Monitor attacking blanket [Archive] - sSNAKESs : Reptile Forum

Hail3gh

01-21-12, 07:42 PM

I am new to this forum and have read through a lot of your posts... I have found that most everything you have to say I agree with I have searched through and not found anything like this... I have a year old monitor and she is awesome I handle her everyday give her baths for exercise and let her run around the house... She always since she was a baby of a few inches long laid with us on the bed... She snuggles and loves to get her head rubbed. I hand feed her and she makes sure not to bite me. I put my hand in her cage and she gets excited and runs up my arm. I speak and she comes to me.. I know this all sounds like I am making it up but its true... Now here is my dilema she is shedding now and she is a little less than a year old. She will be laying on me for a while and all of a sudden she will start rubbing her nose on the blanket and all of a sudden lunge at the blanket and bite it and will not let go... Any ideas if this is because she is cranky because she is shedding or maybe hungry I just dont think she is being mean because she does not hiss or show any type of anger as far as I can tell.

infernalis

01-21-12, 08:04 PM

Does not sound made up to me.. if she is a she, I hope she's not looking to breed??

alessia55

01-21-12, 08:11 PM

BarelyBreathing

01-21-12, 08:14 PM

First off, what type of monitor is it?

Second, can you tell me a little about your husbandry? What type of enclosure is she kept in? How large is it? What are the temperatures, and what are you measuring them with? How about humidity? How much substrate is in the enclosure, and what kind? What's her diet? Are you using supplements?

Any time a reptile is in shed, their behavior can change. If it is indeed a girl (how do you know?) she could be gravid, even if she's never been with a male. If this is the case, you are facing a very dangerous time.

infernalis

01-21-12, 08:17 PM

I can't help you because I have no experience with monitors BUT I wanted to say Welcome! :) I hope collectively people on here can help you figure out what is going on. In the meantime... I'd love to see a photo! :)

We need a photo, several actually....

The Monitor & the enclosure, preferably multiple angles.

Hail3gh

01-22-12, 10:27 PM

I have no camera at the moment but Olive lives in a 15 by 5 pen with dirt on the ground a fish bucket full of water a slate rock raised off the ground with a duel heat lamp above it one red one white the temp averages about 85 to 90 degrees I keep a heat rock under the slate just because I live in Maine and nights are cool in the winter.. I feed her a mixture of raw turkey eggs and calcium, and frozen cod or smelts and crickets as a treat every other day I dont feed her live animals other than crickets because I like her not feeling that she has to hunt for the food and she gets plenty of exercise running around the house and I have read that feeding mice is only for the enjoyment of the owner not healthy for the lizard. . Olive is about a foot and a half long and spends about an hour every day running around the house or swimming in my extra large bath tub... I dont know for a fact that she is a girl but its just my gut telling me and I always felt she was a girl and it doesnt seem to upset her when I say it lol... So I think that maybe she might be ready to breed because from what I have seen the way she bobs her head back and forth and opens her mouth is a sign that is what it is... I have had her since she was about 3 to 4 inches long and have always been able to hand feed her she is not mean in any way and makes sure when she takes the food to grab it softly, I can even hand feed her a cricket. I hope this answers everyones questions....

BarelyBreathing

01-22-12, 11:10 PM

Are you ready for a big change? I sure hope so, because no monitor can be kept this way. Your monitor will die if you don't make changes fast.

First off, your monitor needs a proper enclosure, like yesterday. She needs a basking spot with a surface temperature of 130f. Her cool spot needs to be at around 75f. She needs 18-24" of sandy soil (I use a 60/40 mixture of Eco Earth and children's washed play sand for my monitors). Her enclosure needs to be made of wood, without screen or wire.

Secondly, you need to stop feeding your monitor fast food. It's as horrible for them as it is for somebody who's had multiple heart attacks. Whole prey only. No eggs (unless they are fertilized with a chick inside), no turkey. Also, you want to stay away from cod and smelt.

