Monitor enclosure discussion thread

[infernalis]

From the sounds of what you describe, you have a lucky lizard.

Thanks for the kind words.

[Lobretto]

Awesome, I pray that she gets to be in that small group that make it well past 5.

[Pirarucu]

That sounds like a lucky lizard to have you as an owner. Far luckier than most, she should live past five with no problems whatsoever.

[Lobretto]

I went ahead and sealed the vent between the glass and the top with weather striping to better hold heat and humidity, the Nevada winter is fast approaching and it can get cold even in doors.

[infernalis]

Insulate the enclosure, put a layer of foam board and build outer walls, like a house or a room would be built.

Went without power for 24 hours once, and my monitor enclosure never dropped below 80 degrees.(F)

[Lobretto]

Sounds like a great idea. I knew coming here was a great idea! Here is a pic of Ridex for everyone to enjoy.

[Wyldrose]

Here is my girl, Raptor, I have had her 3.5 months now, I had her in a 6'x2'x2' expecting that to last long enough to build her a larger home. I was amazed at the rate of her growth and she has now moved into her 8'x4'x4'.
Here is the almost finished(I need to get some paint for the outside) home
Hubby brought home a bunch of his late step dad's tools and he figured he'd store them in my way lol!
http://i77.photobucket.com/albums/j69/Pharfly/002-56.jpg
Pretty much everything I used to build it was 2nd hand, minus the plywood. I paid $10 each for the windows. I took out the screens, extra panes and turned them around so it locks on the outside.
She seems very happy and content in there, she ate the day after moving in there.
She has pretty much trampled and killed that pothos... oops
http://i77.photobucket.com/albums/j69/Pharfly/061_zps75ccf778.jpg
Basking
http://i77.photobucket.com/albums/j69/Pharfly/003-44.jpg

[infernalis]

Another really cool cage.. Thanks for posting.

[Pirarucu]

Very nice cage and Sav you have there.

[Wyldrose]

Tossed in some leaf litter and more branches
http://i77.photobucket.com/albums/j69/Pharfly/050-5.jpg

Where's Waldo?
http://i77.photobucket.com/albums/j69/Pharfly/051-5.jpg
I think Raptors enjoying the leaves! Got lots of bugs in with it too (glad her home is sealed) we saw some spiders, black beetles and lots of lady bugs.

[BarelyBreathing]

Awesome enclosure, Wyld!

[infernalis]

It is awesome....

[Kaetlinv]

Where's Waldo?



He doesnt play very well. :P Need to teach him better hide 'n seek skills!

[AjaMichelle]

Hi Susan!!! :) Great enclosure! :)

[Pirarucu]

Good looking setup!

[Lobretto]

Very nice setup, looks like you got a happy varanid

[Wyldrose]

Very nice setup, looks like you got a happy varanid
I thank all the members of various reptile forums for that mainly Wayne. Raptor deserves to be happy and seeing her happy and content makes me very happy :)

[Danimal]

:Water Tub Question:

Right now I am planning on keeping the water monitor. So I have been kicking around enclosures ideas. Most of it I am pretty comfortable with but I keep coming back to the water tub and the plumbing. Do any of you guys use a large water tub, like 80-100gal? If so , do you drain it or use some kind of filtration or both. I can reason out what seems the most logical way to go but I have no practical experience with a large animal enclosure.

Is it more practical to plumb it to drain, use filtration to save some water between cleanings or just suck it out with a python, clean it, refill it?

[-MARWOLAETH-]

For ages I wanted to get some acanthurus but just before I got them I realized it was probably unwise to jump from Crested geckos to varanus so I'm currently concentrating on Thamnophis instead.After reading through this thread I really have the urge for some varanus again :). have some questions.
What ratio of sand and dirt works best?
Do you have to treat the dirt to make it safer?
What do you guys do for night time heat?
Could a pair or trio of acanthurus be housed in a 120X60X60cm vivarium?

[AjaMichelle]

Hi Danimal,

I have a savannah monitor and she has a 20 gallon pool with 40 gallons of water in the system. I'm using a filter and a freshwater sump and the same principles could be applied to a 100+ gallon system. Have you looked into sumps? :)

[Pirarucu]

For ages I wanted to get some acanthurus but just before I got them I realized it was probably unwise to jump from Crested geckos to varanus so I'm currently concentrating on Thamnophis instead.After reading through this thread I really have the urge for some varanus again :). have some questions.
What ratio of sand and dirt works best?
Do you have to treat the dirt to make it safer?
What do you guys do for night time heat?
Could a pair or trio of acanthurus be housed in a 120X60X60cm vivarium?
1) That depends on the soil and sand you're using. It's usually around a 50/50 or 75/25 ratio of soil/sand.
2) No, in fact it's often advised not to. Having bacteria and such in the dirt helps waste break down on it's own. It can be a good idea to change it out every so often though.
3) You either don't do anything, or you can leave the basking lights on 24/7. This is what many successful breeders choose to do.
4) Yes, though they will use all the space you give them, and larger is always better.

[Danimal]

Hi Danimal,

I have a savannah monitor and she has a 20 gallon pool with 40 gallons of water in the system. I'm using a filter and a freshwater sump and the same principles could be applied to a 100+ gallon system. Have you looked into sumps? :)


Do you just use the sump to drain it or pull it through your filter? I have sumps and I use them but only to move water out of places.

[infernalis]

I know someone with a water monitor, I'll ask him.

Aja knows who I am talking about.. If I remember correctly he recently commented on his filtration system.

[AjaMichelle]

The 20 gallon pool in the enclosure drains into a 20 gallon sump via a gravity siphon. Then water is pumped out of the sump and filtered on its way back to the pool. :)

And he did recently comment on his filtration system. I believe it's a Fluval. The photos and explanation are on the water monitor thread, I think. :)

[Danimal]

I see if I can find it, this forum search doesn't work well for me. I always try a search before I ask. Anyway I looked at the fluval 306 when I was doing my homework.

[infernalis]

I see if I can find it, this forum search doesn't work well for me. I always try a search before I ask. Anyway I looked at the fluval 306 when I was doing my homework.

Stefan is not a member here. so searching for his posts will be futile.

Anyway, I dont think he will mind, so I will copy and paste...


http://farm8.staticflickr.com/7119/7876274562_ecaa25d2bd_z.jpg (http://www.flickr.com/photos/62077372@N05/7876274562/)
100_1208 (http://www.flickr.com/photos/62077372@N05/7876274562/) by murrindindi (http://www.flickr.com/people/62077372@N05/), on Flickr
http://farm9.staticflickr.com/8437/7876331012_0e0169682d_z.jpg (http://www.flickr.com/photos/62077372@N05/7876331012/)
100_1209 (http://www.flickr.com/photos/62077372@N05/7876331012/) by murrindindi (http://www.flickr.com/people/62077372@N05/), on Flickr
http://farm9.staticflickr.com/8289/7876208716_ff418f86f9_z.jpg (http://www.flickr.com/photos/62077372@N05/7876208716/)
100_1206 (http://www.flickr.com/photos/62077372@N05/7876208716/) by murrindindi (http://www.flickr.com/people/62077372@N05/), on Flickr
You must make a plastic bracket to hold the inlet pipe in place so the monitor doesn`t push it out of the water, which if left for any length of time would damage the motor. It`s held in place with two self-tapping screws just above the water level.

[Danimal]

Thank you Wayne

[EmbraceCalamity]

Stefan is not a member here. so searching for his posts will be futile.

Anyway, I dont think he will mind, so I will copy and paste...You're a mod here? =o

[infernalis]

You're a mod here? =o

I guess you could say that..

Welcome.:D

[EmbraceCalamity]

I guess you could say that..

Welcome.:DTHAT'S AWESOME. I'm not sure why I'm so excited by that, but it still is.

~Maggot

[fldaddy2]

No doubt I'll catch hell for this but......
When we got our baby Sav, Zilla we had done a lot of research online and in books and 1 popular theme was not giving them any sand, soil or wood substrate as they can injest (even the reptisand) the sand or soil and get compaction and the wood substrates could prodce splinters and chips that could get in their eyes and nose. We decided to go with newspaper for the flooring (which we understood is quite common) in his cage as it posed no dangers. Being a pet who is handled, played with and cuddled EVERY day, we found he enjoyed laying on and wrapped in a wash cloth when he was out. That was when he was 4" long, about 8 months ago. He has taken to not using his enclosure as a toilet and is puppy pad trained, so I put some loopless outdoor carpet in and did away with the newspaper. At 28" he has outgrown every kind of hide we put in his enclosure. We tried to go ahead with some substrate but he seemed to get very agitated and pretty much NEVER dug into it. We decided we didn't like the mess, as he is taken out every day and it was becoming a mess. We removed the substrate and proceded to experiment with different things for a hide. A box....he flipped it over and beat it up, a wooden box, he hissed at it, slapped it with his tail then spent 2 days laying outside of it pouting. I built a nice stone hide which he promptly snubbed then pouted for 2 more days. In frustration I threw a semi-wadded up towel in there and told him he could have that until I figured something else out. Immediately he slipped under the towel, turned around so his head was sticking out, laid down, I swear if he could smile, smiled at me. He has been a happy little cookie since. Unless his towel is removed to be washed then it's mister pissy until it comes back. Just my experience with our little monster. Zilla is not the norm, he craves attention and loves to cuddle in our laps and gives "kisses". That's where he will flick our mouth with his tongue then rest his chin on our lips and totally relax.

