Calcium sand?

[KingFfaj]

I've herd a few people say sand is bad for reptiles because it can cause impactions and it can get under scales and irritate the animal, but i was wondering what every one thought about calcium sand, as its suppost to be digestable an all?

I've just started using it as its good for conducting heat around

[crazyboy]

i dont thiunk that should be used either. i know many peoplae have the same feelings about calcium sand as they do about regular sand and that is that eihter one is known to cause impactions and poossibly kill yourm reptile so i would steer away from sand. But it does depend on the reptile you are housing in ther but i still wouldn't use sand because there are many alternitives.

[Auskan]

Try this thread:

http://www.ssnakess.com/forums/showthread.php?s=&threadid=35715

I've never used it, but according to people on this thread, the calcium that is in that sand is not the right kind of calcium to be beneficial.

[Linds]

Calcium sand is made from calcium carbonate, an antacid, exact same thing in Tums. It will neutralize the stomach juices which will inhibit digestion and absorption of essential nutrients.

[djc3674]

What about that stuff they sell in like Petco or something. It's supposed to be digestable and 100% safe. A friend has been keeping his leo on it since it was a baby..approx 6 months now, without a single problem. He said the bag even says that its safe for reptiles. I'm just curious if anyone has had problems with that stuff?

[marisa]

The bag is lying. And that's the same stuff we are talking about.

Unfortunatly there is no group that makes sure reptile products claim facts....basically they can say anything they want. No one tests the products except for us consumers.

Marisa

[Big_V]

Even that calcium sand can cause problems. If you look under a microscope the edges of it are very sharp and jagid. If too much sand is ingested these sharper edges kinda lock up and its hard for the animal to pass the sand. If you just have to use sand for some reason i think there are brands of play sand out there that beach washed and the sand grains are smooth and smaller.

[DragnDrop]

Anyone ever heard that water is the ultimate solvent? It can dissolve anything..... in time? Given enough time it can dissolve whatever you throw into it. It will dissolve granite and diamonds.... in time. IN TIME is the clincher.... it ain't gonna happen in one human lifetime..... but in 'one universal lifetime'. Big diff.

Same with calci sand, reptisand... all those calcium based sands. They're 100% digestible... IN TIME. Give the digestive juices enough time, and they'll dissolve all those little grains of calcium compounds into mush. As long as you keep adding fresh proper-strength digestive juices, and leave the sand in contact with it long enough... the sand too will pass :) ........ In time.

Which leopard (or other gecko, lizard or snake) has that much time to digest one grain of sand?? Not in one lifetime. The grains just sit inside, pile up in a tight gut corner, calcium content neutralizing acidic digestive juices... neutral digestion going on.... add more fresh digestive juice with the next meal and pile on more fresh sand particles to congregate inside the gut.... around and around and around we go...


Check out the discussion on the Gecko List about impaction in geckos. I've included the URLs and copied the pertinent parts of the posts.

BTW, the "Keith" being quoted is Dr Keith Benson DVM:

~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~
http://lists.gekkota.com/pipermail/gecko/2003-April/001438.html


I have seen many lizards, who were well supplemented with minerals, that still killed themselves eating this material. Many animals eat inappropriate objects (particularly young ones) regardless of their nutritional state.

Be careful out there.

Keith

~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~

Another one from "Keith" replying to Julie Bergman from The Gecko Ranch:

~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~

http://lists.gekkota.com/pipermail/gecko/2003-April/001437.html

Julie Bergman wrote:
> Digestible my butt! These bags of junk flat out lie! As soon as these
> "digestible" products came out all kinds of lizards started getting
> impacted on the stuff according to non-dom vets I work with.


Now julie, technically it is digestable. A very tiny amount will eventually dissolve in stomach acid. Of course in the real world this never works and many lizards die.

There is little control over the truth in advertizing for these products - and many manufacturers knw this and knowingly deceive the public.

Keith

~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~

http://lists.gekkota.com/pipermail/gecko/2003-April/001443.html


Calcium carbonate is indeed digestable - it will dissolve in a low pH aqueous solution - such as that in the stomach. But - it only works so well, and ingesting similar quantities of CaCO2 to those of what is seen in a sand impaction would likely overwhealm the system,

Keith

~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~

If you want to read the entire discussion, go to http://lists.gekkota.com/pipermail/gecko/2003-April/thread.html 2003-April Archives by Thread and read the "sand impactment " thread.

All I can say is why risk the life of your pet(s) because the sand looks so pretty or conducts heat or whatever the reason?

[Dark_Angel_25]

PERSONAL EXPERIENCE:
I recently bought an african fat tail. The store kept him on Calci-Sand. They only had him on it a week. I bought him Saturday. He only pooped Monday, and when I checked it, it was FULL of the sand. obviously it did not get digested, and was hard to pass as he eat Sat and Sunday night, but only pooped Monday. and then only after I soaked him in warm water. if one week built up enough sand to stop him from going and to be VERY visible in his poop, I would say it is a bad thing. DO NOT USE IT.

[KingFfaj]

thank you people. I think i'll stick to feeding out side the vivarium for know then.
Does look good though :p
This is really scary, it shouldnt be allowed to happen

[Dark_Angel_25]

in all honesty, I would take it out completey. they could ingest the sand (thinking it is calcium like they do) or just by accident. do you really want to risk it? use tile or papertowel, it is so much cheaper anyway. and if you get grey tile, it looks like stone and looks natural too. good looks should not be your top priority, it should be the potential health hazard to your animals.

[KingFfaj]

its snakes that are on it at the moment so im not to worried about them trying to eat it, more the sand getting stuck to the food

[Jeff_Favelle]

Water can dissolve Hydrochloric acid, bleach, cyanide, Pot. Permangenate, etc etc, but I'm not about to eat or drink any of those things.

[djc3674]

Water can dissolve Hydrochloric acid, bleach, cyanide, Pot.

LOL...maybe the "pot" (green leafy parts) but not the THC. THC is not water soluable.
Hence the process of making "bubblehash" :D

[KingFfaj]

lets not get in to that shall we: ) "crack" doesnt dissole in water either, or concreate