R.I.P. Sally

[TheRedDragon]

Two days ago, my beloved pet Pink-Toe - Sally passed away due to a bad molt. She will be sadly missed as she was an absolute sweetheart in addition to being my first and favourite tarantula. I cried a great deal in her passing, who would have thought that one could get so attached to a spider. Below is a picture of my sweetheart...R.I.P. little one....

http://www.angelfire.com/myband/slaughter/snakes/Sally03.jpg

[marisa]

That's really terrible! What do you mean by bad molt? Did she get stuck in it/die while molting?

Sorry for your loss. that bites.

Marisa

[TheRedDragon]

Yes, she died while molting...and it looked to be a bad one as her leg was all deformed.

[~Suntiger~]

There's nothing strange at all about growing so attatched to a tarantula, or any other creatures for that matter. (Well, maybe if it was a tapeworm...that would be pretty strange!)

So sorry to hear of your loss :(

[Vanan]

Are you sure she was a she and not a he? Don't see why it would die in a moult unless it's a) insufficient humidity or b) it was a male at his penultimate moult. Would there be any more reason why a T would die in a moult? Aside from direct trauma to it's body. I'm inclined to think that your pinktoe was a male. Either way it sucks. RIP Sally.

[daver676]

Sorry for your loss Erin. :(

[Dragoon]

Hmmmm, I was under the impression humidity is not a factor with larger T's...regardless, her pic of Sally shows some good moisture retaining stuff in there...

Could Rob or Martin give some reasons for bad molts happening, hmmm? Please? Pretty please....
*bats eyes*
:)
D.

[SaIiLdVaEnR]

Sorry to hear, she was a beautiful tarantula.

[Dani33]

Sorry to hear about Sally's passing.

[LadyHawke]

know what it feels like, i just lost my cobalt blue tarantula a little while ago
sorry for your loss

[OttawaChris]

Originally posted by Dragoon
Hmmmm, I was under the impression humidity is not a factor with larger T's...regardless, her pic of Sally shows some good moisture retaining stuff in there...

There is a lot of debate on that point actually. I am a believer of higher humidity during a molt, but I have had tarantulas molt out fine when it is bone dry in the enclosure too.

First off, I am very sorry to hear about your loss. The first one is always the hardest.

Now for my 2 cents...

The reason I am pro-humidity is for this... anyone ever keep a molted "skin"? The best way to soften it up is to put it into a small container with a few drops of water. This changes the hard, dry shell into a pliable hollow tarantula :) This is because the few drops of water in a small space creates high humidity and softens up the shell. I think it happens the same when a spider is molting... it helps soften the exoskeleton to allow them to have it more elastic and easier to escape from.

When I notice a spider is molting, I traditionally bring them into the bathroom and set them on the counter (be VERY careful when carrying the enclosure so not to jolt or move it too much). Then I run a hot shower for a few minutes (this boosts the humidity and the temperature) And I leave the spider there in the dark for the remainder of the day or night undisturbed. This is sort of a makeshift variation of the "ICU" for tarantulas.


In this particular case though, I don't think humidity had anything to do with it. You say it was deformed when it was coming out... its a shame I cant see a pic. This sounds a lot to me like the damage was done before you ever got her. I am suspecting malnutrition.

When a tarantula doesnt get to eat right, they can get deformities like what you were describing. Unfortunately, a high percentage of tarantulas are still WC specimens (one the size you had was almost guarenteed to be)

The sad thing is that many of these spiders after being harvested, are poorly treated. They arrive here starved and dehydrated (some of the WC shipments I used to receive came in with abdomens shrunken to the size of peas and it disgusted me). To compound the problem, they usually head to pet stores where things often only get worse.

Don't blame yourself here... I think this poor spider was a victim of the ruthless spider trade that 3rd world countries have. This is a prime example of why people should always strive to obtain CB specimens that come from someone that cared for them... because I guarentee that the WC ones didnt.

[Tarcan]

Sorry about your loss Erin...

I simply not a fan of higher humidity during molt, as this is pretty much pointless...

While it is true that humidity will make the exoskeleton softer... one needs to understand what is the real problem when a spider gets stuck in a molt (which are most often the legs)... you will find the reference to this in the very valuable Schultz's book p. 152:

" The greatest peril is that the tarantula will not be able to pull it's legs through the hardened rings around the joints in the legs of the old skeleton. These constricting rings are as hard and inflexible on a fresh exuvium from a yound tarantula as they are from a very old one... (cutting a little bit of text here)... the STATE OF HYDRATION OF THE OLD EXOSKELETON IS IRRELEVANT..."

Of course, I invite you to reed the rest of the text, or buy the book if you do not already have it... and read the whole book! (please).

