Why waste money on heat lamps?

[Dehlida]

Ball Pythons don't need them, why are you wasting money on them? Why waste money on a screen top that allows humidity to escape when you can use a piece of wood and a brick?

Boggles my mind folks.

[candyraver69]

Some people have the opinion radiant heat is better than underneath or on the side. I personally think from the side is just fine, my snakes seem healthy.

[stephanbakir]

Belly heat is best for most snakes, ambient is still important though.
Screen tops are also just asking for nose rub.

I personally like uth's for most terrariums and RHP/UTH combos for larger ones.

[Gungirl]

I go with flexwatt and a RHP for my ball.. he is in a 4' x 2' x 18" viv and his heat and humidity have been spot on for a few months. I am scared of fires and other issues heat lamps can cause...

[TeaNinja]

Ball Pythons don't need them, why are you wasting money on them? Why waste money on a screen top that allows humidity to escape when you can use a piece of wood and a brick?

Boggles my mind folks.

why make annoying posts?
boggles my mind broseph.

[Dehlida]

why make annoying posts?
boggles my mind broseph.
How is this an annoying post, it's 100% legitimate- heat lamps are 100% waste for ball pythons unless you live in like, antartica and your house isn't heated.

Stop trying to be a troll, you're failing, and you know NOTHING about reptile husbandry as demonstrated by your posts.

[Jay]

Round 1 *Ding, ding*

@Delila I use lights for my night and day cycle, I just have 40w smoked bulbs. As for the screen lid they are ok when modified.

[TeaNinja]

How is this an annoying post, it's 100% legitimate- heat lamps are 100% waste for ball pythons unless you live in like, antartica and your house isn't heated.

Stop trying to be a troll, you're failing, and you know NOTHING about reptile husbandry as demonstrated by your posts.

i like how you keep personally attacking me and my "apparent lack of husbandry knowledge"

let me go ahead and elaborate. what was the point of your post? to tell people that heat bulbs are inferior and not to be used? i for one think you're wrong and the point you're making only has half validity. i have a screen top with a CHE and everything is perfectly fine. to each his own is something you don't seem to understand.for you it either seems to be your way, or they're an idiot.

also i think its funny that you call me a troll just because i have issues with the things you say. i certainly have the right to debate your point if i think it's stupid or invalid. show a PINCH of respect by at least knowing the facts before you pointlessly slander people.

[kreaturekeeper]

Well I guess I live In antartica haha? My ambient temp is NO were near correct without my low wattage heat lamp. My girl has a belly heat under one hide but it does not keep the rest of the tank at correct temps. Not waste of money for me. Keeps my girl from freezing :S brrr

[Dehlida]

i like how you keep personally attacking me and my "apparent lack of husbandry knowledge"

let me go ahead and elaborate. what was the point of your post? to tell people that heat bulbs are inferior and not to be used? i for one think you're wrong and the point you're making only has half validity. i have a screen top with a CHE and everything is perfectly fine. to each his own is something you don't seem to understand.for you it either seems to be your way, or they're an idiot.

also i think its funny that you call me a troll just because i have issues with the things you say. i certainly have the right to debate your point if i think it's stupid or invalid. show a PINCH of respect by at least knowing the facts before you pointlessly slander people.
I've been keeping and breeding snakes for 15 years. Seal the top of the enclosure, and put a working under tank heater. All the heat will be trapped inside. You get nice ambient air temps, your humidity stays inside the cage, and you still get the amazing benefit of the UTH aiding digestion.

Yeah, let's get a bulb and a screen top and dry out our cage forcing us to mist all the time while throwing light at nocturnal/underground dwelling snakes. I'll enjoy never having to do a bit of work with my animals because it's self maintaining :)

[youngster]

Guys let's not start again. Many people have different opinions and there isn't just one right answer always. Just step back, take a deep breath and respect each others opinions.

[Dehlida]

Guys let's not start again. Many people have different opinions and there isn't just one right answer always. Just step back, take a deep breath and respect each others opinions.
I stated something, it wasn't trolling, and it wasn't a worthless post.

This tea guy follows me around like a lost defeated puppy looking for a fight at every turn, it's pretty funny.

However, seeing as though it's an "opinion" how come nearly every big snake breeder will agree that UTH are better than lamps? :)

[brylecc1989]

My two cents. Dehlida, no question you are EXTREMELY knowledgable, and have VAST experience. No one can take that from you and your points are often correct husbandry wise. That being said, you're also a jerk sometimes. Let me ask you somethin. When you first started in the hobby, "15 years ago", did you know everything already? I'm just asking because you really seem to expect everyone here to! The way you say things, whether the facts are correct or not, are condescending, judgemental, self-ritcheous, and often plain mean. Me, having a tough skin, can easily ignore these things and enjoy the forum usually. However, it is a trend that 99% of posts you participate in result in arguing or people needing to defend their husbandry and responsibility as owners. It's getting agitating. Again, I really respect you as a source of knowledge, and as a keeper of animals. However, in my opinion you have a lot to learn in regards of how to treat people/say things. I don't mean this in an aggressive or attacking manner, and i apologize if you are offended. I only wrote this because i hope maybe you'll consider some of the things i addressed, because i know for certain that every single person on this forum can learn loads from you, but a lot of us won't because of how you present your information.

