Rats do make a world of difference...

[jathoma]

Well, Cain is eating his 6th rat as I type this note and you'd be amazed at how quickly he's growing....he's shed twice in the past month, and he's probably gotten about 2-1/2 to 3 inches longer in the past 6 weeks. He's not obese in the slightest, so I wouldn't consider it "power" feeding....I just have to believe what everyone says about them being more nutritious...

Good luck to anyone trying to switch over...and if it doesn't work the first time (I was one of the lucky ones), keep trying!

There's nothing like a big FAT snake to be proud of...

As soon as I get a cam, I'll post pics.

:D :D :D :D :D

[morph]

not more nutritious, just more.

[snakehunter]

actually i think they are more nutritious, i was feeding 40g mice, and switched to 40g rats, and my snake almost exploded she was groin so fast!

[sapphire_moon]

I have to agree. When we moved back to kansas my male was about MAYBE 2ft, we switched my male bp from adult mice to small rats.......and within about 6 months he's has grown about 1.5-2 ft longer than what he was..(and weighs about 3 pounds)....gotta be more nutrious *sp* for him.

[mykee]

Morph, DEFINITELY more nutritious.

[Ron]

Has anyone seen a nutritional breakdown of both to determine pound for pound which is more nutritious?

Some of my BP's won't touch rats and that's fine with me. I have one who pounds back F/T mice and she has grown quite nicely (300 to 1600 grams in 10 months).

Maybe rats are higher in fat? Kinda like mealworms for Leo's. Who know's, first we need someone to do the nutrtional breakdown and then we need to determine the nutrtional requirements of BP's.

[morph]

Hey mykee i am not attacking just wondering what makes you positive they are more nutritious. I mean I have def. seen huge growth in my rat eaters but what makes you think it isn't just meal size as I have females that will eat at least 15 large mice in a week and the pack on the weight I mean pack it on so too me it looks more like a portion thing

[RepTylE]

I had planned on asking if anyone has seen actual comparative analysis between rats and mice. The results of feeding rats can't be argued over but is it the actual meal size or a quality difference? I mean rats and mice are so similar except for the size diffference.

[Jeff_Favelle]

Less hair. Mouse hair doesn't make snakes grow. Rat protein and rat innards and rat fat do.

[Edwin]

Reptyle,

Download this pdf, it should answer your question.

http://www.nal.usda.gov/awic/zoo/WholePreyFinal02May29.pdf

[Slannesh]

Very cool, Thanks for the link Edwin! Interesting reading.

[Invictus]

Originally posted by Jeff_Favelle
Less hair. Mouse hair doesn't make snakes grow. Rat protein and rat innards and rat fat do.

Don't forget also that gram for gram, rats have way more bone structure and thus more calcium. Calcium isn't just good for growing human children. :)

[Jeff_Favelle]

LOL! You should do commercials Invictus!! LOL!! :D

[jathoma]

Boy, I'm glad I started this thread...

:D

[morph]

Well then my mouse eaters must have thyroid problems cause they are growin like a mother.

[Invictus]

Originally posted by Jeff_Favelle
LOL! You should do commercials Invictus!! LOL!! :D

LOL... you should hear my TV commentator voice. You'd never know it was a long haired, bearded freak doing the voice. I sound like a car salesman! LOL

[RepTylE]

Thanks Edwin for the pdf file. Now I can get a better idea of what the nutritional components are. I need to give it a good going over and digest the info (pun intended)

[TannimBP]

Curious but how can you tell if BP is getting obese??? (i know its kinda dumb but not asking is dumber)

[Edwin]

Generally speaking, a snake would be considered obese if the snake is unable to coil properly (without a prey item inside it, of course), or if there is exposed skin between scales.

Hope this helps.

[TannimBP]

okay thanx just worried about over feeding her because she'll get day in and day out and then some :-)

[IMO]

http://www.nal.usda.gov/awic/zoo/WholePreyFinal02May29.pdf

This is an interesting study. From what I've read, and speaking very generally, I've gathered several contributing factors to whether rats or mice are better.
1) The food that the rat or mouse was raised on will contribute to its overall nourishment for the snake.
2) The age of the rat or mouse at the time of consumption. As the rat or mouse ages from one stage to another there are greater or lesser degrees of certain nutrients.
3) Rats and mice metabolize some nutrients differently-Regarding vitamin E, "Clear species differences in vitamin E metabolism/utilization have been shown between laboratory mice and rats raised on the same diets,7,15 suggesting that species that have not been studied may have different requirements."

The tables provided at the end of the study at times indicates wide variation and at other times very small differences in nutrition, again depending on the age of the rat or mouse. It would seem to me that from this limited study, it would be hard to support the argument, across the board, that rats are nutritionally better than mice. Having said that though when it comes to convenience, cost, and keeping the python feed, it only makes sense to feed larger items, i.e., rats if possible. In My Opinion, they both probably offer equal nutrition. We as purchasers of live or frozen rats or mice usually have no idea what food they were raised on, how they were euthanized, etc., and therefore have no idea what's under that fur coat. I think you have to look at what your buying and judge as best you can on appearance and behavior of the rat or mouse. (In the case of frozen, behavior is usually consistent, LOL). Initially, I don't think it matters which you serve up. When the snake gets larger, I would go for rats for the reasons mentioned above.

[Syco]

LOL! Yeh, frozen rats and mice usually behave quite well! Never had any problems out of one myself. :D