[infernalis]

I felt exactly that way about Chomper once.... He expired at age five.

[murrindindi]

No doubt I'll catch hell for this but......
When we got our baby Sav, Zilla we had done a lot of research online and in books and 1 popular theme was not giving them any sand, soil or wood substrate as they can injest (even the reptisand) the sand or soil and get compaction and the wood substrates could prodce splinters and chips that could get in their eyes and nose. We decided to go with newspaper for the flooring (which we understood is quite common) in his cage as it posed no dangers. Being a pet who is handled, played with and cuddled EVERY day, we found he enjoyed laying on and wrapped in a wash cloth when he was out. That was when he was 4" long, about 8 months ago. He has taken to not using his enclosure as a toilet and is puppy pad trained, so I put some loopless outdoor carpet in and did away with the newspaper. At 28" he has outgrown every kind of hide we put in his enclosure. We tried to go ahead with some substrate but he seemed to get very agitated and pretty much NEVER dug into it. We decided we didn't like the mess, as he is taken out every day and it was becoming a mess. We removed the substrate and proceded to experiment with different things for a hide. A box....he flipped it over and beat it up, a wooden box, he hissed at it, slapped it with his tail then spent 2 days laying outside of it pouting. I built a nice stone hide which he promptly snubbed then pouted for 2 more days. In frustration I threw a semi-wadded up towel in there and told him he could have that until I figured something else out. Immediately he slipped under the towel, turned around so his head was sticking out, laid down, I swear if he could smile, smiled at me. He has been a happy little cookie since. Unless his towel is removed to be washed then it's mister pissy until it comes back. Just my experience with our little monster. Zilla is not the norm, he craves attention and loves to cuddle in our laps and gives "kisses". That's where he will flick our mouth with his tongue then rest his chin on our lips and totally relax.



Hi, can you put a few photos up of the monitor and the enclosure? Thanks!

[Aaron_S]

No doubt I'll catch hell for this but......
When we got our baby Sav, Zilla we had done a lot of research online and in books and 1 popular theme was not giving them any sand, soil or wood substrate as they can injest (even the reptisand) the sand or soil and get compaction and the wood substrates could prodce splinters and chips that could get in their eyes and nose. We decided to go with newspaper for the flooring (which we understood is quite common) in his cage as it posed no dangers. Being a pet who is handled, played with and cuddled EVERY day, we found he enjoyed laying on and wrapped in a wash cloth when he was out. That was when he was 4" long, about 8 months ago. He has taken to not using his enclosure as a toilet and is puppy pad trained, so I put some loopless outdoor carpet in and did away with the newspaper. At 28" he has outgrown every kind of hide we put in his enclosure. We tried to go ahead with some substrate but he seemed to get very agitated and pretty much NEVER dug into it. We decided we didn't like the mess, as he is taken out every day and it was becoming a mess. We removed the substrate and proceded to experiment with different things for a hide. A box....he flipped it over and beat it up, a wooden box, he hissed at it, slapped it with his tail then spent 2 days laying outside of it pouting. I built a nice stone hide which he promptly snubbed then pouted for 2 more days. In frustration I threw a semi-wadded up towel in there and told him he could have that until I figured something else out. Immediately he slipped under the towel, turned around so his head was sticking out, laid down, I swear if he could smile, smiled at me. He has been a happy little cookie since. Unless his towel is removed to be washed then it's mister pissy until it comes back. Just my experience with our little monster. Zilla is not the norm, he craves attention and loves to cuddle in our laps and gives "kisses". That's where he will flick our mouth with his tongue then rest his chin on our lips and totally relax.

I'm going to attempt at being nice.

I hate to say, I doubt you're the person who has the magically completely "not the norm" monitor as a pet. Who pouts and shows affection like no other reptile ever has. You'd win a nobel prize if you could prove it beyond any doubt.

[Lankyrob]

No doubt I'll catch hell for this but......
When we got our baby Sav, Zilla we had done a lot of research online and in books and 1 popular theme was not giving them any sand, soil or wood substrate as they can injest (even the reptisand) the sand or soil and get compaction and the wood substrates could prodce splinters and chips that could get in their eyes and nose. We decided to go with newspaper for the flooring (which we understood is quite common) in his cage as it posed no dangers. Being a pet who is handled, played with and cuddled EVERY day, we found he enjoyed laying on and wrapped in a wash cloth when he was out. That was when he was 4" long, about 8 months ago. He has taken to not using his enclosure as a toilet and is puppy pad trained, so I put some loopless outdoor carpet in and did away with the newspaper. At 28" he has outgrown every kind of hide we put in his enclosure. We tried to go ahead with some substrate but he seemed to get very agitated and pretty much NEVER dug into it. We decided we didn't like the mess, as he is taken out every day and it was becoming a mess. We removed the substrate and proceded to experiment with different things for a hide. A box....he flipped it over and beat it up, a wooden box, he hissed at it, slapped it with his tail then spent 2 days laying outside of it pouting. I built a nice stone hide which he promptly snubbed then pouted for 2 more days. In frustration I threw a semi-wadded up towel in there and told him he could have that until I figured something else out. Immediately he slipped under the towel, turned around so his head was sticking out, laid down, I swear if he could smile, smiled at me. He has been a happy little cookie since. Unless his towel is removed to be washed then it's mister pissy until it comes back. Just my experience with our little monster. Zilla is not the norm, he craves attention and loves to cuddle in our laps and gives "kisses". That's where he will flick our mouth with his tongue then rest his chin on our lips and totally relax.

:no::no::no::no::no::no::no::no:

[crocdoc]

fldaddy, I've been keeping monitors and hanging around monitor forums for around 12 years. In that time I've seen many, many people come and go that think that their monitor is the exception to the norm. Doesn't need substrate, doesn't need assorted other husbandry 'requirements' as instructed by other monitor keepers. Is affectionate etc.

In all cases, without exception, the monitor has died after a few short years. Nowhere near the life expectancy in captivity of the species in question. Invariably, the vet's analysis (given that vets usually know little about monitor husbandry and would be disinclined to scare off customers by saying 'your husbandry sucks', anyway) is 'must have been something congenital'. It's a strange coincidence that these congenital abnormalities only occur in monitors kept a certain way but, hey, who am I to argue. Perhaps the savannahs of Africa are littered with the carcasses of congenitally abnormal monitors. I've never been there.

No, I'm not giving you the flak you expected and am not going to tell you how to look after your monitor, for it's your monitor and they are your choices. I just think it's important that you know the stats going in and that you keep in mind that there's a reason certain types of husbandry are recommended.

[DeadlyDesires]

can someone link me to an Enclosure section? im not sure if im over looking it or what?!? lol.. i wanted to post pix of my sav enclosure as i built it but can't find the thread :-/ must be blind or something.

[infernalis]

post it here, this is a popular thread.

[DeadlyDesires]

ok, thanks.

[DeadlyDesires]

Ok, so i was told to post my monitor enclosure here.. to show everyone what kind of tank Demon is in :D
The monitor you see in the first picture was the one i was making this tank for but, sadly, she died before i could finish the tank, im not certain on how she died if anyone is curious could have been a number of things. But here is how i built my enclosure.. If anyone has any questions feel free to ask :D ..
Also, its already finished so if you have suggestions on how to tweak things please make them easily done suggestions lol tearing down and rebuilding is not an option..

http://i1309.photobucket.com/albums/s638/cynthia_mitchell/20121226_215040_zpsc398fffc.jpg
http://i1309.photobucket.com/albums/s638/cynthia_mitchell/20121229_003224_zpsc23ba852.jpg
http://i1309.photobucket.com/albums/s638/cynthia_mitchell/20121229_003232-1_zps95f14571.jpg
http://i1309.photobucket.com/albums/s638/cynthia_mitchell/20130101_192631_zpsa13e3caf.jpg
http://i1309.photobucket.com/albums/s638/cynthia_mitchell/20130101_192640_zps409aa34e.jpg
http://i1309.photobucket.com/albums/s638/cynthia_mitchell/20130101_204322_zps98eb09c2.jpg

[DeadlyDesires]

http://i1309.photobucket.com/albums/s638/cynthia_mitchell/20130101_210813_zpsd8d7e07a.jpg
http://i1309.photobucket.com/albums/s638/cynthia_mitchell/20130101_222032_zps40698ed4.jpg
http://i1309.photobucket.com/albums/s638/cynthia_mitchell/20130101_222046_zps1f310b27.jpg
http://i1309.photobucket.com/albums/s638/cynthia_mitchell/20130101_222046-1_zps2f03f6fb.jpg
http://i1309.photobucket.com/albums/s638/cynthia_mitchell/20130102_185002_zps0ebeecf4.jpg
http://i1309.photobucket.com/albums/s638/cynthia_mitchell/20130102_185009_zps8376a320.jpg
http://i1309.photobucket.com/albums/s638/cynthia_mitchell/20130102_213634_zps02d57bc8.jpg

[DeadlyDesires]

http://i1309.photobucket.com/albums/s638/cynthia_mitchell/20130102_215049_zps4b35caf5.jpg
http://i1309.photobucket.com/albums/s638/cynthia_mitchell/20130102_215747_zpsb1650504.jpg