Bryan

[youngster]

I stated something, it wasn't trolling, and it wasn't a worthless post.

This tea guy follows me around like a lost defeated puppy looking for a fight at every turn, it's pretty funny.

However, seeing as though it's an "opinion" how come nearly every big snake breeder will agree that UTH are better than lamps? :)

I never said you were trolling or anything, and in fact I very much agree that uth is better in most cases. But if Tea's snake is healthy with the conditions he's in there's no need for this. I come here for learning about snakes not for a soap opera ;)

[NennaMeerkat]

I come here for learning about snakes not for a soap opera

Best thing ever said. You should use it in your signature.

Anyways to keep humidity up, and for those that do live in colder places than say where a Ball normally lives, it might be better for a Heat Lamp to be used...even a low watt one. I myself find it useful to use a low watt heat lamp during the winter for my hognose and my 2 leopard geckos because I prefer a cooler house in the winter. The temps in my home can get well below what would be good for the reptiles I keep and to be honest I think ambient heat is much better during those times than just relying on local heat an UTH gives. During the Summer months it gets durn hot here in Texas...so I normally don't even have to use a UTH. Temps in the house are usually pretty hot, around 80+ degrees during the day during Summer months.

As for the screen top...plenty of owners own the aquarium before they own the snake. Easier to put some plastic wrap or other heat/humidity keeping technique with the screen top rather than buying an entirely new enclosure or new top. Not all of us keep our snakes in plastic tubs (which I myself don't like the idea of for the "casual" snake owner).

[youngster]

I come here for learning about snakes not for a soap opera

Best thing ever said. You should use it in your signature.


You know what? I think I will :D

[NennaMeerkat]

Awesome Youngster...just awesome :)

[stephanbakir]

You guys need to stop focusing on the negative feelings you have for whatever reason, and take what you consider BS and ignore it. Keep the good and forget about the bad.

[Dehlida]

^ exactly. If you hate me or my posts that much, ignore them. I'll continue to post them. I've gotten a bunch of people who come to me looking to buy snakes, and talk about how they just spent xxx on a heat lamp, which I tell them to promptly return to the store.

I keep my snakes in a cool 73 degree house, and in an outside shed, which sometimes hits as low as 65. Even then, I still have no need for a heat lamp. In the winter, my house can cool to 60, snake cages? Still stay plenty warm, don't forget snakes undergo natural cooling in their environments as well, they don't have to stay at perfect temps year round to be healthy.

[KD35WIN.AS.ONE]

However, seeing as though it's an "opinion" how come nearly every big snake breeder will agree that UTH are better than lamps? :)


Its more cost efficient, and rigged easier for a large amount of snakes. That doesn't make it more efficient for heating. A lot of snake keepers in general believe that a uth should not be the main source of heat. Heat lamps also present a night and day scheduled. Alot of people use lamps for ball pythons.. i use them for all the snakes i currently thermoregulate.

[NennaMeerkat]

I keep my snakes in a cool 73 degree house, and in an outside shed, which sometimes hits as low as 65. Even then, I still have no need for a heat lamp. In the winter, my house can cool to 60, snake cages? Still stay plenty warm, don't forget snakes undergo natural cooling in their environments as well, they don't have to stay at perfect temps year round to be healthy.

My house can get down to 60 degrees but parts of my house are cooler at times, especially at night. People often think Texas doesn't get that cold...but you would be surprised! And to save energy I often don't turn on the heat until well after sunset. Thus my home can get down to uncomfy levels even for people in the coldest months. We bundle up 2 layers most of the time to keep warm. You won't sway me from using my lamps for my reptiles during the winter, I would much rather spend the money for the lamps and bulbs than risk something happening to them due to being to cold.

Aren't balls a tropical snake? And if not please tell me where they are from. If they are what is the temperature during the colder months for where they are from?

I also gotta ask what you keep your snakes in? Just cause I am curious.

[youngster]

Aren't balls a tropical snake? And if not please tell me where they are from.

They're from North-West Africa. Around where Togo and Ghana are.

[Valvaren]

Ignored all the drama and hopefully nothing important. Personally I have Brood in a tub from walmart with a UTH I thought about moving him to a tank but I decided against it, he has done perfectly fine where and how he is besides the pooping in his shed haha. Before anyone question ,he has hides on both sides cool and warm, temps and humidity are fine had a issue when I first got him with the humidity but it was easily fixed, and a water dish, the only thing that is different then a tank is the tub isn't glass.

[Dehlida]

My house can get down to 60 degrees but parts of my house are cooler at times, especially at night. People often think Texas doesn't get that cold...but you would be surprised! And to save energy I often don't turn on the heat until well after sunset. Thus my home can get down to uncomfy levels even for people in the coldest months. We bundle up 2 layers most of the time to keep warm. You won't sway me from using my lamps for my reptiles during the winter, I would much rather spend the money for the lamps and bulbs than risk something happening to them due to being to cold.

Aren't balls a tropical snake? And if not please tell me where they are from. If they are what is the temperature during the colder months for where they are from?

I also gotta ask what you keep your snakes in? Just cause I am curious.
I would have to look up exact weather patterns, although you'd be surpised what a savannah/grassland snake can tolerate.

