Imorting Turltes from Taiwan?

[Kyle Barker]

I have moved to Taiwan recently and am currently keeping a few things (not keeping turtles yet). I have also come in contact with many farmers and breeders of plants and animals. I am having a hard time getting solid info on turtles. There are a few types im looking at, their english/scientific names i still cannot find as of yet but i should have them shortly.... I know 1 is a softshell, and another they call "Brazilian White". anyway I would really appreciate any links anyone may have. All of these animals are captive bred, and from the peoples houses i have seen them bred at they seem to be kept quite nicely (for pets not food).

Im also thinking maybe a couple types of lizards and snakes, but they seem to be easier to get info on.

This site says turtles are not allowed to be imported. correct?
From: "http://airs-sari.inspection.gc.ca/AIRS/airs_requirements.asp"
Importer / Broker Instructions

DOCUMENTATION INSTRUCTIONS

The import of these animals from this/these countries is currently prohibited. A risk assessment may be required before the development of import conditions could be considered. If you wish more information on the risk assessment process, please contact your nearest CFIA Import Office.

The very same site says this for freshwater turtles with no country specified.
Import Details for Requirement: 22067 Version: 6

HS Description: 020850
02 Meat and Edible Meat Offal
08 Other meat and edible meat offal, fresh, chilled or frozen.
50 Of reptiles (including snakes and turtles)
OGD Extension: 801302
8013 Turtles and tortoise
02 Turtles - freshwater

Recommendations to Customs / Documentation and Registration Requirements

Approved

Importer / Broker Instructions

CONDITIONS OF IMPORT

- Is subject to packaging and labelling, composition and food safety requirements in accordance with the Food and Drugs Act and Consumer Packaging and Labelling Act and their Regulations.
- Labelling must be in French and English for prepackaged products sold at retail.
- United States "Nutrition Facts" information is not permitted; label claims must comply with the Regulations.

Must be free of pathogenic bacteria.

ADDITIONAL INSTRUCTIONS

*** Please note that border lookouts and targets take precedence over import requirements indicated in the AIRS. ***

- Any import inspection services provided by CFIA staff are subject to a CFIA user fee. Inspections carried out by a CBSA officer are not subject to a CFIA user fee except those inspections that were provided by a CFIA inspector prior to Dec.12/03, which continue to be subject to the applicable fee set out in the CFIA Fees Notice, whether the service is provided by a CFIA inspector or a CBSA inspector/officer.
- May be subject to requirements of Other Government Departments.
- Contact an Import Service Centre for further information.

WOOD PACKAGING MATERIAL (if applicable):
Brokers/ Importers should attest to one of the following with respect to the packaging material being used to ship the product:
- "Wood packaging contained with shipment displays the ISPM No. 15 compliant stamp."
OR
- " Wood packaging material is accompanied by a Phytosanitary Certificate, ie. approved treatment per ISPM No. 15. "
OR
- "Wood packaging material is made out of manufactured wood which is exempted from ISPM No. 15."
OR (when it applies)
- "No wood packaging contained with shipment."

Attention - EDI/ACROSS clients - To ensure auto approval of this commodity by the CFIA, you must press "Print" to obtain the codes necessary to complete your electronic release transmission. Failure to submit these codes will result in a machine reject message from the CFIA.

Additional References

Consumer Packaging and Labelling Act and Regulations To view the Consumer Packaging and Labelling Act and Regulations, please refer to our website http://www.inspection.gc.ca/english/reg/rege.shtml or contact the nearest Import Service Centre for further information.

Food and Drug Act and Regulations - Frog legs Regulated by sections B.21.031 of the Food and Drugs Act and Regulations.

Food and Drugs Act and Regulations - General


Thanks for any help!

kyle

[Wu-Gwei]

I worked in Taiwan for five years and I have brought back (imported) turtles into Canada from Taiwan. I will tell yuo this... if you import one or two turtles it is not worth it. The shipping via cargo is about C$150-200 and it is risky since the temps of the cargoholds are not gauranteed. I had lost three turtles and airlines are not responsible. You also need a CDN Import Permit as well (C$35). You can import, but it caused me more headaches. FYI, you can get chinese softshelled turtles cheaply, about $40 in GTA. As for the white brazilian turtle... a Brazilian turtle in Chinese is called (ba shi guei), which is a RES (red eared slider). I would guess a white Brazilian turtle may be an albino RES.

Give me a PM if you really want to import and need any assistance IDing any turtles. BTW, if you had a CITES animal, you will not be able to get a CITES export permit from Taiwan. I have looked into it. Many turtles in Taiwan and in Asia are illegally imported, so they can not get proper documents from CITES for export.


Cheers,
JJ;)

[Kyle Barker]

Thanks a ton man! im assuming chinese softshells are cheap cause of farming? i will pm you next time i go visit, i dont have any pics right now.

the white brazilian definatly arnt red ear sliders. they are very similar in appearance except the red ears are white and their shell seems a little more pointy at the top. if my memory serves.....i wasnt paying much attention to them as i was the snakes :o

thanks again!