If you can tell us what kind of monitor you have, we can give you a list of appropriate food sources to feed your lizard, as well as proper humidity, and enclosure dimensions.

infernalis

01-22-12, 11:38 PM

Cod and smelt is chock full of Thiaminase.. very very bad enzyme. I did a little digging, not all of the species are Thiaminase rich, it depends on locality.

From Cornell University department of Zoological Medicine

THIAMINASES
Thiaminases are enzmyes found in a few plants and the raw flesh and viscera of certain fish and shellfish. When ingested these enzymes split thiamin (Vitamin B1), an important compound in energy metabolism, and render it inactive.

http://www.chompersite.com/CriticalCare/T1.gif

Further: I have found through my own negative experiences, pre-packaged seafoods of any kind are all treated with sodium preservatives, only certified chemical free organic foods should ever be fed to any reptile.

http://www.thamnophis.co/caresheet/STPP.gif

BarelyBreathing

01-22-12, 11:43 PM

Yes, that's what I was getting at, Wayne. Thank you.

SnakeyJay

01-23-12, 04:26 AM

Welcome and Goodluck with your monitor... These guys on here know their stuff, take their suggested changes on board otherwise you may have a sick little lizard.

Hail3gh

01-23-12, 06:32 AM

Gungirl

01-23-12, 06:56 AM

What kind of monitor do you have? If you give us that information the The members that know about monitors will be able to further help you do what is right for your little girl.

KORBIN5895

01-23-12, 07:26 AM

Please take their advice seriously ( you seem to be) between barely breathing and infernalis they have PERSONAL experience with at least different breeds of monitors. Maybe more but those are the ones I
Can think of off the top of my head.

infernalis

01-23-12, 09:48 AM

Okay so I have the pen the way you said but I am not sure how to keep her basking area hotter than what it is because I bought two of the hottest bulbs I could find Maybe I measured it wrong because from what I read she is doing well shedding seems to happen constanly she eats and poops a lot. As far as food You told me what I am doing wrong but not really what I should be doing right. Please dont take this as me saying I'm upset for the advice because I'm not at all I am very thankful but from all I read I was doing good aparently I'm not so if I try to look up what to feed her I will just get the same info

The hardest part about all of this is so much of that information is deadly wrong.

I have seen so many youtube videos that make me want to cry/throw up/ go postal I cannot even count them all.

My Chomper (Savannah Monitor) is super tame, we allow him to roam in the house, we take him out in the yard, he's a member of the family.

But his enclosure is set up to be his "little piece of Africa" so after his romp arounds, we put him in there so he can be all toasty and humid.

To get higher temperatures for basking, it is critical to use lower wattage bulbs placed closer to the basking spot.

In other words, if you need to get your basking spot hotter, move it up closer to the lights, not get stronger bulbs.

Many people build a platform inside the cage that the monitor can climb up on to bask.

I however wired my lights to be adjustable, so I can move my bulbs down lower.

The ambient measurement taken here is close to the basking spot, it is 78 degrees on the "cold end" of the cage.

http://www.chompersite.com/2011pics/digital.jpg

http://www.chompersite.com/2011pics/dirt2.jpg

http://www.chompersite.com/Jan2012/logpipe.jpg

sometimes I run a humidifier in there to give the feel of rainy season..

http://www.chompersite.com/husbandry/wet.jpg

http://www.chompersite.com/Jan2012/frontslats.jpg

BarelyBreathing

01-23-12, 11:58 AM

A "pen" isn't going to cut it. You need an enclosure with a solid top which holds heat and humidity. Don't use high wattage bulbs, they will burn your animal. Use three 60watt flood lights in a row, and raise the basking spot so that it's at the appropriate temperature. Measure your basking spot temperature with an infra red temperature gun (such as from tempgun.com). Also, heat rocks are known to cause burns, so throw that in the garbage.

