When to give up????

[knads06]

Ok everyone im at the point of almost giving up with my baby bp. I had him for about 4-5 weeks now and he still refuses to eat a thing. Ive let him settle in a for a week or two and then i offered him a pinkie when he was small and he didnt eat that, next i tried a f/t small mouse and he didnt eat that, next was a live small mouse and he didnt eat that, the mouse started to do damage to the substrate so i wacked the mouse and killed him and yet the bp still didnt eat it, and yesterday i tried to feed him a live rat fuzzy and he still didnt eat it. SO what do i do now?????? How long can a baby ball python go without eating?? I even tried putting the rat and snake in a small paper bag over night and still he didnt eat it................I need some help before i lose my lil guy, thanks for any suggestions...I'm not giving up by all means but im just starting to worry about the health of my bp

[Jeff_Favelle]

Non-feeding behaviour from a CAPTIVE-BRED baby Ball usually stems from incorrect husbandry, NOT a stubborn snake.

[knads06]

MY temperatures and humidity are exactly what everyone suggests on this board. I only handle my snake the first day or two i got him and ever since ive left him alone inside his cage. He had mites about two weeks ago but i gave him the NIX treatment and there all gone now. Im just wondering how much longer he can go without eating. Even after being left alone with the rat in a paper bag over night inside his cage he still didnt eat it. What more can i do to make him eat??

[crazyboy]

what are your temps? what are you using to measure them? humidity? what are you keeping it in?

[Andy_G]

We need more info...also it sounds like you have gone a little crazy with the offering of food, which would cause the snake stress and cause it to go on a feeding strike heh. Also, even if you think mites are all gone, you should be doing more than one treatment just to make sure because there's a very hig chance they are not.

[BoidKeeper]

Although I don't want this to sound rude I'm affraid it will anyway but please don't take it personally because it's not meant that way at all.
Get rid of the ball and get a corn. You're not ready for a ball by the sounds of things. Asking how much longer it can go with out eating is something you would already know had your reaserched your purchase more carefully.
The only other thing I can suggest if your heart is set on this snake is to take pics of you set and let us see them. That would help us to give you more detailed advice.
Cheers,
Trevor

[Syco]

What time of day are you trying to feed him? I've found that some of mine will only eat at night. It does sound like you have been trying to hard with the feeding, you have only had him for4-5 weeks and said you gave him a couple of weeks to settle in. Since then, according to you, you have attempted to feed him at least 5 times.
When you try to feed him and he refuses the food, wait a week before you try again. What was the breeder feeding it before you purchased him, or do you know if he has ever eaten?

[Artemis]

All I can say is, your posts have been irritating me for some time now. Everyone has told you to stop handling your ball, which you said you have been doing every day, not to mention when you intially got him you were cooking him with double heat and bad thermometers- and now you are frustrated that he wont eat!?! I HAD to take mine out today to treat him with nix for mites, and im feeling horribly guilty for stressing him out, and hoping with a little more time left alone it wont set him back too much.

If you genuinely care about this snake at all, leave it alone for petes sake, if you had done research, you would know that snakes in general are metabolic masterpieices, and so how long they can survive without food is a pretty long time, but it also depends on a number of variables that you should be keeping track of, like how much he weighed when you got them vs. now, and a number of others im not going to waste my time outlining in here. Im a new ball owner, too. and looking back through the forum at what you have said you have done with your ball, despite all the advice of others who have a TON more experience, i dont feel bad for you, i feel bad for your snake. Leave it alone for a week or two. Try feeding it. If you cant handle doing that, then the best thing you can do for your snake is to give it to someone who can.

I find it absolutely hilarious that you even had the kahunas to post about being frustrated with the snake not feeding, when the reasons why should be more than obvious to you. Time to put away the video cameras and get serious. The snake is an animal, not a toy, and you are responsible for it.

Some people might not be willing to "jump down your throat" but I am. Its not that your snake is a problem feeder. IMHO, its that you appear to be a problem owner. Stop being such a wise guy and listen to the voices of experience on this board!

IMHO-

ARTEMIS

[balakoth]

Artemis, I cannot agree with you more. Lack of self education on a pet you are going to buy, to me is the same as animal cruelty and while it may not apply to snakes is a criminal offense.

