What do you feed your breeder mice?

[sapphire_moon]

Ok I have went through the search and I couldn't find anything that said what people feed their breeder mice. All I find on the net is "Feed your mouse a good diet", Ok what is that diet?

I have the "lab blocks" but was wondering what else they could be fed on exclusively?

So what do you feed your mice?

[mykee]

When I bred mice (thankfully I no longer need to) I fed them the same diet as I fed, and still feed my rats; Mazuri 6F.

[sapphire_moon]

what if there is no way you can get mazuri. What is the next best thing?

[marisa]

You can order Mazuri online.

Either way, I do not use it. I use a brand of no name dog food with almost identical ingredient and nutrional values as Mazuri. I also use leftovers (lots of them!) and a mouse diet from a bulk food store locally.

Marisa

[sapphire_moon]

I know you can order mazuri online. But I don't have a credit card of ANY kind, and no one will allow me to borrow one.


Do you know of ol'roy bites and bones dog food? Do you think that would be ok for them? Do you use that as a staple diet? Could you feed it exclusively? Sorry for all the questions!

[testdrivehemi]

All my rat colonies are raised on ol-roy puppy food from wal-marts,with wild bird seed (also from wal mart) and are doing fine,nice litters,and good weight..hey works for me.

[Auskan]

I thought the puppy food was too high in protein and you were supposed to use regular dog food? Also, I would avoid giving too much bird seed to rats as it is high in fat.

[CHRISANDBOIDS14]

I feed my mice something that might shock some of you. But i got the idea from a member on the site who supplies a large breeder(also a member on the site) and has great sucess with it and his mice were always great and now my 80 are too. Anyways, its called Turkey grower 22%(i think) food ration. Its great stuff. can be their diet exclusively but i throw in other stuff. I get it at a local farm supply store. its called UniFeed. You can probably get something similar at a UFA(United Farmers Association) store. Or else a farm supply store.

[Bighead]

I know it may be quite different for rats, but I work at a pet store and I see dogs with skin and other allergy problems at LEAST 3 times a week that have been fed ol' roy. THIS IS NOT AN EXAGERATION IN THE SLIGHTEST! That stuff is evil. Compare the ingredients and nutritional value to any premium (i don't mean k-mart premium) dog food and you won't be surprised why that's the case. The main ingredient is corn, which is bad for several reasons. Ol' Roy dog food has been recalled more than once because of the number of dog fatalities it has caused, due to aflatoxins (mold from corn) that cause fatal liver damage. Any dog food that has corn as a main ingredient is crap, hands down.
Sorry for going off there- I know this isn't a dog forum, and for all I know, corn mold may be the best thing in the world for mice, but I had to vent there.

[annieb_mice]

Actually... I'm with you Bighead! I absolutely refuse to feed ANY of my animals store bought "dog food." My mice and rats are fed a natural food diet according to their nutritional needs. Even my dogs are fed a "natural food diet" with human grade ingredients! I've looked into how those cheap dog foods are made and am disgusted and horrified!! It's no wonder there's so much more canine diseases these days!
Anyways... sorry ... shutting up now... LOL
Take care
Annie B. <:3 )~~

[Stockwell]

I have always used only professional rodent chows.
I used Purina 5015 mouse diet, for many years, then switched to Mazuri 6F which is only 20 bucks for 50 lbs compared to 36 for the 5015
Today they were out of Mazuri, so they gave me a bag of 5010 rodent lab.. It will be a first trying that..and it's only temporary.
Block type lab feeds are really the best way to go especially if you have typical screened hopper rack systems.
I know some people use dog food because it's cheap, but that stuff will make your hands wet and greasy.
Purina Lab chows wont do that.(Mazuri is also made by Purina)

[annieb_mice]

I tried rodent lab blocks for several months, but had a large number of my mice die and the moms who had two litters while on this diet had smaller litters and the babies didn't seem as healthy. After switching back to the diet I fed them before, they did MUCH better.
I haven't tried the Mazuri diet, but to be honest, I'm quite happy with the quality of my mice on their currant diet.
Cheap dog food will also make the rodents fur greasy. And the chemicals that are prevalent in many of the "cheap" type of dog foods are retained in the body and will actually build up over time. I can only imagine what kind of damage this would cause a snake that has been on fed rodents raised on cheap dog food. What kind of health problems would that snake have in ten years time?
Take care
Annie B. <:3 )~~

[Bighead]

Here's some more dog stuff because I'm bored...
If you're feeding your dog Purina or some other low end dog food and it scratches a lot or has hot spots (crappy food is usually the cause of these things), and switch over to a high end dog food like Blue (human grade) or other high end foods, it sometimes takes 8 weeks or more for the dog to recover. That shows you how long all the crap can stay in their system.
BTW, Annie- Your Rottweilers look great and I will be buying some mice and rats from you early this week if it works out. :) I bought 1500 mealworms from you a couple weeks ago, if you're not sure who I am. I would recommend your business to anybody I know with complete confidence.

