A few photographs of my critters - part 1

[crocdoc]

My adult lace monitor pair, Alex and NeLiSh, wandering around my place and enjoying some afternoon sun.
http://www.pbase.com/crocdoc/image/121387889.jpg
http://www.pbase.com/crocdoc/image/128793933.jpg

Alex, the male.
http://www.pbase.com/crocdoc/image/110715630.jpg
Unfortunately, their skin is almost always stained from the substrate so the colours rarely show, but in this photograph you can see his true colours around his face and neck, compared to the darkly stained skin on his back and arm.
http://www.pbase.com/crocdoc/image/116918158.jpg
http://www.pbase.com/crocdoc/image/110715921.jpg

[crocdoc]

Part 2: The pair playing the 'loving' couple, which they do for two or three week-long periods each summer.
http://www.pbase.com/crocdoc/image/117473085.jpg
http://www.pbase.com/crocdoc/image/117473378.jpg

A very rare photograph of them mating inside the enclosure
http://www.pbase.com/crocdoc/image/139532915.jpg

99% of their matings have occurred here, on my rug
http://www.pbase.com/crocdoc/image/139532916.jpg

Sometimes they find other places to mate.
On a couple of occasions, they mated on the top of another monitor's enclosure. You can see the head of the little guy poking out of the log on the left hand side - clearly must have been woken up and was wondering what was going on with the neighbours upstairs.
http://www.pbase.com/crocdoc/image/130665064.jpg

I've got three or four photographs of Alex and NeLiSh mating on this sofa which, after 12 years of the two of them crawling all over it, has finally given up the ghost this year.
http://www.pbase.com/crocdoc/image/130665066.jpg

[Swany]

Nice pics man ;-)

[infernalis]

http://www.pbase.com/crocdoc/image/130665066.jpg

See what happens when you trust the babysitter...

[marvelfreak]

Wow they are amazing and super sweet pictures.

[alessia55]

Those pics are great!! The monitor porn photos around the house are HILARIOUS :freakedout: :yes:

[SpOoKy]

Absolutely gorgeous monitors...thanks for posting.
It is rare to see these guys.

[BarelyBreathing]

How do you feel sitting on that sofa? Lol.

As I've said on another forum, great pictures, amazing animals.

[alessia55]

How do you feel sitting on that sofa? Lol.

As I've said on another forum, great pictures, amazing animals.

This made me think of a question....

...do monitors ejaculate sperm like human men do? Does it ever spill out onto the sofa or wherever they're doing it? :confused: Or is it all a neat, mess-free scene?
Also, do they make noises? LOL sorry but I'm really curious about monitor sex for some reason :wacky:

[BarelyBreathing]

Lol!!!! Erm, I haven't noticed a mess, nor have I noticed noises. That's not to say that all monitors are as quiet and clean as mine.

[SpOoKy]

This made me think of a question....

...do monitors ejaculate sperm like human men do? Does it ever spill out onto the sofa or wherever they're doing it? Or is it all a neat, mess-free scene?
Also, do they make noises? LOL sorry but I'm really curious about monitor sex for some reason


HAHAHAHAHAHAHAHA!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!
I almost just peed myself reading this!

[alessia55]

HAHAHAHAHAHAHAHA!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!
I almost just peed myself reading this!

Seriously! I want to know if the squirt and moan or not ....LOL
oh oh am I being too inappropriate? :shocked: :laugh:

[SpOoKy]

Seriously! I want to know if the squirt and moan or not ....LOL

I don't know but I would assume no. My guess is that being in such a vulnerable "position" in the wild, making noise and drawing attention to yourself would be counter productive :)

Just my guess though :)

[Strutter769]

http://www.pbase.com/crocdoc/image/130665066.jpg

See what happens when you trust the babysitter...

Now THAT'S funny!

[crocdoc]

...do monitors ejaculate sperm like human men do? Does it ever spill out onto the sofa or wherever they're doing it? :confused: Or is it all a neat, mess-free scene?
No spillage at all. There are biological reasons humans produce as much semen as they do (to flush away a competitor's 'input', so to speak). Interestingly enough, this is the second time I've had this discussion in regards to monitor sex in two days, as someone on another forum showed a photograph of a wet spot after his monitors had attempted to mate and it supported what I thought I'd seen in his video - the male missed his target.

Also, do they make noises? LOL sorry but I'm really curious about monitor sex for some reason :wacky:
No need to apologise, we're all adults here ;)
Mild hissing at times, but that's about it. When the male thrusts there's sometimes a weird popping sound, too.

Waaay too much detail!

[Hillsberry]

Wow incredible pictures!

[Trent]

Very nice pics!

[Norm66]

Awesome pics and monitors. And information. I don't know how I'd have slept tonight without knowing all about messy, moany monitor sex. ;^) hehehehe

[crocdoc]

This is why I put up with them having sex on my rug and sofa:

http://www.pbase.com/crocdoc/image/137243144.jpg

[BarelyBreathing]

They're adorable!

[Kayla90]

This is why I put up with them having sex on my rug and sofa:

http://www.pbase.com/crocdoc/image/137243144.jpg

Definitely worth it :P
They are so cute!!

Awesome pictures.

[Trent]

This is why I put up with them having sex on my rug and sofa:

http://www.pbase.com/crocdoc/image/137243144.jpg
They are awesome!!!

[SpOoKy]

blahdjfhfklash...
This is the sound I made when i saw the baby pics.
Way too adorable!!!

[jaleely]

ah haha! good thing your guy doesn't miss, for the mess and so you can have those cute babies!

[alessia55]

Do baby monitors hatch or are they born live straight out of the mama?

[youngster]

They lay eggs Alessia :)

[infernalis]

Yes that they do.. provided there are proper conditions. And crocdoc has that dialed right in perfect.

[exwizard]

Man these monitors are cool! They look like little raptors! :)

[CK SandBoas]

Those are some awesome pictures of some beautiful animals!!

[crocdoc]

Thanks again, everyone!

Yes, they're egg layers. The eggs of this species take 8-9 months to hatch, normally.

This is what the eggs look like before I've collected them, when I've excavated the nesting burrow and uncovered them. They're really tightly packed in by the female.
http://www.pbase.com/crocdoc/image/51267444.jpg

I've changed incubation techniques over the years, but this is what a typical clutch looks like before going into the incubator.
http://www.pbase.com/crocdoc/image/139207861.jpg

Nine months later, the first sign of hatching is a pip, when the hatchling slits the egg with its egg tooth. A few hours later it sticks its snout out and gets used to breathing air using its lungs, rather than via the umbilicus and egg membranes.
http://www.pbase.com/crocdoc/image/128396731.jpg

If you look closely, you can see the egg tooth on the tip of the upper lip
http://www.pbase.com/crocdoc/image/128396730.jpg

In this photo, two had hatched and another five had pipped
http://www.pbase.com/crocdoc/image/67499857.jpg

Eventually, they pop their head out, but will usually still sit in the egg for another 12-48 hours
http://www.pbase.com/crocdoc/image/126935343.jpg

It's rare to catch them in the process of hatching, as they usually back into the egg when I open the incubator. That's what this one was trying to do
http://www.pbase.com/crocdoc/image/87055985.jpg

[crocdoc]

The babies are really tiny when they first come out, but are huge compared to the size of the egg.
http://www.pbase.com/crocdoc/image/85265831.jpg

It's hard to believe they fit into such a small egg
http://www.pbase.com/crocdoc/image/61855098.jpg

This was the first one I'd ever hatched
http://www.pbase.com/crocdoc/image/91480370.jpg


Here's the adult male and the same baby. The photo was taken a long time ago, so the adult male is quite a bit bigger now (as is the baby, of course) but you get an idea of the size difference between adult and baby
http://www.pbase.com/crocdoc/image/39103641.jpg

I used to get updates from the keeper that bought that baby - here's a photo he sent me four years ago of the same animal.
http://www.pbase.com/crocdoc/image/91480375.jpg

[youngster]

Amazing pics crocdoc!

[infernalis]

How big of an enclosure would I need for a lace?

[crocdoc]

Minimum 8' x 8' x 4' in my opinion. Not many in Canada, though. One in private hands that I know of.

[BarelyBreathing]

I'm thrilled you shared these pictures! I especially like the sire and baby picture, although he's probably wondering if he could eat it.

[Kylie]

lol most epic convo ever!
Also those are some amazing creatures!!! Beautiful!! their huge!! >.<
Are they friendly? like cats? :p they just roam your house??

SUPER COOL!!!

[Freebody]

Im in Aw!! wow! thanks for sharing. I love lace monitors! i hope to one day get to see some in person.

[Kylie]

The babys are so tiney!!!! how long is there life span?

[infernalis]

Minimum 8' x 8' x 4' in my opinion. Not many in Canada, though. One in private hands that I know of.

I live in the U..S.A. mate.

The forum is Canadian, but I'm not ;)

[crocdoc]

Are they friendly? like cats? :p they just roam your house??
They're pretty Machiavellian, like cats. Friendly if there's something in it for them. My pair are pretty good - I can walk up to them and lift them up, move them around without an issue. Crazy at feed time, though, so it's best not to confuse handling with feeding. Once they get into food mode, all bets are off.
how long is there life span?
My pair are almost 12 years old but still very young (and damn they can put on a turn of speed at feed time!). I've seen captives older than 35 years old and know of a wild one that's probably around that age or older, too. I suspect they can live to over 40. A good friend of mine has a male that's now 27 years old and to look at it you couldn't tell it was any older than my pair. It, too, moves phenomenally quickly at feed time.
I live in the U..S.A. mate. The forum is Canadian, but I'm not ;)
LOL - too funny. I hadn't even noticed your signature and had a assumed, being a moderator on a Canadian forum, that you were a Canuck.

[infernalis]

I imagine the fact I have an account at Reptiles Canada didn't help with the confusion either.

I can be in Canada in about 90 minutes.

Just for giggles, I looked on KS classifieds, no lacies for sale today.

[crocdoc]

It's been a while since anyone has bred them stateside. I know of a couple of people that are trying.

[alessia55]

those photos are amazing!!!! Thanks for showing me the whole whole process :yes: Very educational. I never knew about any of this stuff before now! :)

[beardeds4life]

Im constantly looking at KS and stuff and very rarely do I see lacies for sale (Im not going to buy any I just like seeing what people are asking and what the market is)

[infernalis]

ever see them, PM me.

[beardeds4life]

Will do! then you can buy one and I can see him/her :)

[jarich]

Great photos man! I cant wait to move into a space with more room for my animals. I want some peach throats next.

[Wolfus_305]

WOW, those are amazing photos!!!!
The babies are soooooo cuttttte, it makes me want one... then i see how big they get and realize they are wayyyy too big as adults, i wish they stayed small though, they look like little dinosaurs

[infernalis]

Lace Monitors | The Reptile Report (http://thereptilereport.com/lace-monitors/)

http://www.chompersite.com/images/lace.gif

[shaunyboy]

http://www.pbase.com/crocdoc/image/130665066.jpg

See what happens when you trust the babysitter...