[Wu-Gwei]

Give me Chinese names (written) and/or pics, I will be able to help you ID. I am curious now what the Brazilian white now. :)

Chinese softies are very easy to raise and breed. I am not sure how they are getting Chinese softies into Canada. Perhaps smuggling them or importing under false pretences (i.e. personal usage or food) and then selling them commercially as pets.

BTW, where is this farm? Southern Taiwan? Kaohsiung area? Pingtung?


Cheers,
JJ;)

[alexandsnakes]

've tried inquiring about the chinese softshells in asian grocery stores, and even the freshly-dead looking ones I'm told are farmed in Taiwan, killed there, quickly frozen and merely thawed out to be sold (still not sure why I've seen the butchers hacking off heads of pre-killed turtles in Richmond BC?) Nut the ones in the fresh meat case are identical in size to the ones you see frozen.
I think given how small softshells are when they hatch, it's more a case of people putting them in their pockets after a trip down to the US. I've bought more than one turtle I'm pretty sure that got into Canada that way, 'cause they're unusually species for up here but were sold pretty cheap by people with only one or two,
Brazilian sliders, T. dorbignyi, are quite distinctive as RES, with very bright red ears. I too am curious about these "Brazilian whites"

[Kyle Barker]

Yes i am close to Pingdong (Yempu), and so are the turtles. I'm not sure which county they are in actually...dont knowthe border, but that area. So by the sounds of it chinese softshells are not legally allowed to enter canada? i think i remember reading that it is illegal to transport softshells (and things like wall lizards, native herps etc) in BC, but not sure.

The brazilian whites were in a large fish store in pingdong city, perhaps you know the one? Next time i go there i will bring my camera and ask if i can get some pics so that i can get an english name...shouldnt be a prob.

One other thing. there was a pet vendor at the Kaohsiung night market yesterday who had a very pretty snake. it had a banana boa look about it, sort of a dull medium gray and a dulled orange stripe down its back going the whole length. the name given was "蛋蛋蛇" which means "egg snake". Im assuming this is jsut a dumb name the guy gave them to help sell? any ideas? he said they are wild in taiwan. from my own google searches i though maybe this "Oligodon formosanus". but this site seems to say its only present in vietnam. http://arcbc.org/cgi-bin/abiss.exe/spd?tx=RE&spd=903
but this site certainly says they are there.....in 1909/1910 anyway. http://www.calacademy.org/research/herpetology/catalog/BrwsHerpRecDisp.asp?Atr=Genus&Val=Oligodon

they looked very very close to this: http://mdsesd.mds.com.tw/~kinmatsu/animal/snake-1.html

[Wu-Gwei]

Kyle, I know little about snakes, but I have a lot of Tawainese herp fans and I am sure they will be able to tell me what 蛋蛋蛇 (egg-egg snake) is.

My wife lives in Fangliao, Pingtung County, it's the last train stop before you go to Kenting. I know the big fish store you're talking about in Pingtung City - I think. I find businesses in Taiwan come and go quickly. I was just in Taiwan last summer, but did not get a chance to go fish/herp hunting in stores.

It sounds like you are "wai guo ren" (not Chinese), and I think many stores will let a wai guo ren take pictures more readily than local Chinese. Cause, many stores carry illegal animals (illegally imported) and afraid of being ratted out.

About importing... you can import turtles into Canada legally and easily, but you cannot use them for commercial purposes. I am sure many are brought in over the border and not imported (most), and some do import legally and then sell it. Cause it is difficult for CFIA to regulate what you do with the turtles after you bring them in to the country.

I don't know regs for BC spefically, but BC does not regulate the border, it's done by Canadian Customs and CFIA. So, once you import the animals, they need to follow BC laws and also your local municipal laws. For example, if I imported a common musk from US into BC. I can keep it in BC no prob, but I cannot keep it if I lived in Ontario. Although you can import over the border, you need to follow the laws of your jurisdiction.

Alexandsnakes, in Chinese, they call RES "Brazilian turtles." I highly doubt they have T. dorbignyi.


Cheers,
JJ;)

[Kyle Barker]

excellent thanks a ton! so is it the same with all turtles? all reptiles? all animals? cant import for commercial use, ie pets? thats what i was wanting to do, as a side buisiness. and legal is a must, i dont want to risk being deported and not welcome....

ya im 6'3" and as white as tehy come :rolleyes: i stick out like a sore thumb, but people here are great! ive noticed theres kind of an unspoken secnd set of rules for foreigners, we seem to be able to do a lot more things just cause people are so nice (and curious!). so pics should come soon :) on a side note, theres a lot of 7-11's!!!!:bugged:

i think i know Fangliao. we went to kenting when i first came here, very pretty. going again within the next couple weeks...interesting hiking.

thanks again man!