impaction due to substrate ingestion...fact or fiction?

[rwg]

I am pretty careful to avoid substrate ingestion with my snakes as much as possible to avoid impaction. That said, I've asked around to some long-time herpers, and quite frankly I have not heard ANY first-hand accounts of death due to impaction caused by substrate ingestion confirmed by post-mortem autopsy.

I'm not saying it doesn't happen or cant happen, and no matter what happens in this thread, I will always take steps to reduce ingestion of substrate in my collection, but what I want to know is:

1) who has personally lost a snake to impaction caused by substrate ingestion?

2) what was the snake's species and age?

3) what kind of substrate was it?

4) How and by whom was the cause of death determined?

5) Roughly how many snakes have died in your care (for comparison)?

Any information would be greatly appreciated.

other Roy

[gonesnakee]

Good post, I haven't heard of a single snake ever either. Lots & lots of Lizards (mostly Leos), but never a snake. I had an experience with a Woma Python that is relevant kinda though. I keep all my Colubrids & smaller Pythons on the shop towels (blue paper towel). Anyhow I've had CKs eat them & pass them before because of mouse blood on them after they eat the prey, they figure eat the substrate too. Same deal with the Woma except she ate 2 or 3 sheets (not during a regualr feeding) & then regurged them later (thats when I discovered she had ate them). Because of their super absorbancy I was really worried for her because it took away major moisture & probably most of the fluids in her stomach when it happened. She was pretty frigging skinny after. I just made lots of fresh water available & stuck to really small meals after for a bit, to let fluids build up again & everything was OK. If not for the regurge I think she would have been SOL I don't think she could have passed them (too big). Other times it was always a large CK & only maybe 1 sheet. Wouldn't of even known if not for blue poo LOL, Mark
P.S. now after feeding I'll replace the towels with blood spots with certain snakes apt to eat them to avoid it from happening. :rolleyes:

[Jason Wakelin]

Hi,

I've kept a fair number of snakes, and had a few die. But I've never had one die of impaction, that I know of. I've heard the stories from others also.

My $.02,
Jason

[gonesnakee]

A little off topic, but how many folks have had a snake with a mouth or throat infections due to substrate "slivers"? Mark

[BWSmith]

I, unfortunately, had the worst case scenario with impaction. More accurately, it was intestinal blockage due to ingested substrate. This was a 27" Sistrurus miliarius barbouri. The animal ingested Cypress Mulch with no obvious ill effects. The subsequent feeding caused the problem. The blockage was rather far down. When she ate the next time, the rodent made its way down to the blockage, beyond the point of regurgitation. As the rodent "decayed" in her gut, it created gas build-up. This gas pocket tripled in size over the course of about a day. The next morning, she had exploded at the blockage site. Blood was projected onto the sides and ceiling of the enclosure. Upon inspection, a large piece of mulch was lodged in the intestines just below the rupture.

[gonesnakee]

Brutal, M

[rwg]

Ouch...that sucks. Thanks for the info.

other Roy

[Holy Mackerel]

When i first started going to the University of Guelph the Massasauga Rattle Snake in the Herpetology teaching collection died from having a small piece of newspaper get lodged in its trachea. The newspaper was ingested with the mouse that was being fed to it. I know that newpaper is not the best substrate, but never the less. Kind of a freak accident.

I'm not sure of the age of the snake, and also that it wasn't a personal incident, as the snake died about 2 months before I started to help care for the collection. But I figured most people wouldn't often hear of such stories happening from newspaper.



Steve

[ChocoMeijin]

My first snake died of impaction....
It was a rough green snake when I was maybe.... 11-12? We used a reptile bark and it ate crickets, and I remember watching it as it ate a cricket and a piece of the bark almost the same size as the cricket got ingested with it.... I tried to ge it out, but it was W.C. from a shop so it just ate it and died.... T_T
I love papertowels....

[rwg]

seriously...in it's trachea? Wow...I wouldn't expect that.

[Holy Mackerel]

Ya, in the trachea, it was pretty unusual, I figured people would be interested to hear that.

It's pretty sad too, to lose such a great animal!

[Stockwell]

Yes, I have kept thousands of snakes, and I have lost grey banded kings and a few triangulum to intestinal blockages due to Cypress mulch.
Any substrate that looks like toothpics could become a problem if it sticks to food.
In my cases, I cut the deceased open and pulled out some pretty big spikes of wood, which had punctured and got stuck in the intestines. The symptoms prior to death were regurgitation, then they stopped eating. A lump or swollen area might also present, but not always

I think impactions are fairly rare, but they can and do happen. I believe there is a relationship between the size of the animal and the size of the substrate. A burm eating a small bark nugget, is likely not going to be a problem. That same nugget consumed by a corn snake could be disasterous.

On the flip side, snakes can on occasion, ingest and pass some amazing debris. I once heard of a cal king that ate a good size branch that had a mouse laying on it. It took the mouse and the branch... The branch was slowly passed over several days, but eventually came out.. The snake survived and went into a shed cycle right after... Another case for dietary fibre! LOL
I would like to point out however, that I have kept and bred Leopard geckos on sand for 25 years,and while I see lots of people concerned about sand, I never had any cases of impaction. I have kept many lizards on sand, and still keep skinks on sand. I also have never ever had an impacted sand boa, yet I have kept them on everything from Beta chip, to Pine shavings to sand.. They always consume substate but I've yet to lose a single one and I've produced many hundreds of them
Some animals might be more prone to impaction than others, based on internal physiological geometry or other factors.

[BWSmith]

You are correct that snakes can pass some amazing obsticles. I have one large adult female Guyana BCC that was the pickiest feeder. She would only eat her rat if I put it on a plate for her! Usually i used paper plates, and worked fine. Over the years I have tried several methods ofr preserving rats. One of latest was vaccuum sealing them on a styrofoam meat tray (like steak come on in the store). I ran out of paper plates so I just served her the rat on the foam tray. A few hours later, the rat AND the tray were gone. It certainly was a very week waiting for her to regurge or deficate. But one evening I checked on her and found the passed tray in the cage nicely rolled up. I still have that tray. Maybe I'll try to remember to get a pic.

[Gary D.]

I too have had a young B.c.c. die of blockage, determined by necropsy. It was being kept on a mulch substrait aswell.

[ChocoMeijin]

Smith, that's crazy!!!! I'd like to see a pic of that lol! I'd be going nuts if that ever happened to me LOL ^_^

[BWSmith]

Originally posted by ChocoMeijin
Smith, that's crazy!!!! I'd like to see a pic of that lol! I'd be going nuts if that ever happened to me LOL ^_^

No pics, but I think the male that was in the cage with her was traumatized.

[Linds]

BW,
What a wild story! Looking forward to seeing pics!

[Stockwell]

There have been several photos taken of Boids that have ingested cage light bulbs after striking the heat source thinking it was prey. I'm not sure if these would be fatal, but most of the pics I have seen were xrays taken just prior to surgical removal. Light bulbs are pretty smooth until the break, but passing one, would be similar to egg binding.. It probably wouldn't make it out that end unless the snake was huge

[Manitoban Herps]

I have had lots of herps on peat moss and sand and have never had one die from impaction and have even witnessed them swallow the substrate while eating there prey.