Feces Question...

[Zoe]

Okay, here's the deal. I got a fecal done on my boa when he first defecated, and the sample came back negative. Anyway, he just defecated again tonight and it's somewhat greenish. The urate itself was white, the feces were dark brown and normal-looking (but there wasn't very much of it) and there was also this greenish, watery, gooper stuff.
Now, the first fecal was done on a small sample, so is it possible there was a mistake, and that the snake does have parasites?
Or could there be another reason for this? I recently found out that he was lost for two months before I got him (and he wasn't fed between his being found and his being acquired by me), so is it possible he's just expelling the last of the gunk that was in him from roaming around with no food for two months? Could that also explain the small amount of feces and large (normal) amount or urate?

Any insight would be good! I will get a second fecal done to make sure, of course, but any info would be much appreciated.

Thanks!
Zoe

[C.m.pyrrhus]

When a fecal is done, all that is needed is a small amount. What is done is this. The fecal is put into a "cup", and a solution is added to "float" the particles to the top of this cup. A slide is placed over this for ~15 minutes to catch these small particles the float solution is working on. What remains are small particles that are looked under a microscope to check for parasites and what have you. Not only are parasites searched for, but red and white blood cells, mucas, other body cells and so on and so forth.

So, by taking in a cup of fecal is not all that nessesary, as only about the size of a pencil eraser is used in the process. What happens in negative results is, nothing in that small sample was found, not that it could have been found elsewhere in the remaining fecal sample per se'. So negative results are only concerning the small amount looked at. Positive certainly means that something was found. Fecals should be done every 6 months or so to be safe, and should not cost but about $20, it is very simple to do and takes only about 20 minutes.

[Zoe]

I see... but I've heard that in some cases the first came back negative and the second came back positive (incompetetant temps??)

Regardless, what else could explain that?

Thanks
Zoe

[eyespy]

If the sample isn't fresh enough, that can also cause false negatives. Many parasite eggs go into stasis when removed from the warm and moist environment of an animal's gut. Once those eggs become hard-coated with a protective barrier they don't absorb stain well and can be very hard to see in a sample.

If the poop is less than 2 hours old false negatives become a strong possibility for pathogens such as coccidia and some of the flagellates.

[JonD]

this may be a dumb question, can you or should you put the ziplocked fecal matter in the fridge overnight if you can't take it in right away? Just wondering if it affects the results?

[Zoe]

LESS than 2 hours old? Just want to make sure that you didn't mean MORE than 2 hours...

I put the sample in an air-tight baggy... how long will a sample last? I won't be able to bring it in - wil tomorrow be too late?

Zoe

[eyespy]

Oops, yes, I did mean MORE than 2 hours old. Refrigerating samples will push some pathogens into stasis because of decreased temperatures and humidity. When you absolutely can't get a fresh sample to the vet right away a refrigerated sample beats a room temperature one because the organisms won't start to decay and become totally unidentifiable. Putting a wet paper towel inside the bag will slow down the stasis process but not fully prevent it. So a fresh sample is always best but I realize that's not always possible.

[JaredAren]

Great thread. Very informative. Thanks Eyespy.

[eyespy]

A vet friend who is peeking over my shoulder informs me that greenish gunk may be bile that is being passed. Ordinarily it mixes in with the food in the digestive tract to help it break down but a fast of a couple months means there's not much for it to mix with and so you get to see it in all its "glory."

But if it's greenish and not yellow that's a sign of a possibly significant dehydration. Getting bloodwork that includes an electrolyte count and liver function tests might not be a bad idea.

[Grant vg]

zoe,

if you just recently got it, theres no need to jump to conclusions...
many newly acquired snakes wont defecate properly right away.
Call it an upset stomach if you will.

if it was lost for a couple of months, soak it every few days , and continue with a normal feeding regimen.
if theres still a concern a couple feces down the road, then perhaps another fecal should be done, but until them, i wouldn't sweat it too much or spend a bunch of money on bloodwork, etc...

[Zoe]

Alrighty, I brought the sample in today (what a pain in the ***, btw, they wanted me to bring in the snake too for 70$. right.) and the results came back tonight that the sample of actual feces was too small. GRR. Sooo I'm supposed to bring another in, whenever he defecates next (who knows when!).
However, I'm not sure if she said she would charge me for the second one or not (I remember her saying she wouldn't but since I was sleeping before and after the phone call I may very well have dreamed it!). Oh well, nothing is too good for my baby.

Thanks eyespy, all that was very helpful!

Zoe

[Zoe]

Oh! About the dehydration... he no longer looks dehydrated (i know that doesn't mean he isn't) but when he defecated, it was very wet. The feces/urate themselves were intact and normal, but a lot of liquid came out, too. What could explain that? Any iders?

Thanks!
Zoe