What's Anerythristic & Axanthic?

[Tigergenesis]

I'm confused on the difference.

[BoidKeeper]

Anery mean lacking red pigment, like in corns. Black and white corns are anerythristic.
Axanthic means lacking yellow. Like in ball pythons. Balls that are black and silver are Axanthic.
In Kenyans some say the black and white ones are Axanthic, I however beliver them to be Anerythristic because they are normally orange and black, not yellow and black.
One more term just to add to the confusion, Xanthic. Xanthic means excessive yellow.
Cheers,
Trevor

[wyz]

Tiger, thanks for asking.. It answers a question I had :)

WYZ

[Katt]

BoidKeeper unfortunately in this respect you're wrong about anery and axanthism in kenyans. Kenyans ARE normally yellow and black. Take a look at the wild ones. Keep in mind, that red is just an "advanced" pigment of yellow.

Axanthism and anerytherism in kenyans is completely interchangable.

[BoidKeeper]

Oh tomAto tomatO!
Thanks,
Trevor

[Jeff_Favelle]

Axanthism and anerytherism in kenyans is completely interchangable.

Then the terminology in KSB's is completely WRONG. Axanthic means a "xanthins". Its doesn't mean a snake can't be yellow. Its just means that it doesn't produce xanthins, a common pigment in the animal world.

Same with anerythristic. It means there is NO production of erythrins. There is NO OTHER meaning for it. It means the animal lacks the pathways for the red pigment production. There is no grey area.

[Stockwell]

The following is from Reptiles magazine Nov 2000
The article called "MUTANTS" by Glen Fankhauser

"Some snakes that have been found to be axanthic are: corn snakes, California kings, South florida kings, Transpecos ratsnakes, SAND BOAS, Ball Pythons, Honduran Milks, Brazilian Rainbows and Columbia boas.
Although the prefix "xan" literally refers to yellow, there has been some confusion regarding the terminology of animals lacking red.
The prefix referring to red is ery, therefore snakes without red are routinely called
Anerythristic.
While this is technically correct, they are more properly termed axanthic as they are missing the entire complex of xanthophores which control both
yellow and red pigment."

So based on this, the black and white Kenyans in question should properly be referred to as
AXANTHIC.
However since they are indeed lacking RED it is not technically incorrect to call them Anerythristic.
I think the bottom line here, is that when we are talking about black and white Kenyans, we are talking about the same mutation regardless of which term is used.

[Jeff_Favelle]

So the Xanthophores control both yellow AND red? That's crazy. I wonder how they have to be altered to be lacking just red, or just yellow, or both?

Nature just kicks a$$! Thanks for sharing that Roy and Katt. It came up in the Queensnake forum as well. I wish we understood it more. Sometimes you just wish scientists would stick their noses in eh? :D

[Stockwell]

Jeff, I don't profess to understand that stuff. That is why I quoted published text.
The reality is that other than by H. Bernard Bechtel and Elizabeth Bechtel, there is not much real work that has been done at DNA levels that has been varified.
There are lots of people saying stuff that ain't necessarily known to be scientifically proven.
Only a couple years ago we were incorrectly calling patternless Leos, leucistic... remember ?
Then came "Blizzards"
Those are now known to be Leucistic.
(from the same article)

You should see the various opinions I have on my new chocolate Kenyan morph..They appear to be missing both red and yellow, but they've been replaced with brown...
so are they also axanthic and anerythristic? or are they hypoerythristic? Perhaps they are the first actual Anerythristics, the black and whites being Axanthics..
I really don't know what combination of chromatophore mutation is at work to turn screaming orange snakes into dew worms. LOL
I have a head ache now...

[Jeff_Favelle]

YOU have a headache? Ha ha!!

What about the Barkers? Haven't they done some preliminary stuff on pigment layers? I'm not entirely sure if they're qualified though.

Those chocolates are definitely intriguing, and I can totally see the interest in them. What's the genetics behind it? (ie. recessive, co-dom, dom, etc etc).

I wish we knew more. Or do I? Its kinda nice having something be such a mystery, don't you think?

[Katt]

Vanan and I were discussing pigments last night, after I made my post. We were trying to think of any snake that doesn't not have yellow as an "underlay" underneath all other colours.

I don't think those chocolate KSB are anery's, there's no yellow tint or hints (like anery corns). I think they may be hypermelanistic. Remember that brown is just a black pigment that's changed shape (correct me if I'm wrong). So the normally coloured areas are now "black" aka brown.

Cross them to albinos. See if there's any yellow underneath that brown.

[Katt]

Jeff, I don't know, the pigment pathway from yellow to red pigments, but if there are say enzymes needed to change yellow to red, a fault in the metabolic pathway in the production of the enzyme(s) itself would stop the production of red.