drowning?

[Solid Snake]

does anyone drown their mice/rats in water?

im just curious.

[mykee]

Not a cool way to kill your feeders. Try whacking them, CO2 chambers, or cervical dislocation. All are quicker AND less painful then drowning.

[DarkHunter]

Feed frozen and save yourself the hassle ;)

[daver676]

Originally posted by Solid Snake
does anyone drown their mice/rats in water?


I sure hope not.

[ohh_kristina]

That would be a horrible way to die :(

[crazyboy]

How would yo feel drowning

[Lisa]

drowning is much like sufficating to death.

[Sunrunner]

where do ppl get co2?

[mykee]

It is available at www.praxair.com.

[Neo]

isnt c02 suffucating to death too?

[mykee]

No, it's falling asleep.

[Derrick]

Originally posted by crazyboy
How would yo feel drowning

probably like i should have paid more attention in swim class

[Lisa]

You can also get CO2 at canadian tire now. Not sure on the cost though. Usually I just get some dry ice, it's cheap, $2 worth fills the little "24" can cooler I have, and 3 or 4 cubes in water will do in a dozen rats. Often I don't even get enough dry ice to make it worth the while of charging me.

[mykee]

Dry ice is CO2.

[mark129er]

dry ice is liquid carbon dioxide compressed under tremendous amounts of pressure. Praxiar produces it in 100lb blocks (usually)and distributes it across the country.

[crazyboy]

Originally posted by Derrick
probably like i should have paid more attention in swim class


lol

[mykee]

Mark, they also produce it in pellets and blocks of almost any size. Check out their website.

[MouseKilla]

I suppose you COULD drown them, I don't make any moral distinction between the various methods that the prey is put down as long as it's done without any intended cruelty. To me drowning is no more and no less cruel than bonking or gassing (unless you are prolonging the process by letting it breathe every so often, swearing at it then dunking it back under again). It's probably not a typical method because it's a lot more work and would likely be more time consuming especially if you're killing and feeding at the same time. What I do when I come home with a couple of boxes full of rats is pile them all into one of the boxes and pick them up one at a time, bonk it and drop it in the empty box. I can get through a box of 30 in less than 5 minutes. What could be easier? There's nothing to set up, no gas to buy, just a couple of boxes and a chunk of wood to get the job done. Why should it be any more complicated?

[RepTylE]

Well prekilling for people that have to whack alot of mice or rats must be hard. I mean it would be like an slaughterhouse on feeding nights. I'd choose to gas them or use f/t.

[mouseman]

I can't imagine that drowning would be very "humane". We harvest and euthanize thousands of mice at a time. The fastest, easiest and most humane way to put the mice down is to use CO2. It leaves no broken bones and no residue on the mice to be harmful to your reptiles. We have had the local SPCA visit our shop to inspect and they agreed with the method we chose for euthanizing our mice.
Lori Stuber
The Canadian Mouseman

[Jayson]

Contrary to everyones belief, using Co2 is suffication.
the Co2 replaces the air in the blood cells, and there for you sufficate (lack of oxygen)The only diff is less panic because you can still actually breath, its just not getting any oxygen in to your lungs.
So no they are not just going to sleep, It just appears that way.

[Siretsap]

ok let's pull out a straw, who ever gets the shortest one will try the co2 chamber, and tell us what it feels like when we cpr him
:-p

Well, apparently when you drown, you do not feel pain either. You do panic but supposively don't feel the pain (unless it's boiling water or freezing water).

Still the "humane way" only cause we don't like to see them panic would be co2. I buy them frozen and if mouseman you ever ship to mtl, I will have my next order from you I buy in packs of 150 to 200 mice and rats.

[RepTylE]

[QUOTE]Originally posted by Siretsap
[B]ok let's pull out a straw, who ever gets the shortest one will try the co2 chamber, and tell us what it feels like when we cpr him
:-p

Count me out, I'm single and have too much to live for :D

[Linds]

Originally posted by Jayson
Contrary to everyones belief, using Co2 is suffication.
the Co2 replaces the air in the blood cells, and there for you sufficate (lack of oxygen)The only diff is less panic because you can still actually breath, its just not getting any oxygen in to your lungs.
So no they are not just going to sleep, It just appears that way.

It is suffocation, but it is far from the same type. It is completely peaceful. Its the same as when people lock themselves in the garage with the car running. Its odourless and tasteless, so all you know is that you are getting very sleepy and then you pass out. Pretty much falling asleep and then dying.

[RepTylE]

It's about the closest to stress free death as you are likely to get. Actually, wouldn't it cause lightheadedness so it would be like being intoxicated in effect???