Now the top of the enclosure is being built..

http://i1309.photobucket.com/albums/s638/cynthia_mitchell/20130103_011445_zpsaf3aba1f.jpg

This is the window..
http://i1309.photobucket.com/albums/s638/cynthia_mitchell/20130103_011507_zps6502b3f3.jpg

[DeadlyDesires]

http://i1309.photobucket.com/albums/s638/cynthia_mitchell/20130103_011522_zps65777baf.jpg
http://i1309.photobucket.com/albums/s638/cynthia_mitchell/20130103_154438_zps5dca46b9.jpg
http://i1309.photobucket.com/albums/s638/cynthia_mitchell/20130103_154451_zpsd3f2d572.jpg
http://i1309.photobucket.com/albums/s638/cynthia_mitchell/20130103_154515_zps8f9f23bd.jpg
http://i1309.photobucket.com/albums/s638/cynthia_mitchell/20130103_202905_zpsa42f9e50.jpg
http://i1309.photobucket.com/albums/s638/cynthia_mitchell/20130103_202913_zps6db41961.jpg

[DeadlyDesires]

http://i1309.photobucket.com/albums/s638/cynthia_mitchell/20130103_202934_zps2ebd00a9.jpg
http://i1309.photobucket.com/albums/s638/cynthia_mitchell/20130103_202940_zps1563c519.jpg
http://i1309.photobucket.com/albums/s638/cynthia_mitchell/20130105_005717_zps0f9c2db6.jpg
http://i1309.photobucket.com/albums/s638/cynthia_mitchell/20130105_005722_zpsd5ec60e9.jpg
http://i1309.photobucket.com/albums/s638/cynthia_mitchell/20130108_203530_zps6d78ccf8.jpg

[DeadlyDesires]

http://i1309.photobucket.com/albums/s638/cynthia_mitchell/20130108_203543_zps7e0b4eca.jpg
http://i1309.photobucket.com/albums/s638/cynthia_mitchell/20130108_203550_zpse5216bc0.jpg
http://i1309.photobucket.com/albums/s638/cynthia_mitchell/20130108_210847_zps9657e9e2.jpg

Dimers
http://i1309.photobucket.com/albums/s638/cynthia_mitchell/20130110_011651_zpscf89afd4.jpg
http://i1309.photobucket.com/albums/s638/cynthia_mitchell/20130110_011659_zps0db5bbd6.jpg

[DeadlyDesires]

OK this was NOT supposed to be blue.. I dont really like it.. I wanted purple but it doesn't matter.. i guess anything is better than looking at OSB lol.. So i may change the color later on.. not sure yet..

http://i1309.photobucket.com/albums/s638/cynthia_mitchell/20130126_193941_zps72b875b3.jpg
http://i1309.photobucket.com/albums/s638/cynthia_mitchell/20130126_193947_zps6b778434.jpg

The window.. i hate this thing btw.. lol i wish it slid both ways when it opened.. but oh well..
http://i1309.photobucket.com/albums/s638/cynthia_mitchell/20130206_223251_zps9734a08c.jpg
http://i1309.photobucket.com/albums/s638/cynthia_mitchell/20130207_183935_zps96ca2a83.jpg
http://i1309.photobucket.com/albums/s638/cynthia_mitchell/20130207_195329_zps7baf4ed2.jpg
Yes the rocks touch the bottom.. no burrowing under for Demon lol..

[DeadlyDesires]

http://i1309.photobucket.com/albums/s638/cynthia_mitchell/20130207_195338_zps20ec0b80.jpg
http://i1309.photobucket.com/albums/s638/cynthia_mitchell/20130207_195504_zps134b1b86.jpg
http://i1309.photobucket.com/albums/s638/cynthia_mitchell/20130213_152148_zps5db86e2c.jpg
http://i1309.photobucket.com/albums/s638/cynthia_mitchell/20130213_152201_zpsf55d1d3f.jpg
http://i1309.photobucket.com/albums/s638/cynthia_mitchell/20130213_152209_zps81117570.jpg
http://i1309.photobucket.com/albums/s638/cynthia_mitchell/20130214_143424_zpse4d923b8.jpg

[DeadlyDesires]

http://i1309.photobucket.com/albums/s638/cynthia_mitchell/20130214_143506_zps81d09bcc.jpg



Its not completely finished yet.. i still have more things to add in there but we are moving Tuesday so im holding off until we get it moved into our new place..

Its not the best enclosure ever but it works and its sturdy and sealed up :D all wood is treated as well.. Thanks for looking :D

BTW... thats my man in the picture lol he gets all the props for this enclosure.. i didnt do much but bitch about not being able to hold the Drill very well lol.. (torn ligaments in my wrist)

[Lankyrob]

Awesome enclosure, that is one lucky lizard!! :)

[DeadlyDesires]

Awesome enclosure, that is one lucky lizard!! :)

Thank you :D

[War Machine]

Finally got around to insulating and boarding the walls. Plumbed my water source, and bolting up some big logs now.

http://i193.photobucket.com/albums/z197/VolcomDub/IMG_1778_zps8ee93650.jpg

http://i193.photobucket.com/albums/z197/VolcomDub/IMG_1780_zps9ab7cfac.jpg

http://i193.photobucket.com/albums/z197/VolcomDub/IMG_1784_zpsa88bee7a.jpg

I just have to attach my corner aluminum trim now. But I'll do that when I do the glass and panel the top deck.

[Mark Taylor]

Looks good that bud.

[War Machine]

Thank you! Got a log in, Trying to figure out how I want to offer different perches for different heat, and what i want to use for full body basking, ideas? This is for a mid life black throat lol

Its also very hard to not "clutter" it. Trying to think of a big guy roaming, while offering options lol for a 10' tank, its really small!

http://i193.photobucket.com/albums/z197/VolcomDub/IMG_1786_zps822745f7.jpg

The second log is to be half burried, to offer options and strength if burrowed near/under.

http://i193.photobucket.com/albums/z197/VolcomDub/IMG_1788_zpsb3eb1d15.jpg

[War Machine]

Just a note:

Silicone tubes used: 30. Not a word of a lie lol.

[Corey209]

Local pet stores way of keeping a sav

http://i.imgur.com/uIN7sHp.jpg

[DeadlyDesires]

Local pet stores way of keeping a sav

http://i.imgur.com/uIN7sHp.jpg
thats not surprising... i went into the uhaul place yesterday and the owner has a sav in a 20 gallon long with calci sand.. he argued with me about the proper care.. so i gave him some websites to look up and told him that his monitor is going to die.. and walked out..

[Corey209]

thats not surprising... i went into the uhaul place yesterday and the owner has a sav in a 20 gallon long with calci sand.. he argued with me about the proper care.. so i gave him some websites to look up and told him that his monitor is going to die.. and walked out..

I explained what can happen to the sav but they just got him and expect to sell him before anything can happen.

They also have a retic that will never sell and a uromastyx that has been the same size for months.

[DeadlyDesires]

I explained what can happen to the sav but they just got him and expect to sell him before anything can happen.

They also have a retic that will never sell and a uromastyx that has been the same size for months.

sad, stupid places like this shouldn't be allowed to sell these herps.

[Corey209]

sad, stupid places like this shouldn't be allowed to sell these herps.

Funny thing is they special order them.

[DeadlyDesires]

yup.. its just sad.. when im with my man and we walk in somewhere with savs, he looks at me and says just let it go.. they wont fix the problems.. but i can't help myself..

[Corey209]

I warned them of what can happen but I'm not going to complain to them about it. The guy who runs the reptiles doesn't know a whole lot and he does his best. I enjoy talking to him about the herps.

[DeadlyDesires]

aah, see the place down the road from me thinks they know everything yet they have a bearded dragon in a tank with yellow fungus and they think it wont spread... but not my place really i dont do bd's ... but i took my monitor from them because of how they were housing him, i couldn't stand it.. so i paid waay to much for him just to get him out of there. i'd take the others if i could :(

[Corey209]

aah, see the place down the road from me thinks they know everything yet they have a bearded dragon in a tank with yellow fungus and they think it wont spread... but not my place really i dont do bd's ... but i took my monitor from them because of how they were housing him, i couldn't stand it.. so i paid waay to much for him just to get him out of there. i'd take the others if i could :(

Well the owners think they know everything which is why I wouldn't go to them about it. Any complaints the store has had have been ignored, personally I enjoy the shop as I have gone there since I was like three but they could step it up.

[Aaron_S]

aah, see the place down the road from me thinks they know everything yet they have a bearded dragon in a tank with yellow fungus and they think it wont spread... but not my place really i dont do bd's ... but i took my monitor from them because of how they were housing him, i couldn't stand it.. so i paid waay to much for him just to get him out of there. i'd take the others if i could :(

Restrain yourself next time please.

It just allows them to replace it with 5 others.

Last I checked 5 dead over 1 dead is a lot worse.

[DeadlyDesires]

Restrain yourself next time please.

It just allows them to replace it with 5 others.

Last I checked 5 dead over 1 dead is a lot worse.

it wasn't just one.. they had like 5 of them (all sizes) in one tiny little 10 gal.. my lizard is around a foot in length.. .he just simply didnt fit.. so i took him... and i would do it all over again.. i have no control over weather the others live or die or who they sell them too.. (they dont keep monitors long) they are always sold, but i can control the outcome of at least one so IMO what i did wasn't a horrible thing to do.. i gave a sav the life it prob wouldn't have if i hadn't came along.

