Keeping "Balls" together

[Kevin McRae]

Are ball pythons cannibalistic?

:dumb:

[Tim_Cranwill]

No, but you shouldn't keep ANY two snakes together... especially not ball pythons, if you want them to eat, that is.

Read this: http://www3.mb.sympatico.ca/~cranwill/faq1.html

[PugLuv83]

Yeah, that's nice, Tim, but every rule has one that contradicts it, and your certainly does.

*points out Children's Pythons

[Tim_Cranwill]

Gee thanks, Ginny. :rolleyes:

Why didn't <i>I</i> think about including the "exception" to the rule... though, I don't think that IS an exception.... I think it's a misconception.... kind of rhymes, but doesn't mean the same thing....

You keep two ball pythons together and see how well that works.

Thanks for the tip though...

[Jeff_Favelle]

Why the heck do you think childreni is an "exception" to this rule? LOL!

[smeagel]

what about when you are breeding ball pythons, is there a certain amount of time you should keep them together before you seperate them, and can you put more than one female in with a male, or do you breed one female at a time with the male?

[PugLuv83]

Originally posted by Jeff_Favelle
Why the heck do you think childreni is an "exception" to this rule? LOL!
For many reasons -

Here are two web examples...

http://www.burkesbackyard.com.au/2001/archives/2001_archives/roadtests/reptiles/childrens_python

http://cc.usu.edu/~jgjulander/ChildrensCare.html

I have also talked to three breeders who say they can be kept in pairs or trios.

[Tim_Cranwill]

Originally posted by PugLuv83
I have also talked to three breeders who say they can be kept in pairs or trios.

"Can" and "Should" are very different words....

But my main question here is, WHY are you even fighting this battle?

Should we tell Kevin it's ok to house his snakes together?

Many breeders (and some good ones too) keep certian species in groups, but is it the BEST way? Is it a method worth recommending?

Maybe in YOUR books, but I don't agree. I see ZERO benefits for the animals and only space saving benefits for the keeper (which don’t come close to balancing the care compromise).

[Tim_Cranwill]

And maybe you would be better off contradicting BAD advice instead of safe, standard and, dare I say, GOOD advice...

[snakehunter]

AMEN Tim

[Jeff_Favelle]

Well if its on a website......it MUST be true.......



;)

[Kevin McRae]

Well I was thinkin, there are thousands of garter snakes out here in the Interlake region of Manitoba and I only see garters together when they are in mating season, so I should only keep ball pythons together in Breeding Season then because they are non social.

Right?

[Jeff_Favelle]

Ball Pythons are not garter snakes. One snake is not ALL snakes. You feed garter snakes worms and frogs, does that mean your Ball Python should that too?

[hhw]

Originally posted by Kevin McRae
Well I was thinkin, there are thousands of garter snakes out here in the Interlake region of Manitoba and I only see garters together when they are in mating season, so I should only keep ball pythons together in Breeding Season then because they are non social.

Right?

Garter snakes actually hibernate communally, so are *strictly relatively speaking* more communal (I use this rather than social) than ball pythons. Avoid keeping ball pythons together as they can get stressed and could stop feeding when kept together. A breeding pair should not be kept together except during breeding season.

I don't really know much about how to keep them together in breeding season though... I'm curious to know this as well.

[Kevin McRae]

I also wonder if I let a female BP incabated her eggs........... if she will eat her hatchlings when they hatch?

[Tim_Cranwill]

No... not a chance.

Do some research, Kevin. Pick up The Ball Python Manual and read a bunch of care sheets. You will learn this kind of stuff and a BUNCH of other things you NEED to know...

Don't hesitate to email me with questions.....

[Canada_Club]

If your first question was whether or not Ball Pythons were cannabalistic, and the answer was "no", then wouldn't that ALSO answer your question on whether or not the mother would eat the hatchlings????

