asian water monitor

[matrix1829]

I've just bought a n asian water monitor. man is she a beaut, she is so friendly. she has not even tried to bite me. does anyone have any ideas on what kind of an enclosure I should build and what size should it be. pics would be greatly appreciated.:D

[Steeve B]

Hello Matrix first congratulation on your new varanids, I hope you know these guys can get to 7+ feet and will need a very large enclosure, A 50 gallon tank will house a baby for only a few months, I can guaranty you under good husbandry a male salvator will reach 6 feet in its first year of life, on the bad end of husbandry it will take 6 years to reach 6 feet. witch is better is questionable, Horn Varius take 4-5 years to mature, all my animals mature in there first year, both my animals and Horn's are in perfect condition.
Varanids growth is directly related to a combination of food heat and humidity, if you can balance the above in the right mixture, you can achieve spectacular growth! If you lack one of the above your monitor will slowly die. Any salvator owner must visit www.Cybersalvator.com
A site devoted to this specie. As for caging look at asphyxia post his cage is excellent for forest varanids.
Rgds

[matrix1829]

thanks alot steeve, cybersalvator is a great site!!!!!!

[markb]

Hi Matrix,

If you complain, rant, raive, act hysterical to webmaster of cybersalvator, maybe he will finish that never-ending saga: a water monitor book he and I have been working on for nearly 10 years now!!!! Im tired of asking, and don't even know where it is around here - I might have thrown it in the fireplace out of anger some years ago....I would begin again if he was serious....I always am about it. I have incredible pics of a Bangladesh boy going fishing with his 7 foot salvator, another of cluster of salvators eating a beached shark....and alot of other amazing pics of this species...

cheers,
markb

[matrix1829]

If you don't mind markb I would really love to see those pics.

chow,
MATRIX

[Scales Zoo]

Our water monitor is currently 5 feet long. When we got him, he was a little over 4'.

We had babies that we grew well in 1 year, but never got any over 4' in that time.

All the while, I heard they should get 6' long in their first year.

I think, that the kind most regularily imported that is made available to us westerners, doesn't normally get 5' long as adults. I've seen 7' and 8' waters, but they do seem different from most of the ones I've seen.

Like some other reptiles, they grow fast in the wild for survival.
To think that they wouldn't also do the same in captivity might border on the foolish side.

As SteeveB said, heat and humidity is a large part of their health and growith. Give them this, and good food, and watch them grow!

Ryan

[matrix1829]

what size enclosure should I build for my water monitor???????

[BAZ]

For a full grown one you will need to give it its own room. The more space the better. Mine will have a 12ft by 7ft room with a pond and branches (logs) to climb on and dirt to dig in. I wish I could give it even more room but this is the maximum I can provide for a fully grown water monitor and in my opinion this is a minimum requirement.

[Steeve B]

You also need to consider a good draining system as he will defecate in water, I ad a 12-12in drain box fitted at the bottom of any water pond, the droppings accumulate there by gravity allowing partial water changes. Just a small tip! that will same you big time.
Rgds

[BAZ]

Thanks Steeve. I was thinking of buying one of those pumps from a hardware store so i could pump the pond right into the toilet.

But if you have a link or more info about making a good drainage system for the pond then that would be greatly appreciated.

Thanks

[Gregg M]

Hey Mark, You should talk...... What about that book on African varanids you have been writting since what, before I knew you and that has to be well over 10 years now....... I must admit that John is draggin his but with this thing....... There is just so much frickin info........ I think you to guys know too much and want to put it all down......... Like I should talk...... How long have I been working on my Bitis paper now???? LOL

[matrix1829]

can I give him a smaller enclosure if I let him roam free at night?

[ReptiZone]

dude I can't belive you just asked that!!!!!!!!!!

You wanted a water monitor. Right! then you should get ready for all cost Vet, Food AND CAGING.ARE you trying to get large reptiles bande from Montreal as well as the rest of the province or did you just not think this whole thing through properly.

I saw the size of your Monitor and B4 the end of next month it will need a 4 X 4 X 8 Cage with a small pond as a water dish at cheapest we are talking about a 300$ cage.

At best 600$ that would be building in a large sink to act as a pond with a huge bucket under it to fasilatate draning. then you would have to place 1-2 water filtters in the Sink or Pond that just lets you change the water every 3 days insted of everyday.

water monitors when they are adults they need a 12 foot square enclosure and 35% of that cage is WATER with a POOL Filter and then you will be leterly cuting down some trees for it to have branches to climb on.

You realy need to sit back and ask your self if you have
$2 000 - $3 000 to put in this animal B4 the end of next year and stop impuls buying I saw that animal for like 3 hours B4 it sold. I dont know if you orderd it or if you just saw it and had to have it.

What ever you plan on doing DO IT B4 you get your self or this hobby hurt or worst F.U.B.A.R!

