because "you want to" any better than people who breed to make some extra salt?

Do you breed your reptiles for anything other than self satisfaction?
Lets face it, not one of us is doing it for the greater good of the species. Anyone who says that or thinks it is only fooling themselves.

I think you better look more into a post before you jump and say it is brainless.

If you did not type this with the idea of insulting me in mind, I apologize in advance.

But at what point do they stop being wild and become domestic? Should we get rid of our dogs? Are we selfish because we keep them?


They will never be domesticated. They are not pack, pride, or herd animals that rely on eachother or their owners. Also the are actual criteria that need to be met to be able to call an animal domesticated. The biology of reptiles alone make them unable to be domesticated. Animals that are domesticated are because their behaviors and instincts allow them to be. Its not just because we can breed them.


I will say that i won't breed them for money, that's perpetuating the problem. there SHOULD be regulation, and not everyone should be sold to or should own.

Breeding them for any reason would be perpetuating the problem even if money exchange was not involved. And I agree 100% with your last sentence.

[infernalis]

But at what point do they stop being wild and become domestic? Should we get rid of our dogs? Are we selfish because we keep them?

These are just points to ponder because all animals were once wild.

Your dog will follow you home, it will come in when called.

Show me any reptile, any at all that will even look back at you as it runs away.

When people keep certain birds, they clip their wings, Why?? because it will fly away.

Put your goldfish in a river and see if it comes back to you.

[bushsnake]

Lmao, love the goldfish part Wayne

[red ink]

A little OT...
I was once called selfish because I breed reptile in order to make some cash. Like there are better reasons to breed reptiles in captivity? When I asked why they breed their reptiles the answer was something like... "Because I wanted the experience" or "because I like the feeling I get when I see eggs hatching blah blah blah"... How are those reasons better than mine? Ofcorse I love reptiles and get excited during breeding season. So what makes making money on reptiles a bad thing?

The procedure and ethics behind it...

Making money off well kept reptiles in pristine conditions with all their captive husbandry requirement met.... pretty satisfying and sweet!

Making money off reptiles by the "numbers" game without really offering more than the bare minimum to keep them breeding and generating hatchlings for money.... pretty sad and at times despicable.

Absolutely nothing wrong in making money from reptiles... it's the way people go about it that's the grey area of morality.

[millertime89]

Such an interesting conversation, I'm gonna hold my tongue on my opinion on the direction this discussion has taken for the time. However I DO disagree with the original FS add that was posted.

[infernalis]

Lmao, love the goldfish part Wayne

Illustrates the difference between captive and pet nicely eh?

[KORBIN5895]

I would just like to point out I said nothing about reptiles. My point was all animals in general.

[kriminaal]

I agree with the basis of what you're saying Gregg.
Personal hobbyists is a selfish endeavour no matter how much we don't like to think about it. There are all kinds of levels to it and debates I'm sure.

[Gregg M]

The procedure and ethics behind it...

Making money off well kept reptiles in pristine conditions with all their captive husbandry requirement met.... pretty satisfying and sweet!

Making money off reptiles by the "numbers" game without really offering more than the bare minimum to keep them breeding and generating hatchlings for money.... pretty sad and at times despicable.

Absolutely nothing wrong in making money from reptiles... it's the way people go about it that's the grey area of morality.

I agree that all husbandry requirements should be met to the fullest. If you do not care about reptiles and their well being, you should not be keeping them, much less attempt to breed them.

One thing is though, in order to get the healthiest hatchling and even good numbers, you need to take very good care of your breeders. I see people saying that even unhealthy reptiles will breed in a last ditch effort to pass on their genetics. This is simply untrue. Believe it or not, self preservation is a top priority on the instinct list. An adult female reptile generally will not breed or even ovulate if she is not "doing well". People who think otherwise most likely have very little to no breeding experience.

So honestly, even those who pump out hatchling in big nimbers and doing so every year for years are most likely keeping their reptiles in proper conditions. Breeding reptiles are reptiles that are having, at the very least, the large majority of their needs met. Is there room for improvement? Certainly. We can all improve our husbandry. This is why proper information is important. On the net, there is a lot of conflicting information. That is why standards should be set. Unfortunately, we as a group are not organized enough yet. We are off to a great start with organizations like USARK though. Hopefully it all pans out well for us as a community.

