What's the best substrate?

[maiden_canada]

hey i have my ball on newspaper now with a large water dish and a hide spot only, ive kept it simple cause hes had mites and ive been getting rid of them for a few weeks, but now since i think they're all gone i was thinking it would be nice to put some woodchips in there of somekind. whats the best kind..aspen? also where can i get it for cheap?

[mykee]

I would stick with the newspaper, hide and water dish. That's how I keep my balls. They're very easy to clean that way, and work great in a rack with rubbermaids.

[maiden_canada]

ok thanks mykee, i was wondeirng how you heat rubbermaids also, how do you heat/light rubbermaids, just cut a hole in the top, put some wire over it and use a lamp? also with a heatpad on the bottom? right now hes in a 15gallon aquarium

[sapphire_moon]

I think you can use cypress mulch as well but not completely sure. But news paper is great, wether or not you have a rack. Cleans up really easy. If you want more responses about heating the rubbermaid try the enclosure forum.

:)

[mykee]

Maiden, I run heat tape under all six levels of my rubbermaids, heating them all from beneath. I don't have any supplemental lighting for my BP's, they don't really need it. I have them in a room with a window, and that's enough for them.

[Invictus]

I personally don't trust newspaper as a substrate, because I find the ink gets all over the place, including the snake. I refuse to believe that this is not at least somewhat harmful to them.

We keep our BPs on paper towel, which is just as easy to clean as newspaper, but there no ink to rub off onto the BP. :) If you want to use wood chips, Aspen is the only way to go.

[Tim_Cranwill]

I'd be interested to hear if anyone has any info on newspaper ink and snakes. I've been using it for the past year just because of the ease and price. :) I haven't had any experience with ink rubbing off on anything except my hands.

One thing about news paper vs paper towel though, I do see a lot more "mess" on paper towel. It just shows up more on paper towel. Might be a point for using paper towel if cleanliness is a big thing for you.....

[mykee]

Maiden, allow me to edit my post regarding newspaper. I do not use normal newsprint, I use unprinted newspaper stock. You can find it at any moving store. It usually comes in 24x36 sheets, or 18x24 sheets. Not as cheap as the Toronto Sun, but definitely worth it in my opinion.

[Jeff_Favelle]

I phoned the newspaper printing presses and they said the ink was just vegetable dye. I've been using it for 12 years, no problems. Proof is in the pudding, and not theories are what you THINK might happen.

[Big Mike]

I read somewhere that the black ink is vegetable based but the color dye is not at nice. I don't remember what it is made from.

I use newspaper and try to use the black & white pages on the top where the snake will be in contact with it.

[lilyskip]

i also use newspaper, and haven't had any problems with ink rubbing off on huxley. Big Mike has a great point about color pages, though...I only keep huxley on the b&w sections.

[killaclown]

News paper is the best sumstrate but for looks i would go with Repti BarK

[Derrick]

ya my reptile bark came with these lovely little black specks that beautifully accented my snow cors coloring. I espcially like the y way they moved around

[Jeff_Favelle]

But the key to the substrate can also be usefullness to the snake. I have since switched from newspaper, to shredded aspen, to shredded newspaper, to aspen chips, and now to bark mulch. And I gotta tell you, I love the bark mulch. Look at the big breeders cages (Davis, Kahl, Sutherlands, NERD etc etc) and see what they use.

[munchy]

yes i agree that the bark mulch and repti-bark type substrates are great. if you have tons of snakes i can see how it might be a bit pricey, but i dont mind paying for it since it looks good and the snakes can burrow or do whatever.

[tHeGiNo]

Bark mulch, would you mind explaining why this is good? I am just curious, as if they use it, I am sure there is something right about it and I would like to switch to it myself.

[Ron]

I started with Carefresh went to paper towel then to newspaper and back to Carefresh. The paper towel and the newspaper didn't have the odor absorbing ability that I needed since my snakes were in my dinningroom. If you have a small collection I would use Carefresh. I would stick to Carefresh exclusively but they recently rasied their price by 35%. I have an order for some aspen chip, aspen shaving and a product that I believe is similar to Carefresh. I would love to try triple chipped cyprus mulch if I could find it, anyone have a source?

[Jeff_Favelle]

I have found that aspen sucks lemons because Balls need higher humidity than most people think and anything over 15% humidity causes aspen to mold like a son of a b........ :D

[Clownfishie]

Where do you buy your bark mulch Jeff? I've been thinking of switching from newspaper in a couple of the enclosures, just to give something else a try... I've been thinking that it would be a lot easier to just have to spot clean than to have to take everything out of the enclosure just to get the newspaper out, and then put everything back in again....

[Invictus]

Originally posted by Jeff_Favelle
I have found that aspen sucks lemons because Balls need higher humidity than most people think at anything over 15% humidity causes aspen to mold like a son of a b........ :D

Depends on how well ventilated the area is, and how often you change it out entirely. I have a BCI in shed right now, so I've been misting him heavily... but the tank is very well ventilated, so no mold has formed yet, and I've been misting the same aspen shreddings for a week now.

However, if you need to maintain high humidity (as I did with the asian elaphe, rainbow boas, etc) you're right - aspen sucks beyond belief. I had the blue beauties in it for TWO DAYS before the aspen grew its own green fur coat. :)

[Jeff_Favelle]

Ha ha, mmmmmm green furrr.... :D

Well if I added more ventilation, that would defeat the purpose of my high humidity, so the point is moot moot moot!

Jen, you were JUST here!! How the he!! did you post so fast? Oh, maybe you posted before you came over? That would explain it. Ha ha, I guess so because I just showed the mulch. Ok, not enough sleeeeep. I'm outtie...............

