Mid body swelling on a male African House Snake

[lolaophidia]

Just got back from the vet's $343.75 poorer and none the wiser about the cause of my male African House Snakes odd mid body lump. The history is he last ate a frozen thawed mouse on December 14th. Passed mouse with no problems. Attempted to feed again during the first week of January and he refused to eat. I didn't think it was a big deal because I'd put him in with the female earlier thinking he might breed. Went out of town and when I got back on the 10th of January, noticed that he had an odd lump about halfway down. Went back out of town and when I came back the lump seemed larger so I scheduled a vet visit. The snake has been active and drinking water but not eating (which isn't that unusual). No weight loss that I can notice but that lump is really worrying me! The lump is ovoid, not fatty or boney- seems firm and is distorting the belly. The vet performed an X-ray (just showed a pale ovoid mass in the mid section) and a fine needle aspirate which drained about 3 cc's of clear fluid which will be sent off for cytology and an aerobic C&S. He'll call with the results later this week, I hope.

http://www.ssnakess.com/photopost/data/509/2138swelling_on_m_AHS1_2_7_04.JPG http://www.ssnakess.com/photopost/data/509/2138swelling_on_mAHS3_2_7_04.JPG

Has anyone seen anything like this before? Any ideas would be appreciated!

[Vanan]

Sounds similar to what a snake of ours had. It turned to be an abcess. This after some stupid vet told us he had parasites just cos there were pinworms in his fecals. This snake then started wasting under his medications (septra, flagyl and panacur!). NO reduction is size of of abcess. After death (yes he died!) we necropsied him and found a hardened abcess. One which could have been aspirated in it's earlier stages.

Another reason for mid-body swellings is Crypto. The swelling usualy shows after the snake dies though.

Keep us posted on the results as I'm very interested in the outcome. Oh and btw, if finances permit, try get a second opinion too. The vet who treated our snakes was supposed to be a herp vet but he told us that all snakes require UV lighting else they can't synthesise D3!

[lolaophidia]

Vanan, Thanks for the reply! I'm wondering if it might be an abscess- hopefully the lab will catch that. I'd think though that fluid from an abscess would be more milky with particulate matter. I didn't get a fecal done because- well I haven't saved any fecal matter from December... I am hopefull that simple aspiration and a round of antibiotics will clear things up. I'll let you know what the lab results are.

I have some doubts about this vet- though he's the most recommended reptile vet in town. The exotic pet questionaire I had to fill out prior to being seen hit a few of my annoyance buttons.

I can totally understand your frustration with the death of your snake from a preventable/treatable cause! Dewormers are poisons after all and can be worse that the parasite sometimes.

If the labs don't show some results- I'll look for a second opinion. I'll also do some research on Crypto- I appreciate the suggestions!

[Stockwell]

Yes, Vanan is probably correct. I have seen many snakes in my day develope various tumours, cysts, abscesses,cancers, whatever they are.
Some microbial infections like Ameba can cause swellings, as can impaction, and various organ ailments. I recently had a rosy boa develope something very similar. It stopped eating, got skinny in the neck and died in 3 weeks. On autopsy it's liver was completely necrotic

[Vanan]

well I haven't saved any fecal matter from December.

Did he even have any bowel movements since December? Sometimes the abcess (or whatever lump it is) can cause an impaction cos it swells up and blocks the intestines. That snake we had was impacted. Just another thing to think about cos while he's on antibiotics, he could still have problems from an impaction. Sorry to give you so many reasons to worry about! I just get paranoid when I have no explanation for a snake's illness. Just so that you cover all areas to be foolproof. Good luck! :)

[Katt]

Seth, (the snake Vanan is discussing), could have lived if only we had gone to surgery. I had money on my VISA to do anything it took, but no, Seth was on four different meds, like really smart idea, Mr. Vet, the snake is already weak! (Baytril is the fourth med).

Poor guy, we cut him open and found a horrid mass, he had a huge impaction from the food that couldn't get through the squished intestine.

Seth died over a year ago. He was my first snake. I still haven't quite gotten over his loss, and to this day, I shed tears over him. I would give up all my snakes to have him back.

[lolaophidia]

The snake hasn't eaten since December and hasn't had any appreciable bowel movement since- just urates. Once the cause for the swelling is determined (if ever), I'll closely monitor bowel movements. For now, he's not feeding so I'm not adding to the impaction at least.

I'm sorry to hear about Seth- it really is horrible to lose an animal. It sound's like you did all you could and just got some bad advice from the Vet. :(

I'll let you guys know what the lab results are when I get them.
Thanks!

[lolaophidia]

Spoke to the vet the other night- still no definite diagnosis. He mentioned Crypto as a possibility and my heart just sank. We're waiting for the rest of the labs to come back. How could the snake have gotten Crypto? I purchased the pair last year as breeder adults and other than this instance- haven't seen any health issues. The female laid two clutches last year. None of my other snakes are showing any symptoms. I read that some snakes can be carriers and I'm really concerned for the rest of my collection. I also didn't see any hopeful treatment options so once I get a positive diagnosis, I may have to consider euthanasia. The vet did say that he thought that Crypto wouldn't be passed to hatchlings if I did keep the snake as a breeder. However, my concern is about possible transmission through some stupid hygine error on my part to the rest of my snakes.
The swelling was greatly reduced by the aspiration and the snake is very active so I may see if he'll feed today. The female he'd been breeding with fed last week and is preparing to shed now so I can at least take in a fecal sample of hers to see if it tests positive.

[Vanan]

Here's to hoping it's not crypto. I've heard too many horror stories with people and their whole collections having to be euthanised. *fingers crossed* There is a possibility of transmission through bad hygiene. Guess it's a lesson to all, crypto or not.

Hopefully he eats for you and starts recovering my friend. :)

[lolaophidia]

The swelling is definitely back. He ate a fuzzy mouse in spite of it on Tuesday night. He didn't eat the adult mouse I also offered him but I'm not surprised as swollen as he is right now. I'm hoping to get a fecal sample from him off to the vet before I leave town again on Sunday. I may have to have one of my herp friendly pals collect the sample and run it over to the vet for me while I'm gone... My hubby is a little squeamish when it comes to the snakes. The final results of the labs were inconclusive, no Crypto detected but it's still a possibility. The female the ill snake was paired with still seems well (fed, shed and passed the mouse she ate last week). I'll have her tested also, just in case.
Just keeping you guys posted...
Thanks,

[Vanan]

Thanks for the update. Wonder if it could also just be a tumour. Depends on what they were testing for anyways. They'd have to do a specific test for crypto to be sure too. Don't think it shows up on a broad spectrum kinda test.