UV lighting for savs, and retes hide burrows

[ohh_kristina]

I am planning to get a savannah monitor. I have been researching for a few months now, and I feel that I am ready. I have a few questions, though. I have read on a few caresheets that UV lighting is required for this species. Then, on another care sheet I read that it was not required. Which is true?
Also, does anyone use the retes hide burrow deal? Do you find that it works best, or would you recommend a regular hide?
What do your sav set ups look like?

Thanks for your help!

[Jeff_Favelle]

1) Don't bother with the UV light.

2) Retes stacks work great for thermoregulation/hides, but don't limit yourself to them. Do what works for YOUR cage, not what has worked for other people's cages. And not all monitors are created equal. Some things work for some, some don't work for others, even the same species.

[ohh_kristina]

okay, thank you!

[Steeve B]

Hello Kristina

Let me try to explain a simple concept that most peoples fail to understand.
As you know many peoples loos there first babies monitors, they loos them for a multitude of reasons, UV isn’t one of them. interesting fact! I can assure you that UV is more damageable to your reptiles eyes then it is to yours, it’s a simple question of physic, there cornea is 100 times thinner then yours, yet peoples are still advocating the need to use them, I think the need has now become a commercial need, as many companies are selling them very expensive and often when tested by outsiders turns out to be quit similar to regular bulbs. Needless to say some are infact true UV lights, and still unproved with varanids husbandry.

As for the Retes rack? (or Eidenmueller’s rack) A very good tool for many monitors, but not for Exantematicus, the problem most peoples have with them is they bake them till they die. This specie will bask at much higher temps then needed, this leading to dehydration and rapid weight lost even if they feed a lot they cant conserve energy much less fat, you need to provide a soft basking 100-110f with a nice 80f ambient keep him humid spray if you need too, or supply him with a nice shoe box shelter with humid sphagnum moss.
I have never lost a monitor with this husbandry, and never treated them for parasite, this combine with common sense (not over handling) and good feeding clean water, will guarantee you a healthy monitor.

Rgds

[eyespy]

I've worked with vets and reptiles since 1985 and have yet to see a single healthy animal develop UV-related eye injuries. That's rather an old wives' tale. Reptiles have significantly greater amounts of keratin in their corneas so even though thinner they are much more "armored". They also tend to have much more highly pigmented irises and retinas that further protect delicate tissue from absorbing too much radiation.

I've seen a few animals develop macular degeneration or keratitis sicca, but all of them had underlying malnutrition and dehydration issues. Most had other abnormalities as well, such as iris coloboma (keyhole pupil), albinism, and an overall failure to thrive syndrome.

Still, as long as a monitor eats the livers of critters that make their own vitamin D they don't need UV lighting.

[mbayless]

I know of two (=2) incidents where UV has blinded two Varanus species, a bengal and a dumerils monitor. These animals were kept indoor and had rodent diet all their lives.

Perhaps his liughts had illuminated some black light, which is a known cause of retina damage and blinding causality?

V. exanthematicus are burrowers and really require dark cramped retreats, preferably subterranean, but a clay roof shingle built with cement and burried underground works too....

Get Daniel Bennett's book on Savannah monitors - its terrific.
cheers,
markb

[eyespy]

Is that the Dumeril's from Houston, Texas? That animal had significant hypovitaminosis A which had caused corneal dystrophy and that was the causation for the blindness. Normally UV doesn't penetrate the cornea of a dumerils well at all because of the heavy keratinization.

If case histories are available for either of those animals, 5 vets have already emailed me asking where they can get details.

[LORI34205]

i think retes are fine for savannahs just dont put the retes too high,make the highest one 130ish:)

[Steeve B]

Sorry but I fail to understand how can the density of carotene in reptiles cornea be generalised, isn’t carotene a direct consequence of specific foods (Vitamin A) intake? How can an Iguana (vegetarian) cornea be compared to a Varanids (carnivorous) cornea?
In humans carotene density varies from one individual to the next depending on regimen, shouldn’t this be applied to reptiles as well?
Studies in Somalia Kenya and Bangladesh have shown Vitamin A deficiency disorder to lead to blindness, as the cornea can’t protect against UV, these peoples are forced to live in darkness until they become totally blind.
No dough if these studies your referring to where made on such reptiles as iguanas, then yes they may have a high carotene level, however I don’t think we can say this of all reptiles.

Your post has given me plenty to think about, but it doesn’t seem to fit.
Don’t get me wrong aim fascinated by all of this, I did a study on varanids cataract with an eye specialist from MTL university, he attributed the cause of cataract in my monitors to be related to high cholesterol blood levels, from feeding red meat, witch I was almost feeding exclusively at that time. He also told me the cornea was much thinner then in humans, therefore easier to damage, the carotene issue was never broth up, but your affirmation makes me wonder, how can the density of (carotene) per cornea exceed the volume of carotene in a much bigger receptacle (human cornea)?

If the density of carotene in a reptile cornea was in fact higher, who dents this, impair vision as carotene isn’t translucent?
Sorry to bombard you like this, but this is interesting to me, and hopefully you can shed some light on the questions you’ve broth up!
Rgds

[mbayless]

Yes, blindness has been connected to carotine/vitamin A deficiency, and well documented. This is also why when feeding rodents to your varanids they get lots of greens too so they can pass these vitamins onto your apex predators....the people I know whose animals went blind fed them rodents, used uv lights and were in private collections. One of the animals was 11+ years old (V. dumerilii). Perhaps he had used black light maybe?? I am not sure, but it in my files and a letter (pers. com.) to me...
I never gave it much thought until this posting, and it has been 10+ years since I recieved that letters....keeping files like this can be helpful. Now if I only had more space!!! Ive run out and need more file cabinets!! Anyone know where I can get on discount?
Cheers,
markb

[eyespy]

Keratin is a protein, the major one found in the cornea, nails, claws, horns and hair. It is totally unrelated to carotenes, except in cases of hypovitaminosis A. They are merely sound-alike words.

Vitamin A deficiencies cause dry eye syndrome as the tear glands malfunction. Tears are the major nutrition source of the cornea, and so with a lack of tears the cornea begins to break down. So a lack of carotenes ends up being a lack of keratin evenually. A lack of carotenes also ends up breaking down retinal tissue so the eye is basically attacked from both sides.

Once the cornea is sufficiently de-keratinized, it can no longer effectively filter out UV and other wavelengths of light and so the retina gets much more light exposure and suffers much higher degrees of damage than a healthy eye would ever experience. Normal reptile corneas filter out UVC entirely, which is the wavelength primarily responsible for eye damage. They should also filter out approximately 75-85% of UVB but do allow UVA to pass through.

[Steeve B]

That is a very informative post; IV learned very much from this post, I think I understand much better now, with a little net research IL be able to understand even more.
Do you think the nictating membrane may have something to do with eye lubrication?
Is a tear gland the same as lachrymal gland?
Thanks for your insight
Rgds

[eyespy]

yes, tear and lacrimal glands are the same thing. The nictitating membrane most definitely does assist with lubrication, it's full of goblet cells that help to create tear components, and also is a mucus membrane that helps to hold existing moisture in the eye. It's also a mechanical barrier to further protect the eye from foreign particles, excessive light, wind, etc. Sometimes I wish I had one! ;)