Charcoal Powder

[Dani33]

I was curious if this safe to use as a bottom layer for naturalistic vivaria. When making plant only terrariums, it is beneficail to use it to keep the soil sweet, (not rot). The three layer would be charcoal, sand for drainage and organic soil. I have been thinking about getting some kind of amphibian and making a show piece for my living room. Thanks in advance for your replies.

[Double J]

I have used charcoal in the past. The problem is that it eventually gets saturated with "the bad stuff" and doesn't do anything further. I do not use it anymore in my vivs, it isn't really necessary or useful in the long run unless it is in a filter and can be easily replaced. And as for the sand.... I would use gravel instead. It will be a little lighter, and will give much better water circulation. The cheaper alternative to using aquarium gravel is to go to a landscaping store and buying a bag of washed stone. Not only does it look far better, but it is a heck of a lot cheaper, and does a better job. Just make sure you rinse it out well before putting it in your tank.. and stay away from limestone.
Also, I would stay away from potting soil... it tends to get rotten and soggy fast. A better mix is the following that can be made up yourself....
1 part eco-earth/bedabeast
1 part sphagnum moss
1 part peat moss
1/2 part sand
1/2 part crushed oak leaves
This mix works well for me, my plants go nuts. I take no credit for the mix.... I read about it somehwere actually.
Anyway, I'll post some great links to vivarium sites tomorrow... I have to get back to putting my Lygodactylus tank together.
Later
Double J

[C.m.pyrrhus]

Viv mixes is the trick. I use no soil myself. Usually is basically the same as above. Forest Bed, Fir bark, some sand and some leaves.

I also would vouch for using pebbles/river stone (washed stone) at the bottom, this allows more air that you need and better circulation. The leaves in the viv mix help add healthy decomposition to your mix and breaks down your herps poo. Basically what you are aiming for is a natural healthy mini eco-system. Many folks still have this idea that vivs are dirty, but if done right it will add a great addition to any realistic set-up.

[Dani33]

Thanks for the info guys. I don't have any oak trees near me. I do have a red maple in my yard. Is this safe to use as leaf litter? I was speaking to someone today and he recommended that I use sheet aquarium filter sponge in between the gravel and top layer. What do you guys think? Have you used this before? He said that I could purchase it from the local aquarium shop. Anyhow, thanks for the replies. Oh, Double J, do you have any pics of your vivs? I would love to see some.

Oh, when you do have, how do you keep it clean? Do you haul everything out and replace the mix, wash gravel etc every once in a while? Also, I want to get nocturnal species so that I don't need UV, but have read that I should use some kind of light for the plants. Any ideas?

Thanks

[Double J]

The filter in between the gravel and the soil is a good idea. I have used window screen, others weed block... all do the same thing. Now... the theory is that you never need to replace the substrate as long as you have water going in and coming out. You may have to add leaf litter every so often, but the frog poop and dead crickets are all the fertilizer you will ever need. So... you are misting every day, depending on what you have, then draining out the excess water on a weekly basis. This can be done by leaving an area of the gravel on the bottom bare, and then siphoning the water off with a turkey baster or a gravel washer. It is good to let the water level come up and wet the soil for a day or so every so often, and then draining off almost all of the water. This helps to flush the system out. Now, this system works as long as you have plenty of plants, and a large ratio of volume to animal size. This is why this system works so well for dart frogs as they are relatively quite small ieven in relation to a 20 gallon tank. Now, I do have some pics of my old vivs floating around somewhere on the web... but I do not have any recent pics of my any of my vivaria as they all have seen been re-done, and there are many more than before. In a few weeks, I should have some pics on the web... but in the mean time... check out the links below. They will blow your mind and inspire you as well.
www.frogworld.nl
Go to the dutch vivariums section. These tanks will knock your socks off.
Double J

[Double J]

Oh.. as for lighting, a double tube 18 inch flourescent fixture will do the trick for most tropical plants. You can get these at Wal-Mart and Canadian Tire for around 25 dollars. Plants like pothos, philodendrons, calatheas, and fittonia do well under this amount of light. If you want a brighter light for higher light-requiring plants such as bromeliads, use two of the screw-in compact fluorescent bulbs made by the all-glass aquarium company. You can get them at Big Al's/Aquarium Services, and Global Exotic Pets carries them as well. They fit into a standard incandescent aquarium fixture nicely, are low wattage, and pump out plenty of light. If you want a tank with darts or mantellas, you won't need any UV unless you are dealing with the egg-feeders.
If you have any other questions feel free to ask.
Double J

[Dani33]

Thanks, I am not sure as to which species that I would like to keep yet. I have a spare 29 gallon and want to make something beautiful with it. I certainly have some time to think about it. Thanks again and I will definately ask some questions when the time comes.

