???Question???

[chappy]

My friend has got his mind set on getting a crocodilian. He has the money and a 8'longx2'widex3'high enclosure for it and hes thinking about getting a dwarf but it has been suggested by a few people for him to get a trig. Now both him and I have been researching them and we just got back from getting a huge like5'x2'x2' rubbermaid for a water dish hes gonna cut down to about a 1' for it. Anyway I have a few questions first off can anyone suggest wat would be the best type to get that could live in the enclosure he has for life??? if any??? How long do they live and wat is there diets like??? Hes not really to concerned with the price he just wants to buy a really healthy baby prefeerably captive bred if possible??? Also will anybody be selling trigs or dwarfs at the show and are they completely illegal in the city of toronto or can you get a permit and if you keep it without a permit and get caught what can heppen???. We both spent about 2 hours on our computers last night searching for the laws on herp s and came up with nothing . Does anybody no where I can find out anything about the laws????
Sorry this is long and boring read but I really want my friend to know what hes getting into so any information or suggestions would be greatly appreciated

thanx in advance Nick

[Jeff_Favelle]

Ask Dom, he'll know.

[jason h]

well a trig is a variety of dwarf caiman
the adult enclosure size"MINIMUM" for example of a 3.5ft caiman should have 18 sq ft of land area and 32 sq ft of water area with a depth of at least 1 ft( many camain prefer deeper water) but as i said this is minimum an enclosure to small would cause stress to a croc that would eventually kill it.
there diet should very as well (no gold fish) fish in the gold fish family are to oily and cause real health problems, whole pray is best mice rats etc,as they get calcium and other vitamins and minerals from bones and inerds,but if suplemented i feed chunks orf beef,chicken,liver(cause lord know i wont eat it lol) and fish not in the carp family,i frequently alternate these foods so that he wont get hooked on a specific item as veriety is the spice of life,
as for there age many crocs out live there keepers with a life expectancy of over 70 years it is a true liffe long committment,I hope i helped with your questions and will be very happy to answer any more you or your friend may think, alot of research should be done before choosing such an animal as for the laws in Toronto i cant help you but if you contact reptilia in vaughn they may be able to help you in that department as they have carried crocodilians in the past,and know many of the citys laws.

p.s. you can check here on your seach for enlightenment
http://crocodilian.com/crocfaq/

[Dom]

I guess Jason got to it b4 me! Good post man!

Contacting Reptilia is a very good Idea as well for not only the info on the by-laws of TO but also because i am pretty sure that they do adoption for unwanted caimens.. (wich would lead me to beleiive that tehy COULD be legal)

Personally, the speactacels get way too big for me .. but the smaller ones like the Shneiders and cuviers dwarf could be a good option althoguh they do have one heck of a bad reputation and can be quite nasty .. the youngs tend to be tames but the adults will must likely resort to being vicous because of lack of handling..


Specs are the most readilly available .. most often WC but if u look hard enough cb can be available for any of the dwarf species .. although i have been looking for a cuviers for now 4 month and have yet to find either a wc or cb available ..

As for food .. Jason covered that really well .. I mean a caimen is mainly catergorized an a fish and amphibiam eater but in caaptivuty .. whole animals are much better .. personally .. i used to only feed my caimen mice and rats .. but a variety can only be better for him.


Hmm well any other questions feel free to ask and I am sure I or Jason Will be able to answer you ..

BTW Jason .. saw u at the show today but never had the chance to say hello!

Take care all
dom

[Cobra_Fangs]

Here is a link that has laws.
Reptile Laws (http://www.coastalreptiles.com/venomous_laws.htm)
here is a pic of one of mine:
http://reptilelair.netfirms.com/Gator_8-14-02.jpg
Also here is a photo gallery you might be interested in:
Reptile Lair's Photo Gallery (http://kickme.to/reptilephotos)
Hope you enjoy!!!:D
Will W.

[Dom]

man oh man Will ..

You gotta get posting on those pictures .. he looks awesome!

Really nice animal!

Dom

[jason h]

fang these pics are great keep em comin!! where are you located?

Dom,to bad I missed ya at the show maybe catch ya next time!;)

[Dom]

There will be other times .. lol .. or maybe I was just intimidated by your size lol

Ill say hello next time!

[jason h]

LOL!! LIL OL ME !! and to think i lost 50 lbs hehehe

[Dom]

lol but arn't u like over 6 feet man .. lol

Take care bud

[jason h]

lol ya but thats a minor detail hehe:D

[Ontario_herper]

Just wanted to add a couple things.......

Many young crocodilians feed primarly on insects as juvies. If possible I would provide young crocs with an abundance of insect matter in their diet. Crickets, mealwroms etc.......

Someone mentioned above about providing a large enclosure. This is very important for a well-established adult animal. However, when keeping juvies (especially freshly imported animals) it is important not to give them an enclosure that is too large. Giving them a huge amount of space can often stress the animal and cause it not to eat. Many juvies prefer a relatively small enclosure.

[jason h]

good points ,thanks David :)

[Dom]

I competly agreee as well ..

When I had my spectacle .. I was keeping him originally in a 33 gallon .. I had upgraded to a 133 and he stoped eating in front of me. He was always hiding, never basking and a bit more agresive. Small juvies defenatly thrive in smaller enclosures but for the adults .. its a completly different story!

[chappy]

Thanx for the help everybody!!!! Im kind of happy to say my friend changed his mind when he bought an awesome GTP at the show and spent all his money but thanx for the info i really appreciate it

Nick