Anyone know anything about telling the sex of a Salamander??

[TLH_Wär§cöötmän]

I have a 12" (LOL yes its a big one) Tiger Salamander (Ambystoma Tigrinum to be more specific) but I have no idea how to tell whether its a male/female...

Here's a pic of my big fella.

[Lrptls]

wow, i'v never heard of one that big. i'v always read of them geting up to 12 inches, but doubted it was possible.

i'v always seen in books that you have to look at the 2 bumps on the cloaca, the males will be larger than the females. i'm not sure how you would tell with just one unless you had another of the opposite sex.

wish i could have been more help, he looks alot like my tiger. =)

[TLH_Wär§cöötmän]

Well he was 11" a few months back, I have no idea how long he is exactly right now LOL but I do know he is growing larger than average just because he has not hibrenated for the winter like he is supposed to. (its -30°c outside right now LOL)

His name is Laguna, but I think its a male just because at the base of his tail it almost looks like he has 2 elongated, well, testicles I think. I looked all over for info on this guy and found very few scraps of info. This may be due to the fact it is a native species and cannot be sold where I am from. A friend of mine had found him on a construction site he was working at, with a broken leg and was all drying out. My friend nursed it back to health but didn't want it anymore, so I took it off his hands. He's been growing like crazy ever since. I wonder what the recorded record is?? LOL

[TLH_Wär§cöötmän]

Originally posted by Lrptls
....you have to look at the 2 bumps on the cloaca, ....

I have no idea what that is by the way LOL I mainly breed Leopard geckos, this is just my pet. A pet I have learned very little about LOL

[TLH_Wär§cöötmän]

I also have a Wood frog (Rana Sylvatica) in the tank with him. Amazingly enough they get along and the frog has all his limbs still LOL Even tho the frog is only about 1½" long LOL

[Lrptls]

they are not testicles, almost all salamanders and newts have those 2 bumps, males are just larger than females.

all reptiles and amphibians have cloacas- the common opening for reproduction and defacation/urine.

just a few tips about tigers (sence you said you know little about them) their life is digging, if he doesn't have any dirt already, give him about 3 inches of dirt and keep it most, they dont like it when its dried up. mine loves to eat crickets, mealworms, sometimes super worms but his favorite food are pinky mice, but only offer those once or twice a month as they have ALOT of fat in them.

[TLH_Wär§cöötmän]

I have him in a 20 gallon tank with 4" of TREX forest bedding that I keep nice and moist. I have several hides around too, but he does like to burrow and make a mess of himself LOL I actually had the tank ½ water and ½ moss, but the moss was not as easy for him to burrow, so I switched to the Forest bedding. I siliconed in a glass divider and ramp.

[TLH_Wär§cöötmän]

Crickets and waxworms is all I have been able to get him to eat, but mealworms he just ignores completely. Might be the food sources where your from are different than here. I was unaware that he might like a pinky tho...

[TLH_Wär§cöötmän]

This is what I have setup right now.

Moss and a water bowl on the left and Forest bedding on the right with a "root" system that has a tunnel under it and a cave thats about 2-3 inches deep in the top right corner.

[TLH_Wär§cöötmän]

This is a better view.

Man I have to shrink the kaka out of my pics LOL I use a 5MP Digital camera LOL the pics are supposed to be 2580x1932 and I have to shrink them to 400x300 roughly just so I can post em LOL Guess not everyone on the site has cable internet tho and the large pics would cause problems for them...

[TLH_Wär§cöötmän]

This is how my tank used to look, water on the left with a layered stone in it and on the right moss and a cave.

[Double J]

Originally posted by TLH_Wär§cöötmän
I also have a Wood frog (Rana Sylvatica) in the tank with him. Amazingly enough they get along and the frog has all his limbs still LOL Even tho the frog is only about 1½" long LOL

Get that wood frog out of there ASAP. I guarantee you that they are not "getting along" .........instead, the tiger salamander has not removed a limb from the frog yet. I guarantee you, it *will* happen sooner or later.... though sooner is a safer bet.

Though a tank that size is appropriate for a tiger salamander.... most north american ranids such as wood frogs, leopards, greens etc etc should be housed in far larger terraria. These animals have incredible jumping abilities, and tend to bruise themselves due to nervous jumping into the glass in no time. So, the two problems here are the mixed tank itself, and the tank size for the frog. If you do not change things quickly, you will have two things on your hands.. the first being a lost frog limb from a bite by the salamander (they are incredibly aggressive feeders... my tigers jump.. yes they JUMP...at my fingers). The other problem will likely be an aeromonas infection on the wood frog due to infected bruises and wounds from jumping into the glass in a tank that is too small.

Now.. I hope you realize that this is not meant to be an aggressive post or a personal stab. I am simply trying to let you know that your amphibians may be in jeopardy in this setup. I am merely trying to help you out before something bad happens.

It seems like I post these links every day..... but here we go again.

The second link *may* not directly apply to your situation.... but it is still worth consideration.

http://www.caudata.org/cc/articles/Mixing_disasters.shtml

http://www.livingunderworld.org/amphibianArticles/article0007.shtml

Good luck, and please consider changing the housing arrangements for these animals for your sake and theirs.

Thanks for listening.

[Double J]

Originally posted by TLH_Wär§cöötmän
I also have a Wood frog (Rana Sylvatica) in the tank with him. Amazingly enough they get along and the frog has all his limbs still LOL Even tho the frog is only about 1½" long LOL

I take it back. Your frog will not lose a limb. It will get completely devoured....... especially if your tiger is as big as you say he is. Plus... as you may already know... all amphibians have natural toxicity to them whether mild or not so mild. If and when your tiger eats this little frog... he will likely die as well from the toxins produced by the wood frog in this incredibly stressful situation. Tigers are not frog eaters typically in the wild..... so they lack reisitance to these toxins. And just because these salamanders are not typically frog eaters in the wild does not mean it will not happen in this tank... because it will. Remember.. this is barely two square feet of living space. These animals will bump into each other many times a day. Tigers see their prey by movement.. and will snap at anything that moves in front of them. That salamander will eat your little frog sooner or later.