[Double J]

Heh, one more thing, the maple leaves are fine to use. Just make sure that no one around your place uses any pesticides. After you collect the leaves, let them sit in a bucket of hot water for 15 minutes, then drain it out. That is what I do anyway.
I think that's about it.
Good luck

[Dani33]

Can you make any suggestions for a frog other than dart frogs? I want something bigger like a white's tree frog or something. Just something that doesn't have tiny food requirements and that isn't so delicate. Would that be ok? Is the tank big enough and would it work? Just thinking about it. The only amphibians that I have had were fire belly toads. Thanks again.

Oh, and what do you use for backgrounds. That link that you gave me was amazing. I bookmarked it.

Edit: I was also curious, would the flouresents be ok on top of a screen for light? Thanks for answering all of my qs.

[Double J]

Fluorescents are fine sitting on top of the screen tops. Thats how they were on most of my tanks until I bought 4 foot shop lights, and set up proper shelving.
As for backgrounds, corkbark is the easiest for a beginner. I have used it, and it worked fine. Some people like to silicone it to the glass, but I think it's unnecesscary. The easiest way to do corkbark backgrounds is just to bury the bottom of the corkbark in the gravel layer. This gives more than enough structural support, plus, it allows the frogs to get behind it and hide which may help reduce stress. To cover up the visual gaps between the big cork pieces is simply to tape some bristol board to the outisde back portion of the tank. This looks good, and gives the frogs privacy. I have used cork before, but now I use the flevopol-like mixture similar to those dutch vivariums. However, I recommend just using the corkbark. It is a lot less messing around.
Now, you could do up a nice vivarium with some of the following frogs in single species setups.......
green tree frogs (Hyla cinerea)
squirrel tree frogs (Hyla squirella)
grey tree frogs (Hyla versicolor)
Red-eye tree frogs (Agalychnis callidryas)
The above frogs could be set-up comfortably in a 20-30 gallon tank (I'd go for a 30 for red-eyes) in a single species setup.
You could do Whites tree frogs in a 50-65 gallon tank, or something like a Cuban treefrog (Osteopolis sepentrionalis) in a 35 gallon tank or larger. Bigger is always better with these setups, and remember, add plants, plants, and more plants.
Now for your 29 gallon tank, I would recommend either the green tree frogs, squirrel tree frogs, or the red-eyes (no more than 3).
Good luck.
Feel free to ask any more questions
Double J

[Dani33]

Thanks, you've been very helpful! When you say cork, do you mean the sheet stuff that's used for cork boards - (to pin notes on and such)? Where can I purchase it and does it need to be treated? I have lots of drift wood, but find that it molds easily, should I treat this as well? I really like the red eyes, I'll look into thier care.

[Bighead]

You know... I've never actually thoght of using bulletin-board type bark for a background. My initial thought is that there is glue and probably some other stuff that may be harmfull to your (future) frogs. It may be ok, but I wouldn't doubt that the next post will be warning against it.
What most people are referring to when they talk about cork bark is just that - cork bark. It looks like the bark off of a tree (yes, a cork tree) and it makes for a very natural looking and functional background. You can get it at most pet stores, whether it be large chain, or small specialty herp shops. If you can't find any in your area, I recommend www.blackjungle.com. I can't think of much you can't get that you may want at that website and the prices aren't too bad. If you already have the tank, you can spend as little as $50 for a good setup or $1000 for an incredible one. Definitely check that site out as well.

[Double J]

No, no... CORK BOARD (the push pin stuff) IS VERY BAD..... there are countless chemicals in it that will harm your frogs. What I am talking is cork BARK. You can get it at places like Superpet....... but order it from Mark Pepper at www.understoryenterprises.com and he sells it for much cheaper and the pieces look far nicer. Check out his website under the supplies section and you will see what I mean.
Double J

[Dani33]

Duh, I don't know why I didn't think of that. I have tonnes of cork bark here. I use it for all my herps. I guess I didn't because of the shape- LOL. I just had flat stuck in my head. Thanks for the link.