Finally found a vet! Now how do I do this?

[tuper]

And I couldn't be any happier! I looked through all the listings in the phone book and NONE of them said they saw exotics. I was whining to a friend of mine about it and she helped me find one that saw them! Yay! :groove:

So I took Sorin in today to figure out what was wrong with him. Turns out the doc had to squeeze the sh*t out of him......literally! It was very gross, the poor thing was backed WAAAAAAAAAAAAY up! The doctor said I needed to get more fiber in him. :dumb: How do I do that????

I have some metamucil, and th doc said I could cover the mouse in it, but im afraid that he will refuse the mouse because of the smell. So, what can I feed the mouse to make sure my snake gets enough fiber?

Oh, the joys of snake ownership! They need one of those "For Dummies" books on Ball Pythons! But at least my snake is going to be ok! Yay!

[rrrrr]

How big is your snake, and what is he/she eating? Hair acts as a natural fibre for snakes, so if he's eating pinkies or even fuzzies, you may want to move him up to small adults. Actually, even very young ball pythons should be able to eat fairly mature mice.

[Ron]

I think you just found another vet who doesn't know much about snakes. I bet he would have passed all of that with a good soak. Keep him well hydrated and he'll poop when he has to poop. I've had snakes poop and you would swear that there was another snake in there, lol. No extra fibre required, just high quality rodents and clean water.

Ron

[Ciddian]

Yea i was going to say you could always feed your rodents more fiber too... but then you prolly have frozen. lol Silly me.. not as easy to gut load like crix are ~_~! hehe

Your vet had to squeeze the heck outta the snake? That sounds so odd to me and very stressful..O_o hope your snake buddy is alright!

[jjpython]

a young ball python should be started on rat right from the get go...... the rule of thumb is that is the snake is able to take a large rat full grown it should be able to take a small rat as a baby, works for most snakes, plus you dont have to switch them over later on....
just my 2 cents

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[Bluzmn59]

I have a little guy that is only about four months old and he now pounds a pinkie rat every 5 days. I am getting ready to move him up to fuzzies once a week. He seems to have no problem defecating. It took a little patience to get him to eat the first rat when I got him, but now he nails them with no hesitation. I agree with starting them on rats right away when they are young - it is harder to switch them over when they are older.

[tuper]

Let me tell you, this snake has been a HUGE stress to me ever since we got him! I am SO attached to the darn little thing, I don't want anything to happen to him! We have only had him about a month, and he was in pretty bad shape when we first got him. But now I think he's going to be okay.

Nope, a soak wasn't cutting it! I soaked the heck outta him, and all he would pass was pee. The amount of (hard) poo that came out of the poor thing when the doc was working with him was amazing. It was literally a foot of poo, and the snake is only two feet long! The doc also said that the skulls of the mice are soemtimes hard to digest, and that I should probably stick with smaller sized mice for now, until he gets his "movements" back in order. I do feed live (my hubby and I argue about this one,) but he is placed in his special eating box and never left unattended with the mouse. So that's why I thought I might could feed the mice something to benefit the snake. There are only two pet stores in this area that sell feeder mice, and neither will pre-kill them or sell frozen. (My hubby insists on feeding live anyway! I almost had him convinced at one point, but he changed his mind when it was too hard to find them around here. :( )

Anyway, thanks fot the well wishes! He moves around his cage much more now that he can actually move! Hahahaha!

[Bluzmn59]

http://www.rodentpro.com/index.asp

Not to be too harsh, but there is no good reason to feed live.

[jjpython]

I have a little guy that is only about four months old and he now pounds a pinkie rat every 5 days. .

wow a whole pinkie rat you must really not like your snake, you think a pinkie rat every 5 days will satisfy your snake.....nope try moving up to 14-21 day old rats usually 30-60grams my new ball python is about 2 months and is eating f/t 60g rats every 6-8 days.

[HerpAddict]

You could always buy the mice (if that's what you really want to stick to) live, and then pre-kill or freeze them yourself.

If you're in GA, then I would suggest rodent pro. Switching to rats will save you money in the long run, because you'll be feeding multiple mice, when it could be just one rat.

What is your husband's argument for feeding live?

[Bluzmn59]

wow a whole pinkie rat you must really not like your snake, you think a pinkie rat every 5 days will satisfy your snake.....nope try moving up to 14-21 day old rats usually 30-60grams my new ball python is about 2 months and is eating f/t 60g rats every 6-8 days.