[mattchibi]

I pretty much agree with what everybody has said. Yes, we are all being selfish by keeping or breeding reptiles; however, as humans, we have to realize that it is never black and white for any situation. As long as a breeder is giving their snakes the best quality of life possible, then I would think it is much LESS selfish than if a breeder was barely giving their snakes enough in order to make a quick buck. And like Greg said, the ones who have been in the business the longest are clearly the ones who are probably doing the right things. Most of the time, people who get into breeding for the quick buck will not stay in the business for very long.

My personal reasons for breeding other than making a little money on the side is that I wanted to spread the addiction of ball pythons as far as I could- I wanted other people to experience what I had experienced when I got my first one. I dont think snakes as a hobby is nearly as developed in Canada than it is in the States, so one of the main factors that made me want to breed was creating a "worlds first" morph or a "canada's first" morph.

The last reason I think was because, to me, the patterns and colour mutations that happen and are possible within ball pythons and other snakes is fascinating to me. I wish I had studied science in high school but until I ran into ball python genetics, I was never really interested in anything related to science. To me, as an artist as well, I love creating new things, so the opportunity to have a living animal as my canvas and to be able to design and "paint" designs on them by mixing different genes pretty much blew my mind and who knows where breeding a few snakes will take me, but I hope it changes my life.

So after stating those reasons, yes, I still think I am being selfish. But as long as there is a demand for snakes, people will breed them. So why not me? At least I am giving my snakes 100% of my attention and I have really done my research on how to give them the best quality of life, so at least I will be selling HEALTHY snakes to people. If someone was interested in buying a snake, I would MUCH rather there be an option of a private at-home breeder who has healthy snakes, rather than them buying from a big chain like Petsmart which would reinforce the sale of terribly malnourished and unhealthy snakes. There is obviously a flip side to each argument and Im sure someone might disagree with what I've said, but nothing in life is perfect, so we can only really do our best and hope that things turn out the way you want. Just my opinion so feel free to disagree

[infernalis]

So back to the original reason I posted this in the first place, What really bothers me the most is that I have seen what ignoring sound advice can lead to with my own eyes.

So when I try and tell people what is going to happen next and they blow me off, yes I get pissed...

[bushsnake]

dont you hate it when your trying to get a point across and you get "i dont care"...i know your feeling Wayne

[lady_bug87]

So back to the original reason I posted this in the first place, What really bothers me the most is that I have seen what ignoring sound advice can lead to with my own eyes.

So when I try and tell people what is going to happen next and they blow me off, yes I get pissed...

And some will never ever learn. The only tho g we can do is repeat ourselves and the rest is out of our hands

[infernalis]

dont you hate it when your trying to get a point across and you get "i dont care"...i know your feeling Wayne

Yes, I am talking to someone on RFUK right now that said "My bosc stopped eating" but when the poster's husbandry comes into question, the reply is "My Bosc is well kept"

Uh, huh.. that's why an animal that sucks down food like it's starving is nosing up at crickets.

[crocdoc]

I am talking to someone on RFUK right now that said "My bosc stopped eating" but when the poster's husbandry comes into question, the reply is "My Bosc is well kept"

A surprisingly common phrase on monitor forums is some form of "conditions were perfect, then it died", but when you try to point out to these keepers that conditions couldn't have been perfect or it wouldn't have died, they get very angry and defensive. People are rarely critical of their own husbandry and for some reason are reluctant to find out the truth. Personally, I do not understand why people have so much pride wrapped up in something that could actually help them. Aside from monitor keeping, I have a stack of other hobbies - way more than I should, as most have to be ignored for long periods while I concentrate on the others. This means that, aside from monitor forums, I am also a member of many forums that have nothing to do with reptile keeping. On some forums I give out advice but on others I am a newbie and avidly read the advice of others. I have no sense of pride when it comes to things I know little about and would rather find out why I am failing so that I can avoid it in future (or, even better, read about it before I fail so I can prevent failure) than carry on as though I have more experience than I actually do. How hard is that? None of these other hobbies involves the lives of other creatures, so failure has no real world tragic consequences. You'd think that where the hobby does involve a living creature, people would put their pride aside to do everything they can to make sure they get things right, but they don't. As others have said in this thread, most people are selfish by nature.