What kind of monitor do you have? We can NOT tell you how to feed your monitor correctly, or set up the appropriate humidity, unless we know what type of monitor you have. Savannah monitors are highly specialized predators who mainly prey upon invertibrates. Tree monitors feed on a lot of smaller lizards and bugs. Water monitors eat anything they can get their mouths on. Do you catch my drift? We need to know what kind of monitor you have.

infernalis

01-23-12, 01:52 PM

Pictures of the animal and pictures of the setup will help us help you. ;)

Hail3gh

01-23-12, 04:08 PM

My lizard is a savanah monitor. I moved the light closer to her basking spot and now it has warmed up a lot more it is staying between 110 and a 115 My issue was the light not being close enough oh and it is a 100 watt uv av I think its called the one that is specifically for these types of lizards . Her pen does have a cover It looks a lot like the one you have just shorter and maybe a bit wider. If this temp is not enough then I will pick up another light.

BarelyBreathing

01-23-12, 04:21 PM

Okay, that helps.

110-115 is still way too low. You need 130. Do this by using three 60watt flood lights in a row.

Humidity for savannah monitors should be near 60% ambient. This means it will be a bit drier under the basking spot, and a bit more humid on the cool end.

Diet for a savannah monitor should be roaches (you'd do best to start your own colony), crickets, emperor scorpion, fertilized quail egg with the chick inside, silver sides, freshwater crab, head on shrimp, crayfish, and worms.

alessia55

01-23-12, 04:30 PM

Hail3gh I hope you really take the advice you're given on here seriously. We just want to help you to help your sav. We want you to have a happy, healthy sav :yes: That being said, we'd still love to see photos when you get the chance.

jaleely

01-23-12, 04:41 PM

hey! Wecome! these guys have great advice. Don't think they're being fussy, they just really care about animals and want to make sure yours is doing the best it can, and you seem to be doing an awesome job of trying to make that happen! After all, you did come on here and ask...so you're already a great parent! hehe
I think maybe once your little thing has a high temp and humidity level, it may keep her from changing her personality too much if she thinks it's like, mating seasons or something.
It's always a learning process with these critters, but i know monitors can be very rewarding.
Just remember that we take them from the wild areas, and stick them in a box...so the best we can make that box turn out to be just like the conditions in the wild, the better off they will be! I think you're doing great!
Make sure there's a tight fitting lid for that humidity, and you said you moved the basking spot to the lights, great!
Get some more bugs in her, and she should be fine!
Happy herping!

Hail3gh

01-24-12, 12:49 PM

Good news I bought a new therometer and all along it was not reading right I have the temp where it should be and always have. I did not think my temp was to low because she is active for the most part and the difference in behavior has only been for the last few days. It made no sense to me that all of a sudden after a year of having her the temp was causing this kind of affect. Nothing had changed but her behavior for a few days... I think that I can boil this down to her shedding is making her grumpy... I am glad that I got to meet all of you and am very thankful for all the advice.. I will certainly change her eating habbits though the cod thing makes a lot of sense I just figured fish is fish and never thought about how fish is not really just fish.. I will give her shrimp as a treat instead.

infernalis

01-24-12, 12:57 PM

Just make sure you don't buy frozen shrimp at the grocery store. ;) that stuff has a ton of preservatives sprayed on it.

If you can find it, nice fresh whole shrimp is best.

And Night Crawlers, oh they love night crawlers, commonly sold as fishing bait.

theapexgerman

01-24-12, 01:03 PM

hey Wayne how much do you spend a month of food for chomper? i always wanted a nile monitor but i will never get a monitor

infernalis

01-24-12, 01:11 PM

Sometimes a lot, sometimes not much. I never really added it up or paid attention.

I know the organic shrimp is $10 a pound, his rainbow trout is $12 a pound, Night crawlers are about $3 a dozen, I breed the roaches, so they only cost me a banana a week, I get slugs, crayfish and snails out of my back yard for free, and all the beetles, grubs, grasshoppers and what not he sweeps up out in the back 40 are free.

theapexgerman

01-24-12, 01:21 PM

damm he get's treated good

crocdoc

01-24-12, 03:59 PM

Hail3gh, the issue isn't just the temperature, but humidity as well. Monitors kept in open pens indoors tend not to do well long term because houses are heated/air conditioned to suit human comfort levels rather than tropical monitors. After years on the forums a common pattern that emerges with monitors that are allowed to free roam is that they live relatively short lives. They look really healthy and appear to do well, but after a few years (anywhere from 1-6) they die of assorted complications. Long term, low-level dehydration takes its toll, so the animals may have gout or assorted other issues that aren't easily picked up.

