I think it's time

[marisa]

Hi people.

I think it's about time to put my vieled chameleon Gus to sleep. He is over 6 years old now and any of you here longer than a couple months know his story, so I amazed he has gone on this long.

There is not a certian health issue going on....i.e. this isn't say "He has MBD so bad" etc. These are age related problems I am certain. Over the past few months his "bedtime" has gotten earlier and earlier. Normally he would be up until the sun was down. It got earlier and earlier and now he is asleep on his "night time bed" perch by 1 in the afternoon. His basking lights turn on at 8 am and go off at 8 p.m. but still in bed by 1 nowadays. Fully asleep too.

His aim is getting slowly, but constantly worse. My roomate was upset the other day because she watched him eat for the first time in a few months. He struggled to catch one cricket from 3-5 inches away in ten minutes. A contained cricket. Free catching them is a joke now although he used to be a pro.

His weight and tone are going even though he doesn't have parasites and he eats a fair bit. He is just getting saggy. Weak looking. He can't keep hydrated it seems and drippers/misting is not enough anymore...he needs long showers often, like three times weekly minimum. Honestly, his condition is going in much the same way a humans would at this point it seems.

After this past feeding which was pretty bad I am thinking about cutting short his suffering which I am sure will go on for some time as he is a real survivor. I am thinking of putting him down this week. I'd like to know what you guys think. Not the sorrys and thats too bad parts, I want the choice you would make. Put him down or let him die naturally on his own time even though he is clearly going downhill slow?

Marisa

[Drew S]

I personally wouldn't put him down. As you say, he has no known diseases etc., so why end his life? Just because he may require some extra care, I don't see a need to put him down just because he is getting old...

[Pet with a tail]

give him *****...maybe he hasglaucoma...if nothing else he'll atleast enjoy the last bit of his life

[marisa]

Dude you missed the entire giest of Gus's life and why I do not want him suffering.

He suffered on 12 crickets a week for five YEARS. No misting EVER. No dripper, no UV, no nothing. Wounds that are still healing caused from free roaming. He has been lost many times, once for four days on the roof. All this because his previous owner/my ex roomate was an idiot.

To even suggest the extra care is why I am thinking of putting him down is a total case of you speaking before knowing. I care for and purposfully take in animals that need extra care, iguanas, RES, Gus....etc. His extra care isn't the issue and I figured I made that clear as you can see I am providing it all and have been for a full YEAR now.

The reason these things add up to me thinking of it is because its selfish to keep a suffering animal alive just because you think you can "save it" or because you love it. He has had a long long hard life and very little time under proper conditions (a year) and to have such a great recovery from it only to linger on when age hits him seems a little insulting to me to do to him. Although thats is why I asked. Opinions.

I respect your opinion of keeping him alive, but I certaintly did not agree with the "just because he is old" and the "some extra care" part. As neither have or will have anything at all to do with my decision.

Marisa

[Matt_K]

Marisa, i think it basically bowls down to what you feel more comfortable with.. Would you rather wake up one morning and find him dead in his cage? Or would you rather just put an end to his suffering, if infact he is suffering.. It's a tough decision, and personally, i don't even know how i would approach it.. I think it's really just a gut check for you..

Pet With A Tail: This isn't a light situation.. Marisa really cares for her animals and in is a tight spot right now where she has to make a very tough decision, that type of humor is not called for, nor is it even funny..

[Bighead]

That's a really tough call. I think I would put him to sleep if you know he's truly suffering. I think the only reasons not to would be if you were questioning the actual quality of life he is experiencing, or if you had issues with euthenasia. Good luck with the decision and I'm very sorry about poor Gus.

[marisa]

Bighead- Thanks. This sentence of yours exactly explains my current thoughts:

"quality of life"

I believe many people keep animals alive far longer than what's really fair, right and respectful. They don't understand age, or aches and pains, to them I can only assume they are living in more fear as sick animals or old animals know they are targets and hide it, or have a behaviour change.

Lots of thinking to do. thanks for your thoughts so far people.

Marisa

[Drew S]

No no no, I applogize. I wasn't impying that because of the extra care you're going to put him to sleep. I just meant that if the extra care he requires is allowing him to enjoy a full life, then I think you should continue to provide him with it. If no matter what you do, he still cannot function the way he should, then I would support any decision you chose to make. It's definately a hard thing to decide when the time has come to allow you're pet to move on.

With reptiles however, you can ask yourself how the animal would have fared in the wild. And then you can be proud in the fact that you allowed him to enjoy many years under your care.

