Few Questions About Dumerils

[Dietrich]

Greetings,

I've tried to keep to just lurking but, I had some questions that hopefully you lot can help me out a bit with.

I bought a healthy Dumerils neonate (about 10-12") about two and a half weeks ago, this would be my first boa as, I've previously kept ball pythons in the past.

I'm a little concerned with my snake showing no interest in eating, as I've tried once a week on the weekly anniversary that the breeder had been feeding her. So far I've just tried thawed frozen fuzzies. I'm not sure what the general practice on here is but, I've always been told (as well as practiced) feeding my snakes in a separate enclosure to not associate their main housing with feeding to reduce accidental bites. However, when ever I put her in the small feeding tank she becomes very active and seems to want to find a way out - perhaps she's stressed from the change of environment and thus is not interested in eating?

Since I've read this species of boas are prone to stress I try to keep things comfy for her. Her enclosure is about a 10gallon tank, mesh top, infrared heat lamp kept at 85* or so, ample source of water and monitored humidity levels (medium as, I also mist every 2-3 days), a small half log to hide under and aspen bedding for her to burrow. I also haven't picked her up very much because, I'm still waiting for her to adjust and feel secure.

From a bit of reading I've done, these snakes typically hibernate in May-August since those are the coldest months in Madagascar but, maybe those months don't necessarily apply since it's obviously colder here now. Honestly, I've no idea how to tell if a snake is in hibernation or not lol. Not sure if it matters but, she hasn't shown any signs of shedding either.
I figure that I'll try the old washing the thawed mouse off with soap and water for her next feeding. If that doesn't work then perhaps I can give the lizard scented spray a try and, lastly a live mouse. All within week intervals of course.

Any suggestions, corrections, hints are more than welcomed.

[TeaNinja]

Greetings,

I've tried to keep to just lurking but, I had some questions that hopefully you lot can help me out a bit with.

I bought a healthy Dumerils neonate (about 10-12") about two and a half weeks ago, this would be my first boa as, I've previously kept ball pythons in the past.

I'm a little concerned with my snake showing no interest in eating, as I've tried once a week on the weekly anniversary that the breeder had been feeding her. So far I've just tried thawed frozen fuzzies. I'm not sure what the general practice on here is but, I've always been told (as well as practiced) feeding my snakes in a separate enclosure to not associate their main housing with feeding to reduce accidental bites. However, when ever I put her in the small feeding tank she becomes very active and seems to want to find a way out - perhaps she's stressed from the change of environment and thus is not interested in eating?

Since I've read this species of boas are prone to stress I try to keep things comfy for her. Her enclosure is about a 10gallon tank, mesh top, infrared heat lamp kept at 85* or so, ample source of water and monitored humidity levels (medium as, I also mist every 2-3 days), a small half log to hide under and aspen bedding for her to burrow. I also haven't picked her up very much because, I'm still waiting for her to adjust and feel secure.

From a bit of reading I've done, these snakes typically hibernate in May-August since those are the coldest months in Madagascar but, maybe those months don't necessarily apply since it's obviously colder here now. Honestly, I've no idea how to tell if a snake is in hibernation or not lol. Not sure if it matters but, she hasn't shown any signs of shedding either.
I figure that I'll try the old washing the thawed mouse off with soap and water for her next feeding. If that doesn't work then perhaps I can give the lizard scented spray a try and, lastly a live mouse. All within week intervals of course.

Any suggestions, corrections, hints are more than welcomed.

i have a 5 1/2ish foot dumerils and i just got him a month or two ago from someone who was rehoming him. i had the exact same problem with my dum not wanting to eat when i moved him. the guy said he always fed him in a big cardboard box, but he did NOT seem interested. he just looked at the rat, and then climbed out of the box. i tried the bathtub also cuz my friend used to feed his red tail in his, but he just climbed out again. i thought about it and figured he was either stressed from the move, or he needed a few days to heat up for digestion. i kept trying the box and tub for a week or so and he did NOT seem interested. so finally one day i decided, screw it, he's super docile as is, i DOUBT he'll ever see my hand as prey taking him out, and i put the rat in his tank and he took it instantly. ever since, i've been feeding him in his viv and he never shows any signs of aggression or anything being taken out of the viv or being handled.
snakes do slow everything down in the winter, but if the cage is nice and warm and he's got water and hides and everything he needs he should eat. my suggestion is wait a week or two before attempting to give him another meal, so he'll be hungry. then if he doesn't want to eat in the feeding container, try to feed him in his viv.