That being said, I use a mixture of showcase caging and rack systems. I also have a few snakes kept in simple large bins outside of racks.

[NennaMeerkat]

As a breeder or a person that just has 10+ snakes I understand the need for your opinion on heat lamps. If I had the amounts that breeders and really BIG fans of snakes had then I would be looking for different housing as well different heating options. However since at most I will only have 4 different types of reptiles, and I enjoy showing them in their tanks, I find it no problem to have heat lamps.

And as I have said before it is cheaper/easier to just cover up a good portion of the screen top with something as simple as plastic wrap than go out and buy a complete new top or new container. The reptile tank I have has a locking lid just for escape artist reptiles. It would be near impossible for me to find a different top for it. And it is the exact tank I plan to house a Ball in one day. So I will be using plastic wrap for the top when the time comes as well as a low watt heat lamp to help keep humidity up. Texas isn't only hot but VERY VERY dry.

[TeaNinja]

just because you're one of the few i feel the need to argue with doesn't mean i follow you around. in fact, i check every unread post and comment wherever i feel like.

i just merely felt like the only point of this post was to demean the people who use heat bulbs for ball pythons and tell them they are wrong when it is clearly a preferance. if you want to tell someone UTH's are better, let them know when they are asking for the info, or maybe make a post like your others with some information explaining why you feel it's bad, then i wouldn't feel like you're just saying "UTH's are better, you're stupid for doing it your way even though it works perfectly fine"

I've been keeping and breeding snakes for 15 years. Seal the top of the enclosure, and put a working under tank heater. All the heat will be trapped inside. You get nice ambient air temps, your humidity stays inside the cage, and you still get the amazing benefit of the UTH aiding digestion.



Yeah, let's get a bulb and a screen top and dry out our cage forcing us to mist all the time while throwing light at nocturnal/underground dwelling snakes. I'll enjoy never having to do a bit of work with my animals because it's self maintaining


also funny, i just went back and read your post. amongst your belittling of me you mentioned how i give my ball python light with the bulb. you'd think someone who's worked with reptiles and bred snakes for 15 years would know CHE's don't emit light.

[Rog]

I have a ball in a beautiful glass tank with a screen lid. I blocked off half the top and my humidity is perfection. I do need to use a lamp in the winter, as the glass holds no heat. The best thing is to check your temps before every feeding. It is a great habit. I do recommend opaque bind over glass, as my breeders are much more active. Oh and to keep the soapopera going, John fell into a coma and awoke having been given gender mod surgery.

[Lankyrob]

I use CHE's for all my snakes. It is my opinion that the replicate conditions in the wild better than a UTH in that the heat comes from above as if from the sun, it heats the ground/substrate under the lamp to provide a spot that the animal can bask should they wish to and also provide a good ambient temperature to the whole vivarium.

I use melamine enclosures that are totally sealed to moisture and have no problems with humidity for any of the species i keep.

[Will0W783]

I have enough snakes that it works better for me to heat my entire snake room and supplement with CHEs and flexwatt in cages where more heat is required. I arrange my heaters so that all my cages have a front to back heat gradient, and I've had this setup for about a year now. I have yet to have any problems with a snake in that room. They all shed perfectly, eat perfectly and no respiratory issues. I use melamine and ABS plastic cages that hold humidity well. I found it harder to keep things organized when I used lamps on every cage, but a few years back when I only had 10 snakes, the lamps and CHEs were way more efficient. I personally am not a fan of only having belly heat on snakes, as it has been shown to occasionally lead to constipation and digestive issues. Plus, if your thermostat breaks your snake can burn itself on the belly heat. However, a lot of people have success with just using belly heat.
I think that each person needs to find what method works best for them and their snakes. Personally, I don't see the point of this thread, other than to rile people up and create animosity.
Why waste money on heat lamps, you say? Well, I say, Why waste time and energy on this thread??

[Uncle_Rev]

I waste money on heating lamps to go with my UTH because it is what I have access to now. I had never planned on keeping snakes when these little guys were introduced to my home, however they are maintained very well. In large part due to this website.

We will see what Orlando Repticon brings and what manner of enclosure I snatch up there.

[Onyx Cross]

:/
Wow, lots of [pointless] drama here. To each their own. Not going to chime in here too much just going to point some things out.
You should have expected replies like this considering that you did ask a question, albeit seemingly rhetorical. But now you've gotten your answers. Accept such answers and don't badger people for their opinion.

I use a heat lamp and over 70% of my cage is covered from the light anyway. My snake doesn't have any health issues, and I doubt she minds the light because she doesn't try to hide from it. I'm switching over to CHE as soon as I'm a little more well off financially. For now, I use what I have to make sure that the snake stays warm. Her tank never falls below 80 degrees and it's usually 80-85, reaching up to about 90 degrees on a very hot day.

[TeaNinja]

I have enough snakes that it works better for me to heat my entire snake room and supplement with CHEs and flexwatt in cages where more heat is required. I arrange my heaters so that all my cages have a front to back heat gradient, and I've had this setup for about a year now. I have yet to have any problems with a snake in that room. They all shed perfectly, eat perfectly and no respiratory issues. I use melamine and ABS plastic cages that hold humidity well. I found it harder to keep things organized when I used lamps on every cage, but a few years back when I only had 10 snakes, the lamps and CHEs were way more efficient. I personally am not a fan of only having belly heat on snakes, as it has been shown to occasionally lead to constipation and digestive issues. Plus, if your thermostat breaks your snake can burn itself on the belly heat. However, a lot of people have success with just using belly heat.

