How to sex

[Dumeril daddy]

i thinik i might have been givin wrong information on my dumies ...... is there a way to sex them myself?:freakedout:

[Aaron_S]

There is but you should have someone who is comfortable doing it do it in front of you to show you. If they aren't babies the only sure way is to probe them. You can injure a snake this way so it's best to get someone who knows what they are doing.

[Dumeril daddy]

someone was telling me about bending the tail backwards and pressing thumb and run it back twards the exit and feel for bumps i didnt feel non so im not sure what to do

[Jenn_06]

how big are they?

[Dumeril daddy]

females aprox 4'

males a lil over 3' or supposed male lol might be a transexual

[Jenn_06]

when doing this if you feel a bump its a boy no bump girl. it worked for me.
http://i123.photobucket.com/albums/o284/joejenn06/2008_04_18Palpatingpics.gif

[Dumeril daddy]

thank you i will try that after i seperate them.......... looks like something is goin on the have there tails together

[Aaron_S]

First of all popping is to only be done when they are young. You aren't feeling for bumps you're literally popping their genitals out of the cloaca. As they get bigger, as yours are, they will have better control and you won't be able to pop them out without some serious pressure and possibly hurt them. It is not recommended you continue to attempt this.

Secondly, if you're keeping them together then that's a problem as well. Snakes do best as individuals.

To put your qualms aside, just because they have their tails together it doesn't mean they are mating. They are still small and probably not interested in breeding. Still I would seperate them.

[Dumeril daddy]

i do keep them seperated i have 2 tanks i put them together just tpo see how things go..... so what is mature age for breading them then .......im so lost i thought 3 years old was a good age to start.......:crazy2:

[Aaron_S]

Size has as much to do with age when it comes to breeding.

How big is the "female"? Do you know how big they should be when breeding? I don't keep dumerils but I do know they aren't a small species and I believe a 5 - 6 foot and probably a 10 pound female would be a start. Do some googling and check other forums.

I apologize for assuming you kept them together but you should have done your research on breeding them in advance.

[Dumeril daddy]

i didnt plan on breedingbut i found out not many people have them and so ya just started investigating

[Aaron_S]

Have you even found out their actual sex? Found out any caresheets or books on them to know how big they get? I've seen 10 footers! You're trying to breed them at 3 and 4 feet? You'll have dead snakes soon enough. You're seeing dollar signs and the snakes are going to suffer for your selfishness.

[Dumeril daddy]

females everage 6-7 feet males average 5-6 feet
ive done all my homework other than breeding cosit never crossed my mind

[Dumeril daddy]

my female is 4 feet
and my male i got him yesterday he ate 2 small frozon mice ..... he didnt seem full so i put him in with a medium rat and it was like mcdonalds to him

[Aaron_S]

You got a snake yesterday and tried to breed them today? I'm just going to stop posting at this point. Clearly you're in over your head. I don't know where to start.

[Reptile_Reptile]

You got a snake yesterday and tried to breed them today? I'm just going to stop posting at this point. Clearly you're in over your head. I don't know where to start.
he said earlier dude that he wasnt trying to breed them, your tunnel visioning on what you want to complain about, read slowly and dont just assume things:elvis:

[Reptile_Reptile]

thank you i will try that after i seperate them.......... looks like something is goin on the have there tails together
see..............

[Reptile_Reptile]

i didnt plan on breedingbut i found out not many people have them and so ya just started investigating
here is another example (sorry i dont know how to multi quote so you all get 3 messages)

[totheend]

Dums are not rare.......

And really why would you put an animal you just got with another animal? That could be dangerous....

[Aaron_S]

he said earlier dude that he wasnt trying to breed them, your tunnel visioning on what you want to complain about, read slowly and dont just assume things:elvis:

So do you normally just like picking out what people say just to prove your own point? Did you not read the post that he stated he'd just put them together to see how it goes? It's obvious that he attempted to breed them. He keeps them in separated tanks and yet they ended up together just for "investigating breeding". I don't have tunnel vision. You somehow think it's wrong of me to be upset with the lack of quarantine practices, lack of care and seemingly lack of research here.

[Reptile_Reptile]

he just said he was investigating dude i thought you were being a little to harsh, ive got respect for you but your a little hard on some people. you know if you come off a little less heavy people tend to listen better.

[presspirate]

Have to agree with AAron here......quarantine is a must when getting a new snake. If all the research had been done, the poster would have known that and not attempted putting 2 snakes together without proper quarantine. It is potentially harmful to do so. I'm not trying to bag on anyone and take sides, but I do feel that responsible ownership means doing your research BEFORE putting two snakes together. IMO The best thing to do here is to separate them now and hope for the best. Research in case you do end up with a gravid female and have the number of a reptile vet handy in case one or both of them end up sick.

