Bashful Corn?

[blindfireak40]

Hey, I was just wanting to take a bit of a survey of the corn owners here. My little guy(gal?) is veeeery very shy. I've never caught him above substrate, in the weeks before purchase when I dropped by, nor once I had him home. He was perfectly fine with handling, both in the pet store and just prior to his recent feeding. I have not been musked on, and all of his movements have been calm and deliberate, so I'm reasonably certain that he's not overly stressed.

This is all leading up to my actual question: How many of you have corns that are like this? Typically hidden away, and not on display to the general public? Is this something that they grow out of? Again, he seems to be totally fine with handling, just once he is returned to his terrarium, he looks around for a second, then makes for one of his hides, and burrows back under his aspen. For my own peace of mind, I'd like to be able to see him, but this is an unlikely prospect as of right now.

Thanks again! I'm sure I'm just being a worrywort new parent type, but reassurance is good :)

[NennaMeerkat]

My two ALWAYS hid when they were in their home. When they were out they were all over the place cruising around. They were also vigerous eaters, never missed a meal and enjoyed "hunting" when they were fed.

So I wouldn't worry to much as long as he is eating well and not stressed when out of his home I would just let it go.

[blindfireak40]

Mmmm'k, thanks :)

It's just maaajorly different from the first snake I had. I had a baby ball back about 8 years ago, and he was awfully neat. Very calm, very sweet, good eater, but as an early teenager with no income, I had to use newspaper as a substrate. He had the necessary hides and whatnot, but with the paper I got used to being able to tell at a glance whether he was there or not.

Now I have about 600 cubic inches of aspen to hide about 3 cubic inches of snake, because I have enough income to buy substrate for him. So I suppose I'll have to keep playing Needle in the Haystack 'til he's older, huh?

[NennaMeerkat]

Well you *could* get the reptile carpet if you honestly really wanted to see him but he would be much happier with his aspen. With enough practice I bet you will be able to simply look at his tank and be able to find him. I am sure you want a happy snake rather than being able to see him all the time right?

Eventually he might come out, but my full grown snakes never did come up from hiding usually except when they were eating. Then they would try to be at the top waiting for me to get them out and put them in their feeding box.

[blindfireak40]

Hahaha, yes, of course his happiness and health is foremost for me. I'm hopin' for this little guy to tide me over for a while...already after the week or two I've had him I'm already itching to get me another one :)

Maybe a Boa or Python next...I just worry about IBD sometimes.

[NennaMeerkat]

I might be a little bias but have you thought about a hognose snake? They require basically the same as your corn and are usually very mild snakes.

[blindfireak40]

Hmmm, perhaps, perhaps. They're rear-fanged, right? I might just do that...and based on the pictures I'm seeing from google images, I could have a Fettuccine to keep little Vermicelli company :D

[NennaMeerkat]

They are really enduring little snakes to be sure. Hard not to fall in love with those little upturned snout and always smiling faces.

[Reptile_Reptile]

my corn does that too. (although not right now) but i have to say all snakes are different.

[Lankyrob]

Two of my three corns i never see unless i hunt for them. the other is out constantly (and my adult is currently out as he is looking for Luuuurve!!!)

[blindfireak40]

Awesome, thanks guys! I think you all may be the best resource available to herpers of any skill and or experience level!!

[Marica]

Most of my Corns, esp. my babies are almost never out and sometimes I have to take everything out of their vivs to find them. I catch my older ones out more often, but usually late in the evenings.

[blindfireak40]

Another question: He tends to stay on the cold side of the enclosure; even just now when I checked to make sure he was still there, he was on the cool side, and he should currently be digesting. He has two hides on the warm side, and of course has bedding to burrow into. Should I worry about this, or is he likely doing just fine and I'm just over-analyzing still?

[NennaMeerkat]

What you got on the warm side? As far as heat goes.

[blindfireak40]

Smallish heating pad under the tank, taped to the bottom, and a 75-watt basking bulb, keeps hotspot at about 83 during the "day", drops to about 70-72 at night on hot side.

[NennaMeerkat]

Do me a favor go into the home and put your hand over the spot where the heating pad is like the snake would (basically put your hand against the glass as well as against the substrate) hold it there for 20 seconds. You will be able to tell instantly why the snake isn't hanging out over there ;)

[blindfireak40]

Just did it on the bare glass. It's a low-wattage pad, and it wasn't uncomfortable to the touch even after a few minutes. Also, he has a couple of hides over there, and he has no issue with staying above substrate in his cool hide. The heat was practically undetectable with the substrate in the way.

[NennaMeerkat]

How much wattage is the lamp then?

[blindfireak40]

75, it's in a tall-ish terrarium though. Substrate-level thermometer reads just over 80 while lamp is on.

[NennaMeerkat]

Have you taken temps on just the hot side of the home?

[Lankyrob]

The hot spot directly below the lamp should be about 86f, to be honest tho none of my corns ever seem to spend time in the hot hides, they are normally found in the middle hide which i have filled with sphagnum moss.

[richie.w]

hi, i have 5 corns 2 adults 3 yungsters all in vivs 2 foot long x 1foot high 15 inch deep non have a heat lamp corns only need heat from underneath with a heat range of 30 - 35c 88 - 95f on the mat and if the mat is abuot 1 third the size of the base the rest of the tank should sort its self around 21 - 27c 70 - 80f

[NennaMeerkat]

hi, i have 5 corns 2 adults 3 yungsters all in vivs 2 foot long x 1foot high 15 inch deep non have a heat lamp corns only need heat from underneath with a heat range of 30 - 35c 88 - 95f on the mat and if the mat is abuot 1 third the size of the base the rest of the tank should sort its self around 21 - 27c 70 - 80f

This is what I was told by breeders when I got my 2 corns. Not sure on the temps but the fact that they really only need an under the tank heater.