I think that each person needs to find what method works best for them and their snakes. Personally, I don't see the point of this thread, other than to rile people up and create animosity.

Why waste money on heat lamps, you say? Well, I say, Why waste time and energy on this thread??

thank you kim, my point exactly.

[ladyjustice33]

My house can get down to 60 degrees but parts of my house are cooler at times, especially at night. People often think Texas doesn't get that cold...but you would be surprised! And to save energy I often don't turn on the heat until well after sunset. Thus my home can get down to uncomfy levels even for people in the coldest months. We bundle up 2 layers most of the time to keep warm. You won't sway me from using my lamps for my reptiles during the winter, I would much rather spend the money for the lamps and bulbs than risk something happening to them due to being to cold.


I'd never noticed you were in Fort Worth. I'm about 5 hours southeast of you, right outside of Beaumont. Your right about Texas, we've had snow what the last two years I believe?? I don't use any heat right now, my enclosures stay between 80 and 82 degress during the day and about 75 to 78 at night, perfect for my CRBs and also works for my corn. I plan on going with pro-products radiant heat panels in October when I get their permanent enclosures. Going to look at some of the vendors at the Houston Repticon in October. Acadian and Cen-tex and a few other's will be there. Gonna take a look at their enclosures. You going to the repticon in Houston?

[ladyjustice33]

Guys let's not start again. Many people have different opinions and there isn't just one right answer always. Just step back, take a deep breath and respect each others opinions.

You sure you're only 13 youngster, lol ???? You seem lot more mature than some of the "adults" on here!!

[youngster]

You sure you're only 13 youngster, lol ???? You seem lot more mature than some of the "adults" on here!!

Haha, yeah I'm 13 :P Born 1998! I'm probably more mature on here than in real life I don't know why. I'm a pretty crazy person!

[NennaMeerkat]

I'd never noticed you were in Fort Worth. I'm about 5 hours southeast of you, right outside of Beaumont. Your right about Texas, we've had snow what the last two years I believe?? I don't use any heat right now, my enclosures stay between 80 and 82 degress during the day and about 75 to 78 at night, perfect for my CRBs and also works for my corn. I plan on going with pro-products radiant heat panels in October when I get their permanent enclosures. Going to look at some of the vendors at the Houston Repticon in October. Acadian and Cen-tex and a few other's will be there. Gonna take a look at their enclosures. You going to the repticon in Houston?


Nah lady I am going to the big show in Arlington in February. Depending on if any of my tanks clear up by then depends on if I get anymore reptiles. I also often attend the smaller expos in Arlington at the Moose Lodge. Plan on going there next month for more frozen food for my hoggie and possibly a 3rd leopard gecko :) Maybe you should look into it! Would be nice to meet a fellow forum member.

[ladyjustice33]

Nah lady I am going to the big show in Arlington in February. Depending on if any of my tanks clear up by then depends on if I get anymore reptiles. I also often attend the smaller expos in Arlington at the Moose Lodge. Plan on going there next month for more frozen food for my hoggie and possibly a 3rd leopard gecko :) Maybe you should look into it! Would be nice to meet a fellow forum member.

I'm going to check into it for sure. We love road trips and reptile expos, lol !!

[NennaMeerkat]

I'm going to check into it for sure. We love road trips and reptile expos, lol !!

If you need info on it feel free to message me :) Or if you plan on going let me know as well! Just so I can know to watch out for ya.

[ladyjustice33]

If you need info on it feel free to message me :) Or if you plan on going let me know as well! Just so I can know to watch out for ya.


Sounds good, thanks!!!

[citysnakes]

If a keeper's room temp cannot reach the lower end required of the species being kept than some sort of heating element will be required to raise the ambient temperature. In these cases, especially with pet owners, theres nothing wrong with using a thermostat regulated heat lamp. A UTH set to provide a hot spot of 92 degrees, for example, cannot successfully raise the ambient temp in a large enclosure in a relatively cool room.

There is no proof that belly heat aids in digestion anymore than proper ambient temperatures do. As long as the animal is able to achieve proper body temperatures then it is going to be able to properly function metabolically. I know of big breeders that do not use UTHs at all and rely only on ambient temps for certain species.

Not all species of snakes can handle temp drops of 70F and 60F degrees. Night drops are not necessary for pet snakes and I would recommend constant temps to pet snake keepers with most species.

just my .02:)

[Will0W783]

Originally quoted by citysnakes:
Not all species of snakes can handle temp drops of 70F and 60F degrees. Night drops are not necessary for pet snakes and I would recommend constant temps to pet snake keepers with most species.

Thank you Julian...that is very true. A lot of exotic species will get sick if they are repeatedly subjected to nighttime drops down to 60-70F. I know bloods, balls, and Burms would definitely not handle that well. I've read and heard from a lot of breeders and keepers more experienced than I am that you should not be subjecting your snakes to nighttime temperature drops unless you are cooling them for breeding. It's especially hard on young snakes- a lot of nighttime drops can signal to the animals that it's winter and time to start brumating and go off food.
I would definitely not recommend year-round severe night drops for an entire collection.