[Reptile_Reptile]

I was merely saying to cool down there is no f*cking need to get angry right away ok i was trying to calm him down and aaron you actually are wrong to get mad at someone else's practices especially if you dont know if they knew the knowledge you were getting angry at him for neglecting anyways either way i felt you were in the wrong and you at times are a negative light on this forum. Ease up and get facts before your rage ok you make it less fun to be on this forum when you be a jerk you are a use full asset to all of us snake owners but you are self righteous and over zealous at times

[Damion930]

its better to educate than agitate...but on the other hand do your homwrk my friend u have some learning to as do we all I hope but u should keep them separate for Ther health quarantine any new snake for example to insure health sorry your post was turned into a rant I hope u won't be put off from asking questions and learning more about the animals u keep

[Dumeril daddy]

No i wont be put off the axtual breeding size is 3 feet or better ..... Of all the reading i have sone i never came across anything about quarentine period ,..... That guy that wants to rant n rave seeems to think everyone ahould know AS MUCH As Him and anyone with a bit of ignorance should not be alive Cant fault a mister know it all just pray that one day they will see life is better with sugar then salt

[Dumeril daddy]

Ive only seen 3 dummies up for grabs in cali .... There not dime a dozen where i live ..... Would love to be provin wrong though so i can start a dum club

[Jenn_06]

quarentine is a must with snakes, you dont know the full background of the snake you just got, you dont now if its sick or has mites and will get your other snake(s) sick. Everytime i get a new snake i quarentine them in a different room for 3 to 6 months.

and you guys need to cool down i see this on too many forums, fighting is not going to help anyone, if you dont have anything nice to say or cant give info in a nice way dont post.

[shaunyboy]

So do you normally just like picking out what people say just to prove your own point? Did you not read the post that he stated he'd just put them together to see how it goes? It's obvious that he attempted to breed them. He keeps them in separated tanks and yet they ended up together just for "investigating breeding". I don't have tunnel vision. You somehow think it's wrong of me to be upset with the lack of quarantine practices, lack of care and seemingly lack of research here.


^^^^^
arron has every right to say the above

i saw the same thing as arron did when i read this guys thread

lack of quarintine,lack of research,lack of care

you dont throw 2 snakes together to investigate what would happen when you dont have the knowledge to know whats best for the snake

the above is not an assumption on my part,its what i see in the op's posts

he shows little or no knowledge of breeding but decides to give it a go just to see what happens

if he happens to get a female of this age and size gravid the female stands a good chance of ending up dead

at the very least she will have wrecked her chances of ever producing a viable clutch in the future

imo it is you reptile reptile who have tunnel vision in this case

you seem fixated on pulling arron up

ive had heated debates with arron myself

but i also understand his passion

he can be agressive in his posts but as you get to know him you realise it stems from his passion to see all snakes kept properly

reptile reptile you chose to pick only parts of arrons post that would help proove your point

you used them out of context to proove what you were saying when in fact if you read the whole post arron makes perfect sense

[Marica]

As for the original question of how to sex your snakes, I would recommend taking them to a reputable herp vet or breeder to have them probed as they appear to be too old to be popped. Popping and probing are useful skills for a breeder to learn so that they can sell their offspring sexed correctly. There are also some visual indicators that are unreliable such as the size or visibility of spurs, the length/shape of the tail, etc. Also, I've heard of males attempting to dominate each other, so them entwining may not necessarily confirm opposing sexes.

Any and all new reptiles should be placed in quarantine for at least 3 months if not more prior to being introduced in to the same room where another reptile is housed. I believe viruses such as Crypto and Paramyxo are slower to affect and show symptoms in boas compared to pythons, so a quarantine period of up to 6 months is often recommended. Making sure you have healthy animals and that they are being giving the correct care should be confirmed prior to even considering breeding.

With regards to breeding, boatloads of research should be done prior to attempting a pairing. Just because there aren't many Dumeril's available in your area does not mean that there aren't breeders out their working with them. They are a protected species and exporting them from their natural habitat is illegal and transporting them between other countries very difficult, so the ones in captivity are pretty much all we have to work with. Care should be taken to breed healthy, unrelated specimens (though inbreeding does not always lead to immediate complications in reptiles and has helped with providing new morphs, it is best to be avoided if possible). There are many complications that can occur during breeding and having available vet care and/or the knowledge/experience to deal with any issues that arise can mean life or death for your snakes. Since [most] boas are livebearers, with a Dumeril's you will be looking at taking care of a gravid female for about 8 months. This can be quite strenuous on their bodies and therefore they need to be of adequate size (neither over or underweight) prior to breeding to ensure minimal risk of complications. From my research Dumeril's are slower to sexually mature than other comparable boas, and often require an additional year to reach breeding size. Size and overall health are primary factors as opposed to age when it comes to determining breeding maturity. There is also the issue of being prepared to care for the young, housing however many you end up with, dealing with non-feeders, finding good homes for them and caring for ones that may not sell.

