New Asian Ratsnakes!!

[Invictus]

I recently traded in my 2 baby Vietnamese Blue Beauties for this pair (2.0 unfortunately) of what I believe are Chinese Beauties. However, I've seen some pictures of Yunnan Beauties that look quite a bit like these guys. If anyone can help me identify them for sure, it would be appreciated!

Anyway, they are named Aragorn and Boromir. Here they are:

Aragorn:
http://www.invictusart.com/images/Aragorn01.jpg

http://www.invictusart.com/images/Aragorn04.jpg

Boromir, who we only got one picture of because he's such a brat (Anyone got an Uruk'hai I can borrow?) :D

http://www.invictusart.com/images/Boromir01.jpg

They are both incredibly docile and fun to handle. Never bitten, although they had bad sheds and were a bit verbal when I gave them a bath! :)

Thanks for looking, and any help correctly identifying them would be appreciated.

[Tim_Cranwill]

Very cool guys! :D Sorry, I can't help ID them though.... Shouldn't the guy who you got them from know what they are?

Do these guys get as large as the VBB's?

[Jeff_Favelle]

Wow, those are cool man. Wish I could ID them for you. Katt and Vanan might know.

[Invictus]

Originally posted by cranwill
Very cool guys! :D Sorry, I can't help ID them though.... Shouldn't the guy who you got them from know what they are?

Do these guys get as large as the VBB's?

They were dropped off at the pet store that Erin and I work at, so it was kind of a rescue situation. The owner did not have the means to care for them anymore.

I don't think they get anywhere near as big as VBBs if these boys are adults. I would venture to say that they are little more than 5.5 feet. VBBs are commonly 6-8, so they could be pretty close to a small-ish VBB :)

[NewLineReptile]

Can't help you out with the ID of them but the are awesome
Congrats man

Brandon

[Dani33]

Very nice!

[Clownfishie]

Wow -- very cool guys, congrats! :D

[Edwin]

Invictus,

Yunnan ratsnakes have 2 dorsal rows of black blotches and 2 rows on the sides, which merge into brown or black stripes on the posterior third of the body. Dorsal scales are slightly keeled, and the ventrals are keeled.

With that being said, I would guess that you have a yunnan rat, but the above description also somewhat suits the chinese beauty as well. I will see if I have more notes on these species and post them.

Congrats on your new herps, they look really nice.

Hope this helps...


Here is a pic of elaphe taeniura yunnanesis.

http://www.elaphe.it/image/Elaphe_taeniura_yunnaniensis.jpg

And here is a pic of elaphe taenuira
http://www.elaphe.it/image/Elaphe_taeniura_2.jpg

Link:
http://www.elaphe.it/specie.htm

[Invictus]

Thanks Edwin. The picture above of the taeniura taeniura is dead wrong, btw. (I saw that site too... they need to be slapped. That's a Vietnamese Blue Beauty.) :)

Anyway, I did some more reading. Those are DEFINITELY Yunnans that I have. The Chinese beauties have a ladder-like dorsal pattern. The Yunnans, E.T.Yunnanesis, have the double rows or X-like patterns, which mine have.

So, do you by chance know where I can find a female???? :D

[Tim and Julie B]

You suck! I have wanted those forever. The yunnanesis I mean. I hope that is what you have. I can't really tell from that pic. Once again you suck!

[Invictus]

Ummm... thanks. :D Find me a female and I'll have plenty of young Yunnanesis I can sell you Tim. :)

[Scales Zoo]

I'm not sure if they are yunnans....

I've got some good information on identifying the different beauty snakes - but it is down at the zoo, I will see if I can dig it out later and read through it.

Can you take some good dorsal pictures, side pictures and belly pictures of it and send those to me?

Also - did you find out where the previous owner got them from - and when he got them. If they were imported, then bought from a petstore, it might be easier to figure out what kind of snakes those are for sure.

Ryan

[Katt]

Sorry to burst anyone's bubble, but those are taiwans.

This is a chinese beauty. Please notice the neck. The cross overs are bold on yours, but chinese have delicate cross overs.

<img src="http://www.ratsnakes.com/images/Ettaeniura1_m.jpg">
(c) www.ratsnakes.com

I own both taiwans and chinese as well as blues, and cavers. I have seen a yunan and they are distinct. The colour is WOW. Even as a baby. Pattern is also different. Like an okeetee to a normal. Easy to confuse, but after careful looking easy to see the differences.

Word descriptions are pretty worthless, compare pics.

Taiwans are also the largest of the beauties and the nicest in terms of temperament. Congrats on yours!! I hope they get HUGE!!

[Scales Zoo]

I will have to read through all of my information, but I do think they bear a resemblence to taiwans as far as pattern goes.

They seem to be a bit on the dark side, is that just the picture messing with us.

Who knows, maybe they are our babies?

Ryan

[mark129er]

They sure are beautiful

[ohh_kristina]

beautiful snakes, Invictus!

[Invictus]

I agree that these very well could be taiwans. They just seem to have more of the distinct bow-tie pattern that is associated with the Yunnans. If you look at the first picture above, you'll see the bow-tie pattern which comes to a very sharp point in the middle. I have't been able to find that on a picture of a Taiwan beauty. Don't get me wrong, I hope they are Taiwans - then I won't have such a b*tch of a time finding a female. :)

Ryan, I'll look forward to reading any info you have on getting a definitive ID on these guys. In the mean time, I'll get more detailed pictures of the patterns.

Thanks for the help so far everyone!

[Vanan]

Keep in mind that pattern's not all what Yunnan's are about. They're colour is also very distinctive. Taiwans may have yellow too but Yunnan's seem to have a more intense colour. I have no doubt that yours are Taiwans. :)

[Simon Sansom]

Hi Invictus,

Without really delving into the literature I have to concur with Katt and Vanan - looks like friesei to me. That was my initial impression.