^^^^^
:yes::yes::yes:

really good pictures of amazing looking lizards mate

their facial expressions crack me up:yes:

cheers shaun

[millertime89]

Thanks for sharing the pictures CrocDoc, I'm jealous of where you live, Morelia, Varanid, and Croc central.

[infernalis]

Thanks for sharing the pictures CrocDoc, I'm jealous of where you live, Morelia, Varanid, and Croc central.


Yes!

If I lived there, I would be in the house even less than I am now.

[crocdoc]

Thanks, everyone.
Thanks for sharing the pictures CrocDoc, I'm jealous of where you live, Morelia, Varanid, and Croc central.

That's why I moved here. Originally to do research on crocodiles (as per my online nickname, first given to me by my siblings back in the pre-digital days of letter writing. It's how they used to address the envelopes) but now I spend a lot of time out looking at wild monitors, just for fun, and have zillions of photographs. Unfortunately, I have to spend at least some time inside if I'm ever to get anything done. It's also been raining a lot lately, so there's not much in the way of varanid activity to see at the moment.

On the 31st of January I celebrated 31 years in Australia, as I originally grew up in Canada. You'd think that after 31 years the gloss would wear off, but I still get as excited about seeing wild reptiles as I always have. Just yesterday I caught a lizard (a bar-sided forest or rock skink, Eulamprus tenuis, around 20cm long) in the cockroach trap I had put in one of my kitchen cupboards (a live trap, so the lizard was released unharmed). It's not often I find them inside so I got a bit of a kick out of it.

There's a national park around 35 minutes' drive from here at which I spend most of my time watching wild lace monitors. There are a number of animals there that I can recognise on sight by their patterns, three of which I've been watching for almost 12 years, since I first started keeping monitors at home.

Here's a photograph I took in December. I first saw this animal quite a number of years ago, although it's not one of the three 12-year 'familiars'.

http://www.pbase.com/crocdoc/image/140356100.jpg

My most recent wild lace monitor photos were taken last weekend, when I travelled to the south coast property of some friends for a wedding. Saturday (exactly a week ago) was an unbelievable day for monitors, as it had been cool and rainy the day before so the warm morning sun had the place crawling with monitors. Despite the day being full of obligatory social events (bridal family lunch and the afternoon wedding) I saw no less than six different monitors cruise within 100 metres of the house and another four or five on short excursions down paths and tracks elsewhere on the property. Normally I just photograph the monitors themselves (like the photograph posted above) and this is another typical example:

http://www.pbase.com/crocdoc/image/141279306.jpg

Last weekend, though, I decided to take a few shots at a slightly wider angle so one could see where the animals were relative to the house. Here's one of the monitors (same one as the photo above) with the chook-house (chicken coup) in the background.

http://www.pbase.com/crocdoc/image/141279305.jpg

Here's a shot of a yellow-bellied water skink (Eulamprus heatwolei) on the wood pile.

http://www.pbase.com/crocdoc/image/141279398.jpg

The next two shots were taken at a wider angle so you could see what was in the background.

Shot 1, focusing on the skink:
http://www.pbase.com/crocdoc/image/141279303.jpg

Shot 2, focusing on the background. Look to the right of the woodpile, next to the base of the tree:
http://www.pbase.com/crocdoc/image/141279304.jpg

Shot 2, from above, cropped:
http://www.pbase.com/crocdoc/image/141279426.jpg

I also took a video of a red-bellied blacksnake, Pseudechis porphyriacus, looking for mice in the chook-house itself, with another water skink watching it warily from on top of the laying boxes. That'll have to wait until I have editing time before I can upload it to youtube, which may be a later in the year.

[infernalis]

Oh so awesome.

Thanks.

[BarelyBreathing]

Wow, I really envy you. I also really like the darker lace. Please keep the photos coming.

[millertime89]

I watch BBC America a lot and I keep seeing commercials for visit Australia, I want to leave Nebraska and wouldn't be opposed to moving down there.

[alessia55]

I bet it's just so amazing to see these guys in the wild :yes: Lucky, lucky you

[Swany]

Really cool pics, thanks for sharing and please keep em coming ;-)

[beardeds4life]

I want to go there some day I jus will have to remember I cant take anything with me lol

[shaunyboy]

this is a great informative thread mate

thanks for sharing

cheers shaun

[crocdoc]

Thanks all. As the title says, here are a few more wild shots.

There's a lace monitor in this tree, can you see it?
http://www.pbase.com/crocdoc/image/93945871.jpg
close-up
http://www.pbase.com/crocdoc/image/93945870.jpg

Here's a really old photograph, scanned from a transparency. It's something one rarely sees in the wild - a hatchling lace monitor. It was in a rainforest and I found it like this, feeding on a king cricket. It was too distracted with its meal to care about me.
http://www.pbase.com/crocdoc/image/78349744.jpg

Lace monitor from the south coast with particularly beautiful markings
http://www.pbase.com/crocdoc/image/103857416.jpg

Local wild lace monitors. Three 'familiars' that I've been photographing for almost 12 years in a park around 35 minutes from home:
http://www.pbase.com/crocdoc/image/64875520.jpg
http://www.pbase.com/crocdoc/image/134096659.jpg
http://www.pbase.com/crocdoc/image/110269528.jpg

[crocdoc]

What one sees when there's meat on the barbecue wafting smells around the place.
http://www.pbase.com/crocdoc/image/110681993.jpg
http://www.pbase.com/crocdoc/image/110681994.jpg

Monitor at a popular lookout spot, enjoying the view.
http://www.pbase.com/crocdoc/image/134096300.jpg

Giant lace monitor from the south coast.
http://www.pbase.com/crocdoc/image/140619174.jpg

This is a heath monitor, Varanus rosenbergi, the other species we have locally. It's a gravid female and the photo was taken on the day she had started digging her nest (which is how I had spotted her to start with).
http://www.pbase.com/crocdoc/image/93270352.jpg

Going further afield, a wild yellow-spotted monitor, Varanus panoptes panoptes, from inland Queensland.
http://www.pbase.com/crocdoc/image/108377813.jpg

[Gungirl]

Thank you for sharing these beautiful pictures with us. I LOVE the last pic of the yellow spotted one.

[infernalis]

Wow... just wow

[Jenn_06]

LOVE them they are so beautiful,

on our 10th wedding anniversary(next year) we was playing to go to Australia but found out he is getting deployed next year :( but i think after seeing these pics we are going after he comes back. you have so much wild life out there i love to see it all.

[CK SandBoas]

Thank you for sharing those beautiful pictures!:)

[alessia55]

oh my :eek: These are AMAZING! I can't believe you can see those in the wild!

[BeardedDee]

Awesome wild monitor pics, some I've seen you post before elsewhere I'm sure. Particularly fond of the Panoptes attitude pic :)

[red ink]

Great Shots of the wild varanids Doc... Love the panoptes shot, I'd love to get a pic of them myself. I travelled from the Daintree through Longreach and down to Melb hoping to catch a pic of one on a road trip, alas I only caught a mere glimpse of one outside Tambo. By the time I pulled over from doing 110, get the camera, walk back all I see is the long tail walking back into the long grass...

[crocdoc]

Longreach/Ilfracombe was where I took that photo. It's a great area for the species, as was the whole area around Windorah. There are also Spencer's monitors there, Varanus spenceri.

Varanus spenceri
http://www.pbase.com/crocdoc/image/108377830.jpg

More Varanus panoptes
http://www.pbase.com/crocdoc/image/108377812.jpg

Really big, thin one
http://www.pbase.com/crocdoc/image/108252644.jpg
http://www.pbase.com/crocdoc/image/108252672.jpg

Here's one from the Kimberley. They'll be gone from there, soon, now that the toads have arrived.
http://www.pbase.com/crocdoc/image/40080970.jpg

Varanus mertensi
http://www.pbase.com/crocdoc/image/40080968.jpg

[red ink]

Thanks for the pics Doc... I was really disheartened when I was walking around the back paddocks of Longreach and found a few toad carcasses

[millertime89]

Here's one from the Kimberley. They'll be gone from there, soon, now that the toads have arrived.

What do the toads have to do with it?

Thanks for the pics Doc... I was really disheartened when I was walking around the back paddocks of Longreach and found a few toad carcasses

What's happening?

[crocdoc]

There are no native true toads (Bufonidae) in Australia, so most of the native reptiles cannot deal with their toxins. Cane toads (aka marine toads) were introduced into Australia many years ago as someone's bizarre idea of biological control of cane beetles. The toads not only did not feed on the beetles, they started to spread across northern Australia, leaving a wide swathe of dead animals in their path. As there are many species of reptile here that feed on frogs, though, they try to eat the cane toads and die immediately. The speed with which the toads have been spreading has increased over the past few years and they've gone across the Northern Territory, so places that used to have thousands of yellow-spotted monitors now have none. The odd one is coming back and they may eventually partially recover (if there are enough out there that are genetically inclined to leave the toads alone). They hit the Kimberley last year and are still moving west.

The toads in Longreach would be the result of rains and flooding - they can't establish themselves well in most of the inland area. We found a number of carcasses, too, but there were still a fair few monitors around.

[millertime89]

That's really disheartening to hear.

[alessia55]

this one looks sooo much like the lochness monster or some dinosaur, I love it!

http://www.pbase.com/crocdoc/image/40080968.jpg

[crocdoc]

Okay, more shots taken away from home. Can anyone tell me what this is?
http://www.pbase.com/crocdoc/image/98000811.jpg
http://www.pbase.com/crocdoc/image/98000810.jpg

[alessia55]

crocdoc it's beautiful! I am just looooving your photos and soaking them up! Keep posting please!! :yes:

[BarelyBreathing]

I thought I was pretty good at identifying monitors, but I'm having a hard time with that one. What is it?

[crocdoc]

I'll give you a hint.

Hint 1: Its closest living relative is the lace monitor.

[asnakelovinbabe]

This thread made my day. Just the random photos of monitor sex all over the house... they're like a couple of newlyweds!

[asnakelovinbabe]

I'll give you a hint.

Hint 1: Its closest living relative is the lace monitor.


Eastern Box turtle.

Without a doubt!!!

[infernalis]

Mangrove Monitor?

[red ink]

V. salvadorii

[crocdoc]

V. salvadorii

Getting warm! There's only one species which is more closely related to lace monitors than V. salvadorii.

Hint 2: The animal in the photo isn't full grown.

I've got to step out for an hour or so, so everyone keep guessing and I'll provide the answer on my return.

[youngster]

Water monitor?
Argus? :crazy2:

Lol. I have no idea. Snakes are more of my thing.

[BeardedDee]

The yellow around the eye screams Komodoensis to me.

[crocdoc]

The yellow around the eye screams Komodoensis to me.

And we have a winner!

Here's 'daddy':
http://www.pbase.com/crocdoc/image/97999496.jpg

[BarelyBreathing]

Those aren't native!

[crocdoc]

Those aren't native!

Nope! I did drop a hint!

Okay, more shots taken away from home.

[millertime89]

Komodos are awesome.

[infernalis]

Nope! I did drop a hint!

right here....

Okay, more shots taken away from home.

what a field trip that must be..