[sapphire_moon]

I use ol roy dog food for my rats. No problems what so ever, and the rat babies get big at a fast enough rate that I can catch the size needed. The rats diet gets supplemented with fresh veggies, ham and baby food every once in a while.

I agree though that I wouldn't give our dog ol roy dog food unless it was the last dog food on earth. We feed both our dogs and cat Natural balance food. It is a more holistic food.

I thought the "growers" and such would be full of all kinds of steriods and things like that to make them...well grow. lol

And besides, I can't find anyone that will split a bag for me. I would have to buy a 50lb bag. Which I don't need for 3 mice!

[Cruciform]

Stockwell: Where do you get your Mazuri at? Ren's in Oakville?

[mykee]

I'm with you guys, there are a lot of people on this forum who feed dog food, and I'm sure they feel secure in doing so, but I also will only feed my rats Mazuri 6F. Cruciform; It's available at Ren's for $19.10 for a 50 lb. bag. For me, it's worth the extra few dollars to ensure that my rats are being fed what they should be fed, not food that I wouldn't even feed a stray dog. JMO as I've never actually seen any real study or information comparing "premium" Wal-Mart dog food with lab block.

[Cruciform]

Looks like I may have to take a trip to Oakville for 250 lbs of rat food. :D

[Stockwell]

Yes, from Rens, but they're having a problem getting Mazuri right now and have none! I assume this is temporary.
Rens will deliver, but I don't know how far they will go.

[Jayson]

I was at rens yesterday and they were out. but they are selling 5010 for the same price.
By the way mazuri went up to $20.50/bag when ever they get it back in.

[dave68]

What we've found works well (provided you want large amounts) is buying big feed size bags of guinea pig pellets, hen or chicken scratch, some nutri-blocks, and maybe a bag of pre-mixed gourmet hamster/gerbil food- mix all together in a lrg garbage can- works great- also in WINTER only we would give as a treat 3/4 days/ week some good high end natural dog food, only for the extra fat because the rats/mice were in outside shed.

[asphyxia]

I use Purina Rat Chow for the rats and mice...50 lbs 24.00

Cheers
Brian

[Linds]

Originally posted by Stockwell

Rens will deliver, but I don't know how far they will go.

You can also have it special-ordered in to your local co-op. When I used to use it, my co-op would order it in for me, and it would come to $24 + tax. Little more expensive than what everyone else is paying, but cheaper than if I drove 2 hours to get it myself :rolleyes:

[annieb_mice]

<< I use ol roy dog food for my rats. No problems what so ever, and the rat babies get big at a fast enough rate that I can catch the size needed. The rats diet gets supplemented with fresh veggies, ham and baby food every once in a while.

I agree though that I wouldn't give our dog ol roy dog food unless it was the last dog food on earth. We feed both our dogs and cat Natural balance food. It is a more holistic food.

I thought the "growers" and such would be full of all kinds of steriods and things like that to make them...well grow. lol >>

*** Hate to be the one to point this out, but Ol' Roy and other such "cheap" dog foods ALL contain the same types of growth chemicals in them that you are wary of. Not to mention a variety of other nasty chemicals that are retained in the animal that eats it. Mice and rats may also more prone to retain these same chemicals as they have different metabolisms than larger mammals. These same chemicals will be retained by your snakes and reptiles. I'm sure you are aware of how "prone" mice and rats are for tumours and other cancerous growths? Many of these are caused by the food they eat. I have been feeding mine a natural seed mix along with fresh fruits and veggies and other foods, including boiled eggs and crushed eggshells <from a local breeder with free run hens> and have only had one tumour in years.
I know many other feeder breeders disagree with me and don't have a problem with feeding dog food to their rodents. I just prefer that my animals, both my rodents and my snakes that eat them, have a more natural diet so they will live longer and healthier lives. :)

<< BTW, Annie- Your Rottweilers look great and I will be buying some mice and rats from you early this week if it works out. I bought 1500 mealworms from you a couple weeks ago, if you're not sure who I am. I would recommend your business to anybody I know with complete confidence. >>

*** <blush> Thanks! :D I remember you now. I'll send you an email in a bit. :)

Take care
Annie B. <:3 )~~

[marisa]

Well I feed dog food, seed mix and leftovers. I have also not had a tumour in years. I am sure your method IS very healthy, but that doesn't mean those of us who add dog food to the diets are making our animals less healthy.