[Jayson]

Actually it would be more like sticking your mouth on the tail pipe of a car untill you were dead.
There is a big difference between slowly filling a room ful of gas and filling a small chamber in three seconds

[ChokeOnSmoke]

there was a good thread on this a few days ago I'll try to find it. It had a link to page that showed how to use vineger and baking soda it also told the effects of co2 as it increased in the air.

[KrokadilyanGuy3]

Good thing I only feed live or hunted prey items..

[RepTylE]

Car engines give off carbon monoxide which is not the same thing.

[Syst3m]

Originally posted by Siretsap

Well, apparently when you drown, you do not feel pain either. You do panic but supposively don't feel the pain (unless it's boiling water or freezing water).




Drowning hurts. You ever swallowed a lung full of water.
But on the other hand it is rather peaceful when you do drown.
At least speaking on the grounds that I have been legally dead in water before.... The panic factor is pretty scarry.

[AnniesMom]

I don't know what it feels like to drown, but it sucks to have be the one doing the drowning. I NEED a better way to pre-kill my rats. I have been buying them live, drowning them, then freezing them. Long, painful process, one I would rather do without.

[Slannesh]

Found this on another thread on the forum

http://personal.riverusers.com/~busybee/euthanasia.htm

While I have my ball python on F/T It is definately an interesting article. I've done whacking and cervical dislocation on mice, neither is really my favorite thing to do. My girlfriend used to work in a lab where they used rats in research. The used either cervical dislocation or CO2 to euthanize the rats they were working with.

[RepTylE]

- In low concentrations (7.5%) it is an analgesic (pain reliever), and at medium concentrations (30%-40%) it can be used as an anesthetic, causing rapid loss of consciousness without struggling, distress, or excitation. 3 At high concentrations (>80%) CO2 causes quick death. High concentrations, however, painfully irritate eyes and the respiratory tract, so it is important to first induce an analgesic effect, then bring about deep anesthesia (within 1 to 2 minutes) before exposing the animal to high concentrations.


I don't know about anyone else but to me it seems like a humane way to kill a few mice or rats

[Lisa]

I have to agree retyle, CO2 has got to be the most humane way to kill rodents.

[RepTylE]

actually it was lifted from the post that slannesh had just put up. I just wanted to stick it in there. I'm kind of hoping that the topic can go to bed now it has had a busy week :)

[Lisa]

this is a topic that will never go away. like feeding live, wc, and keeping multiple snakes in one container.

[RepTylE]

I guess that people have some beliefs that they defend . I just hope that no one uses a method of dispatching feeder animals that is unneccessarily cruel. I hate the idea of any animal suffering even for a minute.

[Lisa]

if anyone wants to get an idea of what it's like to drown, fill up your bath tub, climb in, get your head under the water and try breathing. now immagine the panic you would have with some one holding you down.

[RepTylE]

I think that given the choice of which method I would want done to me that I'd go with the CO2

[Fangs]

Have been culling a lot of rats and mice now for quite a while.
Have also tried various methods for dispatching them.
C02 for mine takes way too long.Watching them gasp for air is not very pleasant to watch,even more unpleasant for the animals I would assume.
Grabbing by the tail and flicking then over head first onto a brick or similar hard surface is the best way to go in my opinion.
Recently we started using chloroform to knock them out before crushing their spines at the base of the skull while asleep.This method now is our prefered way of doing it.

cheers

[Lisa]

you don't worry about the cloraform in their system being hazardous to the snakes?

as for gasping for breath with c02 i haven't noticed the animals do this... they usually just fall over and go to sleep when i gas them

[eyespy]

They will sometimes gasp for breath if too much CO2 is given suddenly. Chloraform is very toxic and stays in lung and liver tissue so I woudn't recommend using that.

[Fangs]

Initially I had concerns about the residual effects of chloroform in the Rodents system but was told that this would be negligable.
Apparently it breaks down very rapidly under normal circumstances,more so when you stick the rodents in the freezer.
However I Would appreciate any info on the use of chloroform,everything I have read on it is about the long term effects of exposure over long periods.

As far as CO2 is concerned I tried it in the form of dry ice and then used one of those small CO2 canisters(the ones that are used for making softdrink)but as I said had bad experiences with it.

I would be interested to know how you administer the CO2 accurately enough to enable the rodents not to gasp for breath or panic ie:use it to sedate before administering a fatal dose.

cheers Fangs.......

[eyespy]

I use the regulator from my old oxygen tanks on a cannister, but I guess only my fellow asthmatics have that luxury.

Using the dry ice method you just use less of it.

Chloraform is found in the liver tissue of dead snakes. It doesn't completely break down even when frozen. Each rodent might offer a negligable dose but over time it can accumulate.