There's a wealth of information out there, though some is incorrect, the more research you do and communication you have with other experienced breeders/keepers the better chance your snakes have of successfully breeding and leading healthy lives. If you ever get an aggressive response it is most likely because you have said or done something to upset someone who is extremely passionate about responsible care. There are too many animals out there not receiving adequate care to the point of neglect and/or abuse. So it is best to consider their advice whether you like the tone or not, which in this medium of text is quite often open to interpretation.

[Aaron_S]

I had responded that I was done with this thread and I made one last defensive post. I didn't want to post again but a few people came here on my behalf so I felt I should thank them.

So thank you to the ones who responded. You know who you are.

I won't respond to anything else in this thread. I'll leave this with a simple saying everyone should know, the truth hurts.

[Reptile_Reptile]

ok well i had just read 2 seperate posts where he was being hard on people and i guess i did have tunnel vision on aaron_s i understand that now that its not 3 in the morning i know you said you werent going to post but i assume your subscribed to the thread and will see this so... my bad

[Will0W783]

I just found this thread, and it's old already, but I've been away for a few days and wanted to say I have to agree that quarantine is a MUST. There are a lot of bad viruses that can incubate for 3-6 months or even years in some cases. NEVER should one throw two snakes together right after getting them. I've bought snakes as a pair from a vendor before and had them breed in the bag on the way home from a show, but they were separated and quarantined apart once I got them home. Breeding snakes is a big responsibility- there are potential complications for the female (calcium deficiency, weight loss, egg-binding, to name a few) that can result in a very sick momma snake and huge vet bills, or a dead snake. You really can't do too much research. IMHO one should never investigate with breeding- you should have all your research done and equipment for housing babies, keeping mom healthy during her pregnancy, etc before you ever put two snakes together. There's just too much at stake. I lost a female GTP a few seasons ago because my fiance put the male in her cage while cleaning and he immediately locked up with her. That one time was all it took for her to become gravid and she somehow didn't have enough calcium or dumped too much into the eggs too soon and she died of hypocalcemia even with vet care. I know several breeders who have been breeding for 10+ years have lost females to egg-binding. So much can happen- you really need to do research and be prepared and know what to expect so you can tell when something isn't right.

I am not trying to be hard on you or a downer or anything of the sort, just a dose of reality. I always quarantined my animals for 1-2 months, and I still had something get one of my snakes that I've had for years sick. I lost her and I am kicking myself, wishing I'd maybe been just a bit more careful in the past. I am now at 3-6 months for quarantining ANY newcomer, even if it came from the best breeder in the world. But I can't change the past. All I can do is try to help others learn from my mistakes.

[TeaNinja]

Ive only seen 3 dummies up for grabs in cali .... There not dime a dozen where i live ..... Would love to be provin wrong though so i can start a dum club

i live in north cali and i got my 5 1/2 foot male dumerils for FREE from someone who was moving or some crap. They aren't rare, you can still charge 50-200$ for nice babies, but i wouldn't consider dums to be a "rare" snake. i was considering getting a female to breed at some point.

[Dumeril daddy]

Nah there not rare as a breed but rare to see for sale ive only found my 2 i got for free and another im tryn to get in southern cali other then thAt what i meant was look how many pythons and redtails and so on and so fourth thats all i was sayin

[infernalis]

I'm in a tough position here...

Sure the exchange of information here has stirred a bit of emotions in the replies.

No need to look for hostility, the information is good, let's try not to lose the conversation in argument.

Please keep the replies civil folks.

Any more personal jabs, I will shut down the thread. ;)

[Swan]

Brother your not qualified to have those snakes! I'm a bos keeper, for one if your feeding a three year old boa mice your starving them and it's no wonder they are so small! A boa that age should be on jumbo rats or rabbits! You need to find someone that can help you, your snakes shouldn't suffer because of your negligence. To put a new snake directly in with your collection is, for a better word, pretty dang stupid. Remember we all have to learn, don't get ahead of yourself. Also with the little knowledge you have you should not worry about breeding. Like the other response said "dead snakes".

[Jay]

WOW i used to enjoy this forum but how can you guys down this kid remember when you first started ...or were you all experts ...probably and all of you probly have done worse but didn't post it let the guy do what he wants its his not yourrs
good riddance

[NennaMeerkat]

I agree with ya Jay the atmosphere in this particular thread is rather demeaning and hostile. Now not everyone is being that way but there is more than one person who could have said things in a much better way.

[Jay]

what every ist
ts just a ***** forum there are 1000 more just like it

[infernalis]

Sorry folks, putting this one to bed.