[Steeve B]

Hello Baz Iv use these little pumps you attach a hose too, they work good especially if you have a depression at your deepest part of the water section, however they clogs often and are time consuming.
What works the best is a 2 inches valve like pictured ( 1/2in valve on photo for babies tanks) plugged on 2 in pvc piping with a shower drain, just make sure to go the extra mile and make the bottom tank extender, as a flat tank like on photo is a pain to clean, ply wood covered with epoxy resin works fine, attaching the sub tank to the main tank is easy with resin and flat copper screws, then as mentioned before gravity brings all debris to the lowest part of the tank, making water change a snap, just open the valve a few seconds and the first thing to go out, is the only thing you whant out.
Rgds

http://www.ssnakess.com/photopost/data/500/959Untitled-Stitched-04-med.jpg

[matrix1829]

chondro python what do you mean you saw it before I bought it! and just to let you know money is no problem!

[ReptiZone]

I saw it simply because I work at the reptile shope you baught it at Magazoo I asked Martin how much he was leting it go for and he said it was all ready sold then he pointed you out to me I only saw you for a split second I did not know who you were so I did not go a introduce myself.

And if money is no option then why ask if you could build a S#!T @$$ cage and let it free roam at night we want to have these animals then we should porvide them with proper caging that is the least the deserve. I dont blame you for buying it it is a sweet looking monitor but this is not a gecko we are talking about it is one of the bigest lizards out there and you are still asking how big a cage it needs and how big of a water dish it needs.

To me that is all stuf you should have thaught of B4 you got it But that might just be me.

[matrix1829]

I know what the animal needs, all I want to know is what is the min. this beast needs. I'm moving in june and want to know what to look for as space. And just to let you know, when I bought it Martin was not even working that day!!!!! (MARC)

[mbayless]

Gregg,

I was 75% done with African book, the way I wanted it and all when my computer crashed and I lost it all - I still have all the notes and all the material here - but my enthusiasm is lacking alot, and I do not know if I want to put all that energy back into something I have already done.....for instance: a country by country synopsis of Varanus living there, people who collected there, explorers who made a vara-discovery, and all associated stuff like that that made it real and alive. Not to mention the species synopsis for living/fossil varanus from their anatomy to their zygomatic arch discussions and all about each species and what they are, where they are, and where they're going....and then the chapter on Africa itself and what is this continent like? The book only had 4 chapters + a appendix with 500 local names found by me for these animals -= do I want to sit down and do it all again?? I don't know.....it was thousands of hours of effort, and for what - to be lost in a millisecond - I know your answer Gregg - I just don't know mine. I was also working on a S.E. Asia varanid book with to include all the stuff I have on them too - these books will let people see how much is really out there, and that the cyberworld is not everything!!

You keep going with your article Gregg - Im there to help you anytime, but I will not make copies from my snake book anymore = too fragile/rare....hope that last stuff I sent you on Bitis was useful? Did you email him?? do so....

cheers Smeggy-Greggy,
markb

[ReptiZone]

I dont care man do what ever the heck you want with the darn thing I could not care less you asked questions I gave you an answer.

SURE....I came off as being rough and maby down right rude.. But tell me this why on gods green earth would you buy a best like monitor just to give it the smallest posible enclosure with the smallest posible water dish. AND even consider having it free roam at night just to make up for where you slacked off...while you are planing on moving. WHY...Why did you buy that monitor under thows condition.

I am sick of seing ppl get huge @$$ reptiles giving noting but the min. space and some times min. food to slow down the groth. (this may not be your case) I am speeking in general.

PPL need to face reality YES it is a sweet looking monitor and YES they make excelent display animals but only in a profesional set up. you dont stick a 3 foot monitor in a 4 foot cage just cause it fits and it is not a big clean up job.
You put a 3 foot monitor in somthing like a 8 foot cage with a huge water dish to swim in log type branches littel rock caves.

Ya sure when it is all said and done you have like 4-5 feet of flore space but on top of that you have a pond for it to swim in nice basking spots a hand full of hiding places.

ppl need to stop thinking what will keep it alive and start thinking what will make it thrive what will keep it content how will I reach all of what it needs to be in a comfertable stress free enviorment.

AND you should of had all these answers B4 you baught the animal.

Why get a water monitor and just keep it alive when you could have got a 40 galon tank 1.5 leopard geckos and make them thrive and have that much more respect for you collection and recive that much more respect from others.

And you are maby thinking to your self well "you are the only one complanig (MARC)."
The thing is that there are a bunch of ppl reading this and feel the same way as me they just wana keep the peace and most of the time I do to. BUT when it is somthing like this I just have to voice my self some times the thread get moved for evaluation I get warnings by mods GOD love them they put up with me through so many of my mis spelled rants.

In conclusion: from my fave movie head of state by Chris Rock."This $#!t is WRONG." I know it and ppl here know it the day you see it you will have a whole new view on being a herpacultralist.

Marc Doiron

[snakemann87]

AMEN!!!!!

