Are their any Kings or Milks that can live in a 15 qt as an adult?

[Tigergenesis]

15-quart boxes are 11" W x 17" D x 6"

[Optimus Prime]

Some of the smaller milks should be fine in there.

[C.m.pyrrhus]

Unless there is a reason you strongly desire to use that size tub, I would recommend using Sterilite model #1856, for almost any colubrid is fine in those (cept maybe a large pituophis or the like), and they are not to large as well. Any king or milk will do fine in those. Wal-mart sells them for about $2.64 each, not a bad deal.

[gonesnakee]

Some of the smaller Mtn. King species would be my recomendation as they stay considerably smaller than Milks etc. & are highly underrated. Mark

[C.m.pyrrhus]

Mountain Kings rock! I would highly recommend them as well. They are my personal favorite Lampropeltis species, just splendid snakes to keep. They are very hardy in my opinion, and take to mice and rats very easy.

This here is my male L.p.pyromelana, and is in the standard Sterilite # 1856, and is on a diet of rats pinks at about 4-5 days old every 10 days. I keep him on aspen shavings and this guy does me proud. Awesome kings I must say.
http://hometown.aol.com/beauconstrictors/images/pyro3.jpg

[Tigergenesis]

What are the dimensions of the Sterilite #1856?

[marie]

man come on people would any of you want to live in your bathroom ? give the snake some room or set him free. that's abuse . a ten gal. is too small in my oppinion for a 7 month old king that's why i'm going up to a 20 at least. think about the poor snake if you don't have the room or the money you don't need it . i'm not being mean but i believe in space for an animal just like betta fish and goldfish in these little bitty dishes that go round and round wow what a life it's sad. just my oppinion marie

[Tigergenesis]

I have money, I have space. I spot clean at least twice a day so my snakes don't wallow in their waste. I'm getting a rack with 15qt and 32qt tubs. I plan to use the 15qt tubs for new purchases until they are big enough to move to 32 qts. I was just wondering if i will be able to use the 15qt on a more permanent basis for any snakes. Not all snakes get big and/or move around a lot to require huge amounts of space. I've never seen how big all the various species of kings/milks get when they are adults - so I don't know what can and can't work.

Thanks for all the suggestions!

[Yness]

Touche

[crazyboy]

Originally posted by marie
man come on people would any of you want to live in your bathroom ? give the snake some room or set him free. that's abuse . a ten gal. is too small in my oppinion for a 7 month old king that's why i'm going up to a 20 at least. think about the poor snake if you don't have the room or the money you don't need it . i'm not being mean but i believe in space for an animal just like betta fish and goldfish in these little bitty dishes that go round and round wow what a life it's sad. just my oppinion marie

i definetly wouldn't set it free.

[C.m.pyrrhus]

man come on people would any of you want to live in your bathroom ? give the snake some room or set him free. that's abuse . a ten gal. is too small in my oppinion for a 7 month old king that's why i'm going up to a 20 at least. think about the poor snake if you don't have the room or the money you don't need it . i'm not being mean but i believe in space for an animal just like betta fish and goldfish in these little bitty dishes that go round and round wow what a life it's sad. just my oppinion marie


Well, Marie, it it very far from abuse. Snakes (if you would take the time to research) are not huge land-loving animals with large territories. And being this is a king question, fact is these snakes LOVE to be contained in small areas. Out of the 14+ Mountain Kings I see every year, only one was not found in the same crack in rocks I found it in several times before. It is extremely rare to find them out in the open at all. Maybe if you knew the natural history of the animal, you would be less inclined to act like your a snake god and realise that snakes feel more at home in smaller, less expansive areas. Fact is, snakes rarely will venture far from there homes. Depending on species, most of the time any given snake is going to be resting under rocks, burrowed in soil or sand or just plain living in a dark secluded area. This is what they like, they are not land-roaming cattle. You will find that most folks that use the Sterilite Tubs have better results in feeding, breeding and stressless snakes. Big huge open areas are going to lead to heavier stressed snakes in general, only becuase this is not how the generally live.

They are not human, so do not feel as if your "loving and caring ways" are better than what we are discussing, because frankly your wrong, to say it as nice as possable. It is not wrong to care for your snakes, but first understand them before acting and pronouncing yourself as better.