[Aaron_S]

it wasn't just one.. they had like 5 of them (all sizes) in one tiny little 10 gal.. my lizard is around a foot in length.. .he just simply didnt fit.. so i took him... and i would do it all over again.. i have no control over weather the others live or die or who they sell them too.. (they dont keep monitors long) they are always sold, but i can control the outcome of at least one so IMO what i did wasn't a horrible thing to do.. i gave a sav the life it prob wouldn't have if i hadn't came along.

You missed my point so I'll end this here.

*pats your head*

[infernalis]

Remember Slayer's post Deadly?? Aaron is alluding to the same point. ;)

[DeadlyDesires]

i already knew what he was saying.. but i was a little offended because he told me not to do it next time, made he seem like he didnt approve of what i did.. well i just simply said that i helped save a monitor so if that is the way i choose to look at it :D then yay me!

[poison123]

Imo if you see an animal you want then get it if you have the space. If this one were to die nothing would have stopped them from getting another.

[poison123]

The point is if NOBODY gives the BAD pet stores money then they can't replace it and will go out of business. Simple economics.

True.......

[KORBIN5895]

no hes not.. hes saying i killed a bunch of other animals simply by saving one.. if that were the case then you can't purchase reptiles anywhere.. there is no reason to let one animal die simply because once it does it will be replaced anyway so IN MY OPINION <<<<<< i dont give a crap what he thinks about what i did.. as far as im concerned he would have died in there and been replaced with another to die. so i just saved one i dont care what kind of stupid negative spin you want to put on the situation..

My local pet store had three savs die in store. Guess what they no longer carry?

Aaron is a veteran member so his opinion does mean something but it doesn't mean it's right. Whether someone agrees with him or not is up to them but opinions are free to share. By buying a sav from a pet store you did open up more room for another one which will most likely die. Yes he would have died but instead of supporting an already damaged Sav you could have just bought a baby from a reputable breeder that only sells to homes that they will last in. Reptiles aren't dogs or cats, we don't need to take in every animal that's special needs or will end up dying.

First off there are no reputable sav breeders.

Secondly wtf does that last line mean?

[Corey209]

My local pet store had three savs die in store. Guess what they no longer carry?



First off there are no reputable sav breeders.

Secondly wtf does that last line mean?

I'm sure there's someone who breeds and makes sure they go to a good home..

I was meaning dogs and cats go into shelters and it's preferred to adopt rather then buy from a breeder who doesn't care where the animals go.

[jarich]

It's an interesting position to take so indignantly, Aaron; given that you breed one of the few reptiles killed more often than Boscs. Do you know how many of the BPs youve bred are alive still now? What percentage have died from poor care? How responsible are you for their deaths?

Just thought I'd throw a similar wrench in the works for you. ;)

[KORBIN5895]

I'm sure there's someone who breeds and makes sure they go to a good home..

I was meaning dogs and cats go into shelters and it's preferred to adopt rather then buy from a breeder who doesn't care where the animals go.

Yeah. There are really no sav breeders.

[Aaron_S]

It's an interesting position to take so indignantly, Aaron; given that you breed one of the few reptiles killed more often than Boscs. Do you know how many of the BPs youve bred are alive still now? What percentage have died from poor care? How responsible are you for their deaths?

Just thought I'd throw a similar wrench in the works for you. ;)

Lots. I talk to most of my customers on a regular basis. They keep me up to date.

I know of only one that has died. Each one of my customers knows how to contact me if they have any trouble.

I am not responsible for any deaths based on the fact that I sell directly to consumers who know what they are doing. I am a breeder. I don't sell pet store stuff usually so most people take care of their animals. Like I said though, if they don't reach out to me then I can't help them and I am NOT responsible for any death.

You can try to twist it around on me because I keep and breed ball pythons but honestly, it has nothing to do with import savannahs and pet stores. I am talking about giving bad pet stores money. I am not a bad pet store who's somehow going to kill each animal I breed or buy.

Try harder next time.

[infernalis]

another noteable build....

http://www.ssnakess.com/forums/varanid/94845-getting-ackies-need-advise-suggestions-3.html

[War Machine]

http://i193.photobucket.com/albums/z197/VolcomDub/IMG_1821_zpsaec46f5c.jpg

The hunt for dirt is next! :)

[jarich]

Looking good man!

[Redbeard206]

What is the best reptile friendly sealant to use on the wood for my Monitor enclosure? Wanna make sure not to use anything harmful. Thank you :D

[infernalis]

I used Dutch boy floor sealer. seems to be holding up.

[monitorlizard]

What are the dimensions on that War Machine?

[War Machine]

What are the dimensions on that War Machine?

Roughly 10' long, 5' wide, and 7' tall

[monitorlizard]

That's huge!
How are did you attack the branches?

[Pirarucu]

That's huge!
How are did you attack the branches?Probably with a saw.

[War Machine]

That's huge!
How are did you attack the branches?

Attack or attach?

I scoped around my area for a while for people cutting down trees, asked if I could have a few braches, tossed em $5 for his effort, he cut some stuff up for me.

They're attached by lag bolts and brackets.

[smy_749]

Roughly 10' long, 5' wide, and 7' tall

What species is being housed in this?

[monitorlizard]

Attack or attach?

I scoped around my area for a while for people cutting down trees, asked if I could have a few braches, tossed em $5 for his effort, he cut some stuff up for me.

They're attached by lag bolts and brackets.

Woops,
I meant attach...

Do you think those will last when your Black Throat is an adult?

[War Machine]

Woops,
I meant attach...

Do you think those will last when your Black Throat is an adult?

The logs? Absolutely.

The enclosure, far too small for an adult. This is a "grow up" tank for him. And will be my "adult enclosure" for my V.A. Microstictus. once I have a bigger setup for the V.A.Ionidesi.

[cparker]

Would 1/8 plywood work for the sides of an adult Savannah monitor enclosure? I have a bunch already and would like to use it if possible. Would it be to thin for the weight of the dirt pushing on it from the sides?

[smy_749]

Would 1/8 plywood work for the sides of an adult Savannah monitor enclosure? I have a bunch already and would like to use it if possible. Would it be to thin for the weight of the dirt pushing on it from the sides?

Not sure if 1/8 is thick enough for this idea but I'll say it anyways. Make a better supported / reinforced dirt box, and then another one with your 1/8 to set on top of it.

Or make a insulated cage, have thicker board, then insulation, and the 1/8th on the outside away from contact with the sav.

[cparker]

I was thinking of putting the 1/8th over the insulation on the outside. I'm using 3/4 plywood for the base and framing the whole thing really well. do you think the 1/8th work for the sides if it was just the 1/8th?

[infernalis]

I was thinking of putting the 1/8th over the insulation on the outside. I'm using 3/4 plywood for the base and framing the whole thing really well. do you think the 1/8th work for the sides if it was just the 1/8th?


Good idea, 1/8 is way too thin for anything on the inside, except maybe the ceiling.

On the exterior you should be fine.

[Pirarucu]

I tried to respond yesterday, but my computer must have messed up. You should be fine using it for the exterior sides and top, but I would use something thicker for the bottom because of the frame pushing down on it with the weight of everything in the cage. You would probably still be fine, but just for the sake of being thorough I would personally use something thicker.

[formica]

amzing thread, thanks to all who have contributed :)

I am a new Sav owner, admitidly bought on impulse, although I was aware of their basic needs before hand, have kept quite a few reptiles over the years, always loved them, and monitors have been on my list of reptiles i'd love to have for a loooong time!

At the moment, he/she, is just a hatchling, 5 inches long and quite nervous, i've set up a small enclosure for now, because I want to be sure its feeding properly and generally in good health - will be off to the vet in a few weeks for a check up, sexing and parasite checks

Although currently in a small enclosure, i've managed to keep the humidity high, and a nice tempreture gradient and 48C (sorry i'm english, i dont know F, 130ish i think) basking spot, although it seems to like the slightly cooler areas just around it. Theres a big plastic bowl full of water, which is obligingly used as a toilet every morning :) currently about 6 inches of tortoise sand-soil mix in the bass of the enclosure, tapering off to an inch nearer to the heat lamp. Two large pieces of aquarium drift wood are its favorite places to sit on and sleep under.

I'm using a 75W hallogen bulb at the moment, the basking area seems ok, but i may try a spot lamp bulb if i have any issues with tempreture. Also have a 15W heatmatt under the 'cool' side of the enclosure, which comes on at night once the main basking lamp is out - personally I prefer to emulate natural heating, and keep it nice and warm at night, but not hot as it is during the day - been to africa a few times, and it can get damn cold at night, so I think this is ok.

Average temps in the enclosure are 30C in the middle, 35C around the heat lamp, 48C under the heat lamp, 25-26C on the cool side, with the soil temp about the same. Humidity in the middle is around 70-80%, 20-30% near the heat lamp, and around 90-100% underneath the drift wood where it likes to sleep most of the time.