I researched both of my reptiles for months on end before taking them on.

My first being a ball python, which since I have gotten her, following common sense has taken to her mice and rats instantly. A few times even jumping ahead of the gun and grabbing onto a towel in her feeding tub.

Your best bet is not only to study pet keeping guides but to research the animal and where it came from in a NATURAL habitat. First thing I found instantly, that many people pushing a 80 percent constant humidity rate were going a bit overboard, being the animal comes from an arid region. During her shed she gets a pete moss hide or a quick soak.

Many people who seem to have issues with their ball pythons, stem as others have said.. POOR husbandry.

Sorry for a little bit of a OT post, but these type of keepers irritate me just like they do Art.

[knads06]

LIke i said oringinally i havent handled my bp since the first week i got it. granted i was a little excited to finally own one so i did handle it a bit more then i should have but since that first week i have left it alone and settle into his new home. The only time ive been in there is to offer him food and he has rejected it. Ive done plenty of research and ive made his home almost exactly as others have suggested. I switched to the paper towel substrate so id be able to see if any mites are still around and they have been gone since i treated him not once but twice. I treat him exactly how all of you said i should since the first week i got him and im just wondering what more i can do to make him eat. If he can go a while without eating then so be it, ill just offer him a meal once a week like you all say and if he takes it then he takes it, if not then he'll just have to wait till next week

[balakoth]

By your posts you made 3 attempts in 4 days. Which requires handling.

You still need to slow down, especially after the mite treatment.

Secondly, have you tried a Common MOUSE from PetCo? Not sure how large your Python is, but that is what I had started my Ball off on.

[Artemis]

Knads- response is in the other thread. I dont mean to be mean by it, or make you feed bad, you just need to see the bigger picture here, and work from where you are at right now, which isnt pretty.

Artemis

[Clay]

I've been keeping snakes for the better part of 20 yrs. burms, balls, retics, corns, rats, even a few venomous: my best advice would be to quit being such a bother to these people that you obviously not going to listen to and ask the advice of your two friends that have them and are not taking care of them properly either. If all else fails at least all three of you will agree on something.

[Corey Woods]

small cage, 90F hot spot, hiding box, water dish, dark cage, no handling. If he won't eat a live hopper mouse that is a little on the big side assist feed him............hold him by the back of the head and put the mouse in his mouth.....if he drops it put it in farther. Baby balls can only go for about 6 weeks before they get too week. If you let them go 8 weeks some will die even if they start eating. I assist feed new borns after 4 weeks.

Corey

[sapphire_moon]

we still don't know the temps and how you are measuring them? How about how big is the cage and snake? What kind of area of traffic are you keeping him in? is he in constant light? How OLD is he?

Not to be rude, but everytime someone says "my temps are exactly where everyone says they should be" usually don't even know what those temps are. And they can make a world of difference!

[crazyboy]

like saphire said, we still dont knwo teh temps. or what you are measuring them with? how long are you leaving the mouse in there? are you trying to feed him when he is in a bright light? are you standing in front of him? becuase if you are4 trying to feed him when you are standing there with a spotlight he surely wont eat.

[knads06]

my temps are 90 on the hot side and around 72 on the cold side. he loves to hide under his water dish which is on his cool side. Im using paper towels as my substrate ever since the mite problem and he has a wooden log on the hot side with a paper towel roll in the middle which he uses a lot too. I listened to my friends at first because they both have bp and they eat just fine. But after getting more advice on this board ive leaned to listening to you guys more. Im not looking for a verbal argument, just help in trying to get my bp to eat. I usually try to feed him at night when the room is dark and the lights are off. I tried a common mouse which seemed to be a good size but when i put him in the tank he was way too wild and started ripping the substrate apart which scared my bp more then anything.... Its getting to that point when i might have to forced feed him just once

[Syco]

I know this is going to sound bad..... but, will the store you bought the snake from take it back? From what I understand you to say, this is a hatchling BP which has never eaten. Right? The store should never have sold a snake that wasn't eating. If I am wrong, and this is an older hatchling which has eaten before and has just gone on a feeding strike then you can afford to give it a little more time to settle in and it will probably eat. How big is your BP? How is it's weight? A pic would really help so we could get an idea of how old it is.