[youngster]

Whew I failed pretty hard. That's a nice looking lizard though.
I admit, I really didn't think that was a komodo :p
The only ones I can identify easily are savs, laces, and perenties :)

[DragonsEye]

Awesome pics, Crocdoc. ;)

Q: When allowing the monitors to wander around the house, isn't a bit of an issue to clean up after them if they choose to defecate while out and about?

[crocdoc]

what a field trip that must be..

'Awesome' doesn't quite cover it. It was amazing.


Q: When allowing the monitors to wander around the house, isn't a bit of an issue to clean up after them if they choose to defecate while out and about?
They're creatures of habit, so I try to slot in with their routines. Normally they defecate before they are let out, but lately the male has been going later than the female so sometimes it's just easier to leave them in the enclosure until he's done his bit before letting them out. The female is pretty comical in that regard - she'll come down from the basking spot and sit in the corner from which I normally let them out. If I try to let her out, though, she'll often just look at me. A few minute later she'll wander off, defecate, then come back and insist on being let out. It seems to me that she's waiting for that. I don't think she likes defecating outside the enclosure, whereas the male is the opposite and seems to hold on until he's let out.

[BarelyBreathing]

My bad. I totally thought you meant on a drive or something, not out of country.

[crocdoc]

Juvenile dragon from Rinca Island, where the dragons are more colourful than on Komodo Island itself. The hatchlings (ie much younger than this animal) are patterned quite similarly to lace monitors, particularly in the banding on the neck.
http://www.pbase.com/crocdoc/image/97999498.jpg
http://www.pbase.com/crocdoc/image/98000790.jpg

Big male dragon hanging around the ranger's hut on Komodo, hoping for scraps.
http://www.pbase.com/crocdoc/image/98000776.jpg

A dragon heading towards me just before the ranger suggested I back away.
http://www.pbase.com/crocdoc/image/98000795.jpg

Typical savannah habitat in which most of the dragons are found. This is Rinca.
http://www.pbase.com/crocdoc/image/98000780.jpg

A dragon we spotted in the monsoon forest on Komodo.
http://www.pbase.com/crocdoc/image/98000802.jpg

Same dragon, different angle
http://www.pbase.com/crocdoc/image/98000808.jpg

Hiking hazard on Rinca. Hey, I think there's something on the trail ahead.
http://www.pbase.com/crocdoc/image/98000796.jpg

[infernalis]

The photos are amazing..

[youngster]

Superb, thanks for sharing. :D

[BarelyBreathing]

Oh man, I'm insanely envious. My brother is about to go over there to study them. I have some pictures of hatchling komodos, but these are captive.

[millertime89]

God I want to make it over to Indonesia and experience all the amazing wildlife in their natural habitats.

[crocdoc]

When's your brother going to be there and where's he going to be stationed? I may be heading back later this year.

[crocdoc]

Dragon food, small to large
http://www.pbase.com/crocdoc/image/98636486.jpg
http://www.pbase.com/crocdoc/image/98000799.jpg
http://www.pbase.com/crocdoc/image/98000785.jpg

Russell's viper (although I think this is now classified as a separate species)
http://www.pbase.com/crocdoc/image/98297498.jpg

White-lipped viper
http://www.pbase.com/crocdoc/image/98445483.jpg

Flying lizard, Draco sp (probably Draco volans)
http://www.pbase.com/crocdoc/image/98445479.jpg

Tokay gecko. This was in a tree near where the buffalo above was photographed. They may be common pets in the US, but I still got a buzz the first time I heard one calling at night, and recognised it as a tokay. They have a very clear call that sounds either like "GEH-KOH GEH-KOH" or "TOE-KAY TOE-KAY".
http://www.pbase.com/crocdoc/image/98445507.jpg

Baby reticulated python in a cavity on the wall of a bat cave on Flores. The fuzziness isn't lack of focus, it's smeared guano and condensation on the lens. That particular adventure was 'interesting' rather than awesome. It would make a whole post on its own, but as I have almost no photographs to go with it, it is mostly in the telling. The white-lipped viper, above, was found near the cave, though, along with two others.
http://www.pbase.com/crocdoc/image/102982099.jpg

[millertime89]

please share the story, I would love to read it.

[BarelyBreathing]

When's your brother going to be there and where's he going to be stationed? I may be heading back later this year.


He's going in August. I'm not sure he knows where he's going yet, though.

[crocdoc]

There's a cave on Flores called Istana Ular ('snake palace'). It's starting to become quite famous now. It's full of bats and reticulated pythons go in there, particularly during the dry season, to maintain humidity and to feed on the bats. My mates and I hired a guide, the best known one in the region, to take us there. We got permission from the locals and from the landowners (the cave features heavily in local myths and it is thought that the snakes represent ancestors, if I remember correctly) and headed towards the cave.

As we walked into the cave, the guide warned us that there may be some guano (bat droppings). At first we didn't think much of it, as it was not much deeper than the treads of our boots. Within minutes we were thigh deep in guano the consistency of mangrove mud. Thigh deep, no exaggeration. And when I say it was like mangrove mud, I mean that it sucks in your legs, so if you slow down or stop moving you will get stuck and may not be able to get moving again.

That's issue #1

Issue #2 was that the cave got warmer the further we went in. We were already in the tropics, so it was hot as hell outside, but one would expect it to get cooler the further in we went. But no, it got warmer. The breaths of thousands of bats combined with decomposing guano ensures that it is a cosy high 30s C in there.

Issue #3 was the humidity. Not only did it get warmer as we went further into the cave, but the air got more and more humid until it was at around 99%.

Issue #4 was the insects. Whenever my headlamp beam scanned across the surface of the guano, a sea of cockroaches would scatter. That's okay, it was the insects around my face that were a nuisance. Attracted by my headlamp, there was a little cloud of them right in front of my face at all times. That on its own isn't a huge issue, until you consider Issue #5

Issue #5 was the air quality. The further in the cave we went, the less oxygen there was to breathe, the more heavily saturated the air was with carbon dioxide, ammonia and nitrogen - a combination of breathing bats and decaying guano. This meant that even walking at a slow pace, we were breathing rapidly at all times. Going back to issue #4, this meant there was a small cloud of insects going in and out of our mouths with each and every breath, some of which would make it into our lungs. A few coughs and you'd want to breathe in, right? No, more ammonia, more insects, more coughing.

Issue #5 meant that if you got stuck in the guano (issue #1), you'd exhaust what little air you had to breathe in no time. Exercise in a low oxygen environment is not a good idea. At one point one of my mates got stuck in the guano and couldn't move. I tried to help him by grabbing a part of a wall (covered in guano also, making it slippery - issue #6) and then pulling on his arm slowly until he finally freed one leg enough to start moving slowly again, but by then he was toast. The effort of trying to get out exhausted his blood oxygen and he just couldn't catch his breath again. Imagine sprinting and then trying to catch your breath while breathing into a bag. He had to leave the cave in order to recover his breath. My other mate got stuck a bit further in and although he eventually freed himself, he also (sensibly) decided to leave the cave.

The guide and I continued on for a while, but eventually we reached a point where the guano was too deep to go any further. He put his walking stick in and it seemed to keep going, so we decided that was enough and turned around to leave. By that stage every part of me was covered in guano, including my camera, so when I stopped to photograph the little reticulated python near the entrance of the cave I was trying to wipe a guano covered lens with a sopping wet sleeve (did I mention the heat and 99% humidity?) which was also covered in guano.

When I got outside the cave I found my two mates by the stream, gently washing off bits of guano. I said "you're both mad", put my camera down and walked straight to the middle of the stream, clothes, boots and all, laid down under the water and stayed there as the water rushed over me, until I needed to breathe. It's hard to describe, but that cave was one of the strangest experiences of my life (and the others agreed on that). It's definitely the sort of thing only hard-core reptile people would do, just to see some snakes. Unfortunately, there weren't many retics in there at the time, for it was the wrong time of year, but we did see a fair number of vipers nearby.

Apparently the guano isn't always that deep and is sometimes more fluid in consistency, so less arduous.

[crocdoc]

He's going in August. I'm not sure he knows where he's going yet, though.

Do you know who he's working with? Is it Tim Jessop?

[BarelyBreathing]

Wow, one heck of a story!

Andrew told me who he was working with, but I can't recall the name. I don't know if this means anything to you, but he will be with a bit of an international team, and they plan on studying the venom vs. bacteria contents and I guess something about which is more deadly. My brother used to basically test whether or not a cure for different things would work or not, and I believe he will be doing something similar here (although I'm not really caught up on all the details). Does any of this make sense to you?

[crocdoc]

He may be working with Bryan Frye, although I suspect a lot of people will be working on the venom thing, now.

[BarelyBreathing]

I know who Bryan Frye is. It wasn't him.

[millertime89]

wow... that's now the third time I've heard of "Snake Palace"
if you have Netflix find "dangerous encounters" with Brady Barr, he goes twice, once he finds a 20+ foot retic, its one of the better episodes.

[crocdoc]

Grrr... I had typed out a long response but it seems to have disappeared.

I'm not a fan of Brady Barr. I was aware of his program on the cave, for I recorded it on TV shortly after I returned from Indonesia a few years ago. It's the only program of his I've recorded and one of very few I've watched. I watched it while I was recording it and one of the guys from the trip was on the phone with me during ad breaks, laughing at the way Barr was carrying on. The reason I recorded the program was a scene in which you can see the deep guano, so I could show other people.

We had the same guide as Barr. Really nice guy. What irked me most about the Nat Geo program is that they didn't list him in the credits, not so much as a 'thanks to'. I know that it would have been really difficult for them to organise their film shoot in the cave without his help and that he doesn't get paid much for what he does. You can see him in one of the sequences after Barr got bitten by the snake (a well deserved bite, too, for he seemed to have no idea what he was doing), as he rushes in front of the camera to offer his help.

[crocdoc]

Grrr...first my long post disappeared, then my second one appeared twice. :(

[jarich]

This is an awesome thread man, thanks for all the pictures and stories! That cave experience sounds both amazing and disgusting. I bet getting out into the fresh air never felt as good at any time in your life!

[crocdoc]

I bet getting out into the fresh air never felt as good at any time in your life!

Got that right! But getting into the stream was an even more unbelievable feeling. After lying down and letting the water rush over me for a while I didn't want to sit up, but had to to breathe.

[millertime89]

He's annoying but his show is, at the very least, entertaining and relatively informative. What about it bothers you other than it giving 0 credit to the guide.

If I can get a decent job post-graduation would you be up for another trip up there with a retic enthusiast?

[crocdoc]

I'd happily head back to Flores and hope to later this year, anyway.

Re his program...Where do I start? To be fair, I hate all personality based animal shows (I refuse to call them documentaries, for they are anything but), so he's already off to a bad start there. Any show that has a lot of talking head or views of someone's butt as they jump on an animal just doesn't interest me. I disliked crikey's show for the same reason. There's a lot to be learned from watching an animal behave naturally in the wild and I try to do as much of that myself as possible. There's very little to be learned by watching someone jump on one.

