Where can I find russian or greek tortoises?

[Dani33]

I have been considering a red foot tortoise. After researching, I am also interested in either a greek or russian tortoise. I just wanted to see if anyone knew of breeders and prices. Any help is appreciated. I do love the red foot tortoises, I am not sure that I want to keep an animal that requires so much space. I have room, just wanted to see what the availability of the others are. Thanx!

[Linds]

Russians can be purchased through pet stores and people that receive imports (these are very difficult to breed, and pretty well all available are imports). I haven't seen many greeks around so I cannot be of much help. Sorry.

[Dani33]

Thanx very much Linds, you are always sooo helpful. I certainly will not purchase anything that is not captive bred, (by importing do you mean wild caught?) I feel there is no justification, as I only want them as pets. I haven't ruled out the redfoot, just wanted to know. I have lots of time to think about it.

[johnnym1972]

Hello there everyone! Russians are NOT that hard to breed, they just do not produce big clutches. Therefore the hatchlings are not just sold to the first person that inquires about them. There are a small number of dedicated breeders in Canada, including myself, who absolutely love to work with them and strive to produce healthy captive bred offspring every year. I would NEVER buy a Tortoise or Turtle from a Pet Store, that is the last place that you should look!!! You can generally find hatchlings and older ones available if you are willing to put your name on a list and wait for up to a year at the most. If you are serious about wanting a captive bred Russian or Greek Tortoise, send me a PM or an email and I will talk to you privately.
Take care, Johnny.

[Scotty Allen]

Being as turtles and tortoises cannot be imported into Canada for commercial purposes, where do you think the few that are in pet stores come from?? Don't be so quick to condemn all pet stores, breeders have to sell their offspring somewhere.

[johnnym1972]

Captive bred and wild caught Appendix II, Appendix III and unprotected Turtles and Tortoises are being imported into Canada every day. To do so, you have to be able to prove competency and also get the appropriate permits. That is why most people think that they are not able to import them. It has nothing to do with being impossible, but it does have everything to do with being very time consuming and costly. I know this from first hand experience and personal involvement. By the way, I don't know of any ETHICAL Tortoise breeders that sell Tortoises to pet stores, and I know most of the ETHICAL Tortoise breeders in Canada. The few Tortoises that are available in Pet Stores generally come from "Wholesalers" or "Importers", not from breeders!!!!!
Johnny.

[gfisher2002]

johnnym is right. Breeders sell there offspring to people., not pet stores. If they do they shouldn't be breeding. A breeder of russians would have no problem selling off the offspring to knowledgable retile keepers. Seeling to a pet store, you don't know who's getting the poor thing. It's a little unhumane on the breeders part if he breeds just to sell them off to stores.

[johnnym1972]

Thank you gfisher2002 for your comments!!! It's nice to hear from someone who cares about the animals and the care that they should receive, rather than referring to them as being sold off as inventory!!!! Best of luck to you and your critters!!!
Take care, Johnny.

[gfisher2002]

Thanks Johnny. I have seen, like I'm sure many others here have, FAR too many animals kept in unhealthy and cruel conditions. Red-eared sliders are a perfect example,. There are thousands of them living in tiny tanks, no lights no basking area, 2 inches of water. And yet they still show up in pet stores. How can you knowingly sell someone an animal without telling them how large they will get, what they require or how many there already are out there in DESPERATE need of a good home. It's bullsh*t!! If you want to make a living selling **** and running a business, open a Tim Hortons. No offence to loyal pet lovers that own stores. I know an awsome reptile lover who has a petstore. But he's informative and selective with his customers. If your ignorant and incompatant, he won't sell you that $200 Chameleon to make the sale. Those other retards selling animals to make money without regard to the animals needs, are stupid heartless F**king MORONS.
Sorry for getting so pissed. I can't stand not having room for an animal that needs a home. And people like us are always cleaning up after the results of these careless pet store owners. Making room for more animals(not that I don't want more) and putting heart and soul into nursing an animal back to health only to have it die because of unreversable damage done by some useless tit. The careless owners are also to blame.

'me grinds teeth and takes a deap breath'

[chalmers]

Hey Johnny, looks like you found your match! Good on ya gfisher2002! With you an Johnny in the forums...there will be no messing around!!

Take care,

Nicole

[Turtle Matt]

I have some russians for sale...Email or PM me for more details..
Matt

[gfisher2002]

chalmers, What does that mean?

[johnnym1972]

Hello again gfisher 2002, she's a friend of mine so don't worry. :) She's referring to our shared passion regarding Turtles and Tortoises, and our propensity to tell it like it is... you know, without the sugary coating!!! :D It's definately a compliment in my books!!! LOL

Hello Nicole, it's good to see that you joined the site. Say hi to your little Russian buddy for me! :)

Take care, Johnny.