[knads06]

This pic is from about four weeks agohttp://www.ssnakess.com/photopost/data/507/5158snake1-med.jpg

[nita]

Originally posted by knads06
my temps are 90 on the hot side and around 72 on the cold side.

72 is too cold. Your cool end should be 80 and your warm end 85 - 90 with a basking spot that gets no higher than 95. If he is staying under the waterdish on the cool end at 72 no wonder he isn't eating. If you can't get his temps right you won't get him to eat. He probably wouldnt' be able to digest his food if he did eat at those temps.

[knads06]

my bad i just look and i was reading the wrong numbers, its currently at 78 degrees and the hot side is at 90

[dave68]

What size of tank do you have him in Knads? It shouldn't be any larger than a ten gallon for a little one to settle in and feel secure . Try a hide on both sides and the water bowl in the middle,closer to the cool side. Security is a big issue with balls they like fairly small tight hides as well. Hope this helps.

Dave

[knads06]

I have him in a 20 gallon tank right now, the water bowl is over on the cool 80 degree side and the paper towel roll which he likes as well is in the middle, with the half wooden log on the hot side.... He makes his way over to the hot side occasionally, but seems to like the middle and water bowl a lot more. Ill be leaving him alone for the next week and hopefully by next thursday he'll eat either a common mouse or a fuzzy rat when i feed it to him at night. I called the store where i got him from today and they said their usually a couple months old when they get them in and they are usually fed atleast once when they get them in, but im calling back on friday to talk to the lady i bought it from and get the exact details on this one.

[BoidKeeper]

A snake that size should be in something smaller then a 10g.
Trevor

[sapphire_moon]

HOW are you measuring temps?

Don't force feed unless recommended by a vet (or knowledgeable breeder that can actually take a look at your snake). It can result in your snake just refusing more.
In your pic the snake looks like a fresh hatchling (judging by others pics on their newly hatched babies).

Goodluck, cause your gonna need it. I would just take it back and get a corn snake.

[knads06]

Jw what time everyone feeds their bp's at? Or better yet what is the best time to feed them at. I usually try for between 8-9pm and as most of you know he still hasnt eaten since i got him. So next thursday will be his next attempt. Hopefully he sucks it down

[elevation24]

First of all, I would highly suggest you get more hides. In a 20 gallon tank 1 hide is not enough for a hatchling of that size. Grab a whole bunch of cardboard boxes (like old food boxes), cut them to a SMALL size that he can just fit into, and leave a small opening that he get through for each one. And I don't just mean one hide. Get as many as you can fit in there.

Either that or go buy a small shoebox Rubbermaid and use one hide and a water dish.

When you go to feed him, try to feed him before he has come out of his hide 'hunting' -- when it's just starting to become evening, he will start poking his head out. Try feeding him around then. Drop the live mouse or rat near his hide. Or, if you're going to try F/T, while he is still in the hide, dangle the mouse in front of the opening of the hide he is in and wiggle it around with your tongs -- he may just snatch it up.

[knads06]

I have three hides in the 20 gallon tank. I have the water dish which is loves to go under, a paper towel roll which he spends a lot of time in right in the middle of the tank, and a half wooden log hide on the hot side which he spends a little bit of time on. Its pretty full in there and he seems to like his hides.

[marisa]

No disrespect to anyone here, but things are looking confusing to even me reading replies. A lot of great advice coming in, but I think it might be getting hard to read the real point here.

knads06, if you take nothing else away from this thread, you should go back and read Corey Wood's advice. Straight to the point, and he has bred and raised more balls than anyone else in this thread so you know it is good advice. It's simple to follow and if you do listen to his advice, your ball *will* eat.

That's my suggestion.
Marisa

[lostwithin]

I'd first like by saying the topic you chose for this post is disgusting, you do not give up on a living animal especially since it's not eating because of something you did wrong, and you stressed it out. I would say you should get rid of the ball and get something you are capable of caring for properly. Or better just look at friends pets that way you can just "give up" on a pet. And will have no responsibilities at all.

