shipper/breeder

[bcbob]

Recently, on several lists, there has been a curious display of badmouthing of a particular breeder/shipper. Anyone who reads these lists knows of whom I speak.

Well, I received a shipment from this man just last week, and it was impeccably packaged, snakes exactly as represented (beautiful) and in superb health,
perfectly priced, and the service and personal attention that he has provided for me goes WAY beyond the call of duty. I'm EXTREMELY (lol) pleased with everything about this transaction. I'm sorry that someone else thinks poorly of this guy. I don't.

Just thought I'd add a "counterpoint".

[gonesnakee]

Its kind of funny after being exposed pubicly that this person now starts doing things properly when shipping. Too bad this person risked all the reptiles lives they shipped prior to being pubicly exposed. Glad to hear shipping methods have changed as a direct result of all the public exposure to the previous substandard methods, Mark
P.S. Sounds like the promise is being kept to me from this person that he would never ship animals like he had in the past ever again, then again it might also have something to do with a "black flag" beside his name with Air Canada Cargo, as ACC stated they would be watching this individuals shipments very closely in the future as they were just as appalled as the rest of us with previous shipping methods praticed by this "man". NUFF SAID!

[gonesnakee]

Anyone that wants to hear how negligent this person was in the past in this persons OWN WORDS can email me at gonesnakee@shaw.ca & I will gladly forward the emails to you so you don't have to trust hearing it from me, you can hear it directly from him. If that don't convince ya, well I just don't know, but thats all I have to say in reguards to this. Mark

[tonyj]

Hello there! bcbob are you out there?

Of course you received a well packaged shipment, one would hardly expect it to arrive any otherway would one?

The recent photos and other well documented facts presented by 'gonesnakee' ensured that others including you, bcbob, would not have their animals delivered in the cargo hold of an airplane with nothing better than a Nike box and the latest edition of the Montreal Gazette to keep them from freezing their cloacas off!

This exposure has provided a service to the rest of us in the herp community, and was certainly not 'bad mouthing' as you so poorly put it.

As the original shipper has already agreed to modify his air shipment methods, many including you will benefit in future.

He has apparently done what he said he would do. Good for him, and a black mark to you for not realising that someone did you a great favour by bringing his previous shipping methods to light.

An apology to 'gonesnakee' or a big 'thank you' would be far more appropriate at this time, especially as you so smugly declare that your animals were 'impeccably packed' and in 'superb health'.

I wonder why?

[bcbob]

Well, tonyj, I certainly wasn't expecting such an aggressive response to my experiences. I think it to be totally unneccesary, frankly.

Listen, bad mouthing is bad mouthing....period. The message has been clearly sent, over and over and over. I simply stated another point of view. I'm very happy with my dealings with this supposed "criminal". Live with it.

I feel that this is nothing short of "mob lynching" and it disturbs me greatly. If this man has done you any injustice, then deal with him personally, rather than advertise your opinionated viewpoint in a public forum. It's already been clearly stated ( by those he's supposedely "ripped off") that he's made restitution in every sense possible, and unabashedely admitted his shortcomings. What else do you want? Blood?

If someone does "wrong" then let it be known. NO problems there. But don't beat it to death, especially if the person in question tries helpfully to make it right. We're ALL subject to mistake. However, it makes NO sense to try and assassinate the character of anyone without true evidence.

Btw, how many shipments from him have YOU received?

Ya, I'm here, BC BOB

[gonesnakee]

I guess its a question of morals. So as long as no one says anything its OK to knowingly put animals lives at risk repeatedly over & over again? Then when it is finally addressed a simple "sorry I won't do it again" will suffice? Maybe in your world BC Bob, but not in MINE.
The word "criminal" hadn't been used but now that you mention it people have mentioned laying charges & ACC has made reprimands internally as a direct result. This was not a first time shipper & he was fully knowledgable on how to do it properly but choose not to repeatedly over the years either for convienence or just lack of overall care of the specimens well being or maybe the extra cost of doing it right? Ask him, but he will claim ignorance.
No one ever said anything about being "ripped off" either BTW but call it what you will. Partial cash refund for an improperly sexed snakes does not change the facts that the individual has compromised many snakes lives in the past repeatedly despite his "knowledge" of them. A little bit of cash back doesn't change the FACT the health of the specimens was knowingly compromised.
If telling the truth & stating ones opinion is "bad mouthing" well then the truth hurts & call it what you will.
"mob lynching" as you put it is commonly refered to as a BOI or Board Of Inquiry & as our industry standards are not really regulated a BOI really gives herpers their own system of sorting out who's who & whats what. Maybe you aren't familiar with it but it is an industry standard practice afterall. When other industry "standards" are not met it is ones obligation to inform others of what practices are (or aren't) being followed & to expose those that are obviously very very wrong. Just because you are happy now does not excuse what has been done repeatedly over & over again in the past. When it comes to animal neglect a simple sorry just don't cut it. You can blow Sunshine up this guys butt all ya want, but those not afraid to speak the truth will continue to do so despite folks like yourself being content that he said sorry. You tell your "story" I'll tell mine. Mark
P.S. I said I was done here, but just had to reply again seeings how you still just don't "Get It" LOL Maybe you never will?

[bcbob]

Honestly, Mark. I think you've lost it. You're now attacking MY character. You're destroying your own credibility with me, anyway. I have merely offered to you MY point of view, and YOU were the one who initially requested it. Then you can't wait to disagree with me cause I don't see eye to eye with YOU, and then you furthermore tear me apart and make accusatory remarks and allegations about how I think, and what I believe. I didn't do that at all to you. And hell, stop repeating your points. I have heard them all about a half dozen times now.

Do I "get it"? Ya, I think so. But wait, no, I'm just too damn stupid to EVER get it. Thanks for clearing that up for me.

[DragnDrop]

No more nasties.... thread closed.
The topic had been covered well enough in the previous discussion. Re-opening it in a new thread that degrades to flames isn't necessary. I'll leave this here for the time being to show that the shipper in question has cleaned up his act.