Get him out of there man.

Double J

[TLH_Wär§cöötmän]

Well I feed Laguna his fill in crickets every two days, sometimes every day. They have been together since.....let me think...mid September 04'. The frog has been ok actually and yes he jumps alot, but I keep a very close eye on his condition.

I plan on releasing him back into the wild this summer. I've seen them pass eachother lots of times, but Laguna has never snapped at Pipp (the frog LOL)

Think they'd be ok till then??

[Double J]

Personally.. I would separate the two ASAP. I could see something happening in the near future.... and am surprised nothing has happened yet.

Is this a tiger salamander from the pet store, or was it caught locally by yourself? What about the wood frog?
If your animals were caught by YOU.. I would have no problems with releasing the frog. That said.... if your tiger was from a pet store..... I think that re-releasing the frog is a dangerous thing in this case. Why? Well.... tiger salamanders have been documented as potential carriers of chytrid fungus. If this is the case with your salamander, and the frog has become infected.. then you would be releasing the incredibly deadly pathogen into your local eco-systems.. that could devastate the amphibian population in your area. though this may not be the case.... would not release the frog if this salamander has been purchased from a pet store.

Now for the tank size of a wood frog...... this depends on what your long term plans for the animal are. If you are keeping it...... then I would recommend at least a 29 gallon tank for this animal. It will give him the minimal height and length. you can find tanks this size for great prices at used fish and pet stores. Still places like Super pet have reasonable prices on new tanks anyway.
If you plan on releasing the frog... then the cheap way to go about it is to put the frog in a large rubbermaid. This is inexpensive and functonal. Then, you can simply use the rubbermaid for storage after you release the frog (if of course releasing it is the appropriate route of action). Even if you plan on keeping the frog on a long-term basis, a rubbermaid can still be a long term housing solution. If done properly, a large transparent or translucent rubbermaid can be dressed very nicely and work well and look great. Now.. for a a jumpy animal like a wood frog the translucent ones (the clear-but-cloudy ones) would be the most functional as they would reduce the chance of a jumping reaction from the frog, as the translucent rubbermaid would reduce what the frog can see outside the tank and thus give more comfort to a nervy frog.

Good luck

[Double J]

Oh... I re-read one of your original posts.... if both of your animals are local... then a re-release for the frog isn't such a bad thing.. so long as you release him in the same place you found him. In this case then... the large rubbermaid housing for the frog is the best and cheapest solution until you release him.
Congrats on helping that salamander get back on its feet (no pun intended).

[TLH_Wär§cöötmän]

Oh and btw, I don't feed them in their tank. I remove them, placing them each in a large plastic terrarium with crickets.

Example: today I fed my salamander 9 4 week old crickets. after he was fed, I removed him, put him back and then put the frog in. He ate 4 smaller 4 week old crickets. Neither seems to be stressed if you look at their eating habits. I wonder if the Salamander has been somewhat "programmed" and knows that feeding is in the other tank only?? I let them eat their fills.

[snakers55]

I had a smaller tiger salamander eat a large green treefrog once a few years back.

[TLH_Wär§cöötmän]

I hope it doesn't happen, but both the frog and the Salamander are from the area around Edmonton, so I am assuming that the frog is natural prey for the Salamander and will not be toxic if ingested. Either way, they've both been togerther for this long, and they're ok, so heres to the best LOL

[Removed_2815]

Originally posted by TLH_Wär§cöötmän
I hope it doesn't happen, but both the frog and the Salamander are from the area around Edmonton, so I am assuming that the frog is natural prey for the Salamander and will not be toxic if ingested.
Being from the same region would make it more likely that the prey has methods of defense against depredation from local predators...
Ryan

[Double J]

Originally posted by TLH_Wär§cöötmän
I hope it doesn't happen, but both the frog and the Salamander are from the area around Edmonton, so I am assuming that the frog is natural prey for the Salamander and will not be toxic if ingested. Either way, they've both been togerther for this long, and they're ok, so heres to the best LOL

This is exactly the WRONG mentality to take. You are setting an incredibly bad example for the other keepers. Your logic is nonseniscal. By your logic, a cocaine addict might as well keep snorting coke... because hey.. they haven't died yet.. so here's to the best right????????

Congrats.... you amphibs are now on death row.

There is no good reason why these animals should be housed together...especially by a novice keeper in a tank that small. It all comes down to selfishness I guess. And your whole container feeding idea makes little sense for these animals. A tiger will snap at somethng moving past its face regardless of whether or not it was fed in a kritter keeper the day before.

Don't come crying back here when the frog is eaten, and the salamander is toxed out by eating the frog.

We have given you sound advice.. and now you have chosen to ignore it. It is a shame that some wild animals have to die because of it.

And for the other forum members... I apologize for my harshness, but things like this really fire me up.

[Removed_2815]

Originally posted by Double J

And for the other forum members... I apologize for my harshness, but things like this really fire me up.
I can appreciate your harshness. Although it may seem unwarranted to some, I think you're reacting to every poor husbandry situation that you've been privy to, not just this one. It's easy to react harshly when you've seen the results... No need to apologize to the members.
Ryan

[Double J]

Originally posted by snakers55
I had a smaller tiger salamander eat a large green treefrog once a few years back.

Take it from someone who has actually experienced the worst case scenario as in the quote above.

To those of you who think it won't happen to you... IT WILL...