You've been given plenty of good advice almost everything becoming repetitive. Start taking it. Or GET rid of the snake.

At this point If you’re truly concerned for your snake I would suggest giving it too somebody who knows how too care for it, or is at least willing too listen too people advice and care for it properly. If you refuse too do that I suggest going out and picking up a small "shoe box" type Rubbermaid, there cheap. Put a few small holes in the top some paper towel in the bottom a small water dish and something for the bp too hide under. if you don’t want too spend extra for a heating pad for this box, just stick it inside your 20 gallon, in the center not stuck in hot or cold, just in the dead center. let your baby python live in this for at least a week. DO NOT bother even trying too feed for a week. only open the lid if you absolutely have too replace water or something and if you do. open it, top off the water and close it that’s all. After a week, pick up a pinky rat for him, get whatever you can that will be the right size or a bit small but still has not opened its eyes. I'd go with a large pinky rat. Yes it’ll be small but it wont be able too hurt your ball because its eyes wont even be open yet all they do is lay on there side and breath maybe squirm a bit. Then leave the ball alone, it should take the food item. and that’s your first start.

Now I do know allot of people out there are completely against any live feeding ,But in some cases it is necessary, and a rat that has yet too developed motor skills is hardly a threat right ? I haven’t seen one capable of any damage. so it should be ok too leave in the Rubbermaid with your ball.

Although Corey Woods knows what he’s talking about, I would avoid force-feeding, and if it comes too that you should NOT be the one doing it. You obviously are not skilled with these animals, so you will only do more harm then good.

Devon

[knads06]

Yes my title is a little off and i would never give up on my bp. Its just frustrating that for the past four weeks ive been leaving him alone and listening to peoples advice on this board and nothing different has happened. Granted i probably stressed the snake out the first week i had him but since then ive left him alone. So dont tell me to start listening to peoples advice because thats exactly what ive been doing for four weeks now. My last question to you would be will moving the bp into the rubbermaid stress him out even more???

[sapphire_moon]

Still would like to know HOW your measuring your temps?

[lostwithin]

Hi, although any handling may stress him out, minimal handling will not, by minimal I mean lifting him into that rubber made and placing the top will not. And what the Rubbermaid does is block him off from the surrounding world, the plastic isn’t clear (if you have the choice for clear don’t go with it) so he will feel very secure. He won’t see movement around him he will probably go inside a hide but the difference is looking out of the hid he's in a small space where nothing else is around. So he can relax. Maybe even move around a bit. Glass tanks are not ideal for snakes they are too revealing, snakes feel insecure. Ball pythons are even worse for this due too there timid nature. And too top it off all young snakes are even more insecure then adults because in the wild everything they encounter it a danger. It’s a built in instinct. A 20 gallon is just too much room for a young ball. A small hide within a small Rubbermaid is ideal.

I apologize if I came off too harsh your title really bothered me. I would still say you need too make the little guy feel secure. And its so easy too do why not do it. Then you can get him eating let him live in that until he’s too big too, then use the tank. That’s my suggestion. And I really suggest avoiding force-feeding no matter what. The only time I would suggest that would be if the snake begins too lose allot of weight. I would say the proper changes and make him feel secure and he will eat for you. I have owned pythons for 8 year now, and not once have I had too force feed. And I have had some VERY picky eaters, you have too have patience and be willing too accommodate too make them feel secure. and healthy. I would still suggest considering another species of snake. Some times Ball pythons just aren’t the way too go, especially if you don’t want something that stresses easily, which they do even as adults. They like too hiding. And tolerate more and more handling as they get older but still some never grow out of having too be left completely alone. And there are lots of other snakes out there that will be fine too handle and eat like champs. As well as ones that are less sensitive too there surroundings and environment. But that’s just a suggestion.
Good luck,
Devon

[knads06]

I have a digital thermometer as everyone suggested i use to measure them. I have those stick on thermostats and they suprisingly are very close to the actual temp read by the digital thermometer

[drupan]

I kind of feel bad for knads06 he's asking for help not for abuse. I've researched all the snake's I've have owned and still run into problems, some with very easy answer's. Without everyone's help here his snake might die. Thank-you Corey Woods with the answer that I would hope to get If I was in the same position as knads06.

drupan

[drupan]

There are no stupid questions, just stupid answers.