[NennaMeerkat]

I would definitely not recommend year-round severe night drops for an entire collection.

This is why I would be keeping my ball in our bedroom as it is always the warmest room in the house even in the winter. Though I will still have to use a heat lamp for it during the winter months.

[SPARTAN 77]

I use a screen top because the care sheets said they need ventilation AND humidity, I also have a heat bulb that a turn on when he's out so he can bask. the only problem i have is that it dries out the substrate so darn fast.

[Snakefood]

I don't have balls YET!! but from what I've found you need to cover a portion of your screen top to aquire and keep the proper humidity for balls.

[takagari]

Drama :(

Dehlida..
You need to realize making a statement like this. That in some situations you are correct. and in others you are wrong. Is going to bring flack.

Noobs who do trust your wisdom.. Will take this and than struggle with how to heat a cold tank. since a bulb should NEVER be used. how do they heat a cold tank whent he UTH isn't cutting it.

You make a point. and someone makes a counter point. thats how things work.

And most giant snake breeders will prefer radiant heat.
It's just expensive.

[bladeblaster]

Personally I go for heat bulbs in every vivarium, the only time I use UTH is with tubs, mostly hatchlings.

Most snakes do NOT need belly heat to aid digestion, this is a myth, and especially true of ball pythons who spend most of their digestion period sat in a tortiose burrow, what the need is good ambient air temperatures.

Logically speaking a Heat Bulb does exactly what the sun does, it heats whats below, the snake can then bask on a warm surface and under a radient heat source, exactly as the would naturally do. Unless the snake lives in an area of high geological activity the chances of heat radiating from below are very slim.

As for screen tops, I will never understand why anyone would use them. All animals need ventilation of course that goes without saying. However a screen top doesn't do a great deal to facilitate this. Heat rises so most air is circulating in the top third of the enclosure, meaning where your snake is the air is fairly stagnent. The best way to provide good ventilation IMO is to have an air vent just above substrate level at the cool end, and near the top of the enclosure at the hot end. This creates an air exchange that circulates the whole enclosure.

[red ink]

Personally I go for heat bulbs in every vivarium, the only time I use UTH is with tubs, mostly hatchlings.

Most snakes do NOT need belly heat to aid digestion, this is a myth, and especially true of ball pythons who spend most of their digestion period sat in a tortiose burrow, what the need is good ambient air temperatures.

Logically speaking a Heat Bulb does exactly what the sun does, it heats whats below, the snake can then bask on a warm surface and under a radient heat source, exactly as the would naturally do. Unless the snake lives in an area of high geological activity the chances of heat radiating from below are very slim.

As for screen tops, I will never understand why anyone would use them. All animals need ventilation of course that goes without saying. However a screen top doesn't do a great deal to facilitate this. Heat rises so most air is circulating in the top third of the enclosure, meaning where your snake is the air is fairly stagnent. The best way to provide good ventilation IMO is to have an air vent just above substrate level at the cool end, and near the top of the enclosure at the hot end. This creates an air exchange that circulates the whole enclosure.

:yes::yes::yes::yes:

[lady_bug87]

OK

I actually read the whole thing, yep all four pages and this is what I have to say.

I have been doing this reptile thing for... 2 years so I am not an expert I read I research and so far the only thing that has died on me was a clutch of eggs which I am almost certain was doomed before they were laid.

everything I own is in a glass screen-top cages my lizards have been fine no shedding problems and they poop like machines (I had a problem with my beardie becoming impacted once and that was a diet thing)

My ball has a 20gal glass tank with 3 sides covered by cardboard and UTH on one side which is on a dimmer he has a temp probe and I have another thermometer I check with it I have modified the screen top using a combination of (dont laugh) sponges and cardboard and his humidity is perfect he is happy in his enclosure and will outgrow it eventually but hes a sub adult and is quite happy he has 2 hides (cool side and hot side) integrated with basking and climbing places and a water bowl big enough for him to soak in he has had perfect sheds, poops, and eats like a champ and his temps are constantly being checked I may have to mist him once in a while but he doesnt seem to mind annd i have a regular light bulb for day and night cycles because I believe its healthy to be able to distinguish between day and night

my GTP is in a viv with live plants (though a topic in a recent thread is making me want to change the variety) she has multiple widths of branches to coil on to and an automatic misting system which keeps her tank at an optimal humidity she only has overhead heat which also gets checked daily her tank is also a screen top which becomes half covered by her lighting system since I got her misting system set up she had the most perfect shed it even had the eye caps attached.

then again I only have 2 snakes. not a dozen... yet my condo is too small

[Snakefood]

everyone I have is set up in my bedroom. Two are in show tanks with screen tops and 1 is in a tub, all corns. I use the UTH alone most of the summer, and then when it starts cooling, the basking lights go on for additional ambient heat.

[bladeblaster]

Its interesting the difference in keeping practices, almost no one uses glass tanks for snakes in the UK, sometimes lizards but even thats rare.

Infact it is most definately frowned upon to use glass tanks, as being far inferior to wooden vivariums.

[Snakefood]

Its interesting the difference in keeping practices, almost no one uses glass tanks for snakes in the UK, sometimes lizards but even thats rare.