Secondly, his show in particular annoys me because of the handling techniques used. I'm not a fan of tongs. Fine for offering a large reptile food or picking up groceries from a high shelf (their original purpose) but I flinch when I see someone taking tongs into the field with them for use with wild snakes, especially a place like Australia or Indonesia where a large number of the snakes one will encounter may be slim bodied, fast moving things like elapids (the cobra family). If you can hold one in your tongs and it is unable to get away, its ribs are toast. They may be okay for slow moving, thick bodied snakes like rattlers, but even then hooks are better. Tongs for pythons - why on earth would you bother?

Also, large crocodilians are easily tired out and it can be dangerous to tire them to the point of exhaustion. If lactic acid levels build up high enough, they can die a day or two after capture. Going out and capturing numerous crocodilians for the sake of measuring them and pretending one is doing 'science' for TV, or simply to boast that one has captured every species of crocodilian in the world, just doesn't sit right with me. I often wondered if any of those crocodilians he captured died afterwards (and I'm not the only one that's wondered that).

For what it's worth, I wouldn't watch crikey reruns, that program with the annoying German or South African guy trying to extract venom (can't recall his name) or any of the other talking head animal shows, either.

[millertime89]

Huh, that's really interesting, I never thought of it that way. I come from an enthusiast background, not really a biologist background so some of those things never even entered my mind.
Guilty pleasure: Croc Hunter reruns, I always loved it when i was little and din't get to watch it very often, so I've been recording it and watching it now that I've got the ability to do so.

[BarelyBreathing]

I was (and still am) a huge fan of The Crocodile Hunter. It was his enthusiasm for reptiles that made him great. I used to bring kids to my house to watch the show, and after that they would be less afraid of snakes. I think we need somebody with his devotion to helping people overcome their prejudices towards reptiles around today, as our hobby is under more and more attack.

[crocdoc]

I do apologise, but I have to admit that I laugh when I read statements like this:
I think we need somebody with his devotion to helping people overcome their prejudices towards reptiles around today, as our hobby is under more and more attack.

It seems most people in the US aren't aware that he was against the ownership of reptiles by private keepers. It's fairly well known here.

What irked me most about crikey was his insistence on using the word 'aggressive' while holding a snake by the tail. "Look how aggressive it is! It wants to TAG me". Gave people the wrong idea about snakes, in my opinion. People watching his show that aren't snake enthusiasts walk away thinking a species is far more aggressive/dangerous than it really is, which is bad in a country like Australia. That's how I found out about his show to start with: A good mate rang me and said "I had no idea (I can't recall the species of snake) were that dangerous" and when I asked "who said they were?" he told me about the show. I watched a couple of episodes and that was enough for me.

[BarelyBreathing]

That wasn't what I was talking about. He was out there every single day advocating that reptiles aren't the bad guys.

[crocdoc]

He was out there every single day advocating that reptiles aren't the bad guys.

Telling people they're aggressive is not the way to do that.

[BarelyBreathing]

I honestly don't recall anything like that. Then again, it's been ages since I've watched the show.

[red ink]

I do apologise, but I have to admit that I laugh when I read statements like this:


It seems most people in the US aren't aware that he was against the ownership of reptiles by private keepers. It's fairly well known here.

What irked me most about crikey was his insistence on using the word 'aggressive' while holding a snake by the tail. "Look how aggressive it is! It wants to TAG me". Gave people the wrong idea about snakes, in my opinion. People watching his show that aren't snake enthusiasts walk away thinking a species is far more aggressive/dangerous than it really is, which is bad in a country like Australia. That's how I found out about his show to start with: A good mate rang me and said "I had no idea (I can't recall the species of snake) were that dangerous" and when I asked "who said they were?" he told me about the show. I watched a couple of episodes and that was enough for me.


Shhh... Doc that's a dirty secret, some people also have inside knowledge of his "poaching days".

[DragonsEye]

What irked me most about crikey was his insistence on using the word 'aggressive' while holding a snake by the tail. "Look how aggressive it is! It wants to TAG me". Gave people the wrong idea about snakes, in my opinion. People watching his show that aren't snake enthusiasts walk away thinking a species is far more aggressive/dangerous than it really is, ....

Interesting that you should mention this. I've had an issue with Frank Indiviglio who often writes articles about the husbandry of various animals. I dropped him a note one day about his use of "aggressive" rather than "defensive" in an article of his (he asks for comments). My concerns were similar to yours (matter of fact I posted my opinion on the "aggressive" vs "defensive" on some thread here not long ago, as I recall). Indiviglio's response was that "as the author of 5 books" he is aware of the distinction between the words but doesn't feel it's possible to distinguish the two when looking at animal behavior. Hence his continual use of "aggressive". My response was that as "the author of 5 books" he should be well aware of the power of words and how the words one chooses to use influence's a reader's perception. He lost a great deal of my respect at that point.

[Swany]

Shhh... Doc that's a dirty secret, some people also have inside knowledge of his "poaching days".

Is this another case of poacher turned gamekeeper ?

[red ink]

Is this another case of poacher turned gamekeeper ?
More or less...

[millertime89]

I actually just watched an episode not too long ago that had a ton of video from his early days and I can't say I'm terribly surprised. I also don't understand how people like him can be against the private ownership of reptiles. What makes them so damn special? Proper training? Do they forget that they had to start somewhere as well?

[red ink]

I actually just watched an episode not too long ago that had a ton of video from his early days and I can't say I'm terribly surprised. I also don't understand how people like him can be against the private ownership of reptiles. What makes them so damn special? Proper training? Do they forget that they had to start somewhere as well?

A zoo that makes them millions of dollars from people viewing animals they can legally own themselves... :rolleyes:

Ironically his old man is the total opposite of him, Bob is a big advocate of native wildlife ownership. I hate to say it but..... Terry Irwin.

[millertime89]

The zoo can keep the animals that already aren't legal for people to own or animals that people don't want to own. In places like Australia they can keep non-native wildlife and things like salties and mambas and elephants. C'mon, how many nuts are out there that WANT to keep those? Things like snakes and monitors that are easily kept in homes aren't going to be kept by very many people. Private ownership doesn't cause any harm to zoos financially. I have reptiles and I still LOVE going to the zoo to see all the crazy things that I can't have/don't want.

What about Terry?

[red ink]

I've got a license to keep salties...

I think I'll leave the Terry issue alone (forget I said it)

[BurmeseGuy]

Man these monitors are cool! They look like little raptors! :)
exactly what I was thinking, very awesome cool pictures, you're a good photographer...well worth the pushin on your cushions lol

[millertime89]

I think I'll leave the Terry issue alone (forget I said it)
Well now you can't.

[beardeds4life]

The zoo can keep the animals that already aren't legal for people to own or animals that people don't want to own. In places like Australia they can keep non-native wildlife and things like salties and mambas and elephants. C'mon, how many nuts are out there that WANT to keep those? Things like snakes and monitors that are easily kept in homes aren't going to be kept by very many people. Private ownership doesn't cause any harm to zoos financially. I have reptiles and I still LOVE going to the zoo to see all the crazy things that I can't have/don't want.

What about Terry?

I agree the it would take a huge collection before it actually hurt the zoo

[crocdoc]

I don't think that was the motivation. I suspect it had to do with misguided ideas about conservation, similar to their stance on crocodile farming and sustainable harvesting of wild kangaroos, two things that are actually pro-environment.

[Skumbo]

Oh man i love these pictures! if only I could go out and see animals like this, The only things I can count on running into while mountain biking are moose and bears.

[crocdoc]

I made a last minute decision to head out into the bush today - an excuse to step away from the computer and clear my head. It was well worth it.

Visiting my nearest favourite spot, I managed to find a very familiar lace monitor, Varanus varius, that I call 'Bluey', within minutes. I've been photographing Bluey for almost 12 years now and he looked like an old monitor when I first saw him. Now he's looking really old. He hasn't grown at all in the 12 years and I strongly suspect that he was already reasonably old the first time I saw him, given that he was adult sized (it takes them around 8-10 years to get his size in the wild) and not a young looking animal (which is what one would expect from an 8-10 year old animal). Depending on whether my guess is correct or not, he's somewhere between 20-35 years old, if not older. Personally, I'd be surprised if he was less than 30.

These days he's even more scarred up than before and his skin looks terrible.
http://www.pbase.com/crocdoc/image/141569216.jpg
http://www.pbase.com/crocdoc/image/141569221.jpg
http://www.pbase.com/crocdoc/image/141569219.jpg

Unfortunately, this season may be his last, as his right forelimb is badly swollen and he can barely walk.
http://www.pbase.com/crocdoc/image/141569223.jpg

It will be a bummer to see him go. On the other hand, I'm pretty sure I've written him off before and he's reappeared.

Over the next few weeks is the time of year that heath monitors, Varanus rosenbergi, start nesting. I thought I'd check out some familiar mounds, just out of curiosity, and was surprised to find some early pre-nesting test digs.

This mound had three holes - two visible in this shot.
http://www.pbase.com/crocdoc/image/141569238.jpg

All three holes visible in this shot.
http://www.pbase.com/crocdoc/image/141569236.jpg

...to be continued in part II

[crocdoc]

Elsewhere on my walk I surprised a male heath monitor in the middle of the track. Unlike lace monitors, heath monitors often freeze when they first see people, rather than bolt, so the two of us had a bit of a standoff while I very slowly pulled my camera out to snap a quick shot. This is exactly how I found him. There was a bit of a 'rabbit in the headlights' look about him and he didn't seem quite sure what to do.
http://www.pbase.com/crocdoc/image/141569249.jpg

I started walking towards him slowly and he, in turn, slowly turned around and started to walk away. I took some shots - not great shots, but okay as 'voucher' shots, anyway.
http://www.pbase.com/crocdoc/image/141569254.jpg
http://www.pbase.com/crocdoc/image/141569247.jpg

As soon as he hit cover he sped up and scuttled off, but I followed him and saw him disappear behind a sandstone slab. I carefully walked up to the edge of the slab and looked down - I could see his tail and his head, but he soon tilted his head up to look at me and disappeared under the rock. I missed getting a shot of his head, but I got these two shots of his tail.

One with my boot (intentional)
http://www.pbase.com/crocdoc/image/141569243.jpg

And his tail
http://www.pbase.com/crocdoc/image/141569252.jpg

It turns out that the sandstone slab was concave underneath and he had a burrow heading right under it.
http://www.pbase.com/crocdoc/image/141569245.jpg

On the way back to the car I found another familiar lace monitor. One I call 'Son of Bluey' or 'Junior' because of his resemblance to Bluey. I'm convinced he's of the same bloodline, as he looks almost identical to Bluey when he was younger and the lace monitors in this area show a fair bit of variation.
http://www.pbase.com/crocdoc/image/141569263.jpg
http://www.pbase.com/crocdoc/image/141569260.jpg

...to be continued in part III...