[Kevin McRae]

no that wouldn't anwser my question, for example tokay geckos(I no they are lizards and are different but I will use them as an example).Big tokays and little tokays can be housed together as long as the little ones are from the same family as the big ones.

Most animals act differently towards there young then other adults.

[Kevin McRae]

Ya I know how to care for the snakes well, I just need to read alot more about breeding which I have 3 years till that happens,so lots of time to reasearch!

[Jeff_Favelle]

Big Tokays won't eat little Tokays if they are from the same family? HUH? :confused:

[Kevin McRae]

Tokay Geckos a type of lizard from South East Asia, they are very aggressive and mean but not toward there own young.

[BoidKeeper]

So are you implying that Tokays eat other geckos young?
Trevor

[Kevin McRae]

Sorry i'm not a very good writer, i will just say this, ball pythons might not get along with other adult ball pythons, but will the female be okay with the babies for a few hours?

[BoidKeeper]

It's not your writting skill we're questioning it the info your presenting.
but will the female be okay with the babies for a few hours?
She won't need to be because she'll never see them cause they'll be in the incubator.
Mother pythons brood their young. If they ate them out in the wild there wouldn't be too many pythons around now would there be?
Trevor

[Kevin McRae]

If the mother doesn't harm the hatchlings why do breeders use incubators why not just let the mother handle it?

[hhw]

Because the mother doesn't feed the whole time she's gravid. If the eggs are left with her, she won't feed the whole time she's incubating either, which puts much more strain on her. Also, hatch rates are usually higher with artificial incubation.

[BoidKeeper]

Because it would not be practicle to maintain the humidity levels in the cage that eggs would need to hacth. The mother can start feeding again right away if the eggs are taken away and therefore get back up to weight faster for the next season. Some female won't incubate their eggs in captivity. Incubators provide better control and less fluctuation of both temp and humidity levels so you get high hatch rates in faster times.
Trevor

[aconto]

Hi im new to this just bought 2 baby balls... was told they were from same hatch but cant be sure they were kept together when i got them and right now i have them both in a 10 ga rep. aq. the tank has two hiding spots the seem to get along ok will it harm them to keep them together for a time (moving soon then hope to set up another cage) and if not when would the ideal time be to split them up ?

[BoidKeeper]

Go back and read all of this post and you'll hav eyour answers. Also get a copy of the ball python manual.
Trevor

[Tim_Cranwill]

Don't worry, they won't miss eachother. Go and get a second enclosure and split them up sooner than later.... :)

[jjnnbns]

Originally posted by aconto
and if not when would the ideal time be to split them up ?

Now.

Just pick up a rubbermaid til you can figure out what kind of enclosure that you want, as well as an UTH.

You will most likely find that you prefer the rubbermaid over the aquarium (at least the snake will!)

[aconto]

kk if i went with a rubbermaid and use an uth do i stick it to the tub or just on the shelf under it ... will it melt the tub? and im also trying to make tanks work cuse my gf would rather have them in something that doesnt look "tacky" that is if i want to keep them out in plain view and not stored away in the basement corner... she seems to think thatthis is all over reacting her dad has had a ball live to full ager and a king and hes done nothing special cept keep im in a tank and made his own wood lids i will spli tthem up but as for the whole rubbermaid / tank conv can i make a tank work and can i keep good humidity in one ?

[hhw]

Firstly, make sure your tank is of sufficient size. Aquariums tend to focus a fair bit on height, when length and width are the important dimensions for a Ball Python. The ideal area is one square foot for each foot of snake, but at the very least you should have 3/4 square foot for each foot of snake.

Tanks are more difficult to heat and keep the humidity high, but it is possible if you're willing to put the time into it. I would recommend using a human heat pad, as there are multiple settings you can use. Make sure there is some space between the heat pad and the tank (it doesn't have to be much, just not have them in direct contact). As for the lid, you will want to cover it at least partly with something. A towel, contact paper, or something of the sort should be fine.