Infact it is most definately frowned upon to use glass tanks, as being far inferior to wooden vivariums.

Why is that?? I mean for what reasons would a glass tank be inferior to a wooden viv?? I think I understand why when speaking of some species of snakes and thier humidity needs, but in the case of corn snakes, who's humidity needs are minimal, why would it matter??

[bladeblaster]

Why is that?? I mean for what reasons would a glass tank be inferior to a wooden viv?? I think I understand why when speaking of some species of snakes and thier humidity needs, but in the case of corn snakes, who's humidity needs are minimal, why would it matter??

well for sure wooden tanks off greater security, plus better heat and humidity retention.

Some species are more suited to them than others for sure, also depends a lot on the climate where you live I guess.

[Snakefood]

That would make sense, we have a very wide range of temps throughout the year here. We regularily soar into the 30's in the summer and drop below freezing in the winter, But our humidity almost NEVER drops below 60%( in the house that is). So really heat is the only issue here, rather than humidity.

Having corns, I don't worry about humidity much, and security is not a concern either, the fully set up show tank has a custom made locking lid on it, and the newest showtank needs the top to be modified to properly lock. Right now it has 4 nice sized rocks at each corner, but hubby is working on it.

Heat retention is GOING to be an issue for me this winter I can already tell. So I will be working on that as the temps cool.

[bladeblaster]

That would make sense, we have a very wide range of temps throughout the year here. We regularily soar into the 30's in the summer and drop below freezing in the winter, But our humidity almost NEVER drops below 60%( in the house that is). So really heat is the only issue here, rather than humidity.

Having corns, I don't worry about humidity much, and security is not a concern either, the fully set up show tank has a custom made locking lid on it, and the newest showtank needs the top to be modified to properly lock. Right now it has 4 nice sized rocks at each corner, but hubby is working on it.

Heat retention is GOING to be an issue for me this winter I can already tell. So I will be working on that as the temps cool.

I actually meant security for the snake feeling secure rather than the enclusore being escape proof

[Snakefood]

Ahhhhhh!! Working on that too with fabric backgrounds wrapped around 3 sides of the tanks!! I am hoping it will also help with heat retention.

[SnakeyJay]

I used a glass exoterra once. Theyre good little vivs but it held no ambiant heat at all, winter was a struggle so i switched to wood n stayed. Id really like a plastic viv for my brb tho.

[Snakefood]

I used a glass exoterra once. Theyre good little vivs but it held no ambiant heat at all, winter was a struggle so i switched to wood n stayed. Id really like a plastic viv for my brb tho.


I wonder if I will have that problem this winter. I know when I was in the UK (in the summer), the whole natural environment (temps, plants, ect...) felt very much like home to me (except we have higher mountains). I wonder if our winters are similar as well!!

I can always have hubby build something appropriate (he is an amazing handy-man) if these tanks don't work out. He is building me my rack system right now, so I can always put them in tubs over the winter in the rack system if I can't keep the show tanks at the right temps.

[lady_bug87]

I wonder if I will have that problem this winter. I know when I was in the UK (in the summer), the whole natural environment (temps, plants, ect...) felt very much like home to me (except we have higher mountains). I wonder if our winters are similar as well!!

I can always have hubby build something appropriate (he is an amazing handy-man) if these tanks don't work out. He is building me my rack system right now, so I can always put them in tubs over the winter in the rack system if I can't keep the show tanks at the right temps.

Honestly in Ontario where it hits -35 Celsius my temps are fine and I use glass exoterra screen tops no less the one I worry about is my GTP since she is just a baby I may move her into the office which is the hottest room in condo and this will be her first winter with us

[Snakefood]

-35, that's the reason I'm a west coaster!! NEVER happens here!!! I think the lowest in my life here on the coast has been about -14. But I was raised up north where it would regularily hit -30/40. YUCK!!

[TeaNinja]

im in west coast california, where it's nice almost all the time lol. the coldest we get is like frozen puddles and hail and stuff.

[Snakefood]

Yes, it is beautiful there. I love to drive down the coast for vacation.

[lady_bug87]

Thanks I will remember that when I am digging a path through a ft of snow to get to the car

[Snakefood]

Thanks I will remember that when I am digging a path through a ft of snow to get to the car

Which is why you should be heading west!!!! We can still go to the lake in December if we want!!

[Gungirl]

Thanks I will remember that when I am digging a path through a ft of snow to get to the car

Snow is the best!! I love it and wish I had it year round! :yes:

[Snakefood]

Snow is the best!! I love it and wish I had it year round! :yes:

I like it for about the first 5 days, then I just wish it would go away!! My husky dog sure loves it though!! It's the only time of year he acts spunky anymore (he's 12!!)

[ladyjustice33]

Texas isn't only hot but VERY VERY dry.

Not my part of Texas, lol, lots of humidity here in Southeast Texas!!!!

[red ink]

Its interesting the difference in keeping practices, almost no one uses glass tanks for snakes in the UK, sometimes lizards but even thats rare.

Infact it is most definately frowned upon to use glass tanks, as being far inferior to wooden vivariums.

Same in Oz mate... glass tanks for snakes are not used (well except for GTPs).

[youngster]

I love snow. Skiing is my 2nd favorite thing behind snakes. (obviously!)