Which leads me to the other things which have been discussed. Here are my thoughts on those topics:

Does keeping animals in captivity engender a desire for the conservation of wild animals? Yes and no. Zoos play (or should play) an important role in public education about wild animals and their habitats. I've worked in the zoo industry, in a handful of zoos and wildlife parks, both government and privately/corporate funded. All of them played lip service to conservation by big claims of having bred animals x,y and z in captivity, but the reality is that very few zoos in the world do any meaningful conservation work through captive breeding and their sole role in conservation is public education. Part of this is simply through an increasingly urban public getting their only exposure to wildlife within zoo-type facilities, therefore developing some level of empathy which may affect their voting decisions when it comes to conservation. This, however, does not seem to translate to private keeping. I disagree that the keeping of reptiles in captivity engenders some sort of feeling for wild populations. Often it is quite the opposite in that the wild is seen as a giant Petco from which more pet reptiles can be taken, with little regard as to how this may affect wild populations. I've been amazed at what a small proportion of the people that keep reptiles in captivity spend any time at all field herping, to see what the wild reptiles get up to. The other thing that has always amazed me has been reading conversations on forums in which someone is weighing the pros and cons of purchasing a wild caught or a captive bred reptile. The pros and cons are always about the keeper, never about the animal. "Will it cost me more in vet bills, to get rid of parasites? Will it be harder for me to get feeding? Will it become tame?" What one hardly ever reads is "Is the trade in this species well enough regulated that I can be assured wild populations are not affected by collecting? Am I supporting an unsustainable trade? Is it likely any habitat was destroyed in the collection of these animals - rock crevices split open with a crow bar, hollow trees felled etc? How many individuals died during the collection/shipping process?" Not all collection of reptiles from the wild is bad, but it's important to find out whether or not the source of one's pets is sustainable. Some trade in WC reptiles is sustainable, but much of it is not. Most people don't care to find out which is which. Years ago I had a conversation with a group of keepers about a hypothetical situation in which they came across a particular rare species of reptile in the wild. What would they do? I, of course, said I'd photograph it with glee. One of the keepers, though, said he'd collect it. When I asked if he was not concerned about its endangered status, his reply was "no, not at all, because I know I could look after it". Even if he wasn't the appalling keeper with a terrible record that he was, that statement went down as one of the most frustratingly ignorant things I've ever heard.

Does captive breeding have any value aside from lining the breeders pockets? Yes, it does. By producing more reptiles for the pet trade, a breeder reduces the market for reptiles being taken from the wild. If it gives the breeder pocket money at the same time, it's a win win situation, for the person is inspired to continue to breed more. This is where one must separate conservation from animal liberation. Sometimes what is good for conservation isn't necessarily good for animal liberation (and vice versa). Like most people, I care about individual animals and worry about animals being mistreated, but if I have to make a choice between the wellbeing of one individual vs a threat to wild populations, I'll always protect the latter first. A good example of that, relating directly to monitors: It is better for someone to breed monitors to supply the hobby, knowing that a certain percentage of people buying those baby monitors will end up mistreating them through insufficient care, than to not breed them and leave those people to buy and mistreat wild caught monitors instead? In my opinion, yes, it is.

Finally, are any reptiles domesticated? Yes, some have been. Domestication doesn't mean they are companion animals, it merely means they have been genetically modified through selective breeding in captivity. All of those colour morphs of leopard geckos, ball pythons etc are domestic. Goldfish have been extremely domesticated, especially those double-tailed, bubble-eyed monstrosities. Setting something free to see if it will return only determines a species' site loyalty rather than its level of domestication. Dogs are social pack animals, so they'd rather be with their keepers than go elsewhere. Horses, a little less so. Cattle even less. Pigs go feral fairly easily. Pigeons have a stronger homing instinct than horses, cattle and pigs combined, but they're no more domesticated and are far less intelligent. They're just site loyal.

There, my two cents in essay form. :)

[jarich]

Nice answer Dave, although I think that would be at least four cents, maybe a nickel. ;)