[Clay]

Maybe try a product like this, I've used it in the past with good results.

http://www.globalpets.com/cgi-local/SoftCart.exe/online-store/scstore/p-NAT-59231.html?L+scstore+paga5287+1096444833

[knads06]

Do you use the drops on the food your attempting to feed to your bp??

[balakoth]

What threads have you been reading Drupan? There have been 4 different people who have given the EXACT same advice as "Corey Woods". This is rediculous. Either one person tells the one looking for help to just listen to so and so because they know best. Or the one asking for help doesn't listen which in turn requires redundant answers. Yet all manners of advice given here could have been the correct ones.

More difficult animals require more exact needs, but caring for an animal is NOT brain surgery. Many people have raised and bred these animals before forums existed and they will continue to do so in the future with the use of COMMON SENSE and PRACTICAL RESEARCH. Without those please stick to a Dog or a Cat.

To recommend a complete beginner who was obviously not prepared in the first place for this type of commitment to force feed an animal....... I just dont get it.

Good luck to all of you.

[Syco]

The drops are added to the water you provide them with, wouldn't do much good to put it on the food when that is what you are having trouble getting into them ;)

[knads06]

Good point, ill look into those drops. thanks for the advice

[Kane65]

Some suggestions... probably mentioned before as I didn't read the whole thread.

* Be freakin patient... it is a Ball Python after all
* Try various sizes of food
* Feed in the PM with the lights off or very dim.
* Make sure that there is very little traffic or vibrations by the enclosure.
* If you are using a light in the cage... stop. This often stresses balls... they like it dark all the time.
* Cover the sides of the cage (if see through) & keep them that way until he eats regularly. Cuts down on external stimuli.
* Make sure you are moving very slow and quietly when trying to feed him or doing anything around the cage.
* When using dead prey, leave it in front of her hide overnight and don't keep checking to see if he's eaten.
* TT the person who bred her... see what they were feeding the snake and under what conditions.
* Don't administer any more mite treatments & don't try force feeding. Go to a vet for this, at least at this point in your herp career.

Oh and the rest of you who aren't offering advice. Shut the hell up! He already has the snake so you could at least try to help him instead of berating him.

[drupan]

Some new people may not know how to go through thread history or to search a previous topic, so they just post a thread looking for help. When you were new to the herp world did you need help answering easy questions?

"your last qoute"
Kane65, That's all I was trying to say.

thank-you

drupan

[still_matic]

hey, i didn't bother reading everything in the thread because most of it did not interest me.... apart from what people mentioned about leaving the snake alone and having a dark cage and all.. you can try rubbing your prey item on a lizard, heating it up under a heat lamp (this works well for me), or feeding either F/T, freshly killed, brained, etc.. also, try different colors as some snakes only seem to take a certain color or type of prey.. as long as they're not losing too much weight your ok.. also, one reason it may not eat is dehydration, in which case you can put it's mouth to a water dish in an attempt to get it to drink, if not, you can buy repti-aid which is exactly for this and can be used on bp's although i've never had to.. i've used it for half dead lizards that where lethargic and wouldn't eat or drink and it's saved them.. take it easy and give it time buddy

[sapphire_moon]

why would you scent with a lizard? I have never heard of that for a BP, a hognose maybe, but not a bp.

I don't think I've ever even seen anyone suggest that!?

Lizards for a bp? I thought their main diet in the wild was jerobas (gerbil like animals) not lizards?

[BoidKeeper]

*shakes his head*

[dave68]

I'm feellin that Boidkeeper

[still_matic]

Originally posted by sapphire_moon
why would you scent with a lizard? I have never heard of that for a BP, a hognose maybe, but not a bp.

I don't think I've ever even seen anyone suggest that!?