Hobbyists have to stop having this false idea that they have to deal with the molt when it happens (somekind of recurrent one event thing)... Actually it is all the contrary... how can I explain this... there are two types of people, the person that will try to heal itself once the damage has been done (or the sickness caught) with not much luck at it... and the other person that will prevent it and will end up not having to deal with it...

The most important period in your Ts life is actually between two molts not the molt itself... if your T is malnourished (well that is obvious, as Chris pointed it out) or if your spider must constantly have to fight dehydration (sounds stupid, but happens really often)... well, when the time comes, it simply does not have enough energy to get out of the old exoskeleton... if it is cared for in the correct manner (that means preparing your T in advance for the event), molting will be a real joke and you won't even remotly bother about this "dreaded event"...

Erin, as Chris pointed out, your spider might have been doomed from the first place if it was recently imported... so, I know it is very unfortunate, but I am pretty sure it was not your fault...

One other thing is that a T will often die of old age being trapped in it's molt... but it will usually be really trapped in it... with WC, it is hard to determine age of the specimen if it was full grown when purchased...

I hope this helps

Martin

[Emily-Fisher]

OMG Erin, I am sooo sorry!

And it's not like she died because of a careless owner... I remember you PMing me with all those questions about her... I knew from the start that you were going to be a very dedicated invert owner. Remember, it wasn't your fault! Often, whenever an animal dies, I want to blame myself for it but we all know what an awesome owner you are! If I was a bug, I would want to belong to you :p

R.I.P., Sally! I'll miss seeing those photos of you... And Erin, I am so sorry :(

[Vanan]

Hmmm...what you say makes sense Martin. And yea, I did read the Schultz's book but didn't agree with that part totally. Not that I'm anyone to judge and decide seeing as I have only 3 yrs of T-keeping under my belt.

The way I look at it is, the time in between moults (like you've mentioned) definitely play a big part, but I'm sure keeping the humidity up during the pre-moult does make a difference. Like in snakes, an underfed, dehydrated snake is gonna shed badly but to help it through, we raise humidity, soak it in water etc. to help make it easier on it. So, wouldn't the same thing apply to T's? Or is there something else which is a major factor in not raising the humidity during a moult? Like would it be bad or possibly cause problems if the humidity was raised?

[Tarcan]

Vanan,

Actually, the thing should be that we should keep our Ts to their natural optimal humidity, before, during and after molt, like that we avoid any trouble as they are in their best conditions... so for me, honest to god, I never raise the humidity of any terrarium prior to molts... and I am not a big fan of the bone dry terrarium either (that is a whole different debate...), only when needed depending of the species...

Keep in mind that semi-arid dwellers still require a good 60% humidity to be happy campers... a lot of people confuse semi-arid with desertic... totally two different things... normally, most houses will have humidity of 40% or so... imagine heating the terrarium on top of that with big ventialtion... no way the water bowl compensates for that, humidity is extremely low... so you still need to boost the normal humidity of the terrarium... for an animal that is used to live in an environment of say 80%, in 40% that is a lot of "stress" fighting the dehydration...

One bad side of raising the humidity too much, mostly with slings... is that in the instance that fungus would grow, a freshly molted sling has no protection against it, and I have seen completely healthy specimens with a succesfull molt dying because of this... but normally everything is all right...

In the end, I am not saying not to do it, I am only saying it is pointless... I have sometimes 10 to 20 molts in one evening here, so there is no way I would allow myself to stress for each and everyone of them...

But if it makes everyone safer, go ahead!

Martin

[Vanan]

So you're saying that it's better to be healthy and not get sick, than allow yourself to get sick and look for remedies, like you said in an above post. Makes sense. Personally, I've never worried during a moult. All I do is a lil bit of overfilling of the water dish to wet the substrate a lil. But yea, what you say makes sense. Thanks Martin! Love these kinda eye-opening discussions! :D

[marisa]

Great posts guys. Definitly given me lots of new things to think about with my two T's.

At this time I basically give them 100% humidity by misting and water dish dumps in the morning, but then the cage has a dry out period and is almost dry by morning. I do this to try and avoid molds, but also provide high humidity. I do not *think* the humidity drop in the afternoon until the next morning effects them but maybe that is also something to think about.

Marisa

[Yve]

sorry to for your loss Erin:(

[TheRedDragon]

Thanks for the support and information guys. I'll be sure to get several more T's in the future. I did get Sally from a petstore that I once worked at, and, their inverts (and most everything else for that matter) are wild caught. I fed Sally quite well; even a pinky mouse once to plump her up a bit. I always made sure that her enclosure was clean, I misted her often to give her some humidity as I know Pink Toes like around 80%, and I always made sure that she had water. Considering the conditions that she was in BEFORE my ownership of her though, I kind of felt that she was doomed from the start, but, you can't blame a girl for trying.