Wonderful attitude. No, you are right, I hate my snakes, know nothing about raising them and have no way to estimate correct size and frequency of feeding. Oh please, enlighten me with some more of your wisdom Obi-wan.

[jjpython]

Wonderful attitude. No, you are right, I hate my snakes, know nothing about raising them and have no way to estimate correct size and frequency of feeding. Oh please, enlighten me with some more of your wisdom Obi-wan.

dude quit being stupid.....

so your trying to say that you feeding your ball python a pinkie rat is perfectly fine at four months of age trust me i have much experience with snakes, i own the large consrtictors , i own/owed a burms, retics, anacondas, bci, scrubs, and mostly all of them i got them when there we babies, so i know that feeding a pinkie rat to a ball python is just not enough food, i just tried to let you know that you should feed bigger prey. and the ball i own is not my first,

[Bluzmn59]

dude quit being stupid.....

so your trying to say that you feeding your ball python a pinkie rat is perfectly fine at four months of age trust me i have much experience with snakes, i own the large consrtictors , i own/owed a burms, retics, anacondas, bci, scrubs, and mostly all of them i got them when there we babies, so i know that feeding a pinkie rat to a ball python is just not enough food, i just tried to let you know that you should feed bigger prey. and the ball i own is not my first,

Not really interested in your resume, dude, nor am I interested in your smart-a** attitude. But I am impressed with your ability to decide size of prey and feeding intervals for a snake you have never even seen, as well as telling me how much I "like" my animals. I will have to go tell my veterinarian wife how wrong we have been all these years.

Now, if only I could discuss that "stupid" comment in person with you...........

[hbwright]

wow a whole pinkie rat you must really not like your snake, you think a pinkie rat every 5 days will satisfy your snake.....nope try moving up to 14-21 day old rats usually 30-60grams my new ball python is about 2 months and is eating f/t 60g rats every 6-8 days.

There is nothing wrong with feeding conservatively. Different snakes mature differently depending on a lot of factors. Even two snakes from the same clutch can grow very differently, not to say that one is healthier then the other.

I have always fed on a more conservative side and have had healthy, well growing snakes.

I think the "you must really not like your snake" was wrong. There is nothing wrong with giving somebody your opinion and bringing up a concern, but this comment was too far out there. EVEN if he was doing something that could cause long term harm to his snake there is no reason to jump on him like this without first trying to get the specifics and trying to help him from there.

[jjpython]

i was just saying that a pinkie no matter what size ball python is to little. and yes saying that he really doenst like his snake was a little much and i appologize. but i just want to know why ppl keep feeding there ball pythons mice, and pinkie rat. everyone knows they can eat a adult mouse when the hatch so y not feed them the equvilent in rat form like fuzzy or hopper. thats all im trying to say. ive seen too many ball pythons eating like 4-5 adult mice when they wont take rats, skip mice all together and give them a rat to start off with, then you dont have to switch later on, savew the trouble.....

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[joeysgreen]

While there is obviously a difference in opinions here, I agree that while snakes can take a lot of food, often, especially when young, there is no need. A pinkie every 5 days is a bit on the slim side, but not on the negligeable side IMO.

With that said though, the snakes problem of constipation may be related to the feeding schedule and a change in pattern and size of prey may help tremendously. You mentioned you're about to switch to a larger size, well, try a good size prey item weekly or every 10 days. This will make the guts work, and also give them a time for rest.

As per the vet; enemas and manipulation is often needed to help snakes void , well, snakes with this problem anyways. I hope sedation was used...
The idea for additional fibre is lacking without any suggestions along with it. I think this is a case for the vet knowing what may help, but not correlating dog versus snake knowledge. The suggestion was based on a "it could only help" theory, which is not a bad thing when coming from an otherwise knowledgeable person.

Ian

[tuper]

Wow, you guys have got me all paranoid now! :medfroner

The snake is approximately 2 years old and about 25 inches long, but has a narrower head than most it's size (that I've seen pictures of, anyway.) The vet himself told me that SMALLER meals were the way to go because the digestion of the skulls may have been what was backing it up. (Where's the pulling the hair out emoticon?)

I have only had him/her a little over a month, and for a little background, it was basically a rescue that came to me in dehydrated shape to begin with. It had retained TWO sheds, and wasn't eating. I have never owned a snake before in my life, so I am trying to learn.

I DO trust the opinions of the folks on this board, or I wouldn't have even come here. I DO know that vets can not be as knowledgeable about some things sometimes. It's just all so confusing at times, when there are different opinions. I am learning that reptiles are not that easy to take care of! (Ask me ANYTHING about horse care, I am a walking encyclopedia on equines! Hahahaha!)