[lady_bug87]

I love snow. Skiing is my 2nd favorite thing behind snakes. (obviously!)


we have it 6 mos out of the year in some form.... powdery white, packing snow and snow sludge in no particular order

[ilovemypets1988]

i only got to page 2 before i had to say this.

there are many cases in which both methods (lamps and uth) are great for heating an enclosure and this i will elaborate on:

UTH are great for small to medium bodied snakes as they are cheap and give the basking temp required but should not be used for large bodied snakes due to a reaction that happens with the mat (i cant remember the name of the reaction but heres the explanation);

lets take a burmese python for example, due to the size and weight of the snake, the UTH will over heat and possibly cause a fire, (put a rock on 1 and u will see what i mean) the weight will cause the mat to constantly heat up until it either blows or starts to melt and catches fire, a UTH or heat mat (as its called in the uk) can easily get to 50 degrees celcius or 122 fahrenheit, ive even had 1 get to 72 celcius or 161.6 fahrenheit and thats without the weight on top which after i had done so, those temps nearly doubled, now imagine a snake laying on 1 that gets to that temp (should the thermostat fail).

Heat lamps are excellent for large bodied snakes such as boa`s and large pythons, partly for the reason above, but also because they are far cheaper than AHS`s (advanced heating systems) and they can supply the snake with a natural cycle if you have the right bulbs, infact, unless you have a snake with a coloured sight, then a red or ble bulb gives the right amount of heat but only gives off enough light to stimulate a "moonlighting" effect which will help the snakes natural cycle of diurnal and noturnal behaviour.

to be quite frank, as long as the snake is healthy, then theres no problem to the husbandry at all.

anyway thats my rant over and done with lol

[2006gt]

o/p: AGAIN SHOW YOUR SETUPS SO EVERYONE CAN BE PERFECT LIKE YOU MR. EXPERT YOU SHOULD HAVE PUBLISHED HUSBANDRY BOOKS/WEBSITES SINCE U KNOW EVERYTHING HAHAH SHOW US SOME PROOF YOU KNOW ALL THE sH** UR TALKING ABOUT!!!!1

[millertime89]

well that was a worthless post^
I read all 5 pages and there's some interesting ideas going on. As temps begin to drop here I haven't had any problems maintaining heat in my viv (glass 30x12x12) with a simple UTH. That said my room is in the basement and I usually have to seal the windows and run a space heater to keep just me comfy in the winter months. We'll see what I have to do to keep Nero happy and comfy. I'm thinking if I use a lamp hooked up to a timer to maintain my simulated day/night cycles shining on the tank, but not directly over the tank, it should maintain temps. I'll see what works and adjust accordingly.

[2006gt]

well that was a worthless post^
I read all 5 pages and there's some interesting ideas going on. As temps begin to drop here I haven't had any problems maintaining heat in my viv (glass 30x12x12) with a simple UTH. That said my room is in the basement and I usually have to seal the windows and run a space heater to keep just me comfy in the winter months. We'll see what I have to do to keep Nero happy and comfy. I'm thinking if I use a lamp hooked up to a timer to maintain my simulated day/night cycles shining on the tank, but not directly over the tank, it should maintain temps. I'll see what works and adjust accordingly.

i dont care if u think my post was worthless....it was about as worthless as the o/p's post... and you posting it was worthless haha i guess all three were worthless hahah

but if i were you i would use a che on a thermostat to heat your viv if u cant heat it well with the space heater, with me at least(this is my opinion not fact) i had better success with che's than bulbs on a glass tank with bps i have had perfect sheds(i mist more during this time). and held good ambient with a towel/shirt cover half the top or clear wrap

[bladeblaster]

i only got to page 2 before i had to say this.

there are many cases in which both methods (lamps and uth) are great for heating an enclosure and this i will elaborate on:

UTH are great for small to medium bodied snakes as they are cheap and give the basking temp required but should not be used for large bodied snakes due to a reaction that happens with the mat (i cant remember the name of the reaction but heres the explanation);

lets take a burmese python for example, due to the size and weight of the snake, the UTH will over heat and possibly cause a fire, (put a rock on 1 and u will see what i mean) the weight will cause the mat to constantly heat up until it either blows or starts to melt and catches fire, a UTH or heat mat (as its called in the uk) can easily get to 50 degrees celcius or 122 fahrenheit, ive even had 1 get to 72 celcius or 161.6 fahrenheit and thats without the weight on top which after i had done so, those temps nearly doubled, now imagine a snake laying on 1 that gets to that temp (should the thermostat fail).

Heat lamps are excellent for large bodied snakes such as boa`s and large pythons, partly for the reason above, but also because they are far cheaper than AHS`s (advanced heating systems) and they can supply the snake with a natural cycle if you have the right bulbs, infact, unless you have a snake with a coloured sight, then a red or ble bulb gives the right amount of heat but only gives off enough light to stimulate a "moonlighting" effect which will help the snakes natural cycle of diurnal and noturnal behaviour.

to be quite frank, as long as the snake is healthy, then theres no problem to the husbandry at all.

anyway thats my rant over and done with lol

Its called 'Thermal Blocking' which yes is a problem but only when mats are used incorrectly. Usually by people having mats inside the enclosure, and the snake can lie directly on the mat. It also happens when people use mats for UTH 'outside of the enclosure' and sit the enclosure directly on the mat. There should be an air gap between the mat and whatever it is heating, this is clear on the instructions for mats, and is important as it is this that prevents thermal blocking.