[crocdoc]

On the drive home I stopped to photograph another test dig in a termite mound on the side of the road. One day I'll get into trouble for craning my neck while driving at high speeds. For something that certain people (who pride themselves on their field skills) claim don't exist, these scars can't be too subtle if I can find them on the far side of a mound, on the other side of the road, while driving a car at 90km/hr.
http://www.pbase.com/crocdoc/image/141569230.jpg
http://www.pbase.com/crocdoc/image/141569232.jpg

Telltale scratches around the holes. I photographed these because someone recently accused me of being 'arrogant' for asserting holes like these were made by monitors. The person in question didn't come up with an alternative mysterious hole-making-monster, so I'm guessing they must have been made by low flying miniature planes or (BarelyBreathing's suggestion) unicorns. Maybe unicorns use these mounds like pencil-sharpeners?
http://www.pbase.com/crocdoc/image/141569228.jpg
http://www.pbase.com/crocdoc/image/141569225.jpg

I'm going to finish this off with a non-monitor (non-reptile, even) photograph. I'm not a macropod/potoroid expert, But I think these prints belong to a tiny swamp wallaby, Wallabia bicolor, fresh out of the pouch. Either that or a potoroo with fat feet. I should have put something in the photograph for scale, as they were really cute.
http://www.pbase.com/crocdoc/image/141569265.jpg

[millertime89]

oh to live in the land of varanids and morelia... Thanks for sharing man, I always appreciate your pictures!
Ever considered "adopting" son of bluey and ensuring his lineage carries on? Or is that something that is frowned upon/illegal in Oz?

[crocdoc]

Aside from it being both illegal and frowned upon, Kyle, I find the idea personally abhorrent. Don't take that the wrong way - my guess is that you would, too, once you saw monitors wandering around in the wild. It's one thing to raise a captive bred monitor in the confines of captivity, but the idea of taking an adult animal out of the wild, one accustomed to moving several kilometres a day, and putting it into a box makes me cringe. They are such active, curious animals it would be cruel.

Aside from all of that, I am sure Son of Bluey does alright on his own with the ladies, without my help. Removing him from the wild would stop his lineage (from a Darwinian sense), no matter how many offspring he produced in captivity, anyway.

[infernalis]

once you saw monitors wandering around in the wild. It's one thing to raise a captive bred monitor in the confines of captivity, but the idea of taking an adult animal out of the wild, one accustomed to moving several kilometres a day, and putting it into a box makes me cringe. They are such active, curious animals it would be cruel.

That sounds almost like what my friend in Africa says about Savs and Niles.

She calls it "Poaching for pets"

[BarelyBreathing]

Grrr, those nasty unicorns always make expert field researchers confused. Keep watching for them, crocdoc, and you will find the real culprites. Shoot those unicorns!

By the way, what great shots. Son of Bluey is a gorgeous monitor. I would love to photograph him. Bluey looks rough, but as sad as that is to see, it's a happy thing, too, to get to see a wild animal live to such a great age.

[millertime89]

Aside from it being both illegal and frowned upon, Kyle, I find the idea personally abhorrent. Don't take that the wrong way - my guess is that you would, too, once you saw monitors wandering around in the wild. It's one thing to raise a captive bred monitor in the confines of captivity, but the idea of taking an adult animal out of the wild, one accustomed to moving several kilometres a day, and putting it into a box makes me cringe. They are such active, curious animals it would be cruel.

Aside from all of that, I am sure Son of Bluey does alright on his own with the ladies, without my help. Removing him from the wild would stop his lineage (from a Darwinian sense), no matter how many offspring he produced in captivity, anyway.

No worries. I couldn't tell if he was an adult or a juvie. Scale is a hard thing to judge by a picture and as I'm not the most familiar with the species I went with my gut since he looked pretty small.

[infernalis]

By the way, what great shots. Son of Bluey is a gorgeous monitor. I would love to photograph him. Bluey looks rough, but as sad as that is to see, it's a happy thing, too, to get to see a wild animal live to such a great age.

And people think you and I are crazy for wanting to mimic nature as closely as possible with our captives.

[BarelyBreathing]

Yep, I'm a bad guy because I feed a natural diet to my animals. :(

[crocdoc]

That's okay. I'm 'repetitive' and 'non-curious' because I let my female lace monitor reproduce successfully year after year and don't want to experiment with her to the point of reproductive failure.
Kingsnake.com - Herpforum - RE: Nest box results for Frank. (http://forums.kingsnake.com/view.php?id=1964323,1965390)

By the way, I've gone with the unicorn explanation for the holes, to avoid being called 'arrogant' again by varanusaurus for assuming they were made by monitors.
Kingsnake.com - Herpforum - more mystery holes (http://forums.kingsnake.com/view.php?id=1966185,1967519)

[millertime89]

I'm curious to see how that second thread turns out. In my experience people like him will just ignore it, but I hope he doesn't.

[crocdoc]

I couldn't tell if he was an adult or a juvie. Scale is a hard thing to judge by a picture and as I'm not the most familiar with the species I went with my gut since he looked pretty small.

That's fair enough - there was nothing in the photograph for scale. Son of Bluey is almost the same size as Bluey and is around 1.6-1.7m in length.

Son of Bluey is a gorgeous monitor. I would love to photograph him.

He's pretty photogenic, so I usually try to snap shots of him when I see him. I'll have to go back through my photographs to find out when I first saw him, but it was at least four years ago. Of the photographs I have of him uploaded to my photo hosting site, the oldest goes back to 2009 but I know I shot video of him before that.

This is him on Australia Day 2009
http://www.pbase.com/crocdoc/image/108595202.jpg

...and again this past December. I was with a visiting American herper when I took this shot - he'd been to Australia before but hadn't seen any lace monitors, so I promised him we'd find some if we had a sunny day while he was in town. We scored a few times over.
http://www.pbase.com/crocdoc/image/140356100.jpg

[millertime89]

sigh... I need to get down there sometime.

[crocdoc]

I'm curious to see how that second thread turns out. In my experience people like him will just ignore it, but I hope he doesn't.

I have absolutely no desire to waste more time on that useless 'discussion' over there. I posted those photographs simply because I thought it was funny that I'd been talking about the two types of 'mysterious hole-making monsters' that dig into mounds coincidentally at the very same times of the year that lace monitors and heath monitors nest, forgetting that it was getting to the latter time of year and there were new holes to photograph. I have dozens of other, older photographs of lace monitor nest holes (what the whole discussion was originally about) on a hard drive that simply weren't uploaded to my photo-hosting site when I posted the photographs of termite mounds to start with.

Them unicorns sure is busy, huh.

Varanusaurus cracks me up. It's one thing to be an Arizona-minion and admit it (that has actually made me think more highly of Moe, funnily enough), it's another to be one and deny it. His failure to make the logical connection between photographs of holes in termite mounds and photographs of monitors in the process of making identical holes, given that the original challenge was "if they nested in termite mounds, there'd be scars", has unfortunately made me jump to the conclusion that he is dim, until proven otherwise. Comparing those photographs to the famous 'lace monitor in a tree' photo (long story - essentially it's a photograph showing absolutely nothing definitive, but it comes with a 'just so' story that's convincing only to the inexperienced) bolstered that impression.

[BarelyBreathing]

Ha, if you're up for a visitor, let me know.

[crocdoc]

I never need much of an excuse to head out to my favourite spots, but showing it to other people is always a bonus so I've taken a lot of overseas visitors out to see monitors. One of my most successful trips was taking an American monitor-loving acquaintance from another monitor forum, who had just arrived in Australia to study zoology in Queensland, out to this spot on his second day in the country. We saw seven lace monitors and a gravid female heath monitor in the act of digging a nest cavity. He was stoked. Heck, I was stoked.

These were taken that very day, in February, 2008.

Look closely:
http://www.pbase.com/crocdoc/image/93945868.jpg

A close-up, to make it easier:
http://www.pbase.com/crocdoc/image/93270351.jpg

It's the same mound I photographed yesterday and I first started photographing digs in this mound in 2004.

In 2004 she nested on the side of the mound. Unlike yesterday's photographs, this is an actual nest rather than a test dig. The termites had already repaired the hole.
http://www.pbase.com/crocdoc/image/64875205.jpg

That's 8 years for that mound, so far. So much for the Arizona assertion that wild female monitors only live 5 years. My money is on it being the same female, too, and if I get time (and weather permits) I'll head out again later this week to see if I can find her. I have several shots of her that I can use for identification and, although I haven't always caught her in the act of digging, I have caught her in the vicinity of the mound before and after the holes appeared during at least two different breeding seasons.

Here's one of my 'I.D.' shots, showing her gravid and ready to lay, in 2008.
http://www.pbase.com/crocdoc/image/93270352.jpg

[crocdoc]

A few more photographs to add to the story:

I have quite a number of photographs of the same mound during the years between 2004 and 2012. The bush on the left hand side with the distinctive leaves is still there, barely, but everything else is constantly changing. The mound has gone through healthy years and bad years. It grows when the colony is healthy (in wet years) and erodes when the colony has been reduced (in dry years). I thought it was dead for a couple of years, after a fire had gone through that area, but I was proven wrong when the female dug a nest hole and the termites came out of the underground core to repair the hole.

Here's the nest hole during the 2009 breeding season, photographed before and after the termites repaired the damage:

http://www.pbase.com/crocdoc/image/110270330.jpg

Here are some holes made by the escaping hatchlings in spring, during the 2011 breeding season.

http://www.pbase.com/crocdoc/image/139428465.jpg

[BarelyBreathing]

That's too cool. Seriously.

[alessia55]

Can't get over how amazing it must be to see these guys in the wild like that...

[millertime89]

That's too cool. Seriously.

Totally, I love seeing where the wee little buggers come clawing out.

[millertime89]

argh, I hate how clunky the BS forum is...

[crocdoc]

Totally, I love seeing where the wee little buggers come clawing out.

A friend saw and photographed that two years ago. The babies have bright salmon-pink markings. It was incredible.

He and I were chatting at a herp meeting one night and he said that he envied me for seeing a female digging a nest hole. I told him that it was the time of year for babies to emerge, so he should keep an eye out. He has a job that gives him afternoons free to do what he wants and he often goes mountain biking in an area that has a lot of heath monitors.

The very next day he found babies emerging and the !@#$% had the nerve to send me photographs from his phone to my work computer.

[crocdoc]

I went for a quick run up to the termite mound yesterday to see if there was any more activity. No more digging, but tracks indicating that the female had visited the mound at least once. I did, however, find a lace monitor on my way back to the car.

It was one of the other animals I've been photographing for a long time. I call this one 'Darkface'. He was the first monitor I photographed in the area 12 years ago, even before Bluey, but he's a younger animal. Although he hasn't grown much over the 12 years, he's filled out a bit and his colours and pattern have changed slightly as well.

Here he is as he looked yesterday:
http://www.pbase.com/crocdoc/image/141622123.jpg
http://www.pbase.com/crocdoc/image/141622151.jpg

Last April (2011)
http://www.pbase.com/crocdoc/image/134096659.jpg

September 2009
http://www.pbase.com/crocdoc/image/116968496.jpg

November 2000 (scanned from a slide)
http://www.pbase.com/crocdoc/image/116968499.jpg

[infernalis]

I can never see too many of these photographs.

[millertime89]

he looks like he had some weight on him in April and September.

[crocdoc]

Last April he was as thin as he is now (pretty thin, too), but you're right in that September 2009 he was a bit chunkier.

I've seen this in all of the monitors I've been photographing over the years. They have good years and bad years, or even good months and bad months. Sometimes they're so thin that you'd think they're not going to make it through winter, then a year or two later they are robust as.

[infernalis]

Do you ever feel "attached" to the ones you see frequently??