As for the blanket, my guess is that it had a smell on it that made the monitor curious as to whether or not it was edible. Some things just trigger that. Monitors don't get grumpy when they shed (if they did, they'd be grumpy all of the time as they are almost constantly shedding).

BarelyBreathing

01-24-12, 04:14 PM

Crocdoc, I have a blue tail who has serious mood swings when he's in shed. Other than him, I haven't noticed huge behavioral differences in my other twelve.

theapexgerman

01-24-12, 04:18 PM

Crocdoc, I have a blue tail who has serious mood swings when he's in shed. Other than him, I haven't noticed huge behavioral differences in my other twelve.
you blue tail wouldn't happen to be a femal would it? female's tend to have mood swings XD

BarelyBreathing

01-24-12, 04:23 PM

That one in particular is a male. I do have a pair, though.

theapexgerman

01-24-12, 04:29 PM

aww it had to be a male ruin my joke

BarelyBreathing

01-24-12, 04:49 PM

I'm sure Max is sticking his tongue out at you right now.

infernalis

01-24-12, 04:51 PM

Hail3gh, the issue isn't just the temperature, but humidity as well. Monitors kept in open pens indoors tend not to do well long term because houses are heated/air conditioned to suit human comfort levels rather than tropical monitors. After years on the forums a common pattern that emerges with monitors that are allowed to free roam is that they live relatively short lives. They look really healthy and appear to do well, but after a few years (anywhere from 1-6) they die of assorted complications. Long term, low-level dehydration takes its toll, so the animals may have gout or assorted other issues that aren't easily picked up..

Please take this advice to heart, for it is the most important piece of information given here.

crocdoc

01-24-12, 05:00 PM

Crocdoc, I have a blue tail who has serious mood swings when he's in shed. Other than him, I haven't noticed huge behavioral differences in my other twelve.
Define a mood swing.

How can you determine when he's in shed, vs not in shed, anyway? All of the monitors I've owned are in almost constant shed. If they're young then they start shedding as soon as the previous shed has come off and the older ones almost always have some piece of loose skin somewhere that's about to come off. If they were moody when 'in shed', they'd be moody all of the time.

That aside, I've never seen a monitor attack an inanimate object like a blanket because it was having a mood swing.

BarelyBreathing

01-24-12, 05:04 PM

First off, he's no longer a baby, he's not in that awkward "constantly in shed" phase. He only gets moody when his shed is coming up around his face. He starts hissing when he's startled (something he doesn't normally do) and he will sometimes charge the glass at me (also something he doesn't normally do). I assume it's because these pieces of skin are somehow irritating him by either itching or being in his field of view.

theapexgerman

01-24-12, 05:05 PM

i would love to see him hiss at you make a video sometime when he hisses at you

BarelyBreathing

01-24-12, 05:20 PM

I think I have a video on my other computer. Now if it will only get repaired and get sent back. :(

crocdoc

01-24-12, 05:22 PM

Now we're getting somewhere. A monitor becoming annoyed when it's already irritated by loose skin around its face makes sense. A monitor becoming moody because it's 'in shed' doesn't.

theapexgerman

01-24-12, 05:22 PM

aww damm oh well

BarelyBreathing

01-24-12, 05:34 PM

Lol. You explain things much better than I do, crocdoc.

Hail3gh

01-25-12, 04:18 PM

So what your saying after all this confussion is You think she is just in a bad mood cause she has a lot of loose skin because of a shed. She attacked the blanket again last night she started shaking her head so I backed away to see what her plan was. She was not irritated by anyone because we were not touching her... She bit onto the blanket and started shaking it back and forth like it was food and wanted to kill it... I am confused now trying to figure out if she is hungry or just plain in a bad mood... Do You think that maybe the smell of my bed is making her think of food maybe the laundry detergent or something?