[V.hb]

Chondro, I gotta agree.. Matrix. go buy an ackie, a storrs a timor etc etc the possibilities are endless. You definatly dont want an asian water if you dont have the space. This isnt meant to bash you, people make mistakes but that water is going to get huge (providing kept properly)

[matrix1829]

chondro even though you lacked a little respect towards me, you got me thinking. I'm man enough to addmitt that I went over my head buying the water monitor. so after everyone's advise I decided to find my water monitor a better home, witch is already done. thanks to everyone for there advise, even you marc!!!!!

[mbayless]

That was very adult of you to do, and admit to others - most people would do neither publically or even quietly...Thanks. Its in the best for everybody, and you realized that certainly.....it is a hard thing to do - I did this some months ago when I gave up monitor living in my home entirely, after 22+ years....it was too much for me now, and I gave it up. Now, I read and write about them, and do miss them. Well Done!

Best Regards,
markb

[ReptiZone]

not a prob;em I come down hard on ppl simply be cause it semas to sink in better J/K. You as a person I have nothing against you did what was best I am proud and feal bad I realy wanted to help you to build a cage for it I just wanted it to be the best cage it deserved or I was not gona help then I tryed to tell you what you need not in the nicest way but I got my point a cross.

I go head to head with a bunch off ppl here most are newbies that dont think I am righ so are verry expereinced ppl that I think are wrong I alwas end up seeing there point in the lomg run just like you did. just to name a few V.hb thaught me a few things I dont remember the actual debate but it was intence and I lost.

Now Snakeman87 there is a kid that got it bad from a tone of ppl here and now we are alwas on MSN together. And I mean that is a kid I choped at the Knees every post he wroght and now he is one of the first to back me up on a topic.

You see I get hot under the coller cause I love my animals and all reptiles and can't digest when some one dosent know what they are seting them selves up for. So I say it as a see it some times if I am in a good mood the day I see it I am nice about it but if I am having a bad day it comes out rude or just not nicely said. but I am well known to not suger coate squat. I call them as I see them if I am wrong so be it I will admit where I was wrong. But when I am right and some one is saying I am wrong then it gets ugly I will debat the isue to death till that person sees it and if it is realy going down hill I wil re-ases my way of doing things and see if there is room for error they way I am doing things. if so then maby just maby I may be wrong then I back off.

But this was sertanly not the case with you. sorry for insulting you or hurting you fealings put some one had to step up too the plate if not you would be beating you self up in the future.

[V.hb]

alot of people feel they are equipped to keep certain animals, and don;t find out that they are until they own them. it happens, and alot of people also take offence to others telling them that they really need to re-think their position! it was very good of you to return that salvator. I own albigularus, this is also a huge species, but not like a salvator. I'd love to own them, but iam just not equipped with the proper space to do so.

[Gregg M]

Hey Mark, As usual the info you sent me was most helpful....... Hey Mark, is there any documentation on V. albigularis feeding on puff adders that you know of........ I may want to add something about what preys on them also......... You are one of the best resourses for info that I know of........ Thanks for all of your help buddy.......

[Steeve B]

yes gregg, Gogga poblished on albigularis eating puff adders, I thingk Gogga and Mark are related, these 2 are the only one in the world with such a passion for African varanids, very interesting material.
rgds

[Gregg M]

Thanks Steeve...... I will talk to Mark over the phone about it...... I am sure he will have some good answers for me.....

[mbayless]

HI Gregg and Steve,

There are actually a few valid reports on V. albigularis feeding on Bitis, and in one paper, an actual photograph of them doing so... in another paper it describes hatchling V. albigularis response to Bitis = same as adults - hilarious to watch. They go spastic when scent is captured by their big noses.....if you wish exact details/source papers, let me know - I think the oldest one I have is ~1909.....as for Gogga and I being related, I would be honoured to be related this missanthrope recluse who described original fossils, plants, petrology, and V. albigularis..... my kind of fellow, to live 40+ years in nowhere, living with V. albigularis and making the occassional passing-by haggard spookdorp woman or sheep nervous!! hahaha.....

Cheers guys,
markb

[Scales Zoo]

That is great information once again Mark.

Ryan

[Jeff_Favelle]

yes gregg, Gogga poblished on albigularis eating puff adders,

Any special immunity to the venom? Or is the skin too tough on the monitor to invenomate?

[Steeve B]

Hello Jeff I posted about this last week, I dont know if youv seen it?
Rgds
Bitis have huge fangs capable of biting thru albigularis skin, however they are more protected then Nil's

http://www.ssnakess.com/forums/showthread.php?s=&threadid=24538

[Jeff_Favelle]

They get partial immunity by EATING venomous snakes?? Holy!

[mbayless]

Like Haas down in Florida - invenomation gives resistance!! Varanus do this too, many of them attempt it, but only a few succeed = stronger genetic affiliation for attaining partial resistance to venom!

Cheers,
markb

[Jeff_Favelle]

Yeah, but Bill Haast doesn't EAT the snakes to gain immunity, LOL!! :D