I know I do with some of the garter snakes I see year after year that I photograph.

[crocdoc]

Do you ever feel "attached" to the ones you see frequently??
Does being close to tears when I saw Bluey's swollen forelimb and limp the other day count? I found myself hoping that when he does go, he disappears quietly rather than me finding him dead somewhere.

[infernalis]

Does being close to tears when I saw Bluey's swollen forelimb and limp the other day count? I found myself hoping that when he does go, he disappears quietly rather than me finding him dead somewhere.

Yes, that counts.

[jarich]

Hey Dave, was just looking at your pics of the Bell phase baby that you had on another forum. Can you post pics here for everyone? That is one awesome looking monitor!!

[crocdoc]

I'm not sure which photos you were looking at, but here's one of the Bell's phase I've had. I've raised a few, as I'm after a female. The one in the photo, called Satan, was recently sent it up to a keeper I know in Qld, as he turned out to be a male.
http://www.pbase.com/crocdoc/image/140081067.jpg

I have another juvenile at the moment, called Bandit, but haven't taken any good photos of it, yet.

[BarelyBreathing]

Beautiful monitor, but I think I like the ”normals” better.

[BeardedDee]

Beautiful monitor, but I think I like the ”normals” better.
I'm with you there, with regards to darkface, bluey and co.

[mo9e64]

I remember seeing pics you took of Bell's Phase before-they are one of my favorites-gorgeous animals.You had Perenties as well did you not-if so what challenge were they compared to your Lacies ,if i may ask Moe

[crocdoc]

I'm a big fan of the 'normal' lace monitors, too. Bell's phase are unusual looking because of the broad bands of colour and can be quite spectacular, but I like the intricacies of patterning in the normal phase lace monitors.

The place I used to work at had perenties and I helped the keepers in getting them to reproduce. I incubated the eggs at home and then reared the young for a while. Although I was offered a couple of the babies, I turned them down for lack of space. They're an easy enough species to keep and breed, but they need huge amounts of floor space and massive volumes of substrate - you can't go vertical like you can with lace monitors and the females like to burrow into long nest tunnels. Not the sort of monitor you'd want to be keeping indoors.

[jarich]

I think that might be the one I saw pictures of when it was just a baby. You were showing the difference between Bells phase and another kind. It was a pretty spectacular baby! Love them all, such amazingly beautiful animals.

[BarelyBreathing]

Do you have any pictures of perenties for me to drool over?

[crocdoc]

Right, here goes. I have dozens of shots, so this is just a small sample.

First person that says "I want one, where can I get one" gets booted off the forum. Wayne, is that okay with you?

male
http://www.pbase.com/crocdoc/image/74548887.jpg
http://www.pbase.com/crocdoc/image/68419482.jpg

pair mating
http://www.pbase.com/crocdoc/image/74640139.jpg

pair cuddling
http://www.pbase.com/crocdoc/image/104242588,jpg

gravid female
http://www.pbase.com/crocdoc/image/70495857.jpg

[crocdoc]

eggs and hatchlings

Same rule as per part 1

http://www.pbase.com/crocdoc/image/82799658.jpg
http://www.pbase.com/crocdoc/image/83929501.jpg
http://www.pbase.com/crocdoc/image/82685388.jpg
http://www.pbase.com/crocdoc/image/83876757.jpg
http://www.pbase.com/crocdoc/image/88663371.jpg

[BarelyBreathing]

Ooooooooohhhhhh man!!! I can never see enough of these guys. More please!

[infernalis]

Right, here goes. I have dozens of shots, so this is just a small sample.

First person that says "I want one, where can I get one" gets booted off the forum. Wayne, is that okay with you?

Yes....

Dare to dream people. ;)

************************************************** ******

For sale: Large colubrid collection and all housing, downsizing to make room for Varanus enclosures.:eek:

[jarich]

They are such beautiful lizards. Totally jealous Dave!

[youngster]

I want one where can I get one?

That gravid female has a nice potbelly :)

[infernalis]

I want one where can I get one?

That gravid female has a nice potbelly :)

http://copiertalk.com/forum/public/style_extra/team_icons/banned.jpg

[crocdoc]

This photograph is labelled 'a good day' on my photo hosting site. Perenties and lace monitors hatching on the same day.
http://www.pbase.com/crocdoc/image/83691222.jpg

[infernalis]

That would be a GREAT day. :D

[It'sKourtneyYo]

Woooow!!!!!!!!! I have not be on here entirely too long! Amazing animals you have here!
Are they aggressive at all? How long have you had them and how big do they get? Also, do you know where they oriiginate from? Just curious :3

[crocdoc]

I'm not sure which animals you're referring to, so I'll answer your questions for both lace monitors and perenties.
Are they aggressive at all?
I've never seen a monitor I would consider aggressive. I've seen highly defensive ones and I've seen others that have really strong feeding responses, either of which can sometimes be seen as aggressive. To answer your question, both lace monitors and perenties start off really defensive (especially lace monitors) and both develop really strong feeding responses as adults (especially lace monitors). My adult lace monitors are like teddy bears, but I wouldn't want to have any part of my body that smelled like food anywhere near them and I certainly wouldn't want to make a sudden move with a hand near their mouths, as they have fast reflexes and a 'bite now, find out what it is later' attitude when it comes to anything resembling food (and in most instances all something has to do to resemble food is move).

How long have you had them and how big do they get?
The adult perenties weren't mine, they were owned by my previous place of employ. I had 17 eggs from two clutches incubating in my incubators (the photo above only shows the smaller incubator of the two) for around 9-10 months for each clutch and the hatchlings were kept at home for another 3-4 months or so. The lace monitors are mine and I've had the adult pair for getting on 12 years. Both species get to roughly 2m in length (adult males), occasionally longer.


Also, do you know where they oriiginate from?
Both species originate from Australia. :)
The lace monitors came from a breeder in Sydney, the adult perenties were both originally wild - the male was a parks and wildlife confiscation, as it was being held illegally by a private keeper without a licence, and the female was a wild rescue removed from someone's property in Alice Springs (if I recall correctly).

[millertime89]

Grr... i want a monitor, perenties are just awesome looking monitors.

[alessia55]

The top photo... is that a BABY? it's huge and those eggs are so small! :wacky:

[crocdoc]

Yep, they're all babies. Once they're out of the egg they look huge compared to the egg, because they are so tightly compacted inside before they hatch.
http://www.pbase.com/crocdoc/image/82685387.jpg
http://www.pbase.com/crocdoc/image/82756154.jpg
http://www.pbase.com/crocdoc/image/83691224.jpg
http://www.pbase.com/crocdoc/image/85807734.jpg
http://www.pbase.com/crocdoc/image/49303634.jpg
http://www.pbase.com/crocdoc/image/67499940.jpg

[millertime89]

I would love to see that in person some day.

[crocdoc]

I had to go out of town this past week to do some work in south Queensland. The weather was miserable, which made it quite conducive to work as I had no desire to go outside looking for reptiles. On the last two days, though, I stayed with a friend that lives in an area surrounded by rainforest and we spent a fair bit of time over those two days 'herping'.

First on my checklist was getting photographs of the local lace monitors. The weather wasn't really suitable, with the exception of a few hours on one day, but during those few hours we managed to see four lace monitors. Most were basking on the side of the road and bolted as soon as we stopped, but we found one while walking a track and with a bit of stealth and patience I managed to get a number of photographs.

It's a subadult, but typical colouration for southern Queensland. In the far south of their range, lace monitors have bands of speckles and in the far north they are spotted, not unlike a tree crocodile (Varanus salvadorii). Half way up, of course, they are half banded (the front half of the body) and half spotted (the latter half of their body). The light coloured head with indistinct banding is typical for this area, too.
http://www.pbase.com/crocdoc/image/141821215.jpg
http://www.pbase.com/crocdoc/image/141821222.jpg
http://www.pbase.com/crocdoc/image/141821220.jpg

We did see a lot of other reptiles - I'll not go into too much detail, given that this is a monitor forum, but will post a handful of photographs you may find interesting. We found four carpet pythons. The smallest was barely beyond a hatchling, the largest a really big, old-looking adult male with a brick for a head.

Smallest
http://www.pbase.com/crocdoc/image/141821214.jpg
http://www.pbase.com/crocdoc/image/141821213.jpg

Largest
http://www.pbase.com/crocdoc/image/141821219.jpg

I like this shot, as in the background you can see the rest of the python coiled up in the shade of the log it is 'hiding' beneath. It was resting on the edge of a trail, waiting for small furry mammals to hop or run past. The area has two species of small macropod (members of the kangaroo/wallaby family) called pademelons, as well as a large number of bandicoots and possums, all of which would be fair game for this snake.
http://www.pbase.com/crocdoc/image/141821217.jpg

[millertime89]

have I said I love this thread?
Those coastal carpets? Awesome pictures. That baby almost looks like a Jag. That adult is one big, old guy, He looks like he's lived a long, productive life, if only he/she could talk.

[red ink]

Great Pics Doc,

Love that big battle hardened looking coastal, good to see the big ones out there.

[alessia55]

wow those pics are amazing :eek: especially that old carpet python!!!

[crocdoc]

The big coastal carpet was blind in its right eye, but clearly very alert. I stepped near it to get a photograph of a skink on a nearby log and it immediately turned its head and started tongue-flicking. I suspect if I'd stepped a tiny bit closer or smelled even vaguely of bandicoot I'd have copped a few teeth in my calf.

[infernalis]

Superb pictures as always, so very appreciative to see them.

[millertime89]

well snakes certainly don't get that old in the wild letting big strange things near themselves.

[crocdoc]

This is true, Kyle.

Speaking of snakes that don't let big strange things near them, can anyone guess this species? RedInk will know this one. It's a crap photo, but it was very dark out and I had time for one quick shot before it lunged off the road and into the grass, then disappeared into the night.

http://www.pbase.com/crocdoc/image/141821223.jpg

[infernalis]

looks like a water snake..

[millertime89]

Fierce Snake or Tiger Snake

[crocdoc]

I'll give a hint. It's sometimes mistaken for our version of a watersnake (called a keelback) because it, too, has keeled scales.

[BarelyBreathing]

As usual, I love the pictures. Thanks for sharing.

[millertime89]

rough scaled snake

[crocdoc]

rough scaled snake

Bingo, we have a winner!

My next hint was going to be that mistaking it for a keelback could be fatal.

[millertime89]

just how venemous are they?

[millertime89]

I mean, everyone hears about the inland taipan and the eastern brown, and some people here about the red bellied black snake, the fierce snake and the tiger snake, but I haven't heard about the rough scaled snake until I was searching for it tonight.

[crocdoc]

The inland taipan and eastern brown are the two most venomous in the world (and not that far from each other in toxicity). The fierce snake is another name for the inland taipan. Tiger snakes are pretty toxic, but a bit further down the list. I'm always dubious about 'top ten most venomous' lists seen on the web, but by most accounts they'd still be somewhere in the middle to the bottom of the top ten. Rough-scaled snakes have very similar venom to tiger snakes. I'd rather handle a tiger snake, though, for rough-scaled snakes bounce around when agitated, as in whole body flips from side to side. Quite the spectacle. That's the other half of the story behind my crap photograph, for immediately after that one off shot, when the snake lunged off into the grass, the friend I was with watched it disappear into the grass and said "I'm not going to f____ chase it".

