What substrate is efficient in cleaning and time?

[Amirra]

I'm looking for something that lasts long is durble and does not absorb fecal and urine smells and bacteria.

I am sick of newspaper and papertowel messes... need something I can swap out and clean pretty quick.

I went to the Florida Reptile Expo this weekend and saw a cork board substrate. I liked it but wasnt sure if it would absorb bacteria and such. I dislike that plastic fake grassy prickly stuff.

I have a Bubblegum Rat Snake and a Ball Python.

I Also have a High Yellow Leo.

Will cork work for my species of reptiles? If not I am in dire need of something else workable.

thanks

-Alexa

[Jeff_Favelle]

Cypress mulch.

[ohh_kristina]

I use cypress bark for my snakes that require high humidity. I just spot clean the area under and around the urates/defecation. I use aspen bedding for the rest of my animals and use the same spot cleaning method for that. It works pretty well and looks nice. I remove and replace all bedding about once a month or once every other month. I haven't had any problems.
If you do the spot cleaning method with the cork bark, you shouldn't have any problems with it.

[burmer]

I'm the same as Kristina. I use cypress for all my herps that are high humidity animals. You can't beat the price. It does look good and spot cleans easy.

[Invictus]

I use sphagnum moss for the humidity lovers, and have had awesome success with it. For the big snakes, astroturf. For the rest, shredded aspen or paper towel depending on how often they need to be cleaned. I guess you can say I've tried it all and continue to use several varieties of substrate for various reasons. :)

As for the cork, negative on that. Cork would absorb smell like you wouldn't believe, and it's impossible to clean.

[sapphire_moon]

since you only have 3 animals and not a big collection.........

I use carefresh for my corn, works great, no smell, absorbs urates and fecal matter, actually kinda clumps together, Check the cage every (or every other) day, and just scoop the little clump out. Once we get my bp's cage all set I am thinking about putting him on carefresh also.

Can't seem to find cypress mulch or aspen bedding around my area.

I do not have a leo so I'm not sure what would work for them....sorry.....

[mark129er]

Just a question: do you buy the cypress bark from the pet store or from the gardening department of hardware stores??

[Amirra]

Thank you all for your replies...And I'm really glad I didn't buy the cork bark...

As for the cypress mulch, it sounds real great and all, but do I go buy it at a reptile store or just go to my nearest wal-mart?

And when feeding time comes around, do any of you have a separate tank for just feeding the snake? When I went to a local reptile store, this guy had just sold his candy corn, and it was in one of those cheap, plastic cricket containers with the vented lid and pop top. It was a large cage too, and he said that the cage was just for feeding the snake and then he put it in another cage forit to live. Said it kept the snake more tame that way... and when it comes to cypress mulch, isnt there a problem with accidental ingestion?

sorry for all the questions, I have had my snakes for about 3.5 years and have made many bad desicions when it came to the right environments, nothing life threatening to the animals, but it cost me oodles of extra money I know I could have saved otherwise.

And what is comfortable living space for a ball python? Most care sheets I have read said about a 20 gallon, but I have one now and Draco, my bp, is only a juvi and he's already squished...

[Amirra]

so where do I get the cypress mulch and carefresh?

[mark129er]

Exo terra markets cypress mulch which is available at most pet stores (at a huge mark-up) or you could buy it from a hardware/gardening store. I like to heat mine in the oven before using it to kill any parasites that may have piggy-backed into the package.

[Linds]

Most garden centres (including Wal Mart, depending on where you are) carry cypress mulch. It is definitely something you can avoid pay the $$ from a pet store for.

If you choose to go with Carefresh, you do have to get it from select pet stores.

For your leo I wouldn't recommend going with cypress mulch, it isn't good for arid environments like that, in addition to which it can still cause impaction, and we know how much substrate tends to end up in a leos mouth :rolleyes: They are paper trained so I would recommend sticking with papertowel... you cannot get easier than that... just remove/replace the "bathroom square" as needed. Seriously only a 10 second job.

[Amirra]

okay thanks.

I was planning to keep my leo on paper towel until she reached full growth, and I'm gonna try either aspen bedding or cypress mulch for my ball python and corn snake.

What about aspen bedding? Do ball pythons like it? I saw that the people at busch gardens have their rat snakes on it, and wasn't sure about bps.

[Invictus]

Our BPs are doing quite well on aspen.

[Classic]

All my animals do really well on aspen also. It is really good for spot cleaning and appears to be more availible than the cypres. Where I am anyways. Aspen, when purchased in a bulk bag can last up to 10-12 months for 20 snakes.