[Freebody]

heres one i hate, my Father, gets a 1.5 year old male corn, 6 months old female. 6-8 months after i got the bulk of my snakes in mid 2010. well he was so excited to breed his corns, he has either A decided to add a year to both snakes in his head, and call it time to finaly breeding his snakes. just says its a few grams under 300 for the female thats all, " ****ing snake is no more than 200 grams tops, ( corns breed at 3 years and 300 grams) < correct me if im worng. i should weight it. well he bread the thing this year, im telling him wtf are you doing when i found out hes been introducing his male. he wont listen, im like i wish i were wrong, but it not who gets to say they won the dispute, the snakes are 2 and 3, not 3 and 4, ie not ready to breed a 2 year old, 200 gram corn snake. i keep reminding him I got my snakes in mid 2010, he had no snakes for the past 20 years, now you got yours before i got the 1st of my current collection? so you were the first person to bring snakes back into the house? he says of course not, your just worng accept it, we live in the same house, we both went to get my first snake of my collection after a time of no snakes in the house, we both know what age bella is, but he just continues to say No im wrong....... the words come out of my mouth and just seem to disapear, i cant help to want yell out ****ing use your brain! just think you will see your wrong becuase you dont want to accept the truth because if she dies its on your conciounce..... but i cant say ****, hes my dad and im better than that.... well lucky thing she layed eggs and they look good and she is not DEAD, now its... it old ya.... i just keep saying you should really count yourself lucky you didnt kill your snake, and he so happy.... if it was anyone else i would beet the hell out of them right now as i write this. but instead i got to be happy for him and swallow my anger for intensional animal abuse.

[millertime89]

Wow Dave, great response.

[infernalis]

Wow Dave, great response.

Yes it was, and I for one am very thankful to have his knowledge available to us here.

[crocdoc]

Aww, thanks, guys!

[KORBIN5895]

@ Dave.

Wow. I really appreciate the insight.

@ freebody.

That whole situation sucks but kudos to you for respecting your father.

[Gregg M]

When are you guys going to learn. Croc Doc has no idea what he is talking about. LOL

Actually Dave, the only thing I do not fully agree with is that there are reptiles that are domesticated. I guess it is all down to opinion and we all cant agree on everything.

And to Freebody, Honestly, that 3 years, 3 feet, 3 years old rule for cornsnakes is a pile of crap. All of the corns I have bred started a 200 grams and around 2 feet long no matter what age. Some were only a year and half old.

[mo9e64]

This 'snake keepers' mentality has and still is one of the biggest setbacks to educating people about monitor husbandry.Unfortunately the control aspect fights adversly with the interest of our charges-monitor don't have the low threshold of care that snakes can subsist and procreate under.Having been in the monitor forum,hearing someone speak of a creature breeding at a size it was biologically designed to do outside human expectations and control i find odd.

As far as being frustrated by people not taking advice,or impulse buys-that is beyond my control.My responsibilty is to take care of my monitors beyond the best of my abilities-not accepting boundaries set by others or possibly my own prejudices,but what my monitor is telling me with the help of a broad spectrum of experienced keepers.Selfish that benefits others is after all another justification that will just have to do

[exwizard]

As far as being frustrated by people not taking advice,or impulse buys-that is beyond my control.My responsibilty is to take care of my monitors beyond the best of my abilities-not accepting boundaries set by others or possibly my own prejudices,but what my monitor is telling me with the help of a broad spectrum of experienced keepers.Selfish that benefits others is after all another justification that will just have to do

This is well said and really applies to ALL reptiles. When I give advice, I fully accept the possibility that the recipient will not take it. That responsibility is not mine as its on them.

[Gregg M]

This 'snake keepers' mentality has and still is one of the biggest setbacks to educating people about monitor husbandry.Unfortunately the control aspect fights adversly with the interest of our charges-monitor don't have the low threshold of care that snakes can subsist and procreate under.


Being a snake breeder I have to disagree with your take on the "snake keeper mentality".

You can keep and breed snakes in conditions that are substandad in my eyes. You can also keep and breed monitors in the same substandard conditions. However, as with varanids, many snake species will fail to thrive after a period of time. They will die early on in life, lay crappy clutches after a couple of seasons, and have other health issues. Monitors are not the only reptiles that should be given what they need to thrive.

Monitor breeders are not an elite group and snake breeders will run into similar problems if their reptiles are not given options.

I honestly think ost snake breeders are behind the times and the ones who are up to par are not sharing information. You would be suprised to know that some snake keepers keep their snakes like we do monitors. My snakes are kept in racks however, they have deep bioactive substrates, high basking temps, and are fed pretty frequently.