Red-bellied blacksnakes are feared by most people here, probably because they're one of the commonest large, venomous snakes and the one most people would encounter in eastern Australia, but in my opinion they barely rate as a dangerous snake. I think there may be one or two fatalities on record, at most. On top of that, they're pretty shy and not as inclined to bite in self defence as, say, an eastern brown. They'll often even strike with a closed mouth, just to frighten intruders off. There's a croc-hunter episode in which Irwin has a large male by the tail and is screaming about how aggressive it is, but if you watch that part of the episode in slow motion you can see that the snake is striking with a closed mouth.

There's a resident red-bellied blacksnake near the home of the people I stay with every xmas and it is often found near the chook-house (chicken coup). I've taken quite a number of photographs and videos of it over the years, but my favourite is this one. My god-daughter was six years old when the photo was taken and has been collecting the chicken eggs whenever she's stayed on the property during her holidays, since she was around two years old. She's very familiar with the snake and knows to remain calm when she sees it. When I took this photograph she was excitedly telling her grandmother (out of frame, to the right) about how many eggs there were and then shrugging when told to be careful of where she steps, because the snake is right in front of her. She was clearly not concerned about it.
http://www.pbase.com/crocdoc/image/120591168.jpg

Here's the same snake, taken the day before. My god-daughter was standing next to me when I took this shot.
http://www.pbase.com/crocdoc/image/120591197.jpg

This may be the same snake (it was on the other side of the house), taken this past December. I found out about it because my god-daughter almost stepped on it and came running into the house to tell me to get my camera.
http://www.pbase.com/crocdoc/image/140616383.jpg

[BarelyBreathing]

That's a beautiful snake.

Your god-daughter sounds like a fun kid. That would have been me, too (telling you to get the camera).

[crocdoc]

That's a beautiful snake.
They're one of my favourite snakes. I used to keep them years ago.

Your god-daughter sounds like a fun kid.
She's a riot. I love taking her out looking for wildlife whenever I can get her interested, for she has eagle eyes (as do most kids) and nothing escapes her. She loves spiders and we spent a fair bit of time over xmas mucking around with the huge wolf spiders living in holes in the lawn. Feeding them flies or teasing them out of their holes with a bit of twig.
http://www.pbase.com/crocdoc/image/140616648.jpg

She has no fear of goannas, spiders or snakes. Terrestrial leaches and ticks aren't a worry, either, but she's funny about wasps and bees so I'm working on that.

[infernalis]

Feeding flies to spiders? that sounds like fun.

My daughter is totally strange, she lives in a house full of snakes, does not even flinch if she encounters one in the wild, has a pet rat in her bedroom, but still screams when she sees a spider.

She gets mad at me because I won't kill the spiders that live in our house, Since I refuse to use pesticides, those spiders work for me, so why would I want to kill them?.

[KORBIN5895]

Isn't feeding spiders a symptom of insanity? Have you guys ever read bram stoker's Dracula?

Oh! I love the pics red!

[crocdoc]

My daughter is totally strange, she lives in a house full of snakes, does not even flinch if she encounters one in the wild, has a pet rat in her bedroom, but still screams when she sees a spider.

That's not all that unusual. I've met a lot of hard core reptile keepers and field herpers that are terrified of spiders, too. However, if there's one animal that almost universally gives people the heebee jeebees (and which is often encountered by field herpers while looking for reptiles), it's this one:
http://www.pbase.com/crocdoc/image/140356183.jpg

Coincidentally, my god-daughter has pet rats as well. They're great pets and she's taught them a few simple tricks.

When it comes to spiders, she has no qualms about them crawling on her and will sometimes pick them up, so she's had to be taught which ones she's allowed to touch and which ones are 'look only'. There was a big female redback (Australia's black widow) in her back yard for a fair while when she was around four years old and she was fascinated with it and the egg sac it produced. She made sure it was always well fed after I told her what an effort it was for females to produce eggs. During the party for her fifth birthday she wanted to show it to everyone, but as the party was outside and a couple of the mothers were sitting in chairs with their backs to the spider, I suggested she wait until after the party was finished and everyone was standing.

On one occasion, while visiting her grandparents, I found a female tree funnel-web spider and brought it back to the house to show her. I plopped the open-topped jar (they can't jump vertically) containing the spider in the palm of her hand and said "See this? This is one of the most dangerous spiders in the world". She was really fascinated and insisted on coming with me when I released it so she could see where it lived.

[BarelyBreathing]

She's awesome. She really is.

I have some strange animal fears myself. I love snakes and lizards, I love spiders, tarantulas and scorpions, I'm scared of fish. The smaller, the grosser.

[alessia55]

All of those photos are fantastic- especially that jet black snake! I'm not afraid of spiders or bees, but I'm definitely nervous around butterflies/moths/dragonflies http://www.japan-legend.com/emoticons/simple/shrugs.gif

[crocdoc]

I'm lucky in that I have no animal fears. I have even tried to grab a scolopendrid centipede with my fingers. Once. I figured that if I can grab large spiders by the cephalothorax, why couldn't I just grab a centipede behind its venomous front legs (the ones that look like jaws)? Clearly I underestimated the creepiness of it wrapping itself around my fingers, holding on with all of its legs and then giving me a good grab with the spiny hindmost legs. That gave me the heebie-jeebies, so I flicked it off with a shudder and have used forceps ever since. I'll sometimes pin one to the ground, at head and tail end, with my fingers, but no grabbing and lifting without an implement. The one in my earlier photograph I wouldn't touch for more than the half second it took to pull it back into the open before it crawled under something, for it was huge. Here it is next to my boot:
http://www.pbase.com/crocdoc/image/140356186.jpg

As I said earlier, my god-daughter's one known apprehension is wasps and bees (she hasn't seen a large centipede, yet). She's not phobic, but gets a bit nervous when there is one flying around so I've been trying to work on that. She's asked me a number of times what the pain of a sting is like and I've told her that if she ever does get stung it will hurt a lot, especially the first time, and that she'll probably want to cry, but it's not the end of the world (extremely allergic people aside). A while ago I told her that one of these days I'd get a honeybee to sting me just to prove my point and also so she can learn how to remove the sting properly, by scraping it off rather than pinching and pulling, so as not to inject more venom.

Two weeks ago we were walking along a beach and saw something moving on the sand. We bent down to look at it and it was a honeybee. Just as we started to walk away she looked at me and said "hey, it's a bee... remember?" I smiled, said "right you are" and we turned back. I picked the bee up gently by its wings and held it above my arm and then noticed that J's eyes were clenched shut. It was really cute. I told her that the experiment would only be useful if she watched, so she gave herself a short while to compose herself and then opened her eyes and said "okay, I'm ready". I lowered the bee onto my arm and it bent its abdomen forward, touching my skin. Nothing. I tried again. Still nothing. Then I realised that the bee must have just stung someone or something else earlier, which would explain why it was struggling in the sand rather than flying around - it was already on its way out.

Next time, perhaps. The funny thing is, I got the impression that my actions alone were enough to get her half way there, as she was pretty calm about the whole thing by the time I put the bee back on the sand and we walked away.

[infernalis]

My favourite bee demonstration is allowing them to land and walk on me, unprovoked of course.

People who fear bee stings will go crazy over that one, since obviously as long as you simply ignore them they won't sting and just be on their way.

[BarelyBreathing]

I don't fear bee stings... I fear the allergic reaction that comes quickly after it.

[Skumbo]

My favourite bee demonstration is allowing them to land and walk on me, unprovoked of course.

People who fear bee stings will go crazy over that one, since obviously as long as you simply ignore them they won't sting and just be on their way.

Friendly:

http://ncpedia.org/sites/default/files/honeybee.jpg

DEMONSPAWN:
http://animals.yakohl.com/pic/hornet_30122008.jpg

[crocdoc]

My favourite bee demonstration is allowing them to land and walk on me, unprovoked of course.

She's seen that several times and has had a bull ant crawl across her foot, too (their sting rivals that of wasps), so she knows that they're usually fine if not provoked. We were pulling pedals off flowers for her aunt's wedding in January and she was only a bit concerned when some of the flowers had honeybees. It's the thought of a sting itself she's worried about and which has become bigger than Ben Hur in her mind, so that makes her clench up when she sees bees or wasps flying around, rather than resting on a flower.

[BarelyBreathing]

Bees don't really make me nervous unless they're right by my face, wasps on the other hand....

[Skumbo]

Bees don't really make me nervous unless they're right by my face, wasps on the other hand....

wasps are freakin' evil

ill knife fight a bear if i have to, but wasps? I give up!

[infernalis]

wasps are freakin' evil

ill knife fight a bear if i have to, but wasps? I give up!


Nah, I ripped into a ground bee nest with an open cab backhoe once, I'll dance with a wasp anyday compared to that event.

[theapexgerman]

Bees don't bother me at all I like haveing a few around

[Skumbo]

Nah, I ripped into a ground bee nest with an open cab backhoe once, I'll dance with a wasp anyday compared to that event.

imagine if you ripped into a wasp nest! :no:

[KORBIN5895]

Nah, I ripped into a ground bee nest with an open cab backhoe once, I'll dance with a wasp anyday compared to that event.

I decided to cover up a the holes to a ground bee's nest once. I used Frisbees. I then told the annoying neighbor kid where I hid his Frisbee ........for some reason he doesn't like bees much anymore.

[millertime89]

Korbin, you're evil
CrocDoc those are some amazing pictures. Make sure you instill the fear of god in your niece though. Its the people that get comfortable with a deadly snake's typical mannerisms that will ultimately get bit. I wish you could take more pictures. I would carry my good camera with me all the time if I lived in Queensland.

[crocdoc]

Make sure you instill the fear of god in your niece though.
I presume you don't mean literally (as that's an unlikely thing to happen) :)

She understands the safe distance for that particular red-bellied blacksnake, but also knows that other snakes (both species and individuals) are different and would be more likely to give them a lot more space. It's far better for people to not be fearful of snakes and I've tried to instill in her that the best thing to do when she sees a snake is nothing. Even the most easily agitated of venomous snakes will not bite unless stimulated to do so. Consequently, the person standing calmly around almost never gets bitten, but the person jumping around in fear or the person trying to kill the snake may.

[crocdoc]

...well, today I had an awesome day.

You know, it's really really hard staying perfectly still in one spot trying to look like a bit of shrubbery, while taking photographs or video at the same time. Especially as the clicking of the camera would cause the monitor to sit up and look around (as per the first shot). This is a very gravid female heath monitor, Varanus varius, digging a nest hole into a termite mound.

http://www.pbase.com/crocdoc/image/141900097.jpg
http://www.pbase.com/crocdoc/image/141900098.jpg

I have a 16Gb flash card full of images and videos just like these (around individual 190 files for the day, so excluding a few lace monitor shots that would probably make it around 170 just of this gravid female heath monitor's activities). I think she's got another few days' work on that mound.

But of course monitors don't nest in termite mounds, do they, because someone told us so. ;)

[infernalis]

Brilliant work as always..