Lizards for a bp? I thought their main diet in the wild was jerobas (gerbil like animals) not lizards?

hey, it's worth a shot is it not? i mean, he says he's tried everything and i'm only trying to help.. i've never had do it but who knows, it just might intice the snake to eat... no need to get on my case now, i now what i'm doing and i'm doing it ill.. :D

[sapphire_moon]

sure :rolleyes:

[BoidKeeper]

he says he's tried everything
He hasn't tried everything. All he has to do is follow Corey's post. If he would forget about the rest of it and just follow that advice there is an extremely good chance we could close this thread. If you need to ask when to give up then it's time to give up. There's no need to ever ask that question because it's never time to give up on an animal. Also anyone who reads up on balls would know better then to ask that question.
It's time for KISS!
Trevor

[knads06]

Do bp's usually start shedding after they have ate their first meal or does it just happen all the time??

[knads06]

http://www.ssnakess.com/photopost/data/500/5158DSC00215-med.JPG

this was taken last week of my little guy after i tried to feed him. I removed his water dish and put the paper towel roll near him to give you somewhat of a idea how big he his

[knads06]

http://www.ssnakess.com/photopost/data/500/5158DSC00214-med.JPG

[elevation24]

They shed when they are growing.

Add more hides or move him into a smaller enclosure.

[knads06]

THose were taken last week, and im planning on moving him into a 10 gallon tank or a rubbermaid inside the tank this week.

[marisa]

Let me suggest a few things since it sounds like you are about to get a new enclosure. First of all I suggest setting it up right this time and leaving it once you have it stable.

1. Get a heating pad. These should be controlled somehow. A dimmer can be found for pretty cheap.
2. Shoebox sized rubbermaid, some holes melted into it.
3. Paper towel for the substrate
4. Tiny tight fitting hides. That snake is small. It needs smaller hiding spots than you think.

Get it all set up with the temps good and move the snake in. Leave it alone for a week. Then feeding attempt. Do NOT handle the snake aside from moving it to this new enclosure, just leave it alone. You don't even need to open the lid.

I hope you do follow the advice given here and here is a photo of a baby ball in his enclosure near his hides:

<img src="http://8snakes.myftp.org/marisa/Snakes/seven/3seven11-23-03.jpg">

Marisa

[sapphire_moon]

like OMG did this thing JUST come out of the egg. it's so TINY. I personally would take it back and get one thats a bit bigger and already eating!

[Smulkin]

You might want to consider covering the sides (at LEAST 3) of that tank if you are adamant on sticking with glass so increase the sense of security vs feeling exposed - especially abutted against a white wall things are bound to be a bit brighter than a ball would prefer.

[mykee]

Wow, it seems that most people who are offering advice are offering bad advice. As Trevor said KISS (Keep it Simple, Stupid). It's not rocket science. I'm not going to offer any advice to you Knads, as you've heard it all, but I will offer advice to all the 'experts' who are crapping all over your legitimate questions: being an a$$ instead of helping is doing no good other than making you look stupid. We were all there at one point, and we all needed help. Some of us were a little more knowledgeable and some of us ran into problems. What we didn't need to hear when asking a legitimate question, was "get rid of your ball, and go get a corn", or "you should stick to a dog or cat". NOBODY started in this hobby knowing it all. We're here to help, and pass on information, that's how we all become more experienced and knowledgeable herpers. 'Nuff said.

[ReptiliansDOTca]

I tried to read all the posts, and sort out the information, and everything is everywhere! Thus, I will try to be of assistance and write a little summary.

First of all, I am having the understanding that you are trying to feed him several times within a week. You need to give him a break for a few days. Anyhow, here is what you will need to do:

Go to your local Wal-Mart and pick up a small shoebox Rubbermaid. Put in two hides, they should be small and tend to their thigmorphic nature. What is thigmorphic? Basically, they appreciate and need a small, tight area to hide in. The most important factor is that the hide makes contact with the snakes' back. This could be anything you can find that fits the description. Keep the temperature on the hot side at 90°F and the cool size 75 - 80°F.

Once you have given him a few days to acclimate to the new environment, pick up a live hopper mouse. Offer this to him. As a side note, great post MyKee.