*sigh* All I want to do is help this little critter out, and keep him/her happy and healthy for many years. Although, along with my lack of knowledge about snakes, I have a hubby. (Married gals might understand where I'm coming from with this one!) I pick and choose my battles with him (although I do love him dearly.) For the most part, care of our pets falls on my "animal-loving" shoulders. But I practically had to beg to be allowed to get this snake, which I only took in the first place because it looked like death. So, in order to "sweeten the pot" (and convince him to let me rescue the snake) I said it could be his. He is the one who has dictated that the snake will eat live. I KNOW it's not good for them as far as injury goes, but my hands are basically tied AT THE MOMENT. I don't have any doubt in my mind that in time I can convince him to feed f/t, but I have to take my time convincing him. Like I said, I pick and choose my battles, and I know how hard to push. I can't push too hard for it, or he will explode on me and it will never happen. That's just the way he works. IF they had pre-killed available in this area, I would buy one and "slip" it in. However, they don't to my knowledge, and I have asked around several times. I have looked into RodentPro, but they were wanting over $60 (all at once) for like 25 small rats. OUCH! (Granted, I paid $50 for the vet visit, but to my hubby those expenses are different.) :medlotsae

Ok, so now that you know my life story (hahahaha) what other advice on what to feed do you have for me? I certainly can't kill the mouse on my own, but it handles them well and is ALWAYS supervised when fed. I feed one mouse, and then ofer a second, but the snake never seems interested in the other one. I REALLY don't want to feed a live rat (like EVER.) *sigh*

Here's my tank set up right now: Undertank heater to 92 degrees in the warm side, 70-84 degrees in the cool side (air temp, it gets cooler at night.) Humidity stayes between 60-70% with a large waterfall. Here is a pic:
http://i2.photobucket.com/albums/y27/tuperdoo/IMGP1727.jpg

Here is a pic of him/her in the bath:
http://i2.photobucket.com/albums/y27/tuperdoo/snakeswim.jpg

[joeysgreen]

Really quickly, I noticed that you're temps are on the cool side. Double check them with others and care sheets, books ect. but 92 seems okay for a hot side, BUT, because your heat pad is set to the temp, doesn't necessarily mean that will be the temp in the cage... you'll have to double check this. I do know however that if the cool end is in the low to mid 70's in a cage that size, then there is no way that the hot end is hot enough. The cool end should be no cooler than 80F in a smaller cage like yours (IMO) with perhaps a drop into the higher 70's at night.

Ian

ps, I"m in a rush tonight, so verify what I said with someone else :)

[hbwright]

How are you measuring your temps. The cool side has to come up somehow. With it being a glass tank I would put some insulation around the outside in the back and sides and keep the screen top covered (assuming there is a screen top). I would be concerned about the waterfall and that it is dampening the substrate which could cause scale rot.

As far as the ordering rodents, order more of them and keep them air tight packed in the back of the freezer and you can have them readily available for a long time and economically it ends up cheaper in the long run.

Long story short, I had a feeding accident years before I had the internet to educate me and when I brought my ball python (adult 4+ ft) to the vet they showed me a photo album FULL of feeding accident pictures including one that the rodent ate its way out of the snake from the inside out. I NEVER fed live again. The snake still died shortly after from what we presume was from parasites caused by live/fresh killed rodents. These rats were even bred by us so we assumed we were safe in that department. I can share pictures with you if you want to show them to your husband. I know mine was tempted to try live when Casey was hard to feed in the first few months with us and I had to use the visual proof of what a rodent could do to a snake in order to get him to change his mind. I know about the choosing the battles thing and this was one battle I didn't even have to think about fighting, it wasn't an option for me. Another option for you would be to make a home made O2 chamber, kill the rats and freeze them yourself. 24" should be able to take fuzzy rats but if fiber is an issue I might go ahead and stick to the mice since hair has been known to act as a natural fiber source for snakes. This is debatable by so many people it is hard to know. You'll find some who say that rats are always better and some that say to stick with mice until your snake is big enough to consume rats with hair at about the pup size. I have never used or made an O2 chamber but I know if you do a search you'll find that many people have and you can copy their instructions. Nobody likes killing small fuzzy animals, but it can be a necessary evil when it comes to caring for your pets.

Your snake is georgeous. I love his pattern. His head looks fine IMO in proportion to his body size. Ball pythons do have a small head compared to their plump bodies. Not so much as a blood but pretty close. LOL. One of the things I love about them.