[mo9e64]

When i say 'mentality' i'm not talking the whole community.Are the methods you talk about commonplace and pretty much accepted by the snake keeping community.I am just going by the few times i have brought it up on a Canadian reptile forum-i was told it was blasphemy and forced to curl up in my room in the fetal position.'Give reptiles choice...heretic LOL.I certainly don't want to give the impression that monitor keepers are elitist,it's just my opinion many snake keepers think that their methods are superior to the methods Gregg described

[bushsnake]

Being a snake breeder I have to disagree with your take on the "snake keeper mentality".

You can keep and breed snakes in conditions that are substandad in my eyes. You can also keep and breed monitors in the same substandard conditions. However, as with varanids, many snake species will fail to thrive after a period of time. They will die early on in life, lay crappy clutches after a couple of seasons, and have other health issues. Monitors are not the only reptiles that should be given what they need to thrive.

Monitor breeders are not an elite group and snake breeders will run into similar problems if their reptiles are not given options.

I honestly think ost snake breeders are behind the times and the ones who are up to par are not sharing information. You would be suprised to know that some snake keepers keep their snakes like we do monitors. My snakes are kept in racks however, they have deep bioactive substrates, high basking temps, and are fed pretty frequently.
nobody learns by being criticized, lead by example is all anyone can do. Talk about what you do, show people...educate, some people will get it, some wont...but thats just how it is with everything
bushsnake (http://bushsnake.yolasite.com)

[bushsnake]

thats because people hate to be critized no matter how nice you are about it. Its a people thing..."people do people things"...kind of how you felt critized by Frank R Wayne

[mo9e64]

So what are you saying-if we have to choose between personalities and the welfare of our animals choose personalties.Remember the comments i made were generalities,not absolute comments made about a community.

Our monitor community as a whole has a dismall record overall,you cannot apply the typical snake husbandry to monitors.A lot of snake keepers cross over to the monitor community this is a fair comment.

[infernalis]

So what are you saying-if we have to choose between personalities and the welfare of our animals choose personalties.Remember the comments i made were generalities,not absolute comments made about a community.

Our monitor community as a whole has a dismall record overall,you cannot apply the typical snake husbandry to monitors.A lot of snake keepers cross over to the monitor community this is a fair comment.

You are absolutely right.

One of the things I see every day, and have been guilty of myself in the past, Monitors are not snakes, not even close.

So whatever husbandry you know about snakes, no matter how good it is, only partially applies to monitors.

[bushsnake]

So what are you saying-if we have to choose between personalities and the welfare of our animals choose personalties.Remember the comments i made were generalities,not absolute comments made about a community.

Our monitor community as a whole has a dismall record overall,you cannot apply the typical snake husbandry to monitors.A lot of snake keepers cross over to the monitor community this is a fair comment.
no thats not what i was saying.....at all! nevermind...

[Gregg M]

So what are you saying-if we have to choose between personalities and the welfare of our animals choose personalties.Remember the comments i made were generalities,not absolute comments made about a community.

Mo, we all know you are here just to start trouble. LOL

Our monitor community as a whole has a dismall record overall,you cannot apply the typical snake husbandry to monitors.A lot of snake keepers cross over to the monitor community this is a fair comment.

I get what you are saying for sure. My pont is, the "snake keeper mentality" is actually "the people who do not know any better or dont care mentality". The same can be said for the majority of monitor keepers. To me, keeping any animals on paper towels or news print is cruel. This includes snakes.

I produced thousands of leopard geckos in rack systems using paper towel as a substrate for years. These days I do not breed them on any scale worth mentioning (I keep them because I like them). I keep them on deep, bio-active substrates and I would never go back to paper towels ever for any species. The difference it has made in behavior, health, and longevity is astounding. No suprize that the huge majority of leopard keepers and breeders refuse to use substrates and stick to paper towels. Mostly because people believe that sand causes impaction. It can not have anything to do with their crappy husbandry. LOL.

[KORBIN5895]

I got banned here..

I still think a paper bag would look better......

[Gungirl]

If you got banned you can not post....

[alessia55]

If you got banned you can not post....

Exactly what I was going to say!

[bushsnake]

Mo, we all know you are here just to start trouble. LOL



I get what you are saying for sure. My pont is, the "snake keeper mentality" is actually "the people who do not know any better or dont care mentality". The same can be said for the majority of monitor keepers. To me, keeping any animals on paper towels or news print is cruel. This includes snakes.