when i got my snake he was in a 40 gallon glass tank with a under tank heater, with no regulator on it so it just got super hot all the time, and he only had 1 hide. i immediately stopped using the UTH so he wouldn't cook himself on it, and switched to above lightning and i bought him a 4x2x2 wooden viv, because not only are glass tanks harder to maintain heat/humidity in, but a 5+ foot snake needs more then a 40 gallon tank.

i made him a second hide in the cold side, and he's been eating normally and shedding in 1 piece and seems healthy and happy. also my dum eats live, i've been thinking of switching to f/t just cuz its safer and more humane, but have yet to. feel free to ask me any more questions, if you have any.

http://i1006.photobucket.com/albums/af184/teaninja/cage002.jpg
http://i1006.photobucket.com/albums/af184/teaninja/cage001.jpg
http://i1006.photobucket.com/albums/af184/teaninja/newviv005.jpg

[TeaNinja]

oh yea, and i switched from aspen bedding to reptibark/coconut shred mixture because it holds moisture MUCH better and people told me aspen molds and such.

[Lankyrob]

My BP is a nervous eater - i put a small tub INSIDE his enclosure and put him in that to feed him - he is then pretty much in his own environment and has eaten for me consistently since i started doing this.

[shaunyboy]

im not trying to be cheeky mate

re feeding out the tank

if you applied the very same logic that.....

feeding in the tank can make a snake bitey as it associates the tank door opening with being fed

then surely it would associate being taken out the tank with being fed ?

so associate being taken out as bieng fed

so be bitey when you take it out

its nothing personal its just people who apply this logic only ever seem to apply it to the parts that suits them.instead of applying it to the whloe scenario mate

i feed carpets into double figures in their tanks

none of mine are bitey

with the exception of a few psycotic jungles that bite every chance they get regardless of where they are.

in or out the tank.even after handling for their first 18 months their still nuts

cheers shaun

[shaunyboy]

give the prey item a really good heat ( i use a hair dryer)

then once its hot take a pair of sharp ended scissors and brain the food item

puncture the skull in 2 to 4 places so grey brain matter seeps out

then give the puncture holes a quick heat and offer to your boa

ask the last owner what he was feeding them on and if they had any rituals to do in order to get them to feed

i hope you get them eating mate

keep in mind snakes can go long amounts of time with out eating to no ill effect

cheers shaun

[Dietrich]

TeaNinja: Interesting that you experience the same problem initially. Honestly, I didn't know the bit about using a wooden enclosure versus a glass one, may have to keep that in thought for when I switch her housing. I've also heard the bit about aspen molding but, have never had that problem in the past how ever, I've also not had a snake that requires much of a humidity level. I do have some coconut husk but, haven't given it a try yet - perhaps I should give that a go.
I've also considered feeding her in her main tank as, Dumerils seem to hold a strong reputation for being very docile.

Rob: One of the BP's I had was also a very picky eater. Got to a point where one of them would just kill the prey and then leave it. Turned out to be bit of a mean snake to my surprise.

Shaun: I see what you're saying about the feeding location/procedure. I suppose it would depend upon the intelligence of the species but, I'd say the main train of thought behind the idea of feeding them in a different enclosure is that, they'd hopefully only actually associate being a certain tank with feeding and not when ever their main is opened, thus not feeding them in their main so they don't confuse feeding with any time the lid is opened. I would guess it's a matter of what works for some people and not so much with others lol, I don't know. Thanks for the tips though man.

[Marica]

We picked up 2 Dums this year, one an 09 the other born this year and both were from breeders in BC. They both took about month to a month and a half to get eating. Our 09 I later found out was probably being fed live, which could have been the reason for his refusals. At first we had to slit the skull to get him interested, now thankfully he'll take them unmodified, but does prefer them dry (a few moments under a hair dryer) and will only eat in his enclosure. Our baby has taken to eating in a feeding tub which we line with paper towel and cover with the lid and a blanket. Despite the different feeding methods, they are both quite calm and I have not noticed that the one we fed in tank is any more aggressive.