What is key here is that you get him out of that tank, and into the small Rubbermaid. Believe me; your results will multiply once you do this. Ball pythons, especially young ones, are extremely timid snakes, and appreciate and benefit from a small environment. I know you may not like the idea of a small shoebox Rubbermaid, but it is what will get your snake to eat. Once he is eating steadily, and grown up a bit, you can always move him into a more aesthetically pleasing enclosure. Do not bother covering your aquarium, painting the sides, or anything else of the sort - just get the snake out of there. Please, do not bother scenting your mouse with a lizard, rat, goat, monkey, gorilla, fish, or anything else for that matter. Scenting the feeder item will not help its security issues, and that is what is most likely causing you problems here.

Similar to what MyKee mentioned, jumping down his throat will not help the situation. In cases similar to this, whatever the case, I always try to ignore the keeper and what he is doing or done, and focus on the animal at hand. After all, it is the snake I am worried about here. By yelling at him and jumping down his throat, the best you are doing is scaring him away, and thus, taking away the proper care for the snake.

One more time, ignore where people have told you to cover the tank, or anything similar to that - just get him out of there and into a rubbermaid. Do not worry about stressing him more. Also, get a really small hide, for this guy, even something similar to what marisa posted is too big. Keep in mind - small, snug and makes contact with back. You will be better of if it makes contact with the snake all the way around.

[Herpguy2004]

Originally posted by mykee
Wow, it seems that most people who are offering advice are offering bad advice. As Trevor said KISS (Keep it Simple, Stupid). It's not rocket science. I'm not going to offer any advice to you Knads, as you've heard it all, but I will offer advice to all the 'experts' who are crapping all over your legitimate questions: being an a$$ instead of helping is doing no good other than making you look stupid. We were all there at one point, and we all needed help. Some of us were a little more knowledgeable and some of us ran into problems. What we didn't need to hear when asking a legitimate question, was "get rid of your ball, and go get a corn", or "you should stick to a dog or cat". NOBODY started in this hobby knowing it all. We're here to help, and pass on information, that's how we all become more experienced and knowledgeable herpers. 'Nuff said.
i totally agree. this guy came to us for advice on a bp thats not eating. and theres people reaming him out for not knowing these things. somepeople do know more than others and those are the people who should be helping this guy. not telling him to give it up. would you give up something youve wanted so long? its more than just a pet. i think everyone here can agree that a snake youve always wanted can have a strong bond with you.

[elevation24]

Any updates, knads?

[knads06]

Well ive moved him into the small rubbermaid a few days ago and ive just let him be for the last three weeks or so. Im going to offer him a hopper mouse or fuzzy rat whichever one is available, tonight or tomorrow. Id like to thank everyone for the advice they have given. A lot of it as been helpful but hopefully everyone can now see how confusing chat boards can be because everyones situations have been different and what works for one person doesnt always work for the next.....Ive read and listened to everyones remarks, i just hope something positive comes to my snake from all this

[knads06]

ONe other thing i forgot to mention is that when i moved him into the new rubbermaid container i noticed that underneath his water dish hide there seemed to be some WHITE poo. I noticed it once before and didnt know what it was so i cleaned it out and sure enough i noticed another one when i moved him into the new setup. Does anyone know what it is???

[nita]

That is not poo it is urine, snakes have solid urates and they look like white poo lumps.

[knads06]

Hey atleast he's peeing, i guess thats all i can say about my snake right now. He's learned how to piss, now lets just hope he picks up on the whole eating thing as well...............

[sapphire_moon]

Originally posted by knads06
Well ive moved him into the small rubbermaid a few days ago and ive just let him be for the last three weeks or so.

Now I'm confused, you JUST moved him into the rubbermaid a few days ago and you have let him be (alone basicly) for the past 3 wks?

[knads06]

Besides moving him into the rubbermaid on monday ive left him alone for a good three or four weeks. I havent been inside his cage except to change his water.........

[mykee]

Knads, PLEASE go out and buy a few books on the captive husbandry of ball pythons and read them until they're committed to memory. Buying first, learning later happens often, unfortunately, but please take this as an early sign to do your research. Good luck.

[zero&stich]

Hey Knads,
First, I'd like to say welcome to P. regius! Second, despite all the negativity, I'd say you are doin a decent job about worrying bout the animal and looking out for its best interests. Most people I've encountered buy an animal and neglect it from proper temps/ humidity ect. Even though the temps may fluctuate, providing the EXACT temps of their native land, is hard to do. However thermostats work wonders for that problem.