I produced thousands of leopard geckos in rack systems using paper towel as a substrate for years. These days I do not breed them on any scale worth mentioning (I keep them because I like them). I keep them on deep, bio-active substrates and I would never go back to paper towels ever for any species. The difference it has made in behavior, health, and longevity is astounding. No suprize that the huge majority of leopard keepers and breeders refuse to use substrates and stick to paper towels. Mostly because people believe that sand causes impaction. It can not have anything to do with their crappy husbandry. LOL.
hypo lavender albino corn, sunglow boas, green granite burms and bla bla bla...people dont wanna keep these types of animals in a naturalistic environment...it might get dirty lol...i think people that have their head rapped around the morph game have forgotten that their animal is a living creature and should be in sterile environment

[mo9e64]

Why should an animal be in a sterile environment?

[mo9e64]

sorry i misread i see what you meant oops

[infernalis]

If you got banned you can not post....

oh darn, what am I going to do with these baby sav pictures.?

[Gungirl]

Post them up...

Why are you being a weenie hut?

[Bradyloach]

Its be because he's old!!!! BAZINGA please dont bann me haha

[Gungirl]

lol... how old do you consider old?

I think its because he is a man....nothing to do with age.

[infernalis]

Its be because he's old!!!! BAZINGA please dont bann me haha


you are not allowed to say Bazinga on forums,,

[BarelyBreathing]

What is "bazinga"? I've never heard that word before.

[jaleely]

me either, and what's a weenie hut? lol

[infernalis]

Bazinga is a slang word that weenie huts use to communicate.

[jaleely]

dang wayne, you know you did that to us on purpose. how am i supposed to get up on my forum lingo now?

[jarich]

Jarich,
I am a NYC kid too. Well not much of a kid anymore. You are too. Not many people outside of NYC understand us too well. The NYC intellect can get us misunderstood at times. Other times it just gets us in trouble. Dont know why, but despite all that, the girls outside NYC seem to like us a lot. LOL.

Ha! Ya, its true. I lived in London for awhile as well and the chavs there are the same. The girls still love them too. ;)

[BarelyBreathing]

Ha! Ya, its true. I lived in London for awhile as well and the chavs there are the same. The girls still love them too. ;)


Girls love... what?

[millertime89]

Jarich,
I am a NYC kid too. Well not much of a kid anymore. You are too. Not many people outside of NYC understand us too well. The NYC intellect can get us misunderstood at times. Other times it just gets us in trouble. Dont know why, but despite all that, the girls outside NYC seem to like us a lot. LOL.

its the "big city idolized" mentality, I personally thought NYC was overrated when I was there. I liked Chicago better.

[infernalis]

New york, London, Paris, Munich...

ten points if anyone gets that.

[SpOoKy]

Pop Muzik :)

[infernalis]

Pop Muzik :)

shoobie doobie doo wop!!!:cool:

[SpOoKy]

La la la la la la la la la
la la la la la la la
La la la la la la la la la
la la la la la la la

...a little before my time but I remember it from childhood lol

[Gregg M]

Girls love... what?
City boys.
Its this weird phenomenon that happens when NYC men go outside NYC. Its like the girls are instantly drawn to us for some strange reason. Swftly followed by local males not liking us because the local women are hanging with us at the bar. LOL

I personally thought NYC was overrated when I was there. I liked Chicago better.

Ah, Chicago id a great city. Still, nothing beats the Rotten Apple. LOL

[jarich]

its the "big city idolized" mentality, I personally thought NYC was overrated when I was there. I liked Chicago better.

Not idolized, no. I have lived many places though, (including Lincoln for a year) and just find that I like the cities much better.

I think what the girls like about NYC guys is their confidence and extroversion. And we new yorkers have no end of that!

[Gungirl]

City boys.
Its this weird phenomenon that happens when NYC men go outside NYC. Its like the girls are instantly drawn to us for some strange reason. Swftly followed by local males not liking us because the local women are hanging with us at the bar. LOL



Ah, Chicago id a great city. Still, nothing beats the Rotten Apple. LOL

hahahahah City boys... I don't know what to say about that. I think country men win every time. A man that hunts fishes and rides a tractor is where the real sexy is.

[jarich]

Ha! Dont worry Kat, Ive done all those things and more. Spent a few years on a horse ranch. Waking up at 5 am to go feed is not my idea of fun though, and neither is driving combine during harvest for 18 hours a day (ugh talk about boring). Still love walking a river fishing all day though.

[Gungirl]

My dream is to own a working farm, I want it all and then some. My husband isn't so sure about the "farm" but he does want to live out in the woods where we can hunt off our own land.