[marie]

ok how can i reply without stepping on your toes? there is no way because just from reading your post you are very easy to offend . put your snake in whatever you want ,i just hope you don't get an iguana!! marie

[Andy_G]

Didn't seem offended to me...sounds like he is trying to spread some knowledge! :)

[RaVeNo888o]

i dont see what getting an iguana has to do with a discussion on enclosure sizes for snakes. If you implying that he would try and cram an iguana in a tiny little enclosure, then you are way off. snakes and iguanas are both reptiles, doenst mean they have the same needs, and people here know that.

[Tigergenesis]

marie,

a ten gal. is too small in my oppinion for a 7 month old king that's why i'm going up to a 20 at least

So why not put it in a 50, 75 or even 100 gallons?

And I don't think anyone was really offended - I just didn't appreciate an assumption being made about my motives behind the original question. I also think we agree your response basically showed a lack of knowledge on snake behavior and was prehaps based more on applying human standards to snakes - which doesn't support any available information in this case. I too felt that way about the amount of space that should be provided to snakes before I kept them, observed them and reseached them. Even now I always give my snakes larger than the minimum recommended cage size. But you can go overboard and end up wasting money as your snake doesn't utilize the excess space. Yeah, if I place my snake outside in the grass he may go exploring and check out as much of the yard as possible - but that's because it's new territory with lots of new smells to investigate. If I gave him an entire small bedroom to roam in his entire life, I'd bet after the intial newness of it wore off he'd basically make use of only a select few spots - unless he got hungry and went hunting. An entire room would be a waste.

[ruthupton]

The question of snake housing is something that I have come across a lot on some of the UK multi-topic discussion boards.

People have posted, asking if anyone keeps snakes and the common misconception seems to be that snakes need large open spaces to 'roam' in. When I try to explain that snakes are, for want of a better word, agarophobic, they think I am mad.

[C.m.pyrrhus]

ok how can i reply without stepping on your toes? there is no way because just from reading your post you are very easy to offend . put your snake in whatever you want ,i just hope you don't get an iguana!! marie

Not exactly stepping on toes, just seems as if your not strong in the ways of knowing these snakes behaviour. I as well would not like to see new folks thinking that Sterilite tubs are abusive (for the right species), that is just not even close.

I was not aiming to be mean or cruel, but my reason of reacting does seem that way. Your responce just simply was not thought out, or your one who tries to pass a 'human' or 'Melissa Kraplan' way of thinking into herpetoculture. Thats why many folks here try to make sure that everyone trully understand and research animals before placing a statement or standard upon them as such.

I also have had MANY iguanas, personally not huge a favorite. They were all animals I took in as rescues from bad owners who knew nothing of the animal they kept. I do have one left that will be my last, also the only one I ever purchased as something I did want to keep. It also lives in a very large cage I built. Strong UVB light, heat light, many perches and climbing structures and a huge diet of greens that she gets to dive into daily. She would never be placed into a tub. You see, that is abuse! They are an animal that needs a larger space to thrive, not only because they simply get so damn big. :)

[Bighead]

Just for the record, bettas in the wild can live there whole life in 2-3 inches of water and never travel out of an area 18" in diameter. They can also live longer lives in captivity than in the wild, even in a bowl. As far as goldfish go, you're right. Bowls are mean. Some types of goldfish can live over 200 years and get over 4 feet long.

[Delirium]

Although far be it for me to consider myself a "snake expert", its early, I'm cranky and feel like adding my two cents.

All I have to rely on in my personal experience is the behaviours of our two animals, Fred and Weeble, a Ball Python and albino Cali King respectively. Researched to death, we are aware of their natural behaviours and penchant for hides and the what not. They both have enclosures where hides of varying sizes and temperatures are available. However, they also have a beautifully setup enclosure outside of their hides with branches for climbing, leaves for cover and a viewing area so that we can enjoy their company with little intrusion as needed. Call it curiosity, adapting to habitat or whatever but both Fred and Weeble consistently use their entire enclosure, climbing on the trees, sitting on top of their hides (and in Weeble's case, hanging out with his head stuck through the hole in the top of a coconut :rolleyes: ) and just generally maximizing the space they have available. This may say different things to different people but my interpretation of what I have seen is that given the opportunity, snakes, either in general or dependant on character, will use space and elaborate enclosures if provided with them.

*throws two pennies on the table*

Take it or leave it.

Dee