Question about a 'stunted' Burm

[Norm66]

A friend of mine has a 9 year old albino Burm named Malikai. He was kept in what Shannon called 'deplorable, unbelievable conditions' until she rescued him this past May or June. You could count ribs and had a ton of stuck shed and eye caps on him. I'm not sure of the exact details, but obviously he wasn't fed anything like properly and was probably not housed well either. Thankfully he doesn't have a bunch of scars from live rats or anything. I haven't measured him but I don't think he's much over six or seven feet long.

For all he's been through he's remarkably docile. Puppy dog tame as Brian Barczyk would say. He's nearly doubled in girth since Shannon brought him home. He eats pretty large rats like a champ and sheds normally now.

Here's a pic of my wife, Becky, holding him Friday. This is only the 2nd big snake she's ever held (Shannon's other Burm, 2 year-old Merlin was the 1st) and I am quite proud of her.

https://lh6.googleusercontent.com/-AgM3kKt0d34/TuVXz4cV7-I/AAAAAAAAAv8/BPBjAbrPBDk/s512/012%252520%2525282%252529.JPG

My question is about the 'stunting'. With him being 9 already and not very large by Burm standards, how much bigger will he likely get? Will an abused snake exposed to better conditions down the line ever fully recover?

Just curious, my wife asked me, I didn't know the answer so I thought I'd ask the experts.

[Jay]

That's horrible, why do people buy stuff they cant handle, kudos to your friend.

For future reference keep lg constrictors of neck. All wee need is a death deliverd from a snake to it's keeper.

[red ink]

Yes it will get bigger if given sustained proper care.... how much bigger is anybody's guess?

[Norm66]

Jay, thanks for the concern, but you'll have to take my word for it that my wife was in no danger. First, his tail had just come up off the chair and I took just a second to snap a pic and also there were 4 of us in the room at the time. I would never in a million years put my wife in danger. Also, Shannon has a hard & fast two-person rule for her Sav, both Burms and the boa constrictor.

Red Ink, pretty much what I thought. No telling really I suppose.

[Jay]

That is great to hear.

[alessia55]

Poor baby! I'm glad she's in better hands now. I'm sure she'll fatten up and grow. She still has many years in her, so who knows how much catching up she'll do. :)

[millertime89]

I honestly don't know. I've never read any accounts of something similar, usually its a 2 or 3 year old snake that was severely underfed and they usually catch up eventually, I'm not sure how a 9 year old burm will fare.

[Norm66]

Thanks for the input. I appreciate it.

I spent an hour or so researching the subject and came up with basically the same thing as in this thread. I wonder if maybe he's a small-ish Burm to begin with on top of being stunted. But obviously only time will tell.

[shaunyboy]

if you take away the bit where it says he's 9 years old and just look at him,he looks healthy and in proportion for a young burm

how sure are you that he's 9 year old mate ?

even taking into account his previous bad conditions he's tiny !

any slow starters feeding wise i've had,usually caught up size wise around 3 to 4 years old

if he truely is 9 years old he is incedibley small.

it will be interesting to see how this guy grows over the next year or two,now he's in good care

please keep us updated with his progress mate

cheers shaun

[Jacob1750]

I had a berm from the time I was little until about a year ago. He was kept in the best conditions and fed large rats. When he was seven I noticed he was still a bit small. I started letting explore out in the yard more often(supervised of course) and it was like he hit a huge growth spert! My suggestion is to continue giving him the proper care and let him get some exercise and he'll get massive. My berm got to be huge before he passed from old age a year ago. Good luck with your berm bro!

[Norm66]

Shaun, I only know what I was told which was what Shannon was told. I guess it's possible she was lied to, but I know that she had been aware of this snake for a while and had been trying to get him. The previous owners were convinced they were going to be able to sell him to a zoo or something.:crazy: Too bad there's really no way to tell.

Jacob, thanks for the input. It makes sense that a little exercise would help. I always get him out when I go over there, he's one of my favorites and other than during feeding times he's a real lover. BTW- it's good to see another WV person on here. :)

I'll keep this thread updated and see if I can get some pics of when he first came into Shannon's care for compare and contrast.

[shaunyboy]

i'm hoping in this case your friend HAS been lied to and its a healthy young burm with a LOT of growing to do

i'm no burm expert but it looks healthy and in proper proportion

maybe kimberly (willow) will be along soon as she knows her burms

cheers shaun

[stephanbakir]

I've NEVER had a "stunted" animal not bounce back to weight and size strikingly fast.