[Lankyrob]

The heat lamp heats the floor area and they absorb the heat from the substrate whether the original heat comes from above or below is kinda irrelevant. THe temps should be 86f on the top of the substrate where the snake will be. 95f i would say is DANGEROUS to corn snakes.

[blindfireak40]

Thanks, as always guys, sounds like I may need to bump the wattage on the bulb up one more step...he's definitely not in danger of overheating though, so I suppose that's a good thing.

86 seems awfully specific Rob. I believe you, but I'm just wondering where you got that figure, and if you think 83-84 will cause any problems. That's usually where the hot spot settles so far.

We're in winter, so summer may be a tricky proposition, but I'm thinking I'll be alright with just the light and no pad, but we'll have to see. Luckily I'll be able to observe carefully because school will be out.

[Lankyrob]

I got 86f from every care sheet and "expert" that i questioned before purchasing my corns. Dont ask me why that is the figure but thats what i use and everyone i know that owns corns uses too.

[blindfireak40]

Hmm. Well, I'll see what I can do, then. Want the little guy to have a long happy life after all. He finally discovered his middle/warm hide though. I think he'll be spending most of his time there from now on :)

[Marica]

All the caresheets for cornsnakes that I've read have suggested the warm side to be in the low to mid 80's F and that anything over 90F is dangerous and could lead to health issues. Just to clarify, it looks like Richie is measuring temps directly above the heat pad and assuming heat dissipation at the top of the substrate to adequate temps.

I try to maintain the warm side at 83-86F in all my corns' tanks and have for about 8 years. I switched from lamps to heat pads about 3 years ago, mostly due to the addition of cats to our family. I do however measure the temps with a probe secured directly above the center of the heats pads as I frequently find that my corns will borrow under the substrate or push it aside.

[Lankyrob]

All the caresheets for cornsnakes that I've read have suggested the warm side to be in the low to mid 80's F and that anything over 90F is dangerous and could lead to health issues. Just to clarify, it looks like Richie is measuring temps directly above the heat pad and assuming heat dissipation at the top of the substrate to adequate temps.

I try to maintain the warm side at 83-86F in all my corns' tanks and have for about 8 years. I switched from lamps to heat pads about 3 years ago, mostly due to the addition of cats to our family. I do however measure the temps with a probe secured directly above the center of the heats pads as I frequently find that my corns will borrow under the substrate or push it aside.

Kinda off the topic but wondering why cats would affect your choice of heating?

[Marica]

Mostly I just wanted to keep them off the screen tops, but also to keep them from knocking the dome lamp fixtures off, so I built the sliding shelf cabinet (http://www.ssnakess.com/forums/enclosure-reptile-room-showcase/84264-sliding-shelf-cabinet.html) to limit top access, which also meant no room for a lamp fixture. I find it's more space efficient when stacking glass tanks, though I eventually plan on building and moving all my collection into wooden enclosures (http://www.ssnakess.com/forums/general-enclosure-discussion/84968-diy-wood-cage-build-guide.html).

I had also read that belly heat was better for them and from most posts I had read on another forum it seemed that most preferred heat pads. Though your reasoning that the lamps heat the substrate adequately kind of contradicts that typical UTH argument. I don't miss having to replace the bulbs when they burn out, so that's a bonus for UTH in my opinion.

[Lankyrob]

I understand with the screen tops. All my vivs are the wooden kind so the cats love to sleep on the warm spot above the bulb!!

[NennaMeerkat]

I know my two corns LOVED their UTH but I also didn't have a heat lamp at the time either. But their temps were always in the 80's except maybe in the cold Kansas winters. They never seemed to mind, never had a problem of any kind with either of them. I didn't even use a dimmer or anything on the pad either.

[Aaron_S]

The reason people generally use heatpads over lamps,especially if it's a tank, is to not dry out the enclosure. Heat lamps tend to dry things very quick whereas pads do not.

I also know of someone who had a house fire due to a heat lamp and a dog. I know they are different than cats but free roaming critters + heat lamps = fire hazard.

[NennaMeerkat]

I also know of someone who had a house fire due to a heat lamp and a dog. I know they are different than cats but free roaming critters + heat lamps = fire hazard.

I know how that is. We had a scare on the book case with our current lamp. Placed the lamp down while it was on, on the bookcase (which is made out of real wood and not that pulp wood stuff) and we ended up with a small fire on it before we put it out. Now there is a small round charred spot of charcoal where the lamp was as a constant reminder.

[Lankyrob]

Must adm it lamps that are clamped onto tanks dont look overly safe to me. And the viv that i inherited when resucing my adult corn has a burn mark cos the guy before me put the ceramic right in the corner of the viv touching both side walls.

Am quite happy having the ceramics inside the wooden vivs with nice guards round tho.

[Reptile_Reptile]

i secured my heat lamps to bricks so they cant burn anything and are too heavy to knock over

[NennaMeerkat]

Most of my tanks are to high for my child or any free roaming pets to mess with. My cat isn't a climber and both my idiots dogs are to big to get where the cords and such are. I don't really have any way to hang or attach my lamps to my aquariums with the screens on top. So meh sorta just taking a chance but so far besides my own stupid mistake that one time it hasn't happened agian.