[choriona]

You sound like you've already made your mind up and you are seeking someone to help you feel like the decision to end a beloved pets life is not your own.

Your decision sounds very reasonable. He is old and not functioning. He would not last a minute in the wild. You have given him so much and he can die in peace now. If he cannot eat on his own and requires so much just to barely be surviving, then it sounds like the right thing, as hard as it is.

Good luck with the mind demons.

[drewlowe]

Marisa i feel for you either way you go. With whatever discission you make know this, you've done more for him than anyone has ever done. I'm sure if Gus could talk he would thank you for making the last part of his life GREAT!!!

One thing you could do is get out a piece of paper and pen, write down all the pros and cons of putting Gus to sleep and having him stay with you. It's a hard discission to make and i don't think any of us can make that choice for you, it's something you have to decied since he is in your care and you know his situation the best.

Let us know what you decide to do, remember to cherish the moments you have with Gus.

Jamie

[Tim_Cranwill]

If I were you, I would try to live with one decision for a whole day and see how you end up feeling about it. Sometimes that is a really good way to figure out what is in your heart. I'm sure whatever you do, you have his best interests in mind. :(

Good luck with the difficult decision. I may have a similar one to make in the next year or so...

[marisa]

Tim & Drewlowe- Thank you! Both those suggestions are excellent. I did make a call to the vet today and today I will live with the thought of putting him to sleep and see if it feels right.

Today he is kinda hanging on the perch oddly....he doesn't hold himself up anymore really. Basically he'll have his back legs on and up, but his entire front "resting" / laying down on the perch. He is already in bed now as well. He did bask for a couple hours this morning but is now seemingly refusing food or just not hungry and neither is normal Gus behaviour. I think that the last feeding yesterday/day before was one of his last unforntuatly. He barely finished a few crickets, if that.

One thing is for sure, putting him down or not, I will be encasing his body into a concrete brick which will go into our garden once he has passed on. We have done this for two very special Anoles my roomate owned for years, and I think its a nice touch for Gus. The bricks have their "birthdates" and names written on them in the wet cement. Then we place them in the garden so we can remember them when we are outside working with the flowers and so we can bring them with us when we move.

Marisa

[Auskan]

Marisa, I applaud you for considering making such a tough decision. The way I look at it, in the wild, "survival of the fittest" would mean that he would already have passed - one way or another. I believe many times pets are kept alive because the owners can't stand the thought of losing them, which is really selfishness in another guise. I don't know all of Gus' story since I don't usually follow this forum, but I think for any animal, euthanasia is a better way to go than a slow, lingering death without any quality of life. Therefore, your call really comes down to: does he enjoy life at all at this point, or is he merely hanging on waiting for father time to take him?

[meow_mix450]

heard the story of Gus, and its truly sad. But this is really based on what you wnat, but i guess your looking for an opinion? my opinion is that i would, cause an average life for a chameleon is around 5-10 years, if your lucky, but there are storys. He can barly eat, and drink for him self, i bet he really enjoyed living with you, instead of his past owner, tell us your decsion at the end

Meow

[Cruciform]

If he is at the point where he can't even feed without it being held still for him, I think I would take him to the vet, and hold him and comfort him while he is euthanized (if you can? I haven't seen how vets euthanize reptiles)

When I was 14 we had our sweet little 3 year old Sheltie euthanized by the vet, and though my parents wouldn't let me be there, they stayed with him to the end. From the age of 1 he had severe epilepsy, which the doctors treated as much as they could but even with the medications he eventually reached a point where he was having constant grand mal seizures. He was the best pet I ever had and I still miss him, but he was suffering too much.

It's a shame that we still have the archaic laws that prevent us from ending human suffering in the same way.

[Collide]

FYI if u decide to do it. Vets in my area have a thing where they can do it in your home my aunt had it doen to her dog soo he wouldent have to go to the vet which he hated. Chams dont like going places either soo just a thought.

[sleddergirl]

Marisa, I am going to answer before I read all the other opinions. Although I have never made this decision with a cham, I have made it with other animals.......it is one of the most difficult ones. My opinion is that if you believe the animal is suffering more than he is enjoying life, its time. If it pains you constantly to watch the suffering, its time. I think that after all you have done to save him, you know best........

Sue

[joer]

I know the story about gus it is a sad story but hey he had 6 years of life and one time being on the roof. LOL he sounds like he has had a fun and full of new experances so good luck with what you do look at the good thing. He is 6 years old he was not stuck in a cage his whole life he has had so crazy adventures. Good luck sorry about my spelling its still to early for me and i type fast as i can.