[Jenn_06]

stunted snake like that will grow but not to there normal size, and if i was you take it to the vet and get everything checked out. you never know if it might have kidney damage or other things wrong with it.

[Norm66]

I've got it confirmed tat he is in fact 9 years old. Shannon knows the girl's mom who had him.

[Corey Woods]

The burm won't get much bigger. Most of their growth is in the first 3-5 years. If he's 9years old he'll get a little longer and probably double in girth but that'll be about it.

Corey

[Norm66]

The burm won't get much bigger. Most of their growth is in the first 3-5 years. If he's 9years old he'll get a little longer and probably double in girth but that'll be about it.

Corey

That's interesting Cory. Thanks for the input. It also makes sense and is in line with what Shannon thinks.

[Caylan]

I read an article by Bob Clark who had a similar situation. That burm conintued to grow to 11 feet from what I believe I remember it saying 4 feet(it was being fed one adult mouse a month for years) I wish I could remember the age, or where the article was, because it really helped me never worry about stunting(i've been worried with one of my snakes, he missed an entire year of food at age 2) but I can say now at age 4 he's right on track, and still grows faster then anyone else. Your snake may not reach the size it had the pontential too, but I have a good feeling it could still hit 10 feet in a few years, which is perfect for a male burm I think! Best of luck, ~Caylan.s.~

[Swany]

Small or not Norm. Hes a beauty ;-)

[Caylan]

Bob Clark - Articles (http://www.bobclark.com/articles/1998an.html) seek and I shall find, hehehe!

[Norm66]

Thanks for the link Caylan. It would be great if he could get to 10'. But honestly I'd have to see it to believe it. Especially since we'll never power-feed him the way Bob Clark mentions doing in that article (paraphrased: all the animal will eat twice a week).

As my wife mentioned on here somewhere we're going to adopt Malaki in the next month or two as soon as we can arrange proper caging for him.

[shaunyboy]

Thanks for the link Caylan. It would be great if he could get to 10'. But honestly I'd have to see it to believe it. Especially since we'll never power-feed him the way Bob Clark mentions doing in that article (paraphrased: all the animal will eat twice a week).

As my wife mentioned on here somewhere we're going to adopt Malaki in the next month or two as soon as we can arrange proper caging for him.


imo bob see's his snakes as stock,nothing more than a comodity to be bought and sold

imo he's bad for selling/transporting snakes right out the egg,before they've even absorbed their yolk sacks.i've heard a few horror storys of bob's exports to the uk

don't get me wrong he always replaces dead or unhealthy snakes.i'm just not keen on some of his methods

i'm not a fan of bob clark mate;)

cheers shaun

[KORBIN5895]

I didn't get good vibes from that article he wrote either........

[Norm66]

I didn't get good vibes from that article he wrote either........

Yea, a very puppy-mill feeling to it.

Thanks for the input Korbin & Shaun.

He's smaller at 9 than most 3 year old boas I've seen. If he grows up great, if not that's great too. Of our friend's entire collection he's the one who pokes his head up every time we (and I presume anyone) walk into the room. He's super friendly and calm and a good eater to boot. We'll give him a great home where he'll be the centerpiece as he deserves.

[Lankyrob]

At the end of the day as long as you guys love him and give him the husbandry he deserves then whether he grows or not is irrelevant.

[KORBIN5895]

Yes and no Rob. Truly that is all that really matters but what if it could reach 18 feet? Are they able and willing to provide for it? I believe that is why he is concerned and wants to know.

@Norm
On a side note the towel trick has worked well on my ferret!

[Norm66]

At the end of the day as long as you guys love him and give him the husbandry he deserves then whether he grows or not is irrelevant.

yes Rob, exactly. Korbin, at this point the damage (short term or long-term) has been done. All we want is to treat him as he deserves.

And yay for the towel trick! I thought maybe with just the one it would work. Especially since he'd been litter trained before. They go native pretty quickly but they're smart enough to remember their earlier training. :)

[millertime89]

Bob's reputation in the United States has been all but destroyed. Very few American retic owners buy from him anymore, the majority of his sales go to people looking to start, and European buyers who haven't heard some of the Bob Clark horror stories.
I can't wait for more dwarf burms to start popping up so I don't have to consider buying from him.