It does like to dig, but generally just sleeps under the wood, which is warm and humid so I guess this is ok

Any advice much appriciated, this is my first monitor :) I already have much of the wood required for its final enclosure which is set to be 10ft x 5ft x 2 ft, with a large heated aquarium in the base for swimming and catching fish (good idea for Savs? I know they love the swim, and feel if they will catch fish, then why not...but open to more experienced advice!). Also will be provided with 3 feet of soil should it deciede that burrowing is its prefered place to sleep

I only plan on keeping it in the current enclosure (2ft x 1.5ft x 1.5ft) until after I've established that its healthy and behaving normally, aswell as becoming used to my presence, then its moving to a 4x2x2 enclosure ( I hve plenty of enclosures for repltiles available so moving from one to another is not an issue from that point of view)

I have one question, is the 4x2x2 going to be big enough for the next 6-7months? i am moving house in 6months time, and i would rather build the enclosure into the house, rather than deconstruct and reconstruct - that said, my sav's health is more important to me than a little extra labour, but if he's not going to grow to much longer than a foot or so i think I can wait till i move? any advice greatefull recieved :)

[smy_749]

I will let someone respond with more detail, but a large aquarium will need an amazing filter, and they are not a very 'aquatic' species so its not necessary. I would just get a large rubbermaid that you can easily replace the water which will end up being mud anyways.

Your current enclosure is too small, 2 feet is not enough.

Put him in the 4x2x2 now, don't worry about if hes eating or not. Just get a dish where he can get in and the food can't get out and you will be monitoring just fine.

[murrindindi]

amzing thread, thanks to all who have contributed :)

I am a new Sav owner, admitidly bought on impulse, although I was aware of their basic needs before hand, have kept quite a few reptiles over the years, always loved them, and monitors have been on my list of reptiles i'd love to have for a loooong time!

At the moment, he/she, is just a hatchling, 5 inches long and quite nervous, i've set up a small enclosure for now, because I want to be sure its feeding properly and generally in good health - will be off to the vet in a few weeks for a check up, sexing and parasite checks

Although currently in a small enclosure, i've managed to keep the humidity high, and a nice tempreture gradient and 48C (sorry i'm english, i dont know F, 130ish i think) basking spot, although it seems to like the slightly cooler areas just around it. Theres a big plastic bowl full of water, which is obligingly used as a toilet every morning :) currently about 6 inches of tortoise sand-soil mix in the bass of the enclosure, tapering off to an inch nearer to the heat lamp. Two large pieces of aquarium drift wood are its favorite places to sit on and sleep under.

I'm using a 75W hallogen bulb at the moment, the basking area seems ok, but i may try a spot lamp bulb if i have any issues with tempreture. Also have a 15W heatmatt under the 'cool' side of the enclosure, which comes on at night once the main basking lamp is out - personally I prefer to emulate natural heating, and keep it nice and warm at night, but not hot as it is during the day - been to africa a few times, and it can get damn cold at night, so I think this is ok.

Average temps in the enclosure are 30C in the middle, 35C around the heat lamp, 48C under the heat lamp, 25-26C on the cool side, with the soil temp about the same. Humidity in the middle is around 70-80%, 20-30% near the heat lamp, and around 90-100% underneath the drift wood where it likes to sleep most of the time.

It does like to dig, but generally just sleeps under the wood, which is warm and humid so I guess this is ok

Any advice much appriciated, this is my first monitor :) I already have much of the wood required for its final enclosure which is set to be 10ft x 5ft x 2 ft, with a large heated aquarium in the base for swimming and catching fish (good idea for Savs? I know they love the swim, and feel if they will catch fish, then why not...but open to more experienced advice!). Also will be provided with 3 feet of soil should it deciede that burrowing is its prefered place to sleep

I only plan on keeping it in the current enclosure (2ft x 1.5ft x 1.5ft) until after I've established that its healthy and behaving normally, aswell as becoming used to my presence, then its moving to a 4x2x2 enclosure ( I hve plenty of enclosures for repltiles available so moving from one to another is not an issue from that point of view)

I have one question, is the 4x2x2 going to be big enough for the next 6-7months? i am moving house in 6months time, and i would rather build the enclosure into the house, rather than deconstruct and reconstruct - that said, my sav's health is more important to me than a little extra labour, but if he's not going to grow to much longer than a foot or so i think I can wait till i move? any advice greatefull recieved :)


Hi, it would be good if you could start another thread as this one is basically for the construction of enclosures rather than the care of the animal/s, and I feel you need to adjust your husbandry asap. E.g. "My new Savannah monitor" might get more responses.
A few comments: I`ll guess you`re using an all glass fishtank at the moment, although they can be modified this one is far too small, it will be extremely difficult to provide the necessary conditions inside. In 6 months this monitor could well be 60cm ToL!
A surface temp at the basking site of 48c is only 118f, it needs to be somewhat higher @ between approx. 50 to 60c (120 to 140f), the other temp you need to worry about is the lowest ambient (air) @ approx. 24c (75f).
A few photos will also be very helpful. Thanks!

[infernalis]

Savannahmonitor.net (http://www.savannahmonitor.net/)

My channel - YouTube (http://www.youtube.com/user/Infernalis1?feature=mhee)

Why improper housing kills monitors!- Quick link (http://www.varanid.us/gout/)

[formica]

thanks for the reply, no its not a glass tank, i dont use those for reptiles, its a wooden enclosure fully sealed with glass sliding doors, humidity is kept high, as i know this is a major issue for monitors, and i do understand the need for a good tempreture gradient. I have another similar enclosure that is 4x3x2, so i'll use that instead when the time comes, i know the current setup is a very small tank for a monitor, it wont be for long while I work on the design for its final enclosure.

thanks for the info, I've now changed the heating light (which was not directional) to a ceramic heater, and moved the basking area a little closer to the heater which is now providing a 56C spot with a spread of about 48C near by, changing the bulb to cermaic has also had the effect of bringing down the lower end to 24C

I have also added a significant amount of soil-sand mix (3 inches across the base, with a bank of upto 6 inches on one side, compacted down and moist so it will hold up to digging holes) to help keep the humidity up and for it to dig, the area it likes to sleep has so far kept at a constant 90-100% any way

my reason for posting here is because I am currently trying to decide the best approach to building its final home, I've layed out my basic plans in the initial post, and any feedback would be gratefully appreciated :) that said, i suspect that many of the designs I've come accross on this thread will heavily influence my final design

if he's likley to reach 60cm at 6months then I may well begin building his final home now and skip the intermediate stage, so I think I need to rethink my current ideas and make the setup a little more portable!

pics will follow at some point soon!

[formica]

I will let someone respond with more detail, but a large aquarium will need an amazing filter, and they are not a very 'aquatic' species so its not necessary. I would just get a large rubbermaid that you can easily replace the water which will end up being mud anyways.

Your current enclosure is too small, 2 feet is not enough.

Put him in the 4x2x2 now, don't worry about if hes eating or not. Just get a dish where he can get in and the food can't get out and you will be monitoring just fine.

thanks, I have a 306 filter which will happily keep a large tank clean, i was also contemplating a smaller setup - i'll investigate more, mud could be an issue, and soiling, it does like using the water as a toilet lol I'll see what I turn up, I would like to give it the opportunity to catch fish to eat, should it so wish - are there any reasons that I shouldnt do this?

eating hasnt been an issue, it has an enourmous appetite! I dont generally buy from pet stores, hence by over cautious approach to his health over the next few weeks, happy to say the place I bought him was very clear about his needs as he grew and became an adult

[murrindindi]

thanks for the info, I've now changed the heating light (which was not directional) to a ceramic heater, and moved the basking area a little closer to the heater which is now providing a 56C spot with a spread of about 48C near by, changing the bulb to cermaic has also had the effect of bringing down the lower end to 24C

I have also added a significant amount of soil-sand mix (3 inches across the base, with a bank of upto 6 inches on one side, compacted down and moist so it will hold up to digging holes) to help keep the humidity up and for it to dig, the area it likes to sleep has so far kept at a constant 90-100% any way

my reason for posting here is because I am currently trying to decide the best approach to building its final home, I've layed out my basic plans in the initial post, and any feedback would be gratefully appreciated :) that said, i suspect that many of the designs I've come accross on this thread will heavily influence my final design

if he's likley to reach 60cm at 6months then I may well begin building his final home now and skip the intermediate stage, so I think I need to rethink my current ideas and make the setup a little more portable!

pics will follow at some point soon!

Hi again, the ceramic heat emitters are good for maintaining ambient (air) temps, not good at all for creating a basking site surface temp because they direct heat all around rather than downwards. Much better to use relatively low wattage halogen bulbs (flood, not spot) @ between approx. 40 to 60w+, raise or lower them or the basking object `til you get the desired surface temp @ between approx. 50 to 60c (120 to 140f), or simply fit a dimmer switch.
I usually pay around £5 each for my halogens and they can last up to 3,000 hours, I get them from the following website: thelightbulb.co.uk
This is my Asian Water monitor`s basking site to give you an idea, I need to use more bulbs because of his size, you might well only need 2 x 40w at the present time.
http://farm9.staticflickr.com/8497/8322444543_e8b89cdbc2_z.jpg

[formica]

taken all the advice onboard and created a new enclosure setup, now using halogen directional lights, a 3 lamp block (9£ including lamps from Argos, score!) with 3 X 50W lights, actually only using 2 because it gives a good 60-70C spread on a log, 3 lamps gave 140C (centigrade not F!!)

when i had one 75W halogen, he never sat directly underneath it, and it only ever hit 50C. but lets see how he feels about the larger and more varied tempretures!