The problem is the words "dog food" there are TONS out there. And even some cheaper brands vary by your location. The one I normally use is sold at Dominion markets, but not at Walmarts or IGA. I used to use another one that was only at IGA. but not other locations. You cant make blanket statements about all dog food. With research of labels, you can choose a dog food very safe for mice IMHO.

Marisa

[sapphire_moon]

I am aware of how prone to tumors and such rats are. Also you said something about metabolisim. I don't know about your rats, but mine are always and have always had high energy. Jumped and played around. Right up to hours before they gave birth, and hours after the babies were born and cleaned.

I have never seen any kind of steriods or growers in the ol roy dog food. Not unless they have added it since i've been using it.

I think that there is a variety of things that are nutritionaly sound for breeder/feeder mice/rats.
If I wanted a 50lb bag of food I found a horse chow that has almost the exact same indgridients in it as the lab blocks I am using. I think the only difference is the lab blocks have something of fish in it?

[Linds]

I have a hard time believing that there are any "growers" in dog food. It makes no sense to be adding hormones, steroids, etc. to dog food. Nobody would reap benefit from that, whereas poultry feeds are made to grow them up quicker to make more $$ for the farmers. In addition, I don't think it would pass AAFCO standards if there was any. I think it is also illegal to not list any such additives, and there are certainly none listed.

[sapphire_moon]

Thats what I was thinking, why would you put growers in dog food? I guess if you were willing to pay a little extra you could always buy the holistic dog food for mice. I've heard of people feeding their pet rats nutro light dog food as a base diet.

[annieb_mice]

The growth hormones are not "added" to the dog food, they are in the animals that are "rendered" for use as animal food. Cattle, chickens, and various other animals that fall into the "4-D's" <diseased, disabled, dying, or dead> and that are considered "unfit for human consumption" are fed foods that are full of various chemicals and such that make them grow big and grow FAST. These chemicals are not broken down during the "rendering" process and get transferred to the end product.
This doesn't include the fact that most of the meat that is used for pet food is usually from animals that didn't quite meet the standards for human consumption and are required by law to be sprayed with chemicals to "denature" it so it's completely unfit for humans... chemicals which eventually end up in the end product.
Here are several links to explain in more detail:
http://www.flintriverranch.org/uck.html
http://www.thefishman.net/dogs/nutrition.htm
http://www.doberdogs.com/foodcht1.html
http://www.thelittlefoxes.net/html/pet_food.html
There are many more sites out there with information about the pet food industry and a quick search on Google will turn up lots.
Take care
Annie B. <:3 )~~

[Linds]

Interesting information. I knew about some of it, but nowhere near that extent. Thanks for the links :) Shouldn't be much of a concern with the really garbage dog foods most commonly used for feeders however. I know the kind I have most recently swtiched to doesn't contain any meat :eek: My dogs are fed Wellness (with Udo's oil added) and my cat is fed Innova and a few times a week he gets leftover chicken and sometimes fish. Picky little booger won't eat beef most of the time, and not always fish :rolleyes:

Hmmm... now one thing that jumps to mind after reading that... I recall reading somewhere that the meat used in dog/cat foods was graded "C". What am I eating when I go to Taco Bell then? They use grade "F" :eek:

[Auskan]

Originally posted by annieb_mice
[ including boiled eggs and crushed eggshells
[/B]

AnnieB, have you ever tried giving your rats a hard boiled egg that you have just cracked slightly? I tried this and they had a ball getting into it and "shelling" it for themselves. They eat the entire thing, and now get a hard boiled, slightly cracked egg about once a week.

[annieb_mice]

<< AnnieB, have you ever tried giving your rats a hard boiled egg that you have just cracked slightly? I tried this and they had a ball getting into it and "shelling" it for themselves. They eat the entire thing, and now get a hard boiled, slightly cracked egg about once a week. >>

*** Oh yeah!! They LOVE it! It's really fun watching them try to figure out how to open it, especially with the egg rolling around everywhere! LOL!
The mice aren't quite as adept as the rats though in opening their eggs, so that's why they get their eggs out of the shell with the shells mixed into their food. :)
Take care
Annie B. <:3 )~~

[sapphire_moon]

well after reading those pages I think I will just get the 50lb bag of Horse chow (it has a few more indgreidients in it than the rat/mouse lab blocks) and supplement it with meat a few times a week. Thanks for the links!