[nolagurl]

I use ReptiBark. It's kind of expensive but it looks good, smells good, and spot cleans like a dream. It's wonderful for retaining humidity as well. You can purchase it in pet stores like http://www.petco.com

[eyespy]

I like the ground coconut husk substrates such as Bed a Beast or Eco Earth. It's light and fluffy enough to shop-vac out of an enclosure so even a total substrate change takes like 10 minutes.

I like aspen for my colubrids who don't need much humidity but prefer the coconut stuff for anything higher than 55% humidity as aspen tends to mold.

[C.m.pyrrhus]

IMO, the best things I have used have been wood /paper products. I use aspen mainly for my colubrids. Works well, stays "healthier" for a good amount of time, and works well for the money. I like to use fir bark and cypress, but personally only makes sence if you have the money and want a really nice looking set-up. My boas are on newspaper and in melamine cages. Clean up is very simple. I have used the Bed-a-Beast and Forest Bed, both coconut products. The only problem I see with them is that you must remove as much water from it as possible, as water/moisture creates mold and bacteria. It does a fair job at keeping these problems away though. It also tends to get dusty after a while, and needs more replacing of new substrate more often. It does work well for those herps needing humidity. Of cource, never use cedar for anything. I also go against pine shavings.

I will never use Astro-turf (Fake grass crap) as once it is wet, it is no longer any good. As much as you try to clean and dry it, the moisture stays in there and creates small communities of bacteria that can come to haunt you later. This is the same with any carpeting substrates. No matter what one says, it never is completly clean or dry after soiled. Some have used it for some time, but I have seen many herps that get sick from the micro-organisms that live within it. IMO it is a death trap waiting to happen.
In the same light, I have a good friend that lost a whole collection (over 400 snakes) due to the same problems with his homes carpeting. He moved into a new home, but the carpet was a few years old but relatively new. As soon as he moved in, the snakes all started to have problems. Eventually he found out the hard way that his carpet was home to a severe bacterial "invection", and even after a professional and spendy cleaning, the bacteria remained. This goes on in the tightly woven threads of the carpet, even the herp related stuff, and is basically impossible to reach and disinfect.

[Stockwell]

Well, well well, the decades pass, and little changes...
There is no perfect substrate! We all continue to try diffent stuff.. and base our opinions on whether our herps seem to be OK...
I tried astro turf in the 80's, it looks great but you need to clean it in the bathtub, and if sheds and clogs the drain.(my experience)
Pine was a staple for many years for both feeder animals and herps...isn't it funny how people now have a problem with it.
I still use Alpha chip which is pine.
Aspen seems fine too.
Hardwood chips , Beta chip I have over 15 years experience with...all good, other than staining water bowls and moulding quickly.
Cypress... I've lost some expensive greybands and rosy boas to that stuff... It's a bag of moist toothpics... I don't use it at all any more as it sticks to prey , gets ingested and kills your animal
whatever works for you I guess.
Eyespy seems to have a problem with Spaghnum, but I have used it for a quarter century for moist species... with good results, and no observable problems...(Brazilian rainbows & bloods)

In general, pet store type substrates(carefresh) are just too expensive for large collections...
But keep experimenting people..there is nothing that is perfect for everything.
I use kids play sand for Leos, and Bibrons& skinks.. I've been breeding leos on that substrate since 1979 and never had an impaction problem

[eyespy]

We routinely do nasal swabbings of all reptiles we get for rescue or that need surgery and nearly 2/3 of all the herps I've swabbed that are kept on sphagnum or peat test positive for aspergillosis.

That's one of those "hidden" diseases that very often doesn't show symptoms until the aflatoxins build up enough to cause kidney failure. So I really hate those mosses. I see a lot of totally preventable deaths from that stuff.

[lordkovacs]

i use cypress as well...never any problems, and good for humidity.
cheers,
MIKE

[JasonBrennan]

I use cypress mulch for all of my snakes. The only exceptions are the new animals in quarantine, and the few worms (colubrids) I get once in a while. These are kept on newspaper regardless of size. Once the new snakes are allowed out of quarantine, they go onto cypress as well.

It should be noted that almost every snake I have is of a large species or a ball python. I do get the occasional colubrid, but they are few and far between.

You can buy cypress as WalMart during the "gardening season" here in Alabama, or you can get it at Lowe's year round. Can't really beat $2.00/bag (3 cubic feet)!!