Enclosure is new, sealed 3ft x 1.5ft x 1.5ft, still not his final home, but has a nice tempreture gradient down to 25C, center is 30C, and he has 5inches soil to make a burron at one end if he likes (creative use of drift wood to make a 'bank' of sorts)

noticed he is molting, shame i had to make changes to his housing today! but he's in a better encloser now, lots of humidity and temperature variations to should settle nicely now

[suz1000]

I'm beginning to plan a new 4x8x4 habitat for our Savannah but not really sure how best to lay out the interior. Could I trouble you to shoot me some photos of your Sav habitats??

[suz1000]

My current enclosure is 4x2x2.5 and is laid out nicely but there are so many more options with the extra space I'd like to utilize it correctly

[TarantulaSteve]

Hi again, the ceramic heat emitters are good for maintaining ambient (air) temps, not good at all for creating a basking site surface temp because they direct heat all around rather than downwards.


Ummmmm,



thanks for the info, I've now changed the heating light (which was not directional) to a ceramic heater, and moved the basking area a little closer to the heater which is now providing a 56C spot with a spread of about 48C near by....


Im not trying to knitpick anyone. I understand that Halogens are the prefered option for monitor lizards, and a lot of that has to do with Wayne and his amazing website, but as long as the basking site gets to the proper temperature, does it truly matter what you use?

I know Im not going to make any friends saying this, but after formica says his CHE gets the basking spot hot enough, someone else comes along to instinctually say CHEs arent good. Im not a fan of the idea that there is only one way to do things.

[infernalis]

Ummmmm,




Im not trying to knitpick anyone. I understand that Halogens are the prefered option for monitor lizards, and a lot of that has to do with Wayne and his amazing website, but as long as the basking site gets to the proper temperature, does it truly matter what you use?

I know Im not going to make any friends saying this, but after formica says his CHE gets the basking spot hot enough, someone else comes along to instinctually say CHEs arent good. Im not a fan of the idea that there is only one way to do things.

No it does not. I have and still use dollar store (non halogen) floods with great results. In fact I have been endurance testing them before I really "go public" with suggesting them.

So far, so good.

The lizards have yet to make them fail.

[murrindindi]

Ummmmm,




Im not trying to knitpick anyone. I understand that Halogens are the prefered option for monitor lizards, and a lot of that has to do with Wayne and his amazing website, but as long as the basking site gets to the proper temperature, does it truly matter what you use?

I know Im not going to make any friends saying this, but after formica says his CHE gets the basking spot hot enough, someone else comes along to instinctually say CHEs arent good. Im not a fan of the idea that there is only one way to do things.

Hi, can you give some details of how you keep your captive Varanids?
I agree with you that there`s more than one way to do things, but surely something that`s been proven to work very efficiently (helps to offer the animals supportive conditions) is the way to go. Halogen bulbs were being recommended and used long before Wayne came into the hobby!

[infernalis]

Halogen bulbs were being recommended and used long before Wayne came into the hobby!

Yes they were....:D

I didn't invent anything other than a slick web site. ;)

[TarantulaSteve]

Hi, can you give some details of how you keep your captive Varanids?
I agree with you that there`s more than one way to do things, but surely something that`s been proven to work very efficiently (helps to offer the animals supportive conditions) is the way to go. Halogen bulbs were being recommended and used long before Wayne came into the hobby!

You make a very good point, and something I overlooked. Halogens are proven and cheap, and perhaps we should be suggesting their use over everything else.
I just got my cackles up earlier because after Formica said his basking spot was sitting pretty at 132.8F using a CHE, you respond that CHE's arent good for basking spots......

They might not be the best option, but that doesnt mean they are a bad one.

[smy_749]

I personally think they are a difficult option. The heat is sent in every which direction, so to get a proper basking spot you usually need a very high wattage bulb since only a certain amount is sent straight downward. This high wattage then bumps the ambients usually to where you don't want them, and humidity plummets. Imo, its very very easy to find the balance/proper wattage with halogen floods and I would only use maybe a 60 watt CHE set to 75 on a thermostat if my house was very cold (which its not).

Also, I don't think anyone here says there is only one way to do things, however, just about ALL of the successful keepers of varanids are doing these techniques. These ways have proven results over many many years so why change it to something which clearly shows no added benefit, and isn't any cheaper.

[franks]

I agree with the above about ceramic heat emitters being a more difficult option. Also, in every case where I tried to implement one, it dried the air out and killed the humidity significantly more than a halogen bulb.

[varanus_mad]

I agree with the above about ceramic heat emitters being a more difficult option. Also, in every case where I tried to implement one, it dried the air out and killed the humidity significantly more than a halogen bulb.

precisely why monitor keepers in general dont use them that and CHEs are quite frankly dangerous if your stat fails... they overheat extremely extremely quickly

[formica]

just to say I switched back to Halogens pretty quickly - the Ceramic was only suitable for covering a small area, which my Sav had ougrown with a couple of weeks, and my Sav was not getting the humidity he needed in that enclosure - GU10's where used until he was 2.5months (give or take birth>sale age) and E27's since then


not sure what thermostats fail in the ON position, i've yet to come across that issue myself? seems like an absurd design flaw, which makes do this?

[smy_749]

just to say I switched back to Halogens pretty quickly - the Ceramic was only suitable for covering a small area, which my Sav had ougrown with a couple of weeks, and my Sav was not getting the humidity he needed in that enclosure - GU10's where used until he was 2.5months (give or take birth>sale age) and E27's since then


not sure what thermostats fail in the ON position, i've yet to come across that issue myself? seems like an absurd design flaw, which makes do this?

All of them can. Once your probe goes whacko, anything can happen....

[formica]

All of them can. Once your probe goes whacko, anything can happen....

Ive only used microclimate and habistat, and they have all failed ''Off'' when they did eventually go, is there any more specific info you can give me? because it seems to me that this is a pretty major flaw in the design if this is happening - i've heard it mentioned, but only on this forum in the last few months

[smy_749]

Ive only used microclimate and habistat, and they have all failed ''Off'' when they did eventually go, is there any more specific info you can give me? because it seems to me that this is a pretty major flaw in the design if this is happening - i've heard it mentioned, but only on this forum in the last few months

Again, not talking about the stat itself. I'm sure there is a fail safe like you are talking about so they turn off. I'm simply referring to the probe going haywire. When any of these probes are exposed to extreme heat or cold or whatever, they tend to stop working. Now, the stat still works, but if the probe is reading 40 degrees F then you will have a problem....

[fldaddy2]

I was using a Zoomed thermostat that stuck on all the time. Just a light thump and it would turn off. Never had a problem coming on, but it damn near cooked my sav a few times (120 ambient). Until I moved it to my blackthroat enclosure (after working on it and mounting it differently)and he ripped the probe off. It's now in the county landfill. Since then I have just played with different wattage lights and combinations and locations until I got my enclosures to stay consistent where they should be.

[BH Varanus]

precisely why monitor keepers in general dont use them that and CHEs are quite frankly dangerous if your stat fails... they overheat extremely extremely quickly


Honesly, I have never had an issue with CME's for my monitor enclosures, but i definitely think that the stat quality is a huge factor. I'm not opposed to UV but if i do I use them in the winter combined with UVB'. However, when my monitor is gravid and i'm using the night bulb in which case i use a lower wattage CME and omit the uvb ( just my strategy). I think opinions will always vary on this topic. I have found that using commercial grad timers, thermostats, etc. increases the life of CME's I actually don't purchase any enclosure equipment from pet stores or pet supplies manufactures I feel that this has greatly lessened the likely hood of failure. I mean that's what works for me though over the past 13 years.

Also since CME's have gained popularity like anything else manufacture have sacrificed quality for quantity. The last CME I had ran for 12 months on a 12 hour timer. Now I'm lucky if i get 6 months...ugh...

[TarantulaSteve]

I use a 100w CHE with my Red Tail Boa on a dimmer, and have been able to maintain temps and humidity in her aquarium. I work from home, and keep my animals in the office. Or more accurately, keep my work station in the exotics room. I check temps daily, and look over each and every animal enclosure more than once per day, and have for the past few years.

I read everything I can and make up my own mind. If something doesnt work, I do more research and change it. Aquariums arent ideal for monitors, CHEs may not be ideal for monitors. But if your handy enough you can make it work for you and your monitor lizard.

[murrindindi]

I use a 100w CHE with my Red Tail Boa on a dimmer, and have been able to maintain temps and humidity in her aquarium. I work from home, and keep my animals in the office. Or more accurately, keep my work station in the exotics room. I check temps daily, and look over each and every animal enclosure more than once per day, and have for the past few years.

I read everything I can and make up my own mind. If something doesnt work, I do more research and change it. Aquariums arent ideal for monitors, CHEs may not be ideal for monitors. But if your handy enough you can make it work for you and your monitor lizard.



Hi, I suspect your snake doesn`t need or use a surface temp between approx. 50 to 60c+, the CHE`s are NOT suitable for creating these temps at the basking site simply because the heat is directed all around as previously stated, they also dry out the air to a much greater extent than for example the relatively low wattage halogen (flood) bulbs, though I have and still do use them for raising the ambient temps at times (during the night, very cold weather).
It would be good if you could explain how you provide those basking temps with CHE`s, and also how you control the humidity range in your Varanid enclosures if you primarily use those (size of enclosure, wattages, distance from animal/s, etc)? Thanks!