Ours are in 20L tanks (though a 10g is probably adequate) with UTHs regulated to around 88-90, hides on the warm and cool side, with plenty of substrate (we use aspen) to bury in as they seem to enjoy to do so and lots of other cover to make up for our larger tanks. Belly heat does help with digestion, though a lot of snakes seem to do alright with a light/heat source. Another downside to lights is they evaporate a lot of the moisture from a tank, though a custom enclosure like TeaNinja's will maintain humidity (and heat) much better than a glass tank with a screen lid.

Another thing I've noticed with my Dums is that unless I catch them with their eyes glazed over it's very difficult to tell if they are in shed, which also seems to last for quite some time. We add a moist hide when they are in shed and mist more frequently.

As for the hibernation-like state, brumation, I would assume they would adjust to their current environment's climate. However, if you are maintaining steady temps in the viv I would assume they would be less likely to go into brumation mode.

[TeaNinja]

my snake has only shed once while i've had him, and now that you mentioned it, it WAS alittle hard to tell. i saw his eyes cloud over and then they cleared up a day or two later so i knew it was shed time. i sprayed all over him with a spray bottle and went to my friends, and when i came back that night he was already done shedding in 1 piece lol.

[Dietrich]

TeaNinja: Clouded eyes is what I usually look for as, some times it can be a tad tricky to tell from the skin hue alone if there isn't any torn bits of skin to shed.

Marica: Thank-you for sharing your experience. I actually don't have a hide yet but, it really seems like I should. I've always kept away from heat pads in fear of it possibly burning the snake's underside, though I suppose with a proper thermostat with a timer that would be less likely to occur. I don't suppose you got your Dumerils from Henry did you?

[Marica]

Yes, our little 2010, Johann (pictured below) was purchased from Henry at this summer's WCRE in Red Deer. Perhaps ours are from the same litter? I find Johann uses the hides even more so than our other Dum. Do you have any pics of your little one?

I've been using ZooMed UTHs for several years regulated by lamp dimmers, ZooMed ReptiTemp 500Rs and Herpstats without issue. Though I only use the dimmers on tanks in rooms where the temperature doesn't fluctuate much. I also have 5 cages (3 that I built myself) with Flexwatt regulated by thermostats.

http://www.iherp.com/Gallery/91837/51667_108128_Large_qKIC0Nb2mABFxU.jpg

[Ch^4]

^^ Beautiful and quite adorable little Dums you have there! I really like his coloration with hints of salmon. You Dums owners are making not purchasing a Dums difficult for me!

[Dietrich]

Nice Marica, it's possible they're from the same litter. I actually picked up my Dum' from Henry's "office" if you will, he certainly has quite the collection but, it was cool to see the adult Dums he had - some thing to look forward to!

There's no question that I'm going to have to upgrade a few things when my snake gets a bit bigger, I may have to give a UTH a try then. Feeding day tomorrow so, hopefully I'll have some luck. No photos of my snake atm, will do in a couple weeks though when I get my new camera.

[Marica]

I've seen vids of Henry's facility and pics of his adult Dums, all quite impressive. I believe he has 2 breeding pairs so it's a 50/50 chance we have sibs. Is yours male or female? Hope your feeding goes well tonight. Ours both ate last night, Sebastian struck and coiled the f/t rat fuzzy, while Johann gingerly worked his mouth around the f/t rat pinks :rolleyes:

I've wanted a Dum since seeing a pic of one in a snake book about 15 years ago. I had trouble getting in touch with Henry, then saw an ad from Sam at SHP this past spring and picked one up from him. But when Henry showed up at the Red Deer show this past summer and we saw his stunning babies, my bf practically ran to the ATM. Ch^4, thanks, Johann was the lightest and pinkest out of the bunch and why we just couldn't resist.

Look forward to keeping touch Dietrich. I'm a bit of a boa newb, though I've had Corns for many years. There also seems to be influx of new Dum keepers here which should be great resources.