[takagari]

I leave my mats on the shelf etself and place the tank on top. essentially heating the air under the tank.
this gives the spot directly above, a warmer temp than the rest, but it does warm the whole bottom

[ilovemypets1988]

Its called 'Thermal Blocking' which yes is a problem but only when mats are used incorrectly. Usually by people having mats inside the enclosure, and the snake can lie directly on the mat. It also happens when people use mats for UTH 'outside of the enclosure' and sit the enclosure directly on the mat. There should be an air gap between the mat and whatever it is heating, this is clear on the instructions for mats, and is important as it is this that prevents thermal blocking.

thats the one, i know it usually happens when people use them incorrectly but that being said, i had to say it as i really think that is a very valid point withthe use of mats.

[bladeblaster]

thats the one, i know it usually happens when people use them incorrectly but that being said, i had to say it as i really think that is a very valid point withthe use of mats.

absolutely :)

[millertime89]

you guys are saying placing the UTH directly on the glass is incorrect and I understand the reasoning, but my new mat has a sticky side that is supposed to be attached directly to the viv and there's supposed to be an air gap between the bottom of the mat and the surface the viv is sitting on. That's what the instructions say on the box.
side note, we might get the first frost of the season tonight, gonna have to see how the set up does. It was 90 here on Monday...

[ilovemypets1988]

you guys are saying placing the UTH directly on the glass is incorrect and I understand the reasoning, but my new mat has a sticky side that is supposed to be attached directly to the viv and there's supposed to be an air gap between the bottom of the mat and the surface the viv is sitting on. That's what the instructions say on the box.
side note, we might get the first frost of the season tonight, gonna have to see how the set up does. It was 90 here on Monday...

yh you should never really use glass as it can crack due to the heat, use a thin piece of mdf (8mm will do) to raise the tank off the stand its on and place the mat in the gap, the mat will then have an air gap which is whats required, use mdf strips and not a hole sheet as the thin strips can be put at each end of the viv to raise it and you will have a gap in between the 2 strips.

[millertime89]

I've already got the tank slightly raised with some rubber grommets that came with the UTH. In addition the tank's base is already elevated as its designed for housing reptiles. So just remove the UTH from the viv and place it on the stand?
I've still got the warranty on the tank, so even if it does crack due to heat (have YOU ever seen this happen? I sure haven't) I'll be able to replace it. I know you Brits are against using aquariums for vivs, but its common practice over here.

[ilovemypets1988]

I've already got the tank slightly raised with some rubber grommets that came with the UTH. In addition the tank's base is already elevated as its designed for housing reptiles. So just remove the UTH from the viv and place it on the stand?
I've still got the warranty on the tank, so even if it does crack due to heat (have YOU ever seen this happen? I sure haven't) I'll be able to replace it. I know you Brits are against using aquariums for vivs, but its common practice over here.

im not against it at all, i used an aquarium for a bp, its only when the mat is directly in contact with the glass will splitting become an issue, but most modern tanks/aquaria will have an air pocket under them anyway.

[millertime89]

understood, but I'm just saying I've never personally seen it. Glass does become brittle when heated, but I've never seen it crack. There usually needs to be an imperfection in the glass (warpage/pit/chip) for it to crack, or a high force. Per physicsit shouldn't crack from heat, heat causes it to expand, its when it is heated and then cooled rapidly that it should crack.

Anyways, enough about physics, its going nowhere. You think I should just detach it and place it on the stand? No need for mdf between it and the stand?

[Gungirl]

I have to ask.. wouldn't the UTH be far to hot for the snake if it was hot enough to crack the tank??

I don't understand the concern of the tank cracking. If your tank gets freezing cold then hot yes it might crack but if you do that to your snake your snake will die.. the UTH keeps the tank at a stable temp not a freezing then hot temp.

I have a UTH on my corns glass tank until his wooden one is finished. I stuck it right to the bottom of the glass tank and have about 1/2" gap below the UTH until the wood shelf it sits on.. been this way for a while no issue at all.

Correct me if I am understanding something wrong or missing something.

[millertime89]

^that's exactly how mine is.

[RandyRhoads]

I've already got the tank slightly raised with some rubber grommets that came with the UTH. In addition the tank's base is already elevated as its designed for housing reptiles. So just remove the UTH from the viv and place it on the stand?
I've still got the warranty on the tank, so even if it does crack due to heat (have YOU ever seen this happen? I sure haven't) I'll be able to replace it. I know you Brits are against using aquariums for vivs, but its common practice over here.

I mist heavily over my UTH and i'm sure with the ammount I use i'm sure some cold water runs on it, i've even messed up and sprayed directly on the glass over it (when my burm dug the substrate off it) and no cracking.

However I have ruined an expensive enclosure by spilling the water dish on the glass over the UTH. Huge crack that seperated shortly after.

[millertime89]

right, a hot, brittle surface (glass) rapidly cooling will result in cracks or breakage.
edit: see post 82
2nd edit: which irronically, might've been my 82nd post