[gfisher2002]

Thanks for clearing that up Johnny. Wasn't sure. Thought she was dissing you and me. Sorry for sounding defensive.

[johnnym1972]

Hey, no problem gfisher2002. I've felt the same way myself sometimes. :P
Take care, Johnny.

[gfisher2002]

lol, take care bud. By the way, I checked your photo gallery, NICE PICS!! Those are some nice herps you got there. I've very jealous of the variety.

'me dreams of having a bigger place'

[chalmers]

Hey guys...should have just sent you both a thumbs up!

gfisher2002 - just glad to read that there is someone else out there as passionate about turtles and tortoises as Johnny and I.
I didn't mean any harm by my last message. Johnny is always so clear and up front with his emails...and he doesn't often get a reply from someone backing him up!! That's why I said he had met his match!!

Happy New Year!

Hey Johnny - my little guy is doing great!

Nicole

[NiagaraReptiles]

Originally posted by johnnym1972
Captive bred and wild caught Appendix II, Appendix III and unprotected Turtles and Tortoises are being imported into Canada every day. To do so, you have to be able to prove competency and also get the appropriate permits. That is why most people think that they are not able to import them. It has nothing to do with being impossible, but it does have everything to do with being very time consuming and costly. I know this from first hand experience and personal involvement. By the way, I don't know of any ETHICAL Tortoise breeders that sell Tortoises to pet stores, and I know most of the ETHICAL Tortoise breeders in Canada. The few Tortoises that are available in Pet Stores generally come from "Wholesalers" or "Importers", not from breeders!!!!!
Johnny.

Here are a couple paragraphs taken directly from the CFIA regulations pertaining to an import permit for Turtles/Tortoises. Keep in mind that all applications for the import of any and all Turtles and Tortoises for commercial purposes will be refused. Educational, personal or Zoo purposes are the only reasons for import that will be considered.

<b>"The animal(s) or thing(s) imported under this permit are for use only by the importer. They are not to be sold, distributed or used for other commercial purposes.

Due to the unknown health impact of environmental release, the imported animals, all subsequent progeny and any tissues of these animals, other than those in final histological preparations, must not be removed from the premises of destination listed on this permit without the written authorization of the Canadian Food Inspection Agency."</b>

This is only a small part of what would be involved in importing any turtles or tortoises, but without this the wheels will not turn any further.

I know of a breeder - correction - <i>the</i> breeder of Red Foots in Ontario that doesn't sell any tortoises privately and produces around 140-150 babies a year. I guess this falls under the category of <b>"The few Tortoises that are available in Pet Stores generally come from "Wholesalers" or "Importers", not from breeders!!!!!"</b>.

I'm sorry if this post comes across as being offensive, that is not my intent. I was hoping to offer a little more information on the subject, nothing more.

Best wishes all,

JonK

[Scotty Allen]

Thank you Jon for a sound, sensible post. There is nothing offensive in it at all, nothing to apologize for. How is the old fart doing anyway, I haven't been out that way for a long time?

[Bartman]

I know Ed_ has some...give him a pm..he checks the site everyonce in a whiiile..but you will get a reply..i bought one from him

[johnnym1972]

Hello Jon K, there is nothing offensive about your post, because there is nothing to take offence to. You are providing nothing more than a snippet of the text that accompanies this long and federally complicated process of importation. If you had checked it out thoroughly, you would realize that the written text DOES NOT always hold all the answers. In fact, it generally only holds the clues that show you how to navigate the loopholes.

As far as your friend "THE" breeder of Red Foot Tortoises is concerned, he is allowed to make his own choices and he will obviously have to live with his choices. As such, breeders who actually CARE about their offspring can make a choice to label him as "UNETHICAL" if he chooses to abandon his offspring to the open market.

If you had quoted me correctly, you would have shown the entire point of the quote that you provided to allow for proper understanding of the context of my statement. Since you did not, I will do it for you.

Quote:
Originally posted by johnnym1972
"By the way, I don't know of any ETHICAL Tortoise breeders that sell Tortoises to pet stores, and I know most of the ETHICAL Tortoise breeders in Canada. The few Tortoises that are available in Pet Stores generally come from "Wholesalers" or "Importers", not from breeders!!!!!"

As you can see, I did not limit my statement to a mindless claim, as you tried to imply. Here is the point of what you obviously failed to understand;
"I know most of the ETHICAL Tortoise breeders in Canada and none of them sell to pet stores!!!"

LIke I said before, there is nothing offensive about your post, since there is nothing in your post that contradict's me!!!

Take care, Johnny.