Now on to your feeding delima...

Corey brings up a good point for starters.
Second, despite what was claimed in "to tried eveything" well I own a pair at home and one in particular is the fussiest feeder I've ever seen! At a juvi stage he went 4 mos without food, lol. How I got him to eat most would frown on but it worked. A prekilled mouse and snake in 10 gal tank. 1 hide and a blanket over the enitire cage, little air flow, thats where most would frown on. He broke his fast and ate.

Other meathods that are proven to work are placing the snake in a brown paper bag and the animal with it in a room where there is no "foot traffic". Another, is the fine art of scenting where I'm surprised noone has suggested. Try a prekilled/froz rodent. I say rodent as I cannot see the pics and was denied of how thick(girth) and long the animal is. Place the rodent in WARM chicken broth. This generally works with froz food but I suppose can be done with prekilled. Make sure the rodent is completly thawed and theres no "cold" spots on the animal. It helps to cover the bowl with a lid to hold in heat. Sometimes an added boost in heat stimulates a stronger response. By this ladder, I mean, after thawing/soakin the rodent placing it under your heat source, assuming if your usin a dome lamp, for bout 10 or so seconds, USING your best judgment, take it out under from the lamp and feel it with your hands. If the head is "hot", since they should feed head first, use a pair of hemostats and wave it in front of the BP's nose, stimulating a live rodent. I'd sugest feedin at dusk/late at night(7-10 pending on daylight savings time)

Another method of scenting thats worked for me is litterally taking, heh, or rather killing/prekilling a rodent and scenting it to another rodent. Exp Prekill mouse, prekill rat. Scent rat by rubbing mouse onto rat. Mouse urine usually is a good way to go. Or as gross as it may seem, taking rat and rubbin its nose in the anal of the mouse. Mix and try various sizes and species. When in doubt a small weanling hamster sometimes gets a response if you absolutly need to get it to eat before force-feeding. Just be careful since BP's are "prey-imprinters" if it excepts the hampster it may only want them for now on. BTW, prey imprinting means, a animal only wants what it was feeding for exp in the wild or what it was orginally eating before it came to you.

There are also "appetite stymulators" to stimulate their appatite to coax them to eat. I'm personally not a fan of this since its no better than force feeding. But if your truely worried, its worth a shot.

On a side not just to give you an idea how fussy these animals truely are besides adults fasting 4-8 mos or more, my female, ONLY eats at night and will only eat white rats. And I just barely gotton her used to taking them. That was 3 months of patients on my part.

And remember force feeding is only done as a last resort. As long as the animal is drinking and is hydrated it should be fine. A trick you can do to check if there hydrated is gently pinch their skin, if it "goes in" right away the animal is hydrated. If you see flaps, or saggin skin, it might be a little dehydrated. A dehydrated animal will not eat contray to what some will think.

As long as the animal has decent girth and is drinking, the feedin part will follow with time. Just be patient and try not to induce alot of stress by handling ect.

Good Luck Bro! :)

[Phrasty]

knads, you now have a plethora of advice to go with, im glad to see that you are very much concerned about your BP and your NOT going to give up on him. PLEASE buy books and read up on BP's back to front and through again. i personally have no advice to give that has not already been said. all i can do is wish you and most importantly your snake the best of luck, and hopefully he will eat. please keep us informed/updated on his progress. Again good luck.

Phrasty

[Phrasty]

double post, my bad...:D

[luvcatz5]

Hi, I'm new here and I believe this is my first post.

Knads, I have a 10-month old bp, and he didn't eat the first few weeks for me either, so I know how worried you must be.

At that time, I was in touch with a vet's office who gave me advice and the number of a local breeder who told me exactly what to do to get him to eat. A lot of which was said here.

But I'm going to suggest what no one else here has...take him to a vet to be checked. There may be parasites or something else that's causing problems. When mine wasn't eating I was told that if he didn't eat by such and such a date he would have to come in.

And take heart...when my guy started eating, he ATE. I apparently have one that isn't fussy in the least when it comes to eating...

Good luck on your guy, I really hope it works out for him and you.

Ciao,
Carrie