[BarelyBreathing]

This girl doesn't like city boys.

Come to think about it, this girl doesn't like country boys, either.

[infernalis]

This girl doesn't like city boys.

Come to think about it, this girl doesn't like country boys, either.

Awesome, so you're into chicks...:freakedout:

[KORBIN5895]

Or maybe MEN?

[Gungirl]

I covered my butt on that one, I stated country men.. Although if I didn't have my country man I would happily take home a woman. ;)

[BarelyBreathing]

Yeah, men. But all the guys I've ever been attracted to were bred, born, and raised in the suburbs.

[BarelyBreathing]

Awesome, so you're into chicks...:freakedout:


Just Dakota Fanning.

[alessia55]

Just Dakota Fanning.

She's legal now, ya know...

http://twilight-review.com/wp-content/uploads/2011/08/Hannah-Dakota-Fanning.jpg

[Gungirl]

I will never understand that one....

[BarelyBreathing]

Yeah. I'm like... obsessed!

[Mikey T]

Well this thread just got quite interesting LOL

[Skumbo]

Incompetent People Too Ignorant to Know It - Yahoo! News (http://news.yahoo.com/incompetent-people-too-ignorant-know-175402902.html)

[BarelyBreathing]

I'm definitely not funny... but I know it. :(

[Gregg M]

A man that hunts fishes and rides a tractor is where the real sexy is.

How about a man that hunts, fishes, and rides these? What do you think only country boys do those things? Only difference is city boys dont rock mullets and leaf camo hats. LOL

http://farm3.staticflickr.com/2095/4509733214_9915976745_z.jpg

http://farm5.staticflickr.com/4023/4509093115_081e5102df_z.jpg

[Gungirl]

yup those count too... lol I have always wanted a bike. That is on a short list of wants for the future. I will have one someday and hopefully sooner rather than later.

[BarelyBreathing]

Only difference is city boys dont rock mullets and leaf camo hats. LOL


Geesh, you should see the country folk around here. Theres one HUGE MAN (both upwards and outwards) who always rides a child's bicycle around town, and he's always bleeding from somewhere (first time I saw him he had an open head wound). I'd guess he was around 35.

There's another guy in his sixties or seventies who rides around town in a scooter (like, motorized wheel chair type) with a trailer attachment behind it that is sometimes replaced by a push type lawn mower. Mind you, this man can walk fine. He bike-chains his scooter to the park bench outside the general store before he walks up and does his shopping. I've even seen him dancing.

The teens are either typical country rodeo jocks or ICP "juggalos".

I could go on and on and on...

[Gungirl]

LMAO! I am glad I don't live around your neck of the woods. I don't have people like that around me that I know of. I hope I never find them either.

[infernalis]

Let's see, we have a guy who got a DWI for driving his lawn mower to the store while drunk, he was buying more beer.

There is one dude down the street who was doing donuts in a hayfield when his truck overheated, he took off the radiator cap, it flew up into the sky, so when he couldn't find it, he revved the truck until it seized and then got out and kicked the side of the truck while yelling at it.

One dude I know of left his wife to move in with his wife's brother's wife.

They met at the family thanksgiving dinner.

Oh yeah, rednecks everywhere.

They make Larry The cable guy look like a sophisticated wall street man.

[Gungirl]

Ok lets say that the hot country men are sophisticated enough to not do those ^ things.
There is a huge difference between a redneck and a hillbilly. I think rednecks have more class. Hillbilly's marry family and act like idiots.

[BarelyBreathing]

The town I live in pretty much consists of the "town" and then the "outside of town". The town has the typical run down hillbilly houses, trailer park, etc. I live in the "outside of town" area, where it's nothing but huge farm land. Most of the people out here are normal. In town, though...

[Gregg M]

There is a huge difference between a redneck and a hillbilly. I think rednecks have more class. Hillbilly's marry family and act like idiots.

Thats all the same to us city slickers. LOL. On a serious note, personally, I love the big city life and the country life. It all about balance. I can only take country music in very small doses though. LOL

[BarelyBreathing]

There is only one genre of music that bothers me as much as country does, and that's rap. I hate them both.

[infernalis]

Well the 2012 madness begins, Youtube is flooded with baby sav videos, and none of them any good.

well, except the ones that Infernalis guy keeps posting.

