How long to wait before launching Paypal dispute for non-sent animals?

[Will0W783]

I have a problem, and I'm not quite sure what the etiquette is on it, as I've never had a deal go bad before- I could use some advice here. I saw on Kingsnake a few weeks ago an ad for Jackson's chameleons, $125 a pair shipped with gravid females. They were from Color Creations. My fiance really liked and wanted them so I ordered a pair. The guy was great at answering my questions and keeping in touch. I ordered them May 27, 2009 via Paypal. I was going on vacation June 4-9 and asked if I could have them shipped when I returned. He said no problem, he would hold me a pair with a gravid female. I got cages, a set up for keeping the babies, cage furnishings, mister and drip system. While on vacation I asked him what time he guaranteed arrival by- as far as I know, most overnight packages arrive by 8am, 10am, or 12noon, depending on which the shipper chooses. He told me he ships USPS and it would arrive "whenever my mail came". That got me a bit worried and I asked if he could ship guaranteed by 8 or 10 and I'd cover the difference. He refused, so I told him they'd have to shipped for arrival today, June 18, as my fiance would be home all day to receive them (he's off Thursdays). The last response I got from Color Creations was June 9, telling me not to worry, he shipped 100 boxes a week and never has problems, they'd be fine with his shipping method. I responded right away and asked for shipping the 17th to arrive the 18th and for him to let me know if he could. I have not heard anything either way since.
I sent him 2 emails yesterday, and one more last night around 10pm, asking him to please let me know if he was shipping. I have not heard a thing. Since it has been 10 days since I heard from him, I'm a bit worried. I have already paid for the pair, and I'm afraid he isn't going to send them.
How long should I wait for a response before I threaten to take this through Paypal for my money back? Is there anything else I should be doing? I've since found out some less than wonderful things about this seller, but nothing for about 2 years on him- he apparently is teen and his parents help him with his business. I wish I had checked him out more thoroughly before I bought from him; I should know better. But I didn't. I also dont' want to seem prematurely aggressive- I have never had this happen before and am not sure how best to handle it. :confused:
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Kimberly Urban
Carter's Critters
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[Aaron_S]

I read your other thread. Really this entire thing belongs on the BOI, not here. Everyone there will gladly assist you with this issue. As well as you need to notify Color Creations of your thread so they have a chance to respond to it. If you want to wait any longer then give the guy the weekend to respond to you. I think you should use the BOI tonight though.

[gonesnakee]

Is it not illegal to ship them with the postal service there? I know the US has some funny rules compared to us here in Canada were live reptiles can NOT be mailed. Even if they could I would not ship or receive any that way, same goes for couriers. Mark

[Will0W783]

I sent him an email last night saying if I didn't hear from him I would put a BOI thread up and launch a Paypal dispute on Monday. Well, I got an email last night saying he had a family emergency and had been out of town and would ship them next week. We'll see. Anyway, if I have any more problems I'll just go to the BOI.

[gonesnakee]

Check with PayPal & see what your timeframe is to do so as well.
Some sellers use stall tactics to make that time frame elapse making it immpossible to get the $ back. Something to consider anyways, Mark

[Tuteuk]

Check with PayPal & see what your timeframe is to do so as well.
Some sellers use stall tactics to make that time frame elapse making it immpossible to get the $ back. Something to consider anyways, Mark


This is so true!!!...(bad experience) 45 days is the limit and be diligent...Once you make a claim to paypal they will make you jump a few hoops to get the bucks back. And negative feedback goes a long way to ruining a sellers day.

Good luck..:)

[Will0W783]

Well, I sent him an email Friday afternoon stating that if I didn't hear from him within the weekend, I would launch a Paypal dispute and a complaint on the BOI on Monday. Within 3 hours he emailed me saying he was out of town with a family emergency and apologized for not being on top of things but he would send them out this week or give me a refund. I opted to give him another chance to send them. We shall see. He said he'd check on the guaranteed arrival time, that was Saturday- haven't heard from him again since. If he doesn't ship them this week, he is getting another threat, then a dispute on his hands.

[Aaron_S]

There's always a family emergency with shady dealers. Seriously, go look at any "bad guy" thread on the BOI. Always happens.

[gonesnakee]

Business is Business, personal is personal. Nuff Said Mark
P.S. watch your deadline time for filing a PP dispute ;)

[Smilts]

Nicer than me I have little patience, as mentioned its always something then your 45 days are up and its over. I hope this isnt the case..

@Gonesnakee I think The UPS now has live animal shipping as long as the animal is on the list. Fedex is much better for shipping reptiles IMO.


these are the only reptiles on the ok list, no snakes at all but you can ship a water moniter go figure.
Reptiles (Limited to the following):
- Lizards: Examples: chameleons, geckos, iguanas, monitors, flying dragons

[siz]

I would try to get my money back over getting the chams at this point. This guy apparently deals with WC and sells them as CB, and he seems to have lots of family emergencys.

[Will0W783]

Well I heard from him today. He said his plane lands tomorrow night, so he could ship them Friday but I won't be home, and the soonest day when someone will be home all morning or all day is next Thursday. I told him this is the last chance to ship them. If I don't get them next week, I want my money back and if he won't give it to me, then he'll get a Paypal dispute. I know they are WC, but the female is pregnant, so I will have some babies I can raise up and sell to recoup some of the costs, or keep a few for future breeding projects. IF the guy sends them- I'm getting peeved, and I'm running out of patience. Next week is the LAST chance I'm going to give this guy.

[Kmef07]

Wow you are nice I would have flipped out on him by now and canceled my credit card payment. Call your bank and explain the problem. They will usually void the money transfer and then paypal will get on it right away. i think bank transactions can be voided because of problems for like 30 days after transfer. But that way paypal will think they are loosing money and get on the problem quick.

[gonesnakee]

I'm not much of a fan of folks that sell/ship gravid animals either, Mark

[Aaron_S]

I'm not much of a fan of folks that sell/ship gravid animals either, Mark

I was about to say the same thing. You're either going to kill the female or lose all the eggs for what? Just so you can have a chance at babies?

[Will0W783]

I know...she got preggers though and the guy still wants to send them to me. I'm still debating what I want to do.

[siz]

If she 'got' pregnant, something to consider would be why? They must have been housed together which, as you know, is poor practice..who knows what other poor practices this guy follows?
Obviously it is up to you and I am not trying to change your opinion or choice.

[Aaron_S]

Personally, I'd just get my money back. Find a better deal somewhere else.

[Will0W783]

Ok, guys. I will see what I can do. Thank you for all your advice! :)

[siz]

Good luck!:)

[Will0W783]

Thanks Jess- I will let you guys know how it turns out.

[Will0W783]

Well, my chameleons FINALLY arrived today. Both survived the trip, although the female looks quite skinny. They are set up in their screen cage with dripper and mister, and I am getting them a hibiscus and maybe a ficus today, at least a few plants on the safe list. Hopefully they will do well for me. Here are pictures of them on my fiance's hand.

[gonesnakee]

Skinny as in no longer "gravid" that doesn't surprise me.
Maybe he was just holding out until after she dropped her clutch? Mark

[carciady]

It sounds like you have been ripped off for the eggs, if she is skinny then she has already layed them. She now needs feeding back up to full health as it takes a lot out of her. Nice pics, I wish you well with them. Ady