[BH Varanus]

Hello everyone!

Here is my past enclosure projects.II hire an electrician for my enclosures I'm a big believer in paying the experts to handle wiring didn't want to be bothered with it. This is the old enclosure and is 8' x 4' x 4' I was testing out filtration and her lay patterns.

I'm currently building a mega (MAN CAVE style..lol enclosure 8' x 8' x 11' with all the trimmings now). I'll have photos of the building process of that one soon. I have added a strong filtration system for my Varanus Ornatus as well that i tested on the old enclosure no more daily water changes !!!!!!!!. Does anyone else have enclosure pics to share; would love to see them?

P.S. my female varanus is Gravid right now; not over fed...lol

[TarantulaSteve]

Hi, I suspect your snake doesn`t need or use a surface temp between approx. 50 to 60c+, the CHE`s are NOT suitable for creating these temps at the basking site simply because the heat is directed all around as previously stated, they also dry out the air to a much greater extent than for example the relatively low wattage halogen (flood) bulbs, though I have and still do use them for raising the ambient temps at times (during the night, very cold weather).
It would be good if you could explain how you provide those basking temps with CHE`s, and also how you control the humidity range in your Varanid enclosures if you primarily use those (size of enclosure, wattages, distance from animal/s, etc)? Thanks!

Hi there, Im actually just finishing off a new enclosure and am hoping to get pics up soon, but will post that later.

Since this is a monitor enclosure discussion thread, I would like to respectfully address what has been previously stated about CHE's. I'm not an expert, so I apologize for the very long post.

CHE's and Halogens work by the same principle. They turn electricity into UV Radiation. The halogen produces light and heat. The CHE just produces heat. This distinction is muddled by the fact that depending on a materials make-up, they can absorb light, which is "stored" as heat. (A dark rock will become hotter in the sunlight than a lighter coloured piece of rock, which will reflect some light which we then perceive as colour.)

To this end, a 60w halogen and 60w CHE will roughly produce the same amount of heat.

Heat travels in three ways. Radiation, Conduction and Convection. We are only concerned with Radiation and Conduction.

Take the temp of the face of your basking bulb. My 65w Halogens are between 325F and 365F, and my 100w CHE has readings between 464F and "Error" (+700F).

Heat travels by radiation in that a warm surface will emit IR at a perpendicular angle towards a colder surface. The much hotter temperature of the face of the bulb is radiating IR straight down to the colder surface of the basking rock. When you place your hand under a basking bulb you are feeling the IR being emitted from the hot bulb to your colder hand. There is far more going on than, "The air is warmer here." Now, the air does have a temp as well, but we really dont need to get into that right now.

Under my CHE, I have a basking rock with surface area 3-4x larger than the face of the CHE. As the CHE radiates heat downwards, CONDUCTION will allow heat to move between objects in contact. So IR hits ~25% of the rock, and since the rock is always in contact with itself, it will attempt to equalize its entire temperature. I use a uniform thickness rock and it does have a perfect temp the entire length of the rock. IE. Directly under the bulb is the same temp as the edges of the rock.


Now, take the temperature of the neck of your bulbs. My 65w Halogens have surface temps between 239F and 296F , and my 100w CHE between 286F and 596F, getting hotter the closer I get to the face. The CHE is a heated coil starting and stopping at the base, with the majority of the coil in a spiral position on the face of the bulb. Its not an aesthetic design, but intended to direct the majority of the heat in the desired direction.
So while there is some "bleed off" with the CHE emitting heat in directions not where you want, we see a similar effect with the Halogens. There are a couple different types of outer core you can find on Halogens, and without testing the styles I dont have, I cant know if one is any better than another in terms of heat efficiency. Im under the impression the bulbs were designed with light output and heat dissipation as the only considerations. Not its ability to direct heat, but again I could be wrong. Ive seen some marketed as "heat bulbs", but dont know if it plays on halogens normal ability to produce heat, or if outer core design will actually reflect additional IR.


When people talk about humidity, they are really referring to relative humidity (rH) which is the % of water vapour in the air, compared to its full saturation level. Humidity is a measurement of water vapour, generally given as parts per million(ppm).
Warmer air can hold more water vapour than colder. So as you heat the air, rH will go down. Humidity levels will always try to equalize themselves. To give you an example, when your outside in the winter you can see your warm humid breath in the air. As the with every dry breath in, you expel humid air from your lungs, as they “bleed” vapour to the dry air you breath in. This is also how lizards dehydrate. Tarantulas and a variety of invertebrates have books lungs which passively absorb oxygen from outside the body, and preferably humid oxygen so they don’t desiccate.

The water vapour will never disappear. The warm air rises and continues to draw in more and more vapour the warmer and higher it gets. It sucks in vapour from the surrounding cooler air, which in turns draws in water vapour from its colder surrounding area, and so on. When the air hits the roof and can no longer heat up, and as reached its desired saturation level, it will slowly make its way to the opposing end of the enclosure, spreading its warmth and vapour in a never ending attempt to perfectly equalize. As the warm humid air hits the relatively cold glass, the air quickly cools and suddenly has an excess of water vapour. This is deposited on the glass as droplets of water, which will eventually slide down to be reabsorbed by the soil where it can start the cycle all over.
Unless I misread something, Varanid keepers don’t add ventilation to the enclosures. Humidity will escape along the sliding glass doors, and any possible cracks that weren’t sealed. As well as everytime you open the enclosure. It is possible for water vapour to pass through dense objects but this is a part of physics that I am stuck on. The point is, in a properly built enclosure humidity is very easy to maintain, and relative humidity is affected by temperature not the heating device itself.

I truly wish I had a halogen and CHE of same wattage. My figures would make a lot more sence than that.

If you made it this far, thanks, and I hope this info helps people with their future enclosure designs. I will be sharing mine shortly.

[psychocircus]

hey guys, I will shortly be setting up a large enclosure for a tree monitor and would like to line the walls of the enclosure with a substance that will allow the monitor even more climbing space.
I have seen cork sheets, cork tiles and coco fiber sheets recommended and I was wondering if anyone had any experience with any of those? My concern with the coco fiber is them getting their toenails caught, but I haven't read of this happening.
Keep in mind tree monitors need 70-100% humidity. Thanks.

[smy_749]

hey guys, I will shortly be setting up a large enclosure for a tree monitor and would like to line the walls of the enclosure with a substance that will allow the monitor even more climbing space.
I have seen cork sheets, cork tiles and coco fiber sheets recommended and I was wondering if anyone had any experience with any of those? My concern with the coco fiber is them getting their toenails caught, but I haven't read of this happening.
Keep in mind tree monitors need 70-100% humidity. Thanks.

I haven't used coco fiber sheets, there is another type of sheeting though. Can't think of the name.

Cork tiles are good, the cork that comes in rolls is really crappy, practically falls apart before you can use any of it.

You could also use spray foam, and then coat it with some sort of epoxy and mix a coco-husk, sand mixture and put it over that. NEherpetological has a section about it on their site with a how-to.

You could purchase backgrounds from universalrock. Or if you want a lot of useable space and have no funds, grab a bunch of vines, and twigs, and put them all over the place.

[psychocircus]

hey guys, I will shortly be setting up a large enclosure for a tree monitor and would like to line the walls of the enclosure with a substance that will allow the monitor even more climbing space.
I have seen cork sheets, cork tiles and coco fiber sheets recommended and I was wondering if anyone had any experience with any of those? My concern with the coco fiber is them getting their toenails caught, but I haven't read of this happening.
Keep in mind tree monitors need 70-100% humidity. Thanks.

I haven't used coco fiber sheets, there is another type of sheeting though. Can't think of the name.

Cork tiles are good, the cork that comes in rolls is really crappy, practically falls apart before you can use any of it.

You could also use spray foam, and then coat it with some sort of epoxy and mix a coco-husk, sand mixture and put it over that. NEherpetological has a section about it on their site with a how-to.

You could purchase backgrounds from universalrock. Or if you want a lot of useable space and have no funds, grab a bunch of vines, and twigs, and put them all over the place.

thanks for the tips. I was leaning towards the cork tiles. I'm not extremely creative so that is a fairly simple choice.

[BC Arboreals]

Hello Guys,


So I have a question I have build a tree monitor enclosure and I am just working out the humidity and the heat for a few weeks before my monitors arrive. I used large branches I collected myself as well as a lot of moss for the hide boxes. The cage looks great florescent lighting and halogens for the heat. 2 hides and ordered a bunch of cork bark tubes and half tubes.


My question is the maple branches have white spots and moss on them, they look like lichen to me as the tree was alive. My question is if this in any way can harm my monitors. I will attach a picture of the enclosure and the logs in question. I am against bleaching woods and feel that our forests should not have any harmful things that will bother my monitors. But I want to be 100% sure as these guys are my pride and joy and have been waiting a long time to get these animals.

[infernalis]

No harm to the monitors.

I have used bio active (living) tree limbs, dirt, leaves and sod for years, never had a problem.

would enjoy photos of your setup.

[BC Arboreals]

No harm to the monitors.

I have used bio active (living) tree limbs, dirt, leaves and sod for years, never had a problem.

would enjoy photos of your setup.

Thanks infernalis

I figured it would be safe but I wanted to be 100% sure. Once I can post pictures I will set up a threat and show the new cage I build for the Tree monitors.

[psychocircus]

No harm to the monitors.

I have used bio active (living) tree limbs, dirt, leaves and sod for years, never had a problem.

would enjoy photos of your setup.

I'm in the same exact boat. I've read that you should use bleach and water to soak the branches, then soak in water several times to kill parasites. You find this unnecessary?

[Pirarucu]

Absolutely. Reptile parasites come from reptiles, not trees.

[psychocircus]

Absolutely. Reptile parasites come from reptiles, not trees.

okay cool. Certainly makes things easier.

[infernalis]

I'm in the same exact boat. I've read that you should use bleach and water to soak the branches, then soak in water several times to kill parasites. You find this unnecessary?

Not only unnecessary, but it defeats the whole bio active concept.

I don't even clean the poop out of my cage, the feces becomes more dirt almost overnight.

Monitors raised in bio active environments seem to flourish better than animals kept in sterile cages.

[psychocircus]

Not only unnecessary, but it defeats the whole bio active concept.

I don't even clean the poop out of my cage, the feces becomes more dirt almost overnight.

Monitors raised in bio active environments seem to flourish better than animals kept in sterile cages.

I will keep this in mind. Should I avoid pine like we do with snakes?

[formica]

sterilizing materials before adding them wont disrupt the bio activity in the enclosure (unless you don't let the chlorine evaporate first) if it is allowed to cycle/stabilize properly - all my bio active enclosures are sterile when they first start to cycle - cleaner crews are added specifically by me, and bacteria builds up as the enclosure cycles

there is no harm in sterilizing materials including branches, and if you are sourcing the materials from an area with reptiles, then it is a sensible precaution imo, as there are many things which could potentially be dangerous (parasites, virii, bacteria, slime molds, the list is endless, one person even brought Carpenter ants into his home...which could have been a disastrous and expensive mistake had they got out and found a home in the house walls)

clearly many people dont bother to sterilize, some come across problems, some dont, as long as you know what could happen you can make your own mind up

[psychocircus]

sterilizing materials before adding them wont disrupt the bio activity in the enclosure (unless you don't let the chlorine evaporate first) if it is allowed to cycle/stabilize properly - all my bio active enclosures are sterile when they first start to cycle - cleaner crews are added specifically by me, and bacteria builds up as the enclosure cycles

there is no harm in sterilizing materials including branches, and if you are sourcing the materials from an area with reptiles, then it is a sensible precaution imo, as there are many things which could potentially be dangerous (parasites, virii, bacteria, slime molds, the list is endless, one person even brought Carpenter ants into his home...which could have been a disastrous and expensive mistake had they got out and found a home in the house walls)

clearly many people dont bother to sterilize, some come across problems, some dont, as long as you know what could happen you can make your own mind up

My other concerns were bugs/fungi, but it's been very cold in Maryland the past few weeks (and cold in general all winter) so I don't know if these things are an issue.

[infernalis]

I will keep this in mind. Should I avoid pine like we do with snakes?

within reason, Pine needles are going to be part of the forest floor, but logs dripping with sap should be avoided.

Personally, I am a big fan of locust wood logs, Locust is a species of wood commonly called "Iron wood" because of it's rock hard tightly packed fiber cells.

Locust wood is commonly used by old world farmers to make fences, because the stuff never rots.

Same reason I like it in my enclosures.

[BC Arboreals]

My other concerns were bugs/fungi, but it's been very cold in Maryland the past few weeks (and cold in general all winter) so I don't know if these things are an issue.


That's what I was concerned about also, but with the cold here in BC also I dont know if there is any thing that can cause the Tree Monitors harm.

I tried to post pictures but I guess I don't have enough posts so it won't let me attach any pictures.

[Snakefood]

Hello Guys,


So I have a question I have build a tree monitor enclosure and I am just working out the humidity and the heat for a few weeks before my monitors arrive. I used large branches I collected myself as well as a lot of moss for the hide boxes. The cage looks great florescent lighting and halogens for the heat. 2 hides and ordered a bunch of cork bark tubes and half tubes.


My question is the maple branches have white spots and moss on them, they look like lichen to me as the tree was alive. My question is if this in any way can harm my monitors. I will attach a picture of the enclosure and the logs in question. I am against bleaching woods and feel that our forests should not have any harmful things that will bother my monitors. But I want to be 100% sure as these guys are my pride and joy and have been waiting a long time to get these animals.

Hey you!! I told you you would get your questions answered here!!! Welcome to our forums!! See you soon.

Darcie:p

[Snakefood]

I tried to post pictures but I guess I don't have enough posts so it won't let me attach any pictures.

when you hit reply, go "advanced" use the paperclip, that's how you post pics!!

[BC Arboreals]

Well here's a few pictures of my enclosure. Substrate is 12 inches of peat moss, coco fiber, dirt, and sand and topped with live moss hides are full to the top with live moss. 6 basking spots 100-150. Hide on the floor of the cage and one on the top of the cage. I also have an order of Cork tubes coming in to add more hides in the cage. Also adding fake vines and plants for more cover.

[Snakefood]

looking good there, I have tons of plastic/silk vines and plants, I will NEVER use them and want them gone. Let me know if you want me to bring them this weekend when I come get the racks.

[psychocircus]

Well here's a few pictures of my enclosure. Substrate is 12 inches of peat moss, coco fiber, dirt, and sand and topped with live moss hides are full to the top with live moss. 6 basking spots 100-150. Hide on the floor of the cage and one on the top of the cage. I also have an order of Cork tubes coming in to add more hides in the cage. Also adding fake vines and plants for more cover.

Awesome. Is that cork on the walls or something else?

[BC Arboreals]

Awesome. Is that cork on the walls or something else?

It's Coco fiber liner, made for growing plants on. It works great for the walls I don't like how cork tiles, they start to smell really foul in a humid enclosure.

First time using it, will see how it works and if I keep it on there or go with cork bark.

[smy_749]

BC, your cage looks great. Can't want to see it with the cork in there.

[psychocircus]

It's Coco fiber liner, made for growing plants on. It works great for the walls I don't like how cork tiles, they start to smell really foul in a humid enclosure.

First time using it, will see how it works and if I keep it on there or go with cork bark.

Nice just coco fiber sheets? Do they hold well? What kind of epoxy/glue did you use?

[infernalis]

This works great... durable too

http://www.varanus.us/enclosures/lattice.jpg

[psychocircus]

This works great... durable too

http://www.varanus.us/enclosures/lattice.jpg

what is the name of that? I've seen it in some arboreal enclosures before.

[BC Arboreals]

Nice just coco fiber sheets? Do they hold well? What kind of epoxy/glue did you use?



I didn't glue it as I will need to remove possibly in 4-5 years from what I've seen. I used staples and stapled the sides and a few in the middle. Made sure they were very close and tight as so the monitors don't get caught in it. I have heard a few people have there monitors get there toes caught in the lattice, so that also was a worry of mine also. I was going to use it but I could only find lattice that was treated.

The coco fiber liner isn't cheap. But holds humidity and looks good. Humidity is staying constant in the enclosure and I am only spraying once in the morning and once at night. I left it for 2 days and opened it up and still got that smack in the face feeling of the high humidity and heat. I will be putting a few humidity gauges in there to make sure I can always monitor it.

[BC Arboreals]

what is the name of that? I've seen it in some arboreal enclosures before.


This is called lattice. It's used for fencing and gates.

[murrindindi]

I have heard a few people have there monitors get there toes caught in the lattice, so that also was a worry of mine also. I was going to use it but I could only find lattice that was treated.
.

Hi, just for interest`s sake, treated timber is perfectly safe to use once it`s dried.

[infernalis]

Hi, just for interest`s sake, treated timber is perfectly safe to use once it`s dried.

Sure is.. My cage is completely framed with pressure treated wood, and the animals are fine.

[Tonka14]

Been Spending a lot of time working on this giant lately. Building a 4'x8'x'4' cage for my Savannah Monitor. It will have 1/4" glass doors and 1/4" windows on each end with a HID metal halide and sulfur sodium light setup when its all done. I have had my guy in a 55gal tank and learned real fast how bad that was for him after reading a a lot on varanustalk. Its not cheap to build one of these and I am not even using pressure treated wood. I will be using the rubber roofing from RV's since I have access to a bunch of it for free.
28235

[metallisch]

Hi guys, couple questions. Moving into a new place soon, so I want to have a brand new enclosure built for my V.A. microstictus - his current 8x4x6 was built by cutting a lot of corners and has somewhat dilapidated. I want to correct the errors I made last time.

-Substrate heating - my monitor has never had properly heated substrate and I'd like to add heating/thermostat specifically for the soil. Would the electric radiant floor heat systems work for this? I've been looking at the kits that hardware stores sell.

-Also, will that heating option work with the FRP lining I plan to use to seal the enclosure?

-I'm interested in building the enclosure 'modular' - by that I mean, I'd like to have several smaller pieces built that can fasten together using nuts/bolts/whatever so that it could potentially be broken down and moved more easily at a later date. is this feasible?

-My basement is carpeted. Is there anything to consider when putting a huge monitor enclosure on a carpeted floor?