[BarelyBreathing]

I wonder who that Infernalis guy is. He's the only one on Youtube who seems to have any sense. And his babies are CUTE!

[infernalis]

I sent a few of them nice comments to look at the web sites.

Careful not to criticize, I say "Nice sav, have you seen savannahmonitor.co"

that way I don't get the "sod off douche" comments back.

Let them come to thier own conclusions.

[BarelyBreathing]

I wish savannahmonitor.org was still up. Makes me sad.

[infernalis]

I wish savannahmonitor.org was still up. Makes me sad.

I just wish I could replicate the level of the info they had, but give me time, I am adding to my site every day.

[alessia55]

I sent a few of them nice comments to look at the web sites.

Careful not to criticize, I say "Nice sav, have you seen savannahmonitor.co"

that way I don't get the "sod off douche" comments back.

Let them come to thier own conclusions.

I really think you should put pics in there of what the cage looks like now, with all the things you've added (the grass, etc). At the end of the enclosure plans link you put, there's no real "end product" photo of the whole thing. Photos of your current enclosure give a much better idea of what it should look like ;)

[millertime89]

They make Larry The cable guy look like a sophisticated wall street man.

We've delivered pizza to a place that he was at once. The driver got his autograph, and a BIG tip.

Ah, Chicago id a great city. Still, nothing beats the Rotten Apple. LOL

NYC is way way WAY down on my list of places to visit (again in this case) and I don't think I could ever live there, which is saying something.

[infernalis]

I really think you should put pics in there of what the cage looks like now, with all the things you've added (the grass, etc). At the end of the enclosure plans link you put, there's no real "end product" photo of the whole thing. Photos of your current enclosure give a much better idea of what it should look like ;)

good idea..

been reworking things till my head is buzzing..

[alessia55]

This guy is so proud of all the work he's done to build a sav this custom enclosure... and then gives him a mouse :no:

S8KDLdKJT5Q

[SpOoKy]

I don't even have words for that video...It makes fish tanks look like high end condo's.
Shame shame shame :(

[infernalis]

The mouse part does not bother me nearly as much as it's small size and the screen front.

He cannot maintain humidity with that, and not enough dirt to burrow in.

sad..

[Gungirl]

I don't see anything good about that video. I am not surprised he is feeding mice and rats. That cage is WAY to small he feeds cat food and it has screen doors. :(

[alessia55]

I am by all means an amateur (only know what I know because of you guys), but I left him a comment. :hmm: :no:

[infernalis]

I am by all means an amateur (only know what I know because of you guys), but I left him a comment. :hmm: :no:

I see that, thanks for the link!!

I just left a comment too, he seems like a nice guy, let's hope he's one that accepts constructive help.

[BarelyBreathing]

That's sad....

[alessia55]

Need suggestions... here is another video I commented on:

p6T8rm7LZts

I wrote:
It is obvious that you love your sav. He has a really great personality! But your housing for your sav is nowhere near what it needs to be... Check out Savannahmonitor.co for more information. Start making the necessary changes or your sav will probably pay for it with his life... I want you to enjoy your sav for a long time, so hopefully you'll do what's necessary...

He responded:
The cage has a second level with 2ft of a 50/50 dirt/sand mixture. Humidity stays between 50-70. He gets a diet of 85% bugs 15% eggs. Basking temperature of 130-135F, top of the cage temperature is at 85-90F, and the bottom of the cage is 78-85F. He has two water bowls with filtered water and a tub full of non filtered water for soaking.
What am I missing?
-Chris

But I'm not experienced enough to respond further. Is there anything I should say?

[BarelyBreathing]

He needs more hides and cover, leaf litter, branches. Bury some earth worms in the soil for mental and physical stimulation when he can't be outside to play. He looks fairly healthy and well rounded, otherwise.

[alessia55]

He needs more hides and cover, leaf litter, branches. Bury some earth worms in the soil for mental and physical stimulation when he can't be outside to play. He looks fairly healthy and well rounded, otherwise.

Can I just copy-paste what you wrote?

[BarelyBreathing]

Of course. :)

[millertime89]

Skorge seems to have it better off than most other ones. I'm digging the name as well.

[jarich]

Thats a great looking monitor, good tone, active and alert and seems well cared for. I like the diet as well. If all that is on the second level I wouldnt doubt that those things Hedy mentioned are there already. Looks like the guy is doing a good job!