Nice snakes, though! Congrats.

Simon

[Invictus]

Cool. Like I said, I was actually hoping they were Taiwans. Now finding a female should be quite easy. :D

[BoidKeeper]

Nice stuff guys!
Congrats,
Trevor

[Simon]

Wow~
nice looking snakes~

congrats Ken~

[Katt]

Thanks Ryan and Simon for the vote of confidence. I absolutely love the beauty complex and REALLY want to get my hands on some yunanensis

Again, colour AND pattern have to be taken into consideration regarding the beauties. Bowties, cross bars etc, can be all mixed and matched. Trying to ID a beauty based on "bowties" can be like id'ing BCI and BCC based on "peaked saddles".

The neck alone on those snakes says, "not chinese". Yunans ARE chinese beauties, but from the Yunan province. They're just a little bit nicer, and a little bit different.

[Invictus]

Thanks everyone. You convinced me - they are Taiwans :) Evidently the guy who had them before had them for 4 or 5 years - so I suspect they won't get any bigger than they are now. That's a bit disappointing, since I'd hesitate to say that they are much bigger than 5.5 feet or so. Nonetheless, they are beautiful, wonderfully active snakes to keep, and I'm looking forward to many years with them.

Ryan and Sheila - Does Jewel have a "date" for this year's mating season? :D

[gonesnakee]

Ken remind me to check out a buddy here in town for you. He has a big female that could probably use a couple of studs. Mark I.

[Invictus]

SWEET! First ask him if he wants to part with his female. If not, I'll go 50/50 on a breeding project, IF he's trustworthy.

[Scott Wahlberg]

Damn nice looking snake dude. I love Asian Rats. I picked up 2 Cave Dwelling Rats from the ETHS/IHS show in Houston earlier this yr. By the way from your pic and shirt it looks like we have a very simialr taste in music. What band is your avatar from.scott Wahlberg

[TheRedDragon]

Thank for the compliments guys. As soon as they were dropped off at our store and I showed them to Invictus, I knew he'd fall in love with them as I did. <b> Scott: </b> His avatar is Shagrath; the lead singer from Dimmu Borgir. :) I like your avatar too BTW, Children Of Bodom RULES!!! My fave song by them is "Hate Me" :D

[Dani33]

I love that snake, I want one!

[Janiman]

Very nice... I'm sure you'll like them as much as I like mine. Ironically, I just got home from Toronto where I picked up a really nice 7 ft male that's as thick as my wrist (I already had a 4 ft yearling female from Scales Zoo). I got this new one from a friend-of-a-friend and when I talked to the guy on the phone I got the impression that it was nippy and hard to handle so I wasn't sure what to expect when I got there. I think the guy was just a little intimidated by the size and speed of this animal because I'm happy to say that I handled him twice tonight for about 20 minutes (including the fact that I had to work him out of his hide) and he showed no signs of agression... and it hadn't been free-handled in over 2 years...

I just love these snakes... :D

[Invictus]

Janiman - Asian beauty snakes are totally incredible to handle, aren't they? I love how active they are! They make corns look freakin' lazy, and that says a lot. :D

Scott - We definitely have similar taste in music. I love Scandinavian gothic, death metal, and black metal.

But, thanks to everyone for the compliments on the snakes. The second they were placed into my hand I said, "Ok, you guys are coming home with me!" :D

[Janiman]

I'll second the part about ACTIVE... you really gotta' be on your toes but it sure is fun! I'll try to get some pic's posted soon. I've been wanting to post for a while now but I don't have a digital camera. They're a highly underrated snake in my opinion.

[Scott Wahlberg]

Originally posted by TheRedDragon
Thank for the compliments guys. As soon as they were dropped off at our store and I showed them to Invictus, I knew he'd fall in love with them as I did. <b> Scott: </b> His avatar is Shagrath; the lead singer from Dimmu Borgir. :) I like your avatar too BTW, Children Of Bodom RULES!!! My fave song by them is "Hate Me" :D

Yea I have to say my favorite song by them is hate and touch like angel of death. I assumed the avatar was Dimmu Borgir. I'll actually be seeing both those bands in Houston on Nov 26, should be a killer show.Scott

[Katt]

Wow, a four foot yearling! The yearling I got a few weeks ago was a mere two feet! Good thing she's a fantastic eater, hopefully she can catch up!

[Janiman]

Katt – My female is a ravenous eater. I got her in July from Scales Zoo and at that time she was only about 2 feet and 70 grams. I had her on a 5 day feeding schedule for the first 2 months that I had her and I’d give her a good feed each time. It wasn’t my intent to get into a “power-feed” mode but it’s certainly something I got concerned about so I moved her to a 7 day schedule a few weeks ago. Needless to say, her growth has been incredible… seems like that for every mouse she takes, about half of it goes into growth. She’s currently 46 inches and about 345 grams in weight. And like I’ve said before, she’s a fantastic animal with a great disposition. I got some photo’s done on the weekend so I’ll be posting pic’s soon.

Cheers,
F

[Katt]

Hey, I just realized you're the one who got that really awesome male mexican pine! Sweet!!

[Janiman]

Hey, don't you mean that really awsome PAIR of mexican pines??? :D

Yeah, that's me... I'll be posting some pic.'s of them shortly too.

Cheers,
F

[Katt]

Naw, your male is the one I wanted!! We got the other pair. Pretty neat snakes eh??

[Janiman]

Great snakes. The female is eating like a pig (6 mice last feeding) so I'm hoping to have her to breeding size next year. I can't wait to see the offspring... and yeah, that male is special, isn't he?

[Janiman]

By the way, congrats. on getting the other pair!