[Jeff_Favelle]

Jen, I should have given you a sample of the bark to try. Damn, sorry girl! But then again, I have a couple more Rainbows here for you, wink wink!! I'll throw in the mulch for FREE!! LOL!

[maiden_canada]

hey guys thanks for all your input, I think ill be switching soon to cypress or bark mulch. jeff, i live in victoria too where do you get your bark mulch from? home depot or just a gardening shop

[sapphire_moon]

Ya, the repti bark I got ONCE came with those wonderful little black spots......

[Clownfishie]

LMAO Jeff! Yes, I posted that just before I left for your place... lol. As for the rainbows -- let's let me get THESE ones paid off first, eh? ;) We'll talk about free mulch then... lol...

I too am interested where you get it from though -- I looked at Canadian Tire on the way home and they had jack squat... I wonder what the people who looked in my car and saw a seat full of snakes thought :p Hehe...

[Jeff_Favelle]

Heh heh, retail is for suckers. I have an account (through work) at a plant-wholesale place. I'm getting a palette of it soon. We might even re-bag it ourselves and then re-sell it with our label on it.

I'll keep you updated.

[HetForHuman]

if you want to get reptibark cheap go to your local greenhouse and buy what is called orchid bark, it is the exact same as repti-bark but without the expensive name.

I paid $30.00 canadian for a 60 litre bag of the stuff, and it was alot of wood chips.

[sapphire_moon]

when you pick up the mulch do you have to sterlize it in any way? if so how do you do it?

[HetForHuman]

i was just told to rinse the stuff off before using it but thats it.

I ended up not using any of it, because i started using paper towel and newspaper. Much easier to use in my opinion.

[sapphire_moon]

yes easier, but we are building a custom enclosure for my bp and I wanted to use something that looked nicer than the presidents face.......if ya know what I mean.

[HetForHuman]

HEHHE yeah i know what you mean..

I myself would go with the reptibark, orchid bark stuff, it looks really nice in the cages and works fairly well holding humidity too.

i would just make sure not to feed on it though.

Good luck with whatever you find to use.

[maiden_canada]

what do you guys think about carefresh?

[lilyskip]

i've heard carefresh is really dusty. i don't use it, but if you need something relatively inexpensive that your snakes could burrow in, it would be functional. i also don't think there is a danger of impaction with it, either.

[Ron]

CareFresh is fairly dusty, when I first put it in I mist the entire enclosure which keeps the dust down. My snakes usually checks out the enclosure which mats the CareFresh down and that also helps with the dust. I mist every couple of days to ensure the Carefresh doesn't get too dry and start to break up. They also make an "ultra" carefresh that is supposed to be less dusty but it is more expensive.

[elevation24]

I haven't noticed dust with CareFresh at all.

I think it works great. It's not too expensive, holds water or can be completely dry, looks okay, and it's easy to clean. It's also completely safe, although there is a risk of impaction -- in fact if my memory serves me correctly it even says so on the bag. But I haven't had any problems with it at all :)

[AnniesMom]

Maiden, I use the cypress mulch for my BP, anid it works great. She wasn't shedding properly until I put it in to up the humidity. I get it at the pet store in the shopping centre on the corner of Blanshard and Cloverdale. Small bags, but it lasts for a long time, if you clean it and let the cage have ventilation

[maiden_canada]

sweet anniesmom, i go to Safari pets about once every 2 weeks. everything there is soo expensive though, like every pet store. ill phone up a couple gardening stores and home harware etc...

[Slannesh]

Over the last 5 years i've used a few different things for my BP

1) Astroturf. Was ok, but a pain to clean, If you go this route get several pieces that are the same size as the floor of your enclosure, Pull the soiled one out and clean it in a sink of very hot water and a couple capfuls of bleach. Then rinse it THOROUGHLY. Hang to dry.

2) Reptibark or something similar, Used this for several years, easy to spot clean, better for overall humitity than astroturf but much more expensive. If parasites are a concern try tossing it on a cookie sheet in the oven for half an hour at I think about 220 degrees Celcius. I'd have to double check the temp and the duration but that sounds about right to kill most bugs.

3) Newsprint.. Basically free once you're done reading for the day :) Easy to clean, just throw it away. But looks icky and obviously doesn't help the humidity at all.

I'm using newsprint at the moment but vastly prefer the bark mulch. The snake doesn't seem to care one way or the other however :)

[Tigergenesis]

I've been using Lizard Liner (a green felt carpet). I like the look, it's easy to spot clean and I can feed w/o worry of impaction. Of course, does nothing to help humidity. I change out once a week with a fresh piece no problem.

I also like the look of Reptibark, etc. I've been afraid to use it because I feared I wouldn't be able to do a good job of spot cleaning. Is it as easy to miss messes as I think with Reptibark (and similiar) substrates. Now my little guy is small and messes are small, but I was thinking when it gets bigger (and leaves bigger messes) I might switch to another substrate - thinking it'd be easier to find the 'presents'.

[Linds]

I've tried several things and always returned to newspaper/paper towel. Great for all sort on environments. Like Big Mike, I also err on the side of caution and put the black and white side up on the newspaper.

Carefresh works well in all sorts of environments as well. Bit on the pricey side however, and you can't feed on it.

Aspen molds.

Repti-bark and the like are made from fir bark, a softwood. The phenols can prove harmful to the animals respiratory system and liver. Though fir bark is very mild, I still wouldn't chance it.

Cypress is a great substrate for a more natural look. Good in with humidity, looks great, cannot feed on it however.