But of course monitors don't nest in termite mounds, do they, because someone told us so.

Darn unicorns...

[crocdoc]

I must say I've never worked this hard for a photograph before. I dressed up in browns and khakis, donned my bush hat, packed lunch and a water bottle and set myself up in some bushes, then waited. Saw all sorts of neat stuff before the heath monitor returned to the mound, including a random female lace monitor. Unfortunately I couldn't get a photograph as I didn't want to make any sudden movements and she disappeared before I brought my camera slowly up to eye level. Lots of sitting around doing nothing whenever the heath monitor turned to give me the evil eye, or decided she needed a break in the shade. After I'd eaten my lunch and texted a couple of friends to say "hey, guess what I'm doing!" I ended up spending the time reviewing videos and shots I'd already taken of her.

[infernalis]

Sounds like a rough day mate, my heart bleeds for you.:p

[KORBIN5895]

Why are all of those monitors keep following the unicorns around? Are the monitors eating the baby unicorns?

[crocdoc]

Such is the big mystery - I'm still waiting for my answer from varanusaurus!

[alessia55]

Fantastic! Camouflaging and waiting around paid off!! :D

[youngster]

Brilliant!

That's something you don't see everyday.

[BarelyBreathing]

Wow, that's just magical (and I'm only partially talking about those unicorns).

[crocdoc]

http://www.pbase.com/crocdoc/image/141913383.jpg

"The herpers I was with were amazed to hear that varanid researchers did not understand varanid reproductive behavior. Like not knowing where and when such a common lizard nested and such."

(link: Varanus.net Forums :: Captive Bred Monitor Forum :: Of topic montane Rattlesnakes last week (http://www.varanus.net/forums/read.php?2,19224,19224#msg-19224))

I'd be amazed to hear that, too, because it is so blatantly not true.

[crocdoc]

In all of the excitement about seeing the female heath monitor digging into the mound, I had forgotten to post about other monitors seen that day. I did see some other heath monitors, but as two were roadkills and the third was also on the side of the road, but scuttled off as I approached, I didn't get any photographs. That's the most I've seen in one day in that area and roadkills are a rarity, so I suspect the heath monitors were really active that day.

I did see three lace monitors, too. One was a female that walked past the mound while I was waiting quietly for the female heath monitor. I couldn't get a shot before she quietly slunk off. The other two I saw were one of my regulars, Darkface (he can be seen earlier in this thread, here: http://www.ssnakess.com/forums/varanid/90155-few-photographs-my-critters-part-1-a-11.html), and an entirely new animal.

I mentioned earlier that I lace monitors are quite variable and I recognise my familiar animals by patterns, head shape etc. Consequently, I've named an animal Son of Bluey because he bears such a strong resemblance to an older animal I've called Bluey. Well, the young animal I saw the other day looks a lot like Darkface, so I've decided to name him Son of Darkface. Not only has he got similar colouration, but his head shape is similar.

Some shots for comparison:

Darkface
http://www.pbase.com/crocdoc/image/109692312.jpg

Son of Darkface
http://www.pbase.com/crocdoc/image/141948479.jpg

Darkface
http://www.pbase.com/crocdoc/image/134096657.jpg

Son of Darkface
http://www.pbase.com/crocdoc/image/141948481.jpg

Darkface
http://www.pbase.com/crocdoc/image/134096660.jpg

Son of Darkface
http://www.pbase.com/crocdoc/image/141948478.jpg

Darkface
http://www.pbase.com/crocdoc/image/141622151.jpg

Son of Darkface
http://www.pbase.com/crocdoc/image/141948480.jpg

And on that note, I must get going as it's a sunny day and I want to see what is happening with ms heath monitor.

[infernalis]

thanks again for the brilliant pictures...

[BarelyBreathing]

Make sure you post what's going on with Ms. Heath!

[alessia55]

http://i161.photobucket.com/albums/t222/biarmampus/emoticon/wow.gif amazing as always... just love these photos... I can hardly tell all the monitors apart! Must be a great skill to have when you're around them all the time.

[crocdoc]

I can hardly tell all the monitors apart! Must be a great skill to have when you're around them all the time.
I suppose it's like pets - they're really distinctive once you get to know them. I've been able to pick offspring from my pair of lace monitors (the ones I breed at home) when I see photographs of them posted by other people online - just because they have a distinctive look about them. Head shape and colour patterns. Even some of my friends can pick them, as I've had people tell me they've seen one of my babies, now an adult, for sale online and when I've inquired with the seller it's turned out to be one of my bloodline.

Make sure you post what's going on with Ms. Heath!
Certainly will.

I took my video camera as well as my still camera today (the other day I was shooting both video and stills on my dSLR), so I haven't taken any stills of her digging, just videos (and they'll have to wait for a fair while before I'll have time to edit them).

She wasn't at the mound when I arrived and there were no signs she'd done much before I arrived - just a single set of tracks - so I hunkered down in the bushes, ate my lunch and started reading a book (I came prepared). When an hour and a half passed with still no action, I stood up to stretch and had a look around. Behind me there was a sandstone ridge I've never really looked at before, so I started scanning that and immediately saw the distinctive shape of a little monitor head, watching me. I'd been sprung!

The good thing about heath monitors is that they usually rely on being cryptic rather than running, so if you move carefully you can get pretty close for photographs. I decided to climb up to take a few shots, but when I was half way up I decided to zoom in on her head to show the 'lookout' pose she had.

http://www.pbase.com/crocdoc/image/141962376.jpg

While up there, I suddenly noticed that there was a family of Cunningham's skinks under the rock. What a coincidence, as I had just mentioned this species in another thread. I've got video of her that pans between her, an adult and a baby Cunningham's skink, but I could only get a still photograph of her and an adult.
http://www.pbase.com/crocdoc/image/141962379.jpg

Here's one of the adults, basking.
http://www.pbase.com/crocdoc/image/141962685.jpg

And here's the baby nearly on the same spot (look at the patterns in the lichen), after the adult had gone into the shade under the rock.
http://www.pbase.com/crocdoc/image/141962395.jpg

The female heath monitor is looking very gravid and when the light hit her just the right way for a few seconds I had to take this shot, as you can almost count the eggs.
http://www.pbase.com/crocdoc/image/141962383.jpg

Another sign that she's close to laying is her flaccid tail base.
http://www.pbase.com/crocdoc/image/141962402.jpg

Eventually I left her alone and then headed back down and moved all of my gear to another spot, then hid and waited. I did get some video of her digging and she's been working on a second hole, which I think will end up being better than the first as the termites are actively trying to repair it, which means she's hit the colony where it's temperature and humidity controlled.

You can see the second hole next to her tail (the one I photographed before is near her right hand).

http://www.pbase.com/crocdoc/image/141962690.jpg

[infernalis]

speechless... and usually I have lots to say.

[alessia55]

I really want to see those digging videos!!

[BarelyBreathing]

Ditto! I can't wait to see the videos!

[exwizard]

Only a few words come out of my mouth right now. "Oh mann!" "Wow!" and "Nice!"

[crocdoc]

Thanks, everyone!

Ditto! I can't wait to see the videos!
I really want to see those digging videos!!

I have good news and bad news. The good news is that it'll happen. The bad news is that it will not happen for a long while (ie a few months). Over the past couple of years I have been accumulating a huge amount of video footage (everything from wild crocodiles and alligators to captive and wild monitor behaviour) which has yet to be edited because I've been working on a big, long term project which takes up a fair bit of my time. Not to mention that when I do have spare time I'm either out in the bush capturing more photos and video (when the weather allows) or spending time with my god-daughter (who is also my biological daughter - I'm a donor father).

I'm expecting the project to be completed, or to be near enough completion to free up some time, by the end of June. That'll be the start of winter here in Sydney, which is a perfect time to edit videos. When I lived in Canada I used to be really into fly-fishing and would keep the interest going through the cold winter months by tying flies. Now I keep my reptile interest going in winter by editing videos of reptiles. Whatever works, everyone needs a hobby. :)

[crocdoc]

Horrible weather today. No sign of the female heath monitor, but the skinks were still out.
http://www.pbase.com/crocdoc/image/142026453.jpg

[crocdoc]

Yesterday was a beautiful, hot sunny day, so I thought I'd check up on Heather the heath monitor (my new, tacky name for ms heath). Not seeing her the day prior didn't come as a surprise, because the weather was horrible, but her absence yesterday suggests that things are not looking good.

The last time I saw her was on Friday, when she was looking very much due to lay, and the weekend was beautifully hot and sunny. She should have been digging like mad and laying at some stage over the past few days, but unfortunately hot, beautiful weather also means a lot of foot traffic in the area she's in. We've had a horrible summer, weather-wise, so people are taking advantage of whatever beautiful weather they can get on weekends and there are a lot of people out hiking. I suspect she got hassled by kids over the weekend and had been put off. Consequently, when I visited the mound on Monday there was only a tiny bit of evidence of any digging since Friday. That wasn't surprising.

Not seeing her yesterday, however, was very surprising and I suspect she had been hassled enough to be put off entirely, to the point of having a failed reproductive event. There's a glimmer of hope she has another termite mound nearby that she's also been working on, but considering the effort she's been putting into this mound I suspect that's not the case. I'll check again later in the week, just in case, but I strongly suspect that the show's over.

Needless to say, I was very disappointed. Not wanting to go home empty handed (or empty memory-carded), I took a few photographs of surrounding 'stuff'. The interesting thing I found, while wandering around looking for other termite mounds nearby, was how quickly the heath habitat near the mound changes to lace monitor habitat when one goes down hill. This may explain why I've seen two lace monitors walking past the mound on previous visits (unless they were specifically hoping to find a freshly laid clutch to eat, rather than just passing through).
http://www.pbase.com/crocdoc/image/142054294.jpg
http://www.pbase.com/crocdoc/image/142054291.jpg
The beautiful gum tree in the foreground of that last shot is a scribbly gum, Eucalyptus haemastoma, so-named for the tracks in its bark made by the larvae of the scribbly gum moth.
http://www.pbase.com/crocdoc/image/142054448.jpg

Now that summer is over, the golden orb-weaver spiders, Nephila edulis, start appearing everywhere in large communal webs.

Female with freshly caught prey
http://www.pbase.com/crocdoc/image/142054331.jpg
Mid-sized female and her male partner. As the female grows over the next few weeks, the difference between these two will be even greater.
http://www.pbase.com/crocdoc/image/142054333.jpg

Of course, I also went looking for lace monitors and then spent a fair bit of time getting video and photographs of one wandering around, foraging. It was Darkface.
With all of the photographs I have of him over the years, I often find I have several of him in the same or similar pose.
2009
http://www.pbase.com/crocdoc/image/116893121.jpg
2012
http://www.pbase.com/crocdoc/image/142065734.jpg
http://www.pbase.com/crocdoc/image/142054348.jpg

[alessia55]

Darkface looks thinner in the 2012 photo versus the 2009 one

[BarelyBreathing]

Well hello there, Darkface.

By the way, I love the spider pictures.

[crocdoc]

Darkface looks thinner in the 2012 photo versus the 2009 one

They all go up and